Reducing the National Debt

[tenthertoo]

Trying to even get a handle on the magnitude of the ND is a real challenge. Most of us, I think, can't even get what $16,000,000,000,000 (did I get it right) really is.

It's a number that defies comprehension.

From here down all numbers are approximate.(and many probably wrong - remember I'm just a retired working stiff)

The debt is NOW more than 100% of GDP. A number most said just a short time ago would put Greece into default. Many believe that the ND should be no more than 70% of GDP.

Let's start there. 70% would be about $11 trillion. So let's look at what it would take to get there.

Our current deficit is running 1.4 -1.5 trillion a year. To get the ND down to we'd have to generate an annual surplus of 100 billion a year for 50 years. That would require a turn around of 1.5 - 1.6 trillion a year.

Of course the task is aggravated by several very significant issues.

• Current interest of Fed notes is about 1/2 of 1 % - The average is about 5%. At that rate the interest would be 100 billion a year more that would have to be added to the 1.5 trillion turn around number (sheesh I'm getting out of breath)
• Taking more than 2 trillion out of the economy would create a loss in federal revenue of (about) 200 billion?? - we'll have to add THAT to the turn around number
• And many more I'm sure the fertile minds on the forum will add

I got lost somewhere in the second paragraph so y'all help me out here!

 

[Steelplate]

Increasing the tax base would be a great place to start. C'mon private sector... bring back the good paying jobs so currently unemployed people can start doing their part in lowering the National Debt.

Oh.... that's right. They are allowed to profiteer.. I forgot.

 

[DiamondDave]

Increasing the tax base would be a great place to start. C'mon private sector... bring back the good paying jobs so currently unemployed people can start doing their part in lowering the National Debt.

Oh.... that's right. They are allowed to profiteer.. I forgot.

Yes increasing the tax base.. implementing the flat tax with zero exceptions, zero loopholes, and no salary floor

BUT that is only a start... because we have a spending problem... we have to reduce the spending and the size of government DRASTICALLY for ANYTHING to work in debt reduction

 

[tenthertoo]

Increasing the tax base would be a great place to start. C'mon private sector... bring back the good paying jobs so currently unemployed people can start doing their part in lowering the National Debt.

Oh.... that's right. They are allowed to profiteer.. I forgot.

That would require an increase in the GDP of 12 - 15 trillion a year for 50 years or about an increase in the GDP of 80 - 100% (if I figured it out right?) ROTSARUCK

 

[Steelplate]

Increasing the tax base would be a great place to start. C'mon private sector... bring back the good paying jobs so currently unemployed people can start doing their part in lowering the National Debt.

Oh.... that's right. They are allowed to profiteer.. I forgot.

That would require an increase in the GDP of 12 - 15 trillion a year or about an increase in the GDP of 80 - 100% (if I figured it out right?) ROTSARUCK

Oh... you want it to be paid back overnight? Wow... even a mortgage holder gets 30 years nowadays.

 

[Steelplate]

Increasing the tax base would be a great place to start. C'mon private sector... bring back the good paying jobs so currently unemployed people can start doing their part in lowering the National Debt.

Oh.... that's right. They are allowed to profiteer.. I forgot.

Yes increasing the tax base.. implementing the flat tax with zero exceptions, zero loopholes, and no salary floor

BUT that is only a start... because we have a spending problem... we have to reduce the spending and the size of government DRASTICALLY for ANYTHING to work in debt reduction

Yep... the Conservative Mantra... Damned poor people... they need to pay up!

 

[Misty]

"On Sept. 18, 1789, the new secretary of the treasury, Alexander Hamilton, entered into negotiations for a temporary loan with the Bank of New York and the Bank of North America—the only two banks in the country at that time. The following February, the deal went through and the government borrowed $19,608.81. It was the start of the American national debt."

Good luck getting rid of it. Lol

 

[merrill]

The debt is not a big deal depending on how the money is spent.

Covering the cost of preferential tax breaks and wars for oil = tax dollar moneyholes

Creating new USA industry that stays in the USA = investment in the USA.

 

[DontBeStupid]

There is no reason we need to pay down our national debt.

 

[tenthertoo]

Increasing the tax base would be a great place to start. C'mon private sector... bring back the good paying jobs so currently unemployed people can start doing their part in lowering the National Debt.

Oh.... that's right. They are allowed to profiteer.. I forgot.

That would require an increase in the GDP of 12 - 15 trillion a year or about an increase in the GDP of 80 - 100% (if I figured it out right?) ROTSARUCK

Oh... you want it to be paid back overnight? Wow... even a mortgage holder gets 30 years nowadays.

NO - no 50 years

 

[M14 Shooter]

Increasing the tax base would be a great place to start. C'mon private sector... bring back the good paying jobs so currently unemployed people can start doing their part in lowering the National Debt.
Oh.... that's right. They are allowed to profiteer.. I forgot.

You do know that profits do not necessarily equate to the ability to add jobs - right?
Oh wait - if you did, you would not have posted what you posted.
Never mind.

 

[merrill]

REaganomics/Wreckanomics is a moneyhole...

 

[M14 Shooter]

The debt is NOW more than 100% of GDP. A number most said just a short time ago would put Greece into default. Many believe that the ND should be no more than 70% of GDP.

No one is really concerned about paying back the debt, especially those most likely to tell you that your great-great grankids will have to do so (but only the debt run up by Repiblicans - debt run up by Dems is OK).

No... eventually the debt will cause an economic and then societal and then governmental collapse - a small price to pay just to maintain (relatively) short-term partisan political power.

Convert your 401k to ammunition - it will someday be the only valid currency.

 

[tenthertoo]

There is no reason we need to pay down our national debt.

True, my State repudiated its debt in the 1880's - I understand ilDuce repudiated his COUNTRY's debt in the 30's (I think)

I do think the consequences would be a disaster however

 

[M14 Shooter]

REaganomics/Wreckanomics is a moneyhole...

Obamanomics is a black hole.

 

[DontBeStupid]

There is no reason we need to pay down our national debt.

True, my State repudiated its debt in the 1880's - I understand ilDuce repudiated his COUNTRY's debt in the 30's (I think)

I do think the consequences would be a disaster however

No need to do that either.

If we hand our grandkids a debt of $20T when they have a GDP of $45T, absolutely no one will be complaining.

 

[DiamondDave]

Increasing the tax base would be a great place to start. C'mon private sector... bring back the good paying jobs so currently unemployed people can start doing their part in lowering the National Debt.

Oh.... that's right. They are allowed to profiteer.. I forgot.

Yes increasing the tax base.. implementing the flat tax with zero exceptions, zero loopholes, and no salary floor

BUT that is only a start... because we have a spending problem... we have to reduce the spending and the size of government DRASTICALLY for ANYTHING to work in debt reduction

Yep... the Conservative Mantra... Damned poor people... they need to pay up!

Damned conservative mantra... everyone with a stake in the game and equal treatment by government blind to money or situation....

Terrible, I tell you... TERRIBLE

Beats your progressive mantra of equal treatment when it benefits you, and unequal treatment of others when it benefits you

 

[M14 Shooter]

There is no reason we need to pay down our national debt.

True, my State repudiated its debt in the 1880's - I understand ilDuce repudiated his COUNTRY's debt in the 30's (I think)

I do think the consequences would be a disaster however

No need to do that either.

If we hand our grandkids a debt of $20T when they have a GDP of $45T, absolutely no one will be complaining.

I see... your solution is to propose fantastic scenarios that have absolutely no chance of actually happening, and then pretend you've offered a real solution.



With the current deficits, $20T debt will be here is 5 years or less.
How, exactly, do you propose tripling our GDP by 2017?

 

[DontBeStupid]

There is no reason we need to pay down our national debt.

I see DiamondDave is right on schedule. I post a comment and he neg reps it, regardless of content.

See, if Dave had read my post and thought about it, he would have realized that the vast majority of our National Debt we owe to ourselves in the form of bonds. For most people, these bonds offer a safe investment vehicle that they can use to help in retirement. Paying off the debt means eliminating ALL of these bonds. Eliminating a safe retirement option for many Americans.

Why?

Why Dave? Why do you not want Americans to be able to safely save for retirement? Do you want them to only be able to go to Wall Street? Is that it?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Yes increasing the tax base.. implementing the flat tax with zero exceptions, zero loopholes, and no salary floor

BUT that is only a start... because we have a spending problem... we have to reduce the spending and the size of government DRASTICALLY for ANYTHING to work in debt reduction

Yep... the Conservative Mantra... Damned poor people... they need to pay up!

Damned conservative mantra... everyone with a stake in the game and equal treatment by government blind to money or situation....

Terrible, I tell you... TERRIBLE

Beats your progressive mantra of equal treatment when it benefits you, and unequal treatment of others when it benefits you

The liberal social agenda is founded upon dissimilar treatment of people as an effot to gain and retain as much partisan political power as possible - it's exceptionally easy to get the 'have-nots' to vote for you when you promise to give them everything they want and force the 'haves' pay for it.