CDZ Remembering September 11, 2001

[Dogmaphobe]

Where did I justify the mass murder of innocent people? I think you are hysterical.

Anyone who doesn't beat his chest and swear vengeance on every Muslim on the planet is DEFENDING THE TERRORISTS.

Another edit to save my sterling reputation. Sneaky, starting this in the CDZ, mike.

As opposed to your favoring the forceful suppression of points of view opposing Islamic terrorism as you have done?

You're doing it again; Why don't you stick to the point instead of going off on one of your wild liberal hunts?

You are not a liberal, but if "doing it again" is your way of saying that I am reminding you of positions you have taken recently, then yes, that is exactly what I am doing

This is a thread about 911. You are on record as supporting the forced suppression of a poster that opposed it as well as other examples of Islamic terrorism. It is ENTIRELY germane to the discussion to illuminate your true view on the matter.

ignore "on"

But what if your taking your toys home with you doesn't work on me and you have to resort to sterner measured like holding your breath until you turn blue?

I remind you of positions you have advocated so you announce you have me on ignore.

That's pretty pathetic, old lady.

 

[OldLady]

For not being a case of attested development who is acting out by justifying the mass murder of innocent people

That would be you.

Where did I justify the mass murder of innocent people? I think you are hysterical.

Anyone who doesn't beat his chest and swear vengeance on every Muslim on the planet is DEFENDING THE TERRORISTS.

Another edit to save my sterling reputation. Sneaky, starting this in the CDZ, mike.

A lifelong friend of mine, a recently retired Army Recruiter and combat veteran, married a Kurdish girl he met while stationed in Germany. They've been together, happily, since 1993. After some initial friction, her Turkish Muslim father and brothers accepted the marriage. She's an amazing person. Their oldest, a girl, speaks English, Turkish, German and Arabic. His wife and her family are amazing people. They set me up once with her younger sister, although it ended up not working out.

My sister-in-law to be is engaged to a Bengali Muslim boy she met at Virginia Tech. He's a good kid, save for his annoying seafood allergy which has curtailed the annual family steamed crab fests (he can't even be in the same room as seafood), and his forbidding my fiancé's sister from having a Christmas tree in their home.

People everywhere can be good or bad depending on our individual perspective, and theirs. Politicized, radical Islam however, is not compatible with Western culture or political or social philosophies. No amount of bleeding heart apology can change that.

Please show me where I advocated for politicized, radical Islamists moving to this country. I'm going to hold the position that the huge majority of Muslims in this world do NOT want to or plan to hurt anyone for their political or religious beliefs. The Middle East is a hell hole right now and millions have been displaced, their lives destroyed, their families killed. They're living in tent cities "on hold" in countries that have suffered a lot more terrorist attacks than we have, but even though EVERYONE blames at least one of our presidents for starting these wars to begin with, Trump has effectively slammed the door on them. I am never going to agree with that. 999 out of 1000 Muslims are like your buddy's wife and daughter. Just folks.

I was not aiming to offend you. Apologies. Emotions run high remembering the day.

You didn't offend me at all, dear.

 

[buttercup]

People everywhere can be good or bad depending on our individual perspective, and theirs. Politicized, radical Islam however, is not compatible with Western culture or political or social philosophies. No amount of bleeding heart apology can change that.

True, but keep in mind that sometimes a "boogieman" is needed, in order to justify perpetual war and interventionism. Have you ever read the book 1984 by George Orwell?

As for September 11, yes it was a horrible, surreal day. I remember it clearly.

Yes I have. Have you read Slaughterhouse-5? Some Bogeymen are real. Hiding our faces from them beneath the blankets will not save us. Sometimes, we must get out of bed and confront them so they cannot hurt us later.

I absolutely agree that hiding our faces beneath blankets will not save us. I've just realized over the last 15 years or so that we the people have been deceived and manipulated, numerous times, and we need to be much more discerning. Especially when it comes to those in power who want to take away our constitutional rights and liberties.

 

[OldLady]

Another President who knew how to mend, not unravel, our country:

Thank you all very much for your hospitality. We’ve just had a wide-ranging discussions on the matter at hand. Like the good folks standing with me, the American people were appalled and outraged at last Tuesday’s attacks. And so were Muslims all across the world. Both Americans and Muslim friends and citizens, tax-paying citizens, and Muslims in nations were just appalled and could not believe what we saw on our TV screens.

These acts of violence against innocents violate the fundamental tenets of the Islamic faith. And it’s important for my fellow Americans to understand that.

The English translation is not as eloquent as the original Arabic, but let me quote from the Koran, itself: In the long run, evil in the extreme will be the end of those who do evil. For that they rejected the signs of Allah and held them up to ridicule.

The face of terror is not the true faith of Islam. That’s not what Islam is all about. Islam is peace. These terrorists don’t represent peace. They represent evil and war.

When we think of Islam we think of a faith that brings comfort to a billion people around the world. Billions of people find comfort and solace and peace. And that’s made brothers and sisters out of every race—out of every race.

America counts millions of Muslims amongst our citizens, and Muslims make an incredibly valuable contribution to our country. Muslims are doctors, lawyers, law professors, members of the military, entrepreneurs, shopkeepers, moms and dads. And they need to be treated with respect. In our anger and emotion, our fellow Americans must treat each other with respect.

Women who cover their heads in this country must feel comfortable going outside their homes. Moms who wear cover must be not intimidated in America. That’s not the America I know. That’s not the America I value.

I’ve been told that some fear to leave; some don’t want to go shopping for their families; some don’t want to go about their ordinary daily routines because, by wearing cover, they’re afraid they’ll be intimidated. That should not and that will not stand in America.

Those who feel like they can intimidate our fellow citizens to take out their anger don’t represent the best of America, they represent the worst of humankind, and they should be ashamed of that kind of behavior.

This is a great country. It’s a great country because we share the same values of respect and dignity and human worth. And it is my honor to be meeting with leaders who feel just the same way I do. They’re outraged, they’re sad. They love America just as much as I do.

I want to thank you all for giving me a chance to come by. And may God bless us all.

Read George W. Bush’s “Islam is peace” speech, delivered days after 9/11

 

[miketx]

Muslims who hate us.

Oh yeah, thank you.

All muslims hate us......... except for the ones that don't.

Gee, first you attempt to be uninformed (a lie), then you commit a fallacy by pretending it is bigotry against all Muslims. No one is fooled by your stupidity.

There were numerous answers he could have given to the question. He gave the most generic. There was no fallacy on my part and I quite clearly knew what I was doing.

I gave the truth as my answer. Sorry that upsets you so much. But you don't really think those Muslims flew those planes into the buildings because they love us do you?

It didn't upset me in the least, I asked because I wanted to know how to approach this thread.

Obviously the muslims that attacked us did not love us.

This emotionally stunted dialogue is what prevents us from having a real discussion about the problems that plague us. It has nothing to do with "regressives".

No what you are doing is trying to start something by insinuating that I mentioned regressives where I did not. Then you claim the dialogue is emotionally stunted. IMO all you are doing is trolling for a reaction. I get it, you hate this country, but stay out of my thread ok? As far as your "claim" that you wanted to know how to approach this thread, it's false like most libs nonsense. You approach a thread by the content of the OP not trolling like you are.

 

[JGalt]

Thank you Robert J. O'Neill for putting that 5.56mm round through Bin Laden's cranium. And that the rest of you Navy Seals who took part in that.

And screw you, Obama.

Obama ordered the mission

Hesitantly. Valerie Jerratt talked him out of giving the go-ahead three times previous to the mission. Obama was often disengaged from the whole thing and was afraid that the mission would go wrong. It was Hillary Clinton who finally talked him into it.

Once again, Obama showed himself as a weak, indecisive, and ineffectual President.

EXCLUSIVE: Obama 'cancelled missions to kill bin Laden THREE TIMES after getting cold feet - until Hillary Clinton stepped in', claims explosive new book | Daily Mail Online

 

[rightwinger]

Thank you Robert J. O'Neill for putting that 5.56mm round through Bin Laden's cranium. And that the rest of you Navy Seals who took part in that.

And screw you, Obama.

Obama ordered the mission

Hesitantly. Valerie Jerratt talked him out of giving the go-ahead three times previous to the mission. Obama was often disengaged from the whole thing and was afraid that the mission would go wrong. It was Hillary Clinton who finally talked him into it.

Once again, Obama showed himself as a weak, indecisive, and ineffectual President.

EXCLUSIVE: Obama 'cancelled missions to kill bin Laden THREE TIMES after getting cold feet - until Hillary Clinton stepped in', claims explosive new book | Daily Mail Online

Seems Bush had seven years of putting it off

Obama waited until he had sufficient evidence and ordered the mission
Gutsy move and it paid off

 

[OldLady]

Haven't most of our homegrown terrorists that were from the Middle East come here as kids and been radicalized here in the good ole US of A? There was that one woman from San Bernardino--she was bad news in the worst way.

There are some radicalized elements in our Muslim communities--that camp for kids that was recently raided, most recently. We can't blame all Muslims for what a few twisted few do, though. Our intelligence services and FBI do a good job. Let THEM do it.

 

[Tehon]

Oh yeah, thank you.

All muslims hate us......... except for the ones that don't.

Gee, first you attempt to be uninformed (a lie), then you commit a fallacy by pretending it is bigotry against all Muslims. No one is fooled by your stupidity.

There were numerous answers he could have given to the question. He gave the most generic. There was no fallacy on my part and I quite clearly knew what I was doing.

I gave the truth as my answer. Sorry that upsets you so much. But you don't really think those Muslims flew those planes into the buildings because they love us do you?

It didn't upset me in the least, I asked because I wanted to know how to approach this thread.

Obviously the muslims that attacked us did not love us.

This emotionally stunted dialogue is what prevents us from having a real discussion about the problems that plague us. It has nothing to do with "regressives".

No what you are doing is trying to start something by insinuating that I mentioned regressives where I did not. Then you claim the dialogue is emotionally stunted. IMO all you are doing is trolling for a reaction. I get it, you hate this country, but stay out of my thread ok? As far as your "claim" that you wanted to know how to approach this thread, it's false like most libs nonsense. You approach a thread by the content of the OP not trolling like you are.

The regressive comment was not aimed at you. As for the rest, it seems you have a point. My apologies.

 

[Natural Citizen]

I've just realized over the last 15 years or so that we the people have been deceived and manipulated, numerous times, and we need to be much more discerning. Especially when it comes to those in power who want to take away our constitutional rights and liberties.

The terrorists hated us for our freedoms, they said.

Little did we know that it was those terrorist cells in Washington DC, those terrorist cells known as the Executive, Legislative, and Judicial branches who were the ones who really hated us for our freedoms.

Never let a perfectly good crisis go to waste and whatnot...

 

[Dogmaphobe]

People everywhere can be good or bad depending on our individual perspective, and theirs. Politicized, radical Islam however, is not compatible with Western culture or political or social philosophies. No amount of bleeding heart apology can change that.

True, but keep in mind that sometimes a "boogieman" is needed, in order to justify perpetual war and interventionism. Have you ever read the book 1984 by George Orwell?

As for September 11, yes it was a horrible, surreal day. I remember it clearly.

Yes I have. Have you read Slaughterhouse-5? Some Bogeymen are real. Hiding our faces from them beneath the blankets will not save us. Sometimes, we must get out of bed and confront them so they cannot hurt us later.

What I have found is that those who stick their head in the sand don't want to know the first thing about Islam or why we were attacked. They would rather offer platitudes and excuses.

Meanwhile, anybody who DOES know a bit about Islam and HAS studied the jihadist movement is accused of hating all Muslims, being an Islamophobe, a bigot, a racist and whatnot. Nobody wants to be called those names so OF COURSE they line up to defend Islamists even though they are monumentally ignorant about that which they are defending.

 

[miketx]

People everywhere can be good or bad depending on our individual perspective, and theirs. Politicized, radical Islam however, is not compatible with Western culture or political or social philosophies. No amount of bleeding heart apology can change that.

True, but keep in mind that sometimes a "boogieman" is needed, in order to justify perpetual war and interventionism. Have you ever read the book 1984 by George Orwell?

As for September 11, yes it was a horrible, surreal day. I remember it clearly.

Yes I have. Have you read Slaughterhouse-5? Some Bogeymen are real. Hiding our faces from them beneath the blankets will not save us. Sometimes, we must get out of bed and confront them so they cannot hurt us later.

What I have found is that those who stick their head in the sand don't want to know the first thing about Islam or why we were attacked. They would rather offer platitudes and excuses.

Meanwhile, anybody who DOES know a bit about Islam and HAS studied the jihadist movement is accused of hating all Muslims, being an Islamophobe, a bigot, a racist and whatnot. Nobody wants to be called those names so OF COURSE they line up to defend Islamists even though they are monumentally ignorant about that which they are defending.

Mean while back in muslimville:

 

[Dogmaphobe]

I've just realized over the last 15 years or so that we the people have been deceived and manipulated, numerous times, and we need to be much more discerning. Especially when it comes to those in power who want to take away our constitutional rights and liberties.

The terrorists hated us for our freedoms, they said.

Little did we know that it was those terrorist cells in Washington DC, those terrorist cells known as the Executive, Legislative, and Judicial branches who were the ones who really hated us for our freedoms.

Never let a perfectly good crisis go to waste and whatnot...

Who is "they"?

Islamist terrorists are following the essential dictate of Islam, which is to turn dar al harb into dar al Islam. Not allmuslims support their methods, of course, but the mission is the same - to turn the world Islamic.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

I feel like with all the conditioning going on in our "education" centers today, that our true history is being glossed over. We need to remember what happened to the world trade center and who did it and why. I realize it's two days away, but still we need to remember. Remember the horrific terror created by muslim extremists and the nearly 3000 people murdered that day.

Here I have shared a collection of images taken shortly after this terrorist attack at ground zero. These images were sent to me by a police officer working the scene shortly after the attack. It may help us to remember just who certain people want to let in this country and why they cannot be allowed to. This was a horrible day, and it has to be remembered. Feel free to copy the images.

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Remind me again who dd it and why, I seem to have forgot.

Muslims who hate us.

And why do Muslims hate you? That’s the part you really need to fix. Just google the Shah of Iran and read what this asshole did to his people with the full backing and support of the US Government and you will understand why Iranians consider the USA the Great Satan and chant Death to the USA.

And just when the Shah had been gone long enough for Iran to think you’d changed, along comes Iran/Contra meddling, followed by the Gulf War, and then after 8 years of peace and prosperity under Bill Clinton, you had W invading Iraq for NO REASON, and suddenly a whole new generation of jihadists are ready to go to war against the US.

Get out of the Middle East and stay out. Every time you send troops over there and get involved in their incessant wars, you give a whole new generation of idiots a reason to hate Americans.

So, let's see here. You justify some Suni men murdering 3000 of your countrymen because 50 years earlier, a Shia leader was deposed after reneging on deals his country made with a British oil company.

.....and you think that makes any sense, do you?

 

[Tilly]

That was a really scary day. I'll never forget it.

I'm not going to suspect every single Muslim on the planet because of it, though.

Who asked you to?

 

[rightwinger]

That was a really scary day. I'll never forget it.

I'm not going to suspect every single Muslim on the planet because of it, though.

Who asked you to?

Our President

 

[Tilly]

Why do think the murder of 3000 Americans is funny, Tehon?

I realize you are a child who wasn't even born yet when it happened, but grow the fuck up, kid.

I am laughing at you.

For not being a case of attested development who is acting out by justifying the mass murder of innocent people

That would be you.

Where did I justify the mass murder of innocent people? I think you are hysterical.

Anyone who doesn't beat his chest and swear vengeance on every Muslim on the planet is DEFENDING THE TERRORISTS.

Another edit to save my sterling reputation. Sneaky, starting this in the CDZ, mike.

Who has asked you to swear vengeance on every Muslim on the planet?

 

[Dogmaphobe]

That was a really scary day. I'll never forget it.

I'm not going to suspect every single Muslim on the planet because of it, though.

Who asked you to?

Our President

False.

 

[Tilly]

Miketx started this thread as a memorial for 9/11.

It’s also in the CDZ, so maybe all those here trolling and those here LYING that they’ve been asked to ‘swear vengeance on every muslim’ would kindly peddle their disrespectful crap elsewhere instead of ruining this REMEMBRANCE thread.

Thanks miketx for the thread and the (sad) pics too.

 

[task0778]

9/11 was a day of hate. The terrorists didn't die trying to kill as many of us as possible because of the Shah of Iran, they wanted the US and the West out of the Middle East. Al-Qaeda hoped that they would promote widespread fear throughout this country and severely weaken the United States’ resolve and standing in the world community, ultimately supporting their political and religious goals in the Middle East and Muslim World. But they seriously miscalculated, and instead they got a war in Afghanistan, then Iraq, and finally drone attacks. IMHO, we cannot assume that these people will not attack us again, indeed they have tried over and over again both here and abroad. And yet here we are, accepting thousands of people from that same region, many of whom we do not know who they are or what they true intentions might be for coming here.

But 9/11 was also a day of heroism, as police and firefighters and 1st responders all rushed to the scene, many of which died trying to help or save others. As did many ordinary Americans. Who can forget United Flight 93, the 4th plane that crashed into a field outside Shanksville, PA? That flight it is believed was initially supposed to fly into a building in the DC area, maybe the WH or Capitol, but instead was overtaken by the passengers on that flight and never made to their intended target. Let's Roll!

To me, the lessons of 9/11 are quite plain and obvious: we have enemies who hate us and our way of life, even our religion whatever it might be. How does one deal with such people? I'm personally good with leaving the ME altogether and letting them kill each other off, but what about Israel and the other countries there that might not be our friends but at least are not our enemies. Do we abandon them to their fate? If we do that, will such people leave us alone? Personally, I kinda doubt that. Are we better off fighting them there, or fighting them here?