Recreational Marijuana Measure To Be Put To Voters...

[GuyPinestra]

Drug users are coddled and protected too much. They cost way more than they should if they just died young. Increase the number of drug related deaths, decrease the number of users.

The War on Drugs was a feeble attempt to protect non-users from users. Time to end that nonsense. Let people protect themselves from users. It won't take long before the prisons and hospitals are half empty.

Domestic terrorism and murder in the streets, wonderful thing to encourage.

People have to be permitted to protect themselves. That goes without saying. We have plenty of murder in the streets as it is. Drug users die young. Many times as teen agers. Legalize the stuff and in a remarkably short time the problem will have mostly solved itself with just some peripheral law enforcement necessary.

People are ALREADY 'permitted' to protect themselves, unless you live in New York or something. Concealed carry permits are SKYROCKETING. You sound as if you'd support some 'extracurricular' vigilantism. You really do have control issues, where's your cry for freedom?

 

[Spectre13]

If they did it nationally they could eliminate 70% of the drug cartels profits and balance the budget with the taxes it would generate. Additionally, it would allow the agricultural exploitation of hemp in this country, and open up new avenues in pharmaceuticals, as well.

But they'd rather turn normal folks into criminals, supporting our record as the most imprisoned people on the planet, and continue allowing the cartels to make BILLIONS of dollars that can be used for the usurpation of the governments south of the border.

It also doesn't hurt that the CIA can move TONS of drugs surreptitiously and use THEIR profits for their black budget, illegal operations.

Besides all that, I am tired of paying through the nose for Hydro! the only reason it is high is because they can get away with it. Anyone could grow great weed these days. I don't need some other potential drain on my cash resources, which are low due to the traitors in Congress and Wall Street. I would rather just grow my own and not have to go outside my home to get my smoke.

 

[GuyPinestra]

I think it is incredibly naive to believe consumption would not rise if a drug were legalized. That is an expression of ignorance of human behavior, which is common among libertarians.

Until drunk driving punishments were made more harsh, there was a lot more drunk driving. That drunk driving declined with enforcement means there are people for whom the only thing stopping them from drunk driving is the law.

The law is a deterrent. People's behavior will change with the repeal of a law.

Believing that alcohol consumption figures for before and after the repeal of Prohibition is evidence that drug use won't rise is erroneous thinking because Prohibition was not enforced anywhere near the level drug prohibition is. Alcohol prohibition enforcement was a running joke.

Drug prohibition enforcement is an even BIGGER joke. After 40 years of the 'War on Drugs' they are cheaper, easier to get and there are more people using AND abusing than EVER.

 

[Katzndogz]

Domestic terrorism and murder in the streets, wonderful thing to encourage.

People have to be permitted to protect themselves. That goes without saying. We have plenty of murder in the streets as it is. Drug users die young. Many times as teen agers. Legalize the stuff and in a remarkably short time the problem will have mostly solved itself with just some peripheral law enforcement necessary.

People are ALREADY 'permitted' to protect themselves, unless you live in New York or something. Concealed carry permits are SKYROCKETING. You sound as if you'd support some 'extracurricular' vigilantism. You really do have control issues, where's your cry for freedom?

It seems like extracirricular vigilantism is a freedom!

If we had legalized drugs, we'd have more of this kind of comic relief

Naked Man Arrested After Fighting With Officers « CBS Sacramento

Users deserve all the freedom to use FREE drugs that they can possibly take, and then the freedom to die quite young. It had to be free or at exceptionally low cost otherwise illegal dealers will surely undercut the legal trade.

 

[Mr. Jones]

If folks want to smoke MJ, and there are loads who do, I really could care less.

I am more worried about that open door.

Once you legalize one drug how long before someone is pushing for legalizing heroin, meth or any of the other drugs out there??

If heroin or meth were legal would you go out and buy some?

You do realize that those drugs are just as easy to get as marijuana, don't you? All the folks that want to use them are ALREADY using them, legalizing them and treating addiction like the MEDICAL problem it is wouldn't increase the use of those drugs one bit.

I wouldn't take that shit if they were giving it away.

Medical problem my ass. Its a stupidity problem and you can't fix stupid.

I'm sure not interested in paying for some stupid fuckers rehab either.

Hemp with high CBD content for medicinal purposes, as well as job producing industrial uses is good for the country, and is a starting point for cannibis legalization.
What most are ignorant of is the fact that the plants with high THC levels, are not as good or effective, for medicinal use, but the DEA and government does not seem to distinguish between the 2.
That is why millions of tax dollars are wasted paying agents to pull hemp weeds that wouldn't get you high if you smoked a pound of it, but would actually be beneficial in many ways, such as have been stated in this thread already.

Feds' Pot Eradication Program Seizes Nothing But Ditchweed Hemp, Not Marijuana Focus of DEA Effort, Report Shows

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgEP9FdIzT8&feature=player_embedded]The Power of RAW Cannabis. - YouTube[/ame]

 

[GuyPinestra]

People have to be permitted to protect themselves. That goes without saying. We have plenty of murder in the streets as it is. Drug users die young. Many times as teen agers. Legalize the stuff and in a remarkably short time the problem will have mostly solved itself with just some peripheral law enforcement necessary.

People are ALREADY 'permitted' to protect themselves, unless you live in New York or something. Concealed carry permits are SKYROCKETING. You sound as if you'd support some 'extracurricular' vigilantism. You really do have control issues, where's your cry for freedom?

It seems like extracirricular vigilantism is a freedom!

If we had legalized drugs, we'd have more of this kind of comic relief

Naked Man Arrested After Fighting With Officers « CBS Sacramento

Users deserve all the freedom to use FREE drugs that they can possibly take, and then the freedom to die quite young. It had to be free or at exceptionally low cost otherwise illegal dealers will surely undercut the legal trade.

So you're all in favor of vigilantism?

How about if it was being practiced AGAINST you?

You'd be all for it then too, right?

 

[Mr. Shaman]

I'm all for people being allowed to do whatever they want - unless I have to pick up their tab. Like it or not, there is a vast amount of evidence of the very real damage that drugs - even MJ - do to individuals. I am NOT going to pay for some other fucking idiots' stupid life choices.

Either way you're still paying for them. You're paying for an overreaching, unconsitutional, government-run "War on Drugs". You're paying to lock up thousands of people... feeding them, clothing them, and buying them porn. You'll pay much less if we take a more common sense approach to the problem and treat Marijuana like what it is, a drug. Nothing more, nothing less. We ALL should be free to make stupid mistakes, and free to face the consequences of those mistakes... personal responsability.

The War on Drugs was a feeble attempt to protect non-users from users.

Yeah...."protecting" White kids from "mixing" with minorities.....and, it didn't work.

Eventually, we all got to figuring-out we weren't all that different from each other; the great tragedy o' the late-'60s/early-'70s.....from which "conservatives" STILL haven't "recovered".​

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Either way you're still paying for them. You're paying for an overreaching, unconsitutional, government-run "War on Drugs". You're paying to lock up thousands of people... feeding them, clothing them, and buying them porn. You'll pay much less if we take a more common sense approach to the problem and treat Marijuana like what it is, a drug. Nothing more, nothing less. We ALL should be free to make stupid mistakes, and free to face the consequences of those mistakes... personal responsability.

Drug users are coddled and protected too much. They cost way more than they should if they just died young. Increase the number of drug related deaths, decrease the number of users.

The War on Drugs was a feeble attempt to protect non-users from users. Time to end that nonsense. Let people protect themselves from users. It won't take long before the prisons and hospitals are half empty.

Domestic terrorism and murder in the streets, wonderful thing to encourage.

Gee.....you're accusing Americans of NOT learning from the past!!!!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tW1_TNVsSSI]HISTORY OF THE AMERICAN GANGSTER - YouTube[/ame]​

 

[g5000]

I think it is incredibly naive to believe consumption would not rise if a drug were legalized. That is an expression of ignorance of human behavior, which is common among libertarians.

Until drunk driving punishments were made more harsh, there was a lot more drunk driving. That drunk driving declined with enforcement means there are people for whom the only thing stopping them from drunk driving is the law.

The law is a deterrent. People's behavior will change with the repeal of a law.

Believing that alcohol consumption figures for before and after the repeal of Prohibition is evidence that drug use won't rise is erroneous thinking because Prohibition was not enforced anywhere near the level drug prohibition is. Alcohol prohibition enforcement was a running joke.

Drug prohibition enforcement is an even BIGGER joke. After 40 years of the 'War on Drugs' they are cheaper, easier to get and there are more people using AND abusing than EVER.

Links please. In 1980, a dime bag of pot (half an ounce) was called a dime bag because it cost ten bucks. How much is a dime bag now? Do they still call it a dime bag?

An ounce cost 20 bucks in 1980.

How much does an ounce cost now in 1980 dollars?

A line of cocaine was one dollar in 1980. How much is it now?

What is the rate of increase of drug use compared to the rate of increase in population?

You made some big claims, they need big evidence to support them.

 

[Dr.Drock]

I think it is incredibly naive to believe consumption would not rise if a drug were legalized. That is an expression of ignorance of human behavior, which is common among libertarians.

Until drunk driving punishments were made more harsh, there was a lot more drunk driving. That drunk driving declined with enforcement means there are people for whom the only thing stopping them from drunk driving is the law.

The law is a deterrent. People's behavior will change with the repeal of a law.

Believing that alcohol consumption figures for before and after the repeal of Prohibition is evidence that drug use won't rise is erroneous thinking because Prohibition was not enforced anywhere near the level drug prohibition is. Alcohol prohibition enforcement was a running joke.

I think it's incredibly naive to believe consumption would rise if a drug were legalized.

I'm 26, so high school wasn't that long ago for me, guess what was easier for me to get, weed or cigarrettes? Alcohol or cocaine? I never did drugs but they were readily available and i could've done the illegal ones every day if i wanted to. I went to a typical high school, not inner city.

A drug dealer doesn't give a shit how old you are, or if you're sick.

 

[g5000]

According to this conversion website, 20 1980 dollars are equal to $50.37 in 2007 money.

Does an ounce of pot cost $50.37 these days?

Not even close, according to this web site.

It costs about 5 times that much.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

I think many people would, hell yes.

Would you go out and buy heroin and meth if they were legal? You are the only person that you can speak for.

I no longer consume intoxicants. Not even legal ones. I don't even smoke cigarettes any more.

In my younger days, I consumed intoxicants on a regular basis. And I would most certainly have been out in the streets smoking a doobie if pot had been made legal. My dope consumption would have skyrocketed from zero to near infinity if it was legalized and the military allowed it.

I'd probably try coke as well. Meth, maybe. And the way a heroin trip is depicted in films, I would probably give it a whirl.

And I am surely not the only person who feels the same way and would react the same way.

You have to be an idiot to think this would not happen.

So, you fancy yourself some kind o' "closeted"-outlaw.....who ended-up pussy-whipped, right??​

 

[g5000]

i could've done the illegal ones every day if i wanted to.

Key word, "could've".

Could have =/= did. As I said, the law is a deterrent. Just because you CAN do something does not mean you do.

Once the legal barrier is removed, you have to be pretty naive to believe usage would remain the same. You have to believe current law is not a deterrent at all.

 

[Dr.Drock]

i could've done the illegal ones every day if i wanted to.

Key word, "could've".

Could have =/= did. As I said, the law is a deterrent. Just because you CAN do something does not mean you do.

Once the legal barrier is removed, you have to be pretty naive to believe usage would remain the same. You have to believe current law is not a deterrent at all.

Legal barrier isn't the only thing, tons more kids smoked weed in my high school and even middle school than smoked cigarrettes. It wasn't even close, marijuana was a very casual thing.

And it wasn't the legal barrier, i drank tons of times before 21. I just had never had the curiosity to get high.

Availability matters way more than legal barrier, and with only having a black market drugs are readily available to kids. Make drugs legal, black market vanishes (as long as taxes aren't too high) and you have regulated drugs like alcohol and cigs and the availability to kids plummets.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

I think it is incredibly naive to believe consumption would not rise if a drug were legalized..

...Short-term, more than likely.....just like after alcohol Prohibition ended.

Eventually, people are gonna settle for whatever "medicine" gets 'em thru-the-day....just ask Porky Limbaugh.

Hell, I remember many people (during the late-'60s) who had reputations as bar-fighters....who calmed-down, significantly, after they first started smokin' Pot! Most everyone (around them) appreciated it, as well.​

 

[manifold]

If they did it nationally they could eliminate 70% of the drug cartels profits and balance the budget with the taxes it would generate. Additionally, it would allow the agricultural exploitation of hemp in this country, and open up new avenues in pharmaceuticals, as well.

But they'd rather turn normal folks into criminals, supporting our record as the most imprisoned people on the planet, and continue allowing the cartels to make BILLIONS of dollars that can be used for the usurpation of the governments south of the border.

It also doesn't hurt that the CIA can move TONS of drugs surreptitiously and use THEIR profits for their black budget, illegal operations.

I'm all for people being allowed to do whatever they want - unless I have to pick up their tab. Like it or not, there is a vast amount of evidence of the very real damage that drugs - even MJ - do to individuals. I am NOT going to pay for some other fucking idiots' stupid life choices.

If there is such a VAST amount of this evidence surely you could post some of it to bolster your argument?

You must be new here.

 

[manifold]

If folks want to smoke MJ, and there are loads who do, I really could care less.

I am more worried about that open door.

Once you legalize one drug how long before someone is pushing for legalizing heroin, meth or any of the other drugs out there??

That's a bit of a red herring argument.

Alcohol, tobacco and caffeine have been legal for a long time without hurling us over any slippery slope.

 

[BlindBoo]

I'm all for people being allowed to do whatever they want - unless I have to pick up their tab. Like it or not, there is a vast amount of evidence of the very real damage that drugs - even MJ - do to individuals. I am NOT going to pay for some other fucking idiots' stupid life choices.

Either way you're still paying for them. You're paying for an overreaching, unconsitutional, government-run "War on Drugs". You're paying to lock up thousands of people... feeding them, clothing them, and buying them porn. You'll pay much less if we take a more common sense approach to the problem and treat Marijuana like what it is, a drug. Nothing more, nothing less. We ALL should be free to make stupid mistakes, and free to face the consequences of those mistakes... personal responsability.

Drug users are coddled and protected too much. They cost way more than they should if they just died young. Increase the number of drug related deaths, decrease the number of users.

The War on Drugs was a feeble attempt to protect non-users from users. Time to end that nonsense. Let people protect themselves from users. It won't take long before the prisons and hospitals are half empty.

Nixon's war on Drugs was a war on the anti-war protesters. Carter wanted to decrminialize it and we still see the treatment the neo-cons give him.
To Raygun, it was all about big business. Has been ever since.

People have alway used drugs as a form of entertainment and alway will. The only way to stop it is a hard line police state. Which is where we are going.

 

[GuyPinestra]

I think it is incredibly naive to believe consumption would not rise if a drug were legalized. That is an expression of ignorance of human behavior, which is common among libertarians.

Until drunk driving punishments were made more harsh, there was a lot more drunk driving. That drunk driving declined with enforcement means there are people for whom the only thing stopping them from drunk driving is the law.

The law is a deterrent. People's behavior will change with the repeal of a law.

Believing that alcohol consumption figures for before and after the repeal of Prohibition is evidence that drug use won't rise is erroneous thinking because Prohibition was not enforced anywhere near the level drug prohibition is. Alcohol prohibition enforcement was a running joke.

Drug prohibition enforcement is an even BIGGER joke. After 40 years of the 'War on Drugs' they are cheaper, easier to get and there are more people using AND abusing than EVER.

Links please. In 1980, a dime bag of pot (half an ounce) was called a dime bag because it cost ten bucks. How much is a dime bag now? Do they still call it a dime bag?

An ounce cost 20 bucks in 1980.

How much does an ounce cost now in 1980 dollars?

A line of cocaine was one dollar in 1980. How much is it now?

What is the rate of increase of drug use compared to the rate of increase in population?

You made some big claims, they need big evidence to support them.

Ha ha ha, I don't know where you grew up, but most folks I know weren't smoking that dirt weed in the 80's. It was the heyday of the Emerald Triangle. Ounces of Humboldt Sinsemilla were $200, Ounces of Colombian Red were $40.

Prices for comparable quality today are about the same, with the best hybrids getting about $400 an ounce.

As for cocaine, I've never seen the cost breakdown per line, but back in the 80's an ounce of very clean Bolivian flake was about $2,000, grams were $125.

Today, the same cocaine costs as little as $40-50 a gram.

 

[Spectre13]

If folks want to smoke MJ, and there are loads who do, I really could care less.

I am more worried about that open door.

Once you legalize one drug how long before someone is pushing for legalizing heroin, meth or any of the other drugs out there??

In Denmark, it is treated as a disease and treated like one. They have less problems with drugs than we do and it is legal there. The government does not waste it's time with drug problems and are better off for it. I think we should do the same.