Religion and Technology?

Discussion in 'Religion and Ethics' started by eagleseven, Jul 11, 2009.

  1. eagleseven
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    eagleseven Quod Erat Demonstrandum

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    This was borrowed from another thread, but I believe it deserves its own thread.

    What technological advancements have come about because of religion? Here are just a few:

    1. Did religion put Man on the Moon? Yes. The physics that NASA used during the Apollo program was initially developed by Muslim scientists studying in Islamic Schools, funded by clerics, during the Middle Ages. In particular, Ibn al-Haytham is the father of modern optics. Thank him the next time you put on a pair of glasses.

    2. Did religion bring us modern farming? Yes. All of the benefits gained by modern GMO's can be traced back to Fr. Gregor Mendel, a Catholic priest who single-handedly invented the field of genetics. Without the Church's support of Mendel, genetics would've been set back a century or more.

    3. Did religion ever restore a lost leg? Yes. The Ancient Egyptians pioneered the field of medicine and the study of human body. While developing better methods for embalming corpses for the afterlife, they learned far more about the human body than any other civilization, at the time. Next time you break your leg, remember that bone-setting was developed because of an irrational belief in a physical afterlife.


    Even if you are not a believer, you should recognize the important role religion has played in our development as a species.
     
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  2. JBeukema
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    The methodology and ideology of approach were scientific. It was science that brought all of those developments, regardless of the what led to the personal or social need for an answer. It doesn't matter why they wanted to set bones, the fact remains that it was as scientists that they approached the problem and furthered human knowledge [​IMG]
     
  3. eagleseven
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    eagleseven Quod Erat Demonstrandum

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    I think you hit on the crux of the issue right there.

    It doesn't matter in an esoteric discussion of religion and science, true. But the "whys" do matter in the actual "doing" of science. Historically, religion has been the motivator behind many of our critical discoveries.

    And even today, ask any scientist fighting for grant money, the "whys" are still critical. And thus, this thread!
     
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  4. Witty
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    Witty BANNED

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    :lol:

    do you know this ?:
    "
    From the study of the development of human intelligence, in all directions, and through all times, the discovery arises of a great fundamental law, to which it is necessarily subject, and which has a solid foundation of proof, both in the facts of our organization and in our historical experience. The law is this: that each of our leading conceptions - each branch of our knowledge - passes successively through three different stages: the theological, or fictitious; the metaphysical, or abstract; and the scientific, or positive.
    In other words, the human mind, by its nature, employs in its progress three methods of philosophizing, the character of which is essentially different, and even radically opposed: namely, the theological method, the metaphysical, and the positive. Hence arise three philosophies, or general systems of conceptions on the aggregate of phenomena, each of which excludes the others. The first is the necessary point of departure of the human understanding, and the third is its fixed and definitive state. The second is merely a state of transition.

    In the theological state, the human mind, seeking the essential nature of beings, the first and final causes (the origin and purpose) of all effects -- in short, absolute knowledge -- supposes all phenomena to be produced by the immediate action of supernatural beings.

    In the metaphysical state, which is only a modification of the first, the mind supposes, instead of supernatural beings, abstract forces, veritable entities (that is, personified abstractions) inherent in all beings, and capable of producing all phenomena. What is called the explanation of phenomena is, in this stage, a mere reference of each to its proper entity.

    In the final, the positive, state, the mind has given over the vain search after absolute notions, the origin and destination of the universe, and the causes of phenomena, and applies itself to the study of their laws -- that is, their invariable relations of succession and resemblance. Reasoning and observation, duly combined, are the means of this knowledge. What is now understood when we speak of an explanation of facts is simply the establishment of a connection between single phenomena and some general facts, the number of which continually diminishes with the progress of science.
    "
    it wrote some influential philosopher from XIX century

    so human knowledge developed from superstitions [religion] to serious knowledge [empirical science], the same technology from backwardness to developed technique

    if religion is so good for developement of technology then tell me why
    why Islamic countries are most technologically backward and most religious countries in the world ?
     
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  5. JBeukema
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    I used to know the name of the man who describes the three stages you speak of. He also described the development of societies from superstitious to polytheists to monotheists, then metaphysics, and then hopefully some day to reasonable and logical
     
  6. eagleseven
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    eagleseven Quod Erat Demonstrandum

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    Two reasons:
    1. We have developed standardized research methods that are superior to the chaotic research of the pre-enlightenment world.

    2. The Islamic world underwent a philosophical reform in the early 1800s which condemned the developments of Islam of 900-1500AD. When Sunnis rejected the very methods (mentioned in #1) that they had originally developed, they rapidly were eclipsed in technology, resulting in the collapse of their empire.

    P.S. The US is one of the most religious countries in the world, and has been at the forefront of technology for nearly a decade. If religion is so detrimental to development, how can America be leading the world in technology?
     
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  7. Witty
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    :clap2: so we both know who wrote above-cited words

    to eagleseven, I like people which in the discussion try to use arguments and not emotions
    but you probably don't know that Mendel came from poor family and only way for him to end studies and be a biologist was go to monastery (it was one from examples of harmful religion's influence on social system)

    but when ?

    whether this did not take place within a period of modern time when people began to reject the religion ?

    and whether in Middle Ages our level of research methods weren't very similar to level of research methods of today Islam ?

    but most of high developed countries are irreligiously - Western Europe, and in Europe again most poor countries are most religious, like Portugal or Poland

    the religiousness of americas is an indication of the backwardness - see South America, their religiousness is much stronger then in Europe and most of these countries are very backward (below level of Portugal), Islamic countries are even more religious then in South America so they are also poorer

    N.America is less religious so it is richer, and most rich countries (richer then USA) like Norway are irreligious

    there exist such rule that
    religiousness = indigence, because religiousness = backwardness

    if religion isn't harmful for PROGRESS then tell me why religious people in US are attacking some fundamental conceptions of Science like theory of Evolution ? it is the same like somebody started to attack theory of relativity in Physics. These are attacks on Science and if on Science then also on Technology and richness.
     
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  8. eagleseven
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    eagleseven Quod Erat Demonstrandum

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    Thank you! I think the same way.
    I would argue that the Church's heirarchy based upon merit, not bloodline, combined with it's preservation of Classical knowledge, enabled Mendel far more than it handicapped him.


    From 800AD to 1600AD, Islamic science far outclassed Western alchemy. From 1600AD to present, Western scientific method far outclassed Islamic science.

    We stand on the shoulders of giants, as they say.

    I would argue that it is wealth that kills religion, not science. How so? Look at the timeline.

    1600-1800AD Christian scientists develop nearly all modern scientific disciplines.

    1700-1900AD Industrialists convert this technological development to historically unprecedented wealth.

    1800AD-2009AD Philosophers living with these new riches declare "God is Dead!"

    1950AD-2009AD The people of Europe, being the objectively richest people who ever lived, agree that "God is Dead!"

    Because religion does not respond rapidly to change. Religion was developed during a time of human history when world-changing discoveries were made every few centuries. Thus, religion adapts to changes across generations.

    Thanks to our newfound wealth, world-changing discoveries are made every few years. Religion is having a very difficult time keeping up, and so many religious are resisting the changes. Ultimately, this is because humans are not adapted to dealing with continuous, rapid change.

    Why do you think nearly 1/3 of Americans are on anti-depressants? Our biology is having a difficult time coping with our modern lifestyle, brought about by abundant wealth.
     
  9. Witty
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    Witty BANNED

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    of course, words:
    came from Course of Positive Philosophy (1830-1842) which wrote A.Comte

    so read again this
    science kills religion and must kill religion because religion contain only superstitions, to believe in god it is the same like to believe that earth is a center of universe

    wealth comes from progress, progress from science, so both science and wealth are enemies of religion

    GOD IS DEAD BECAUSE SCIENCE AND WEALTH KILLED HIM

    your timeline is a little incorrect:

    300 BC - 300 AD godless ancient science and technics is developing

    500 AD - 1500 AD religion is winning, Dark Ages, development of Science and Technics is blocked (in 800-1000 AD was developing 'Islamic science' but development isn't big and quickly was ended)

    1600-1800AD scientists prepared many of modern scientific disciplines
    (many of them were chiristians but they had the same reasons like Mendel to be 'christian')

    1800AD-2009AD Science comes through period of huge development so religion is slowly daying

    People with open minds react quickly on changes, people with closed-minds don't react at all - religion was, is and will has many against science because religion is irrational and science rational
     
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  10. JBeukema
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    Science leaves less gaps in which god can hide
     

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