Religious nut attacks atheist, judge berates victim

[Missourian]

I have a great analogy.

The father of a soldier killed in Iraq punches one of those Westboro Psuedo-baptists in the face when he sees them protesting in a parade.

Are you going to put him in prison, or did they provoke his response?

 

[GuyPinestra]

I have a great analogy.

The father of a soldier killed in Iraq punches one of those Westboro Psuedo-baptists in the face when he sees them protesting in a parade.

Are you going to put him in prison, or did they provoke his response?

Provocation does NOT excuse assault. We have laws against it, they should be applied uniformly, without fear or favor.

And those idiots protest at funerals, not in parades. The KKK still has parades, too, and if they're assaulted the police arrest the perpetrators.

 

[Missourian]

I have a great analogy.

The father of a soldier killed in Iraq punches one of those Westboro Psuedo-baptists in the face when he sees them protesting in a parade.

Are you going to put him in prison, or did they provoke his response?

Provocation does NOT excuse assault. We have laws against it, they should be applied uniformly, without fear or favor.

So you're convicting this father of assault.

I would not.

Not in a million years.

If I'm on this jury, he's going home, just like Muslim guy.

 

[GuyPinestra]

I have a great analogy.

The father of a soldier killed in Iraq punches one of those Westboro Psuedo-baptists in the face when he sees them protesting in a parade.

Are you going to put him in prison, or did they provoke his response?

Provocation does NOT excuse assault. We have laws against it, they should be applied uniformly, without fear or favor.

So you're convicting this father of assault.

I would not.

Not in a million years.

If I'm on this jury, he's going home, just like Muslim guy.

Then you have no understanding of our Constitution or what the Rule of Law means.

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
Evelyn Beatrice Hall
(often mis-attributed to Voltaire)

 

[Missourian]

It would seem that the law is applied uniformly:

The Supreme Court recently ruled that these "protests" at military funerals, while tasteless and hurtful, fall under the First Amendment's free-speech protections. However, a West Virginia court acquitted a man of assault after he spit tobacco juice at Shirley Phelps-Roper (one of the leaders of the church) as the church protested the deaths of miners in West Virginia.


So, it may be legal for the Phelps group to protest at funerals, but it is also legal to spit in their faces.​

Extremist Westboro Church foiled in Mississippi » peoplesworld​

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Someone instigate a fight and gets one, that's on him.

No judge is going to jail you for that.

This zombie Mohammed instigated the altercation.

He went out looking to offend someone...and he did. Now he wants to cry about it.

Want to bet?

The only way to get off for being in a fight is to prove the other guy actually started the physical altercation. Period.

Not at all true, if I catch you in bed with my wife, I can kill you on the spot without you ever raising a hand in anger, and walk away scott-free. I forget the defense is called, but it is exactly what we are talking about here.

Was Zombie Mohammad in bed with your wife? If not, I don't get what you are trying to say.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I have a great analogy.

The father of a soldier killed in Iraq punches one of those Westboro Psuedo-baptists in the face when he sees them protesting in a parade.

Are you going to put him in prison, or did they provoke his response?

Will I put him in jail?

Nope.

Should he go to jail?

Yes.

Is this an analogy?

No.

 

[Missourian]

In defense of Spade, Kanawha County Public Defender George Castelle said Phelps-Roper's actions and signs were carefully calculated to goad others into responding.


"They were signs designed to make [Spade] angry. They were signs designed to provoke him," he said. "They got what they wanted because they invited it."


Castelle noted that the counter-protesters, who numbered between 50 and several hundred, applauded Spade as he calmly left the scene with police officers.


"Billy Spade is not a criminal," Castelle said. "If anything, he's a hero."


The jury deliberated for less than an hour before returning its not-guilty verdict to Municipal Judge Ann Charnock.

Hico man acquitted in Westboro Baptist spitting trial  - News - The Charleston Gazette - West Virginia News and Sports -​

​

Evidently, provocation IS a defense against assault.

 

[Missourian]

I have a great analogy.

The father of a soldier killed in Iraq punches one of those Westboro Psuedo-baptists in the face when he sees them protesting in a parade.

Are you going to put him in prison, or did they provoke his response?

Will I put him in jail?

Nope.

Should he go to jail?

Yes.

Is this an analogy?

No.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

I wouldn't send him to jail and I don't think he should go to jail.

In my judgement, goading and baiting the response makes it a foreseeable event, just as with criminal negligence.

 

[GuyPinestra]

I have a great analogy.

The father of a soldier killed in Iraq punches one of those Westboro Psuedo-baptists in the face when he sees them protesting in a parade.

Are you going to put him in prison, or did they provoke his response?

Will I put him in jail?

Nope.

Should he go to jail?

Yes.

Is this an analogy?

No.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

I wouldn't send him to jail and I don't think he should go to jail.

In my judgement, goading and baiting the response makes it a foreseeable event, just as with criminal negligence.

The problem Missourian, is that you're equating the atheist's parade costumes with 'goading and baiting'. Those guys in the zombie costumes didn't target anybody to 'goad and bait'. They were simply participating in a parade whose theme was atheism. Of course they're going to parody religions.

If anything, the Muslim who went apeshit attended that parade with the expressed intent of getting 'upset' over it. People really need to grow up and grow a skin.

 

[Conservative]

The guys in the parade were assholes. However, that is not against the law in this country.

The guy who attacked the guy in the parade was an asshole. What did he think the parade of atheists was going to be like?

Should the attacker have gotten off? Hell no. Should the judge berate the atheist? Hell no.

 

[Inthemiddle]

I love the right of protest better than most around here but everyone knows by now how touchy Muslims can be about blasphemy, while he has the certain right to protest in any way he wants, what he did was pretty much incitement. Also the people who are trying make atheism a quasi-religious thing and be evangelists about it are just generally dumbasses.

While I'm inclined to mostly agree, none of that changes the legal circumstances. None of that gives a person the right to physically attack a someone.

 

[Unknown_Soldier]

This case perfectly illustrates why you don't ever see anyone make fun of or criticize Muslims. Because we KNOW that they will commit acts of violence on you for doing so.

Now, I'm not necessarily opposed to changing the laws so that if someone offends you you can punch them in the nose, but currently that is NOT the law, and certainly that shouldn't be just for Muslims.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

In defense of Spade, Kanawha County Public Defender George Castelle said Phelps-Roper's actions and signs were carefully calculated to goad others into responding.


"They were signs designed to make [Spade] angry. They were signs designed to provoke him," he said. "They got what they wanted because they invited it."


Castelle noted that the counter-protesters, who numbered between 50 and several hundred, applauded Spade as he calmly left the scene with police officers.


"Billy Spade is not a criminal," Castelle said. "If anything, he's a hero."


The jury deliberated for less than an hour before returning its not-guilty verdict to Municipal Judge Ann Charnock.

Hico man acquitted in Westboro Baptist spitting trial* - News - The Charleston Gazette - West Virginia News and Sports -​

​

Evidently, provocation IS a defense against assault.

In a jury trial.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I have a great analogy.

The father of a soldier killed in Iraq punches one of those Westboro Psuedo-baptists in the face when he sees them protesting in a parade.

Are you going to put him in prison, or did they provoke his response?

Will I put him in jail?

Nope.

Should he go to jail?

Yes.

Is this an analogy?

No.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

I wouldn't send him to jail and I don't think he should go to jail.

In my judgement, goading and baiting the response makes it a foreseeable event, just as with criminal negligence.

Does that mean that a woman who wears a mini skirt and walks through a bad part of town should expect to get raped? Or is that just different, somehow?

 

[Missourian]

Will I put him in jail?

Nope.

Should he go to jail?

Yes.

Is this an analogy?

No.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

I wouldn't send him to jail and I don't think he should go to jail.

In my judgement, goading and baiting the response makes it a foreseeable event, just as with criminal negligence.

Does that mean that a woman who wears a mini skirt and walks through a bad part of town should expect to get raped? Or is that just different, somehow?

Apples and orangutans.

Her intent isn't to mock and enrage.

Zombie Mohammed and Westboro Pseudo-baptist INTENTION is to blatantly offend.

I am a reasonable person.

I have personally thought to myself on numerous occasions that those hateful Westboros needed some sense knocked into them.

I'd imagine that the vast majority here have thought the same.

None though, myself included, have EVER thought, "that woman needs to be raped".

Enormous difference.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

I wouldn't send him to jail and I don't think he should go to jail.

In my judgement, goading and baiting the response makes it a foreseeable event, just as with criminal negligence.

Does that mean that a woman who wears a mini skirt and walks through a bad part of town should expect to get raped? Or is that just different, somehow?

Apples and orangutans.

Her intent isn't to mock and enrage.

Zombie Mohammed and Westboro Pseudo-baptist INTENTION is to blatantly offend.

I am a reasonable person.

I have personally thought to myself on numerous occasions that those hateful Westboros needed some sense knocked into them.

I'd imagine that the vast majority here have thought the same.

None though, myself included, have EVER thought, "that woman needs to be raped".

Enormous difference.

The intent of a victim of a crime is irrelevant. Police do not interrogate victims of armed robberies to see if they were purposely carrying cash in order to tempt people to rob them, nor do they interrogate victims of burglaries to see if they purposely bought high end electronics in order to make their neighbors jealous.

What if her intent was to make the point that women should be able to dress how they wanted and she walked through a predominately Muslim neighborhood where women have been attacked for not wearing veils? Would the fact that the Muslims were outraged by her behavior, and that she had been warned in advance that she would outrage them, excuse the rape, or is that still different somehow.

Personally, I would love to see someone beat the crap out of WBC and burn their church to the ground, but I would expect the police to arrest anyone who did it, and I would expect the courts to send them to prison. The reason for that is pretty simple, it is wrong. The Westboro Baptist Church has every right to say what they do because you do not have a right not to be offended.

If we start handing out rights not to be offended where does it stop? Does it only apply to people who will react with violence, or do we prevent people from saying things cause severe emotional distress? What if all it invokes is emotional distress? Only nincomppops want to live in a world where people saying or doing offensive things is illegal or justifies a violent reaction. I have a strong urge to beat people who think that offensive actions should be stopped with a baseball bat because it is extremely offensive to me. If we followed your logic I could show up at your house, beat you senseless, and the police would pat me on the back and send me on my way. Does that even make sense to you?

 

[chanel]

The guy is getting "hundreds" of death threats from the Religion of Peacers.

The Pennsylvania man assaulted in October by a Muslim who was offended by his Halloween parade “Zombie Muhammad” costume said he has received hundreds of death threats after a judge dismissed his attacker’s criminal charges.

Perce says he has received 471 threats against his life in the short time since his attacker was acquitted.

“People have said that they would kill me, rip my eyes out, run me over, shoot me and then laugh at me, since I have blasphemed Muhammad,” he told TheDC. “They say I will be found out and hung in front of my family.”

Read more: Assault Victim | Threats | Quran-Minded Judge | The Daily Caller

Every single one of those threats should be investigated and prosecuted.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

The judge is just making this worse, how is walking down a street dressed as a religious figure ethnic intimidation? Is it a hate crime to mock religion now? When did it become the job of a judge to lecture on what different religions believe?

Video - Breaking News Videos from CNN.com

 

[GuyPinestra]

The damned judge needs a different job! Maybe as a PC counselor at Kumbayah Camp...