Religion: Real or Fake

[Care4all]

Originally posted by Mr Clean
I wonder how many of the self professed true believers really believe or are they just hedging their bets just in case.

Good point, Mr.

The sharp division between faith and incredulity, believers and non-believers is, to a certain extent, false and artificial. People need labels in order to simplify their lives and facilitate communion and debate.

All human beings walk the fine line between faith and disbelief their entire lives with different degrees of inclination towards both.

i don't know if this is or is not the case, Jose'. I suppose a case could be made to support your argument.... I only know about me...and I have had my share of ups and downs on the ''belief scale'' as you have stated....but i view these down periods as periods that I learned the most about myself, and my resolve of my belief in God.

I don't have a church or specific organized religion that I follow, I just know that I am a Christian....I believe with all my body and soul...I don't even know why, I just know that I do. I am not someone fooled easily either, I am a lover of mathematics and science, tangible things....and i can't even get through any kind of movie, that is just too unrealistic....I have to walk away...but my belief in God seems as real as real can be....and for no solid, sound reason....

I am not ''in it'' for the communion with others, though I suppose I probably should be....the organized Church that i did belong to in my youth, excommunicated me, for divorcing and remarrying...that was 20 years ago....i'm a woman without a country...ummmm i mean, a woman without a Church....

It honestly is, as though I were programmed, to believe....genetically programmed to believe in God....to believe He is real, because I honestly have absolutely no doubt that He is real....how does one explain that...when there is nothing physically to support it? Mental illness? Or trust in my own intuition, or trust in what i believe was revealed to me?

 

[Big Black Dog]

Originally posted by Mr Clean
I wonder how many of the self professed true believers really believe or are they just hedging their bets just in case.

Good point, Mr.

The sharp division between faith and incredulity, believers and non-believers is, to a certain extent, false and artificial. People need labels in order to simplify their lives and facilitate communion and debate.

All human beings walk the fine line between faith and disbelief their entire lives with different degrees of inclination towards both.

i don't know if this is or is not the case, Jose'. I suppose a case could be made to support your argument.... I only know about me...and I have had my share of ups and downs on the ''belief scale'' as you have stated....but i view these down periods as periods that I learned the most about myself, and my resolve of my belief in God.

I don't have a church or specific organized religion that I follow, I just know that I am a Christian....I believe with all my body and soul...I don't even know why, I just know that I do. I am not someone fooled easily either, I am a lover of mathematics and science, tangible things....and i can't even get through any kind of movie, that is just too unrealistic....I have to walk away...but my belief in God seems as real as real can be....and for no solid, sound reason....

I am not ''in it'' for the communion with others, though I suppose I probably should be....the organized Church that i did belong to in my youth, excommunicated me, for divorcing and remarrying...that was 20 years ago....i'm a woman without a country...ummmm i mean, a woman without a Church....

It honestly is, as though I were programmed, to believe....genetically programmed to believe in God....to believe He is real, because I honestly have absolutely no doubt that He is real....how does one explain that...when there is nothing physically to support it? Mental illness? Or trust in my own intuition, or trust in what i believe was revealed to me?

Faith. What you are describing is faith. Unless you have faith, you will never believe in God. Those that do not believe, have no faith.

 

[Avatar4321]

Now I've believed in and blindly followed Christianity my entire life. However I must say that the atheists may have a point. Think about it, if an individual in contemporary society claimed to be the son/daughter of God, would you believe him/her? Many people have claimed to be the son/daughter of God since Jesus, and while some of them had small cult followings, they were never widely accepted as having any relation to God, biological or otherwise. So what makes Jesus Christ so special? Was he just a crazy person who said he was the son of God? Was he just hungry for power and so he impersonated a deity? Or was he the real deal?

Also look at what the Bible says, if God and his disciples love and forgive all, then why do the people who wrote the Bible claim that God hates LGBT individuals? (Corinthians 6:9-10 - "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.") Also, why do those who wrote the Bible also claim God hated women? (Duet 25:11,12 "If a woman grabs a man's privates during a fight, her hand is to be cut off.") Of course, I am not claiming that every word in the Bible is directly from God, but these two instances show some form of hidden set of beliefs that the writers of the Bible wanted to force upon others claiming it's what God wants.

Religion is also a great tool to control people. Religion makes the best slaves, ones who think they are free. Religion was good in the early days of humanity, when people often committed barbaric deeds without remorse (which sadly happens from time to time in the modern world), however now that we have governments that actually work, there is not much need for religious control anymore. I'm not saying I'm an atheist, nor am I a strict Christian (I don't even have a denomination or go to church or have ever read a Bible), but one cannot deny the logic of the atheists. The Bible speaks of seemingly impossible events occurring, which could not have occurred in real life, and many religious ideas have been disproved by science. So is it time that we as people stop believing in fairy tales? Or is religion real?

Im skpetical you actually wrote that. Sounds like something cut and paste.

Not sure how you can possibly interpret any scripture you actually quoted as God hating anyone. Especially considering you admit you havent read them.

As for committing barbaric deeds without remorse, you must have been asleep most of the 20th century which was the bloodiest and most violent century on record.

It seems like you should probably study religion and God before you make a judgment on the matter. I suggest you start by reading the Bible. CS Lewis is good I hear too. Start reading topics. learning about it. And then talk with God about it. Ask Him to show you the truth. Experiment on the Word. Try applying it to your lives and see how it turns out.

If you dont know about something. Learn it. "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God" James 1:5

Experiment if you really want to have an answer to your question.

Or you could simply rely on others to determine whether your salvation is necessary. I figured Id rather find out myself. That's the only reason I know God is real.

 

[Avatar4321]

I wonder how many of the self professed true believers really believe or are they just hedging their bets just in case.

Why don't you just ask us?

 

[Avatar4321]

anyone who truly doesn't believe WHO THINKS they are hedging their bets by saying they do, are in for a big surprise imho....better to be honest, and just say they don't believe...or are unsure or are atheist, again, in my opinion....

I agree. I am a non believer but if you believe you must walk the talk if you expect to get the reward. At least that is my take on it.

You know, this may be hard to believe, but I didn't always walk the straight and narrow uscit, and I still don't....and I still have lots of room for improvement....I am not going to get in to the nitty gritty of it, but just trust me on that.....

However, I would like to believe, if I had died during that ''disappointing to God period'' of my life, that God would have shown Mercy on me, and taken me in, anyway.

I hope and pray we are not judged solely on actions....

I admit, I have done my best to repent and change....NOT because I fear the pains of hell, but because I just don't feel good, when I know I have failed at what God has asked of me....so what comes first, the chicken or the egg? Repentance or forgiveness? For me, it was believing that my sins were undeservedly forgiven, that made me want to repent....that gave me the courage to repent....the knowledge that someone could be so loving and merciful to forgive, made me want to change....

My Father (in Heaven) loved me, like the Prodigal son who went astray....how could I not love and honor Him in return?

I hope we arent judged by actions alone as well.

Ive always said when you feel the love of God and recognize it for what it is, it's very difficult not to love Him. It's nearly impossible to deny Him. I've experienced that love first hand and no one can tell me there is no God, because I know there is. If i said otherwised, I know I would be lying.

 

[Avatar4321]

Whether God really exists or not is beyond the scope of any man or woman to know. Anyone who claims they have the answer to that question is deceiving themselves. Once you have a supposed all powerful entity, than all things are possible and all logic and reason that man uses to prove or disprove things goes out the window.

Religion is man's attempt to quantify God. Like all man-made ventures, it is subject to all the foibles and shortcomings of man.

As history has and continues to show us.

Now do you presume that an All Powerful being has no power to let man or woman know that He is there?

And be fair, how often is logic or reason really used by man? We arent logical beings. We are emotional beings. Why else do you think people are so easily decieved about what's logical or not?

 

[rdean]

Armadillo wrote:

Now I've believed in and blindly followed Christianity my entire life. However I must say that the atheists may have a point

.
Not really. They're some of the most close minded people out there as they're fear of responsibility, and own God complexes refuse to allow them to think of anything greater than themselves.

Think about it, if an individual in contemporary society claimed to be the son/daughter of God, would you believe him/her?

Yup, seen enough proof already in my life.

Also look at what the Bible says, if God and his disciples love and forgive all, then why do the people who wrote the Bible claim that God hates LGBT individuals? (Corinthians 6:9-10 - "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.")

BS, nothing more than RCC revisions. God wouldn't directly contradict the loving, tolerant, peaceful teachings of his own son. Hence that is NOT the real word of God.

Religion is also a great tool to control people. Religion makes the best slaves, ones who think they are free. Religion was good in the early days of humanity, when people often committed barbaric deeds without remorse (which sadly happens from time to time in the modern world), however now that we have governments that actually work, there is not much need for religious control anymore. I'm not saying I'm an atheist, nor am I a strict Christian (I don't even have a denomination or go to church or have ever read a Bible), but one cannot deny the logic of the atheists. The Bible speaks of seemingly impossible events occurring, which could not have occurred in real life, and many religious ideas have been disproved by science. So is it time that we as people stop believing in fairy tales? Or is religion real?

They've already found the remnants of Noah's Arc. Revelations continues to come to pass day by day. JUST LOOK @ CURRENT EVENTS AFTER READING REVELATION.

Also, Atheism makes next to no sense. They continue to lack a real answer of how time and the universe began.

Also, even if God aint real, @ least I would have lived my life tryna do good, charity, right in his name, but if he is (AND HE IS) Atheists are screwed.

It's called Pascol's Proposal. Makes perfect sense.

I know God's real, I've seen, and felt him move thru me and my life to the very bottom of my soul. I have all the proof I need, and feel kinda sorry for you.

Now that is hilarious. Once again proof that American Christianity is "revisionist". Jesus in a Brooks Brothers suit.

Matthew 10:34 "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword"

Sword - even in those days, it was an instrument of death and hostility.

Think about what this means:

Luke 12:47-48 NLT: The servant will be severely punished, for though he knew his duty, he refused to do it. "But people who are not aware that they are doing wrong will be punished only lightly. Much is required from those to whom much is given, and much more is required from those to whom much more is given."

Jesus is saying "Beat the slave, but if they are innocent, then don't beat them too hard".

1 Timothy 6:1-2 NLT: Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them.

This is why many Christians approve a slavery, because apparently, so did Jesus.

So, here was the "Prince of Peace" who says he's not and came with a sword, used a whip to drive people he didn't like out of church and approves a "slavery".

I don't follow such nonsense. I am not one of the "sheeple".

 

[Douger]

Blind faith and utter denial are both forms of irrational thought..........very common in murkins.

 

[geauxtohell]

Whether God really exists or not is beyond the scope of any man or woman to know. Anyone who claims they have the answer to that question is deceiving themselves. Once you have a supposed all powerful entity, than all things are possible and all logic and reason that man uses to prove or disprove things goes out the window.

Religion is man's attempt to quantify God. Like all man-made ventures, it is subject to all the foibles and shortcomings of man.

As history has and continues to show us.

Now do you presume that an All Powerful being has no power to let man or woman know that He is there?

And be fair, how often is logic or reason really used by man? We arent logical beings. We are emotional beings. Why else do you think people are so easily decieved about what's logical or not?

The "letting man or woman know that he is there" is unquantifiable.

People often act unlogically, but on the largest question of life, it has been logically examined since man first looked at the sky.

 

[Montrovant]

Whether religion is real or not is a different question than whether god is real or not.

I don't believe in either, but find the idea of a god far easier to accept than those tenets of religions I've been exposed to.

 

[uscitizen]

anyone who truly doesn't believe WHO THINKS they are hedging their bets by saying they do, are in for a big surprise imho....better to be honest, and just say they don't believe...or are unsure or are atheist, again, in my opinion....

I agree. I am a non believer but if you believe you must walk the talk if you expect to get the reward. At least that is my take on it.

You know, this may be hard to believe, but I didn't always walk the straight and narrow uscit, and I still don't....and I still have lots of room for improvement....I am not going to get in to the nitty gritty of it, but just trust me on that.....

However, I would like to believe, if I had died during that ''disappointing to God period'' of my life, that God would have shown Mercy on me, and taken me in, anyway.

I hope and pray we are not judged solely on actions....

I admit, I have done my best to repent and change....NOT because I fear the pains of hell, but because I just don't feel good, when I know I have failed at what God has asked of me....so what comes first, the chicken or the egg? Repentance or forgiveness? For me, it was believing that my sins were undeservedly forgiven, that made me want to repent....that gave me the courage to repent....the knowledge that someone could be so loving and merciful to forgive, made me want to change....

My Father (in Heaven) loved me, like the Prodigal son who went astray....how could I not love and honor Him in return?

Ohh I know you are not perfect (just close ).
However you see your failings and try to improve and live a life like Christ did.
A Caring, compassionate humanitarian. Not a selfish jerk that basically says let the poor eat cake.

 

[JohnA]

Armadillo wrote:

Now I've believed in and blindly followed Christianity my entire life. However I must say that the atheists may have a point

.
Not really. They're some of the most close minded people out there as they're fear of responsibility, and own God complexes refuse to allow them to think of anything greater than themselves.

Think about it, if an individual in contemporary society claimed to be the son/daughter of God, would you believe him/her?

Yup, seen enough proof already in my life.

Also look at what the Bible says, if God and his disciples love and forgive all, then why do the people who wrote the Bible claim that God hates LGBT individuals? (Corinthians 6:9-10 - "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.")

BS, nothing more than RCC revisions. God wouldn't directly contradict the loving, tolerant, peaceful teachings of his own son. Hence that is NOT the real word of God.

Religion is also a great tool to control people. Religion makes the best slaves, ones who think they are free. Religion was good in the early days of humanity, when people often committed barbaric deeds without remorse (which sadly happens from time to time in the modern world), however now that we have governments that actually work, there is not much need for religious control anymore. I'm not saying I'm an atheist, nor am I a strict Christian (I don't even have a denomination or go to church or have ever read a Bible), but one cannot deny the logic of the atheists. The Bible speaks of seemingly impossible events occurring, which could not have occurred in real life, and many religious ideas have been disproved by science. So is it time that we as people stop believing in fairy tales? Or is religion real?

They've already found the remnants of Noah's Arc. Revelations continues to come to pass day by day. JUST LOOK @ CURRENT EVENTS AFTER READING REVELATION.

Also, Atheism makes next to no sense. They continue to lack a real answer of how time and the universe began.

Also, even if God aint real, @ least I would have lived my life tryna do good, charity, right in his name, but if he is (AND HE IS) Atheists are screwed.

It's called Pascol's Proposal. Makes perfect sense.

I know God's real, I've seen, and felt him move thru me and my life to the very bottom of my soul. I have all the proof I need, and feel kinda sorry for you.

some of what you post concerns me about your insecurity , narrow mindedness, intolarance and superior attitude



First of all cus you conveniantly create a god to answer the question
*how did life start * doesnt make it the right answer


cus atheist dont have a answer as to how life began does.nt make your answer true .

you assume that only believers live there life doing good and athiest dont
many a charity act is performed by non believers they just dont say * doing gods work*

if you feel like you,ve seen and felt god fine if you can live with that its fine with me .

what about other religions when folks say they have felt and seen him and he isnt anything like you discribe why should i take you word over theirs ?
are they disillusioned or are you ?

if i tell you ive seen a invisable yellow unicorn behind my tool shed would you believe me .?

many folks have documented a meeting with aliens
do you believe it? they do and will swear on there lives its true



a child says he saw santa flying over his house with a buggy being pulled by reindeer
do you believe him he believes it why not you ?

pascals wager
will not help him if there is a all knowing all powerfull god (god ) will know pascal is lying and just saying he believes to get the reward
pascal is like a politician tell you what you want to hear .


Pascal's Wager




cus you read something in a book DONT MAKE IT REAL

or are you smoking something

 

[JohnA]

The way I see it is like this... You may have heard this before somewhere else because it is not my original thoughts but I agree with it. I believe in God. If I'm wrong and there is no God, I've looked and sounded pretty silly all of my life. I can live with that. However, if there truly is a God, those that do not believe and frequently slander His name are going to be in some pretty deep shit come Judgement Day. I guess it's what your willing to bet. How much is your soul worth to you?

a lot of folks will be in deep shit if there is a god and the bible is true .other religions say it differant

the bible states only those that believe in the lord jesus christ will go to the kingdom of heaven
so that leaves 2/3 at least of the worlds population plus those who died before the * savior came * going else were .

where is the question ?

didnt the catholics invent hell
to control the masses

 

[uscitizen]

Dante pretty much invented the current image of hell.

 

[AllieBaba]

Armadillo wrote:

Now I've believed in and blindly followed Christianity my entire life. However I must say that the atheists may have a point

.
Not really. They're some of the most close minded people out there as they're fear of responsibility, and own God complexes refuse to allow them to think of anything greater than themselves.


Yup, seen enough proof already in my life.


BS, nothing more than RCC revisions. God wouldn't directly contradict the loving, tolerant, peaceful teachings of his own son. Hence that is NOT the real word of God.

Religion is also a great tool to control people. Religion makes the best slaves, ones who think they are free. Religion was good in the early days of humanity, when people often committed barbaric deeds without remorse (which sadly happens from time to time in the modern world), however now that we have governments that actually work, there is not much need for religious control anymore. I'm not saying I'm an atheist, nor am I a strict Christian (I don't even have a denomination or go to church or have ever read a Bible), but one cannot deny the logic of the atheists. The Bible speaks of seemingly impossible events occurring, which could not have occurred in real life, and many religious ideas have been disproved by science. So is it time that we as people stop believing in fairy tales? Or is religion real?

They've already found the remnants of Noah's Arc. Revelations continues to come to pass day by day. JUST LOOK @ CURRENT EVENTS AFTER READING REVELATION.

Also, Atheism makes next to no sense. They continue to lack a real answer of how time and the universe began.

Also, even if God aint real, @ least I would have lived my life tryna do good, charity, right in his name, but if he is (AND HE IS) Atheists are screwed.

It's called Pascol's Proposal. Makes perfect sense.

I know God's real, I've seen, and felt him move thru me and my life to the very bottom of my soul. I have all the proof I need, and feel kinda sorry for you.

Now that is hilarious. Once again proof that American Christianity is "revisionist". Jesus in a Brooks Brothers suit.

Matthew 10:34 "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword"

Sword - even in those days, it was an instrument of death and hostility.

Think about what this means:

Luke 12:47-48 NLT: The servant will be severely punished, for though he knew his duty, he refused to do it. "But people who are not aware that they are doing wrong will be punished only lightly. Much is required from those to whom much is given, and much more is required from those to whom much more is given."

Jesus is saying "Beat the slave, but if they are innocent, then don't beat them too hard".

1 Timothy 6:1-2 NLT: Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them.

This is why many Christians approve a slavery, because apparently, so did Jesus.

So, here was the "Prince of Peace" who says he's not and came with a sword, used a whip to drive people he didn't like out of church and approves a "slavery".

I don't follow such nonsense. I am not one of the "sheeple".

Oh, yes, you are. You really, REALLY are.

 

[Avatar4321]

Oh, yes, you are. You really, REALLY are.

Seems kind of mean to insult sheeple like that.