• The Israeli Provisional Government declared independence over a portion of the territory formerly under the Mandate of Palestine. Whereas, the APG declaration of independence over the entire landscape of Palestine.P F Tinmore, et al,
Oh, come on --- get with it. Just as a point of clarification and correction: The Gaza Strip was the Palestinian, as defined by the order in Council, land before, during, and after Egyptian occupation.
(COMMENT)Not true. Egypt never annexed the Gaza strip into Egypt. Egypt relinquished control not sovereignty. The Gaza Strip was Palestinian land before, during, and after Egyptian occupation.
First, I never said that Egypt Annexed anything. IF you go back to Posting #76, you will find that I mentioned the Egyptian Military Governorship and not annexation. Below are excepts from three independent sources.
At first the Gaza Strip was officially administered by the All-Palestine Government, established by the Arab League in September 1948. All-Palestine in the Gaza Strip was managed under the military authority of Egypt, functioning as puppet state, until it officially merged into the United Arab Republic and dissolved in 1959. From the time of the dissolution of the All-Palestine Government until 1967, the Gaza Strip was directly administered by an Egyptian military governor. Israel captured the Gaza Strip from Egypt in the Six-Day War in 1967.
Gaza came under Egyptian rule until it was occupied by Israel during the 1967 Six Day War. Gaza became a center of political resistance during the First Intifada, and under the Oslo Accords of 1993, it was assigned to be under the direct control of the newly established Palestinian Authority.
The Gaza Strip was under Egyptian military rule from 1949 to 1956 and again from 1957 to 1967.
RoccoR said:Even the Arab Palestinians declined to declare independence (another example of Arab Palestinian "right to self-determination").
(COMMENT)Not true. The Palestinians declared independence in 1948. That was after the Mandate left Palestine and the UNPC failed to take control. And it was before the UN officially divided Palestine into three areas of occupation in the 1949 armistice agreements.
This is so screwed-up that it needs scrapped and rewritten. Lets just make this clear. No matter what the All-Palestine Government (APG) is claimed to represent, in order to endow the government with legitimacy, a Palestinian National Council was convened in Gaza on 30 September 1948, under the chairmanship of the Mufti of Jerusalem. The council, in a mood of great elation, passed a series of resolutions culminating in a declaration of independence over the whole of Palestine. BUT, there are two flaws that collapse the APG theory of legitimacy:
• The Israeli Provisional Government declared independence over a portion of the territory formerly under the Mandate of Palestine. Whereas, the APG declaration of independence over the entire landscape of Palestine.In Cairo, the Government of All-Palestine gradually fell apart because of its impotence, ending up four years later as a department of the Arab League. Thereafter, it continued to exist in name only until Egypt's President Gamal Abdel Nasser closed its offices in 1959.
• A right to independence exercised in May 1948 pursuant to the UN Steps Preparatory to Independence, supersedes.
∆ No matter what "rights" the Arab Palestinians claim, Palestinian "rights" cannot negate the freedom of the the Jewish People to exercise their "right of self-determination" and their freedom to establish the Jewish National Home.
∆ The APG failed to legitimize their September 1948 claim over the May 1948 claim by the Israelis.
Most Respectfully,
R
What was Israel's defined territory? Is there any definition or map of this territory?
How did Israel legally acquire its defined territory?
Why does every map of Israel use the 1949 armistice lines (that are specifically not the be political or territorial boundaries?) Why don't they use the borders of Israel's defined territory?
P F Tinmore, et al,
You keep dredging up this old argument, as if it has been discussed ten dozen times.
(COMMENT)What was Israel's defined territory? Is there any definition or map of this territory?
On the 15 MAY 1952, the Provisional Government of Israel filed a message in accordance with the Steps Preparatory to Independence, making a Declaratory Statement of Independence with the boundaries as outlined in Part 2 - Boundaries. The Arab League launch 5 Armies simultaneously towards the new State of Israel, violating Chapter I of the UN Charter; constituting acts of aggression and the inappropriate use of actual force on the territorial integrity of Israel.
(COMMENT)How did Israel legally acquire its defined territory?
Israel seized control of territory while in hot pursuit of the Arab League forces retreated.
(COMMENT)Why does every map of Israel use the 1949 armistice lines (that are specifically not the be political or territorial boundaries?) Why don't they use the borders of Israel's defined territory?
Actually, thee international community, less the Arab League, use the International Boundaries that are actually maintained by the Peace Treaties with Jordan and Egypt. The countries of Syria and Lebanon, still maintaining the Three-No's Doctrine, still use Armistice Lines as temporary boundaries, as is done elsewhere in the world.
(COMMENT)Without clear answers to the above, the Palestinians had every right to declare independence in all of Palestine as defined by its international borders.
The All-Palestine Government does not exist. It's invalid 1948 claim dissolved with APG. It was dissolved back in 1959. It was not until 1988 that the PLO Declared Independence and it is generally recognized by the UN as the territory occupied since 1967.
Part of being a defined border is that you must be able to articulate it on the ground and actually control the boundary.
Normally, boundaries are established by some agreement (not always). The Palestinians have no agreements with either Egypt or Jordan. However Israel does and has internationally recognized boundaries by treaty.
Most Respectfully,
RPart of being a defined border is that you must be able to articulate it on the ground and actually control the boundary.
Not true.
ARTICLE 4
States are juridically equal, enjoy the same rights, and have equal capacity in their exercise. The rights of each one do not depend upon the power which it possesses to assure its exercise, but upon the simple fact of its existence as a person under international law.
The Avalon Project : Convention on Rights and Duties of States (inter-American); December 26, 1933
Link does not apply as it only deals with the America's and not the rest of the world.