Religious Groups Evicted From NYC Schools

Discussion in 'Religion and Ethics' started by PoliticalChic, Jan 8, 2012.

  1. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Diamond Member

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    1. The United States Supreme Court declined Monday to hear a Bronx church’s appeal of a city ban on holding worship services in public schools.

    2. The city immediately set a February eviction date for about 60 churches that had been holding services in city schools pending the appeal.

    3. The church, the Bronx Household of Faith, had appealed a federal panel’s June ruling that the city’s ban on holding worship services in a school did not violate the church’s First Amendment right to free speech.

    4. “When worship services are performed in a place,” a judge wrote in that decision, “the nature of the site changes. The site is no longer simply a room in a school being used temporarily for some activity.” The decision supported the city’s view that letting churches conduct religious services in schools could be seen as the kind of endorsement of religion...

    5. The Bronx Household of Faith, which meets at Public School 15 in the Bronx, has been assembling in classrooms since a judge ruled in 2002 that churches — like other community groups — have the First Amendment right to use school spaces. The decision by the United States Court of Appeals in June allowed the city to restrict the churches.

    6. The Alliance Defense Fund: ...“Churches and other religious groups should be able to meet in public buildings on the same terms as other community groups,” the group said in a news release. “They should not be excluded simply because of the religious nature of their speech.”
    Supreme Court Won't Hear Case on Churches' Use of Schools - NYTimes.com


    7." ...the Supreme Court held in Good News Club v. Milford Central School (PDF) that it was unconstitutional for a public school district to exclude from its buildings a religious organization that planned to use the space to teach religious morals to school-aged children through the use of song, verse memorization, and lessons. The Court held that such exclusion amounted to “viewpoint discrimination,” because the district otherwise permitted use of the space “for the teaching of morals and character,” and was excluding the plaintiffs solely on the basis of their religious affiliation.

    8. According to the Second Circuit, in cases like Good News Club, “the policy being enforced categorically excluded expressions of religious content. Here, by contrast, there is no restraint on the free expression of any point of view. Expression of all points of view is permitted. The exclusion applies only to the conduct of a certain type of activity — the conduct of worship services — and not to the free expression of religious views associated with it....the distinction between the activity of worship and the expression of Christian viewpoints sounds incredibly thin (especially considering that the activities at issue in Good News Club included singing). ”
    No More Religious Services in NYC Public Schools | Friendly Atheist



    An addition to being unfair and discriminatory, do the series of decisions seem consistent?

    Seems not so to me.
     
  2. C_Clayton_Jones
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    C_Clayton_Jones Diamond Member

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    The decision was neither unfair nor discriminatory, as it comports with the Constitution and its case law on the issue, as determined by the Supreme Court:

    The Board’s concern with regard to an Establishment Clause violation is consequently justified, the Board is acting in an appropriate and legal manner – as all public sector entities should – in an effort to be in compliance with the Constitution and the law. Indeed, the Board would be negligent in its responsibility to adhere to the law if it allowed religious organizations to remain, in violation of the First Amendment.

    In addition, it is incorrect to perceive the Board’s decision as a ‘violation’ of the Free Exercise Clause of the First Amendment as the state is in no way restricting religious practice, as such practice may be conducted in any private venue.
    Yes, as they are, again, in compliance with the Constitution and its case law.

    Understandable given your motive is political, not legal; as a partisan rightist you’ve unsuccessfully attempted to portray the Board’s decision as some sort of capricious ‘attack’ on religion, when in fact it is acting in accordance with the law.
     
  3. RetiredGySgt
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    RetiredGySgt Platinum Member

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    And yet NYC schools are the very ones that created special classrooms for Muslims on Ramadan to pray. That allowed Muslims special rooms for prayer during school days.
     
  4. Photonic
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    Photonic Ad astra!

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    What exactly is wrong with this? Religion doesn't belong in school in any form, the rest of the civilized world recognizes that, why doesn't this country?
     
  5. Luissa
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    Luissa Annoying Customer Supporting Member

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    I never saw a problem with this. All kinds of groups are allowed to use public schools. They are also allowed to use other public buildings etc.
     
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  6. Photonic
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    Photonic Ad astra!

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    Last I checked this forum has been in an uproar over the apparent issues of schools teaching kids morals and values instead of hard education subjects.

    Why is religion exempt from that?
     
  7. xotoxi
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    xotoxi Platinum Member

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    Religious groups should be allowed to have services in schools. These services are not happening when the school is in session, and are not made a requirement for the students, and are not run by the school or based on the school curriculum, therefore there is no "endorsement of religion" by the school. I think that the religious group should rent the space they use to cover costs. And I don't think that the school should not show favoritism of one religious group over another to whom they rent the space. Or even non-religious groups.

    But it begs the question...what if a satanic group wanted to have services in a school? Or the KKK wanted to have meetings?
     
  8. Photonic
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    As I said, school is not the place for any of those things. It really, REALLY is inappropriate under any context.
     
  9. xotoxi
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    xotoxi Platinum Member

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    A school building, when school is not in session, is just a publicly owned building. So why shouldn't the public be able to use it within reason?
     
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  10. Photonic
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    I never said I had a problem with it when it is not in session. As long as there is no interference between use of the school as an educational facility I see why not.
     

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CHRISTAINS GROUPS EVICTED IN CALIFORNIA