Reasons for Staying on the Fence with Respect to CAGW

IanC

Gold Member
Sep 22, 2009
11,061
1,344
245
Matt Ridley's informative lecture is worth reading. I hope a video comes out.

- Bishop Hill blog - Scientific heresy

some qoutes-

What sustains pseudoscience is confirmation bias. We look for and welcome the evidence that fits our pet theory; we ignore or question the evidence that contradicts it. We all do this all the time. It’s not, as we often assume, something that only our opponents indulge in. I do it, you do it, it takes a superhuman effort not to do it. That is what keeps myths alive, sustains conspiracy theories and keeps whole populations in thrall to strange superstitions.

Bertrand Russell* pointed this out many years ago: “If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence.”
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts", said Richard Feynman.

Lesson 6. Never rely on the consensus of experts about the future. Experts are worth listening to about the past, but not the future. Futurology is pseudoscience.
So what’s the problem? The problem is that you can accept all the basic tenets of greenhouse physics and still conclude that the threat of a dangerously large warming is so improbable as to be negligible, while the threat of real harm from climate-mitigation policies is already so high as to be worrying, that the cure is proving far worse than the disease is ever likely to be. Or as I put it once, we may be putting a tourniquet round our necks to stop a nosebleed.
To see confirmation bias in action, you only have to read the climategate emails, documents that have undermined my faith in this country’s scientific institutions. It is bad enough that the emails unambiguously showed scientists plotting to cherry-pick data, subvert peer review, bully editors and evade freedom of information requests. What’s worse, to a science groupie like me, is that so much of the rest of the scientific community seemed OK with that. They essentially shrugged their shoulders and said, yeh, big deal, boys will be boys.
“In the idealised situation that the climate response to a doubling of atmospheric CO2 consisted of a uniform temperature change only, with no feedbacks operating…the global warming from GCMs would be around 1.2°C.” Paragraph 8.6.2.3.

Now the paragraph goes on to argue that large, net positive feedbacks, mostly from water vapour, are likely to amplify this. But whereas there is good consensus about the 1.2 C, there is absolutely no consensus about the net positive feedback, as the IPCC also admits. Water vapour forms clouds and whether clouds in practice amplify or dampen any greenhouse warming remains in doubt.

So to say there is a consensus about some global warming is true; to say there is a consensus about dangerous global warming is false.

The sensitivity of the climate could be a harmless 1.2C, half of which has already been experienced, or it could be less if feedbacks are negative or it could be more if feedbacks are positive. What does the empirical evidence say? Since 1960 we have had roughly one-third of a doubling, so we must have had almost half of the greenhouse warming expected from a doubling – that’s elementary arithmetic, given that the curve is agreed to be logarithmic. Yet if you believe the surface thermometers* (the red and green lines), we have had about 0.6C of warming in that time, at the rate of less than 0.13C per decade – somewhat less if you believe the satellite thermometers (the blue and purple lines).
So we are on track for 1.2C*. We are on the blue line, not the red line*.
Does it matter? Suppose I am right that much of what passes for mainstream climate science is now infested with pseudoscience, buttressed by a bad case of confirmation bias, reliant on wishful thinking, given a free pass by biased reporting and dogmatically intolerant of dissent. So what?

After all there’s pseudoscience and confirmation bias among the climate heretics too.

Well here’s why it matters. The alarmists have been handed power over our lives; the heretics have not. Remember Britain’s unilateral climate act is officially expected to cost the hard-pressed UK economy £18.3 billion a year for the next 39 years and achieve an unmeasurably small change in carbon dioxide levels.

I highly recommend reading the whole thing
 
The laws of physics don't support the hypothesis of AGW and years of observation are contrary to the claims precisely because the claims aren't supported by the laws of physics. When the laws of physics don't support a hypothesis, there is absolutely no reason to sit on the fence.
 
Last edited:
LOL. Ol' Bent and physics do not mix. The whole of the American Institute of Physics states that ol' Bent doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground.
 
Ian, I did read the whole thing. And one of the other statements in that paper was that the climate predictions up to this point have been pretty much spot on. But he thinks that the coming years will see a decline in the rate of increase in the warming because of what he thinks the present climatologists have failed to include in their models. Within five years we will find out how well his hypothesis stands up.
 
LOL. Ol' Bent and physics do not mix. The whole of the American Institute of Physics states that ol' Bent doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground.

Really? than you can show this mathematically? Theoretically? Yeah...:cuckoo:
 
Look, G-vig, you have been shown to be a brainless troll. Why should anyone try to answer your 'questions'? Go find some more 'vig' links.
 
As stated before, I don't have to. The real scientists have already done so.

The Carbon Dioxide Greenhouse Effect

I have read the whole thing rocks and went to the links attached to it and read them too. I will ask you for about the 100th time, which part of that do you believe constitutes proof of anything. You are never able to answer and yet you keep posting it. Clearly you don't see anything there that you believe amounts to any sort of proof or you would name it. Or perhaps you know that you would be laughed off the board if you actually stated what on that page you believe to be proof of anything.
 
Look, G-vig, you have been shown to be a brainless troll. Why should anyone try to answer your 'questions'? Go find some more 'vig' links.

On that link you posted why do all the links on the right say things like "more" or "simple models" as if they go to some evidence when they do not?

Why does your so-called "scientific evidence" site send you on a wild goose chase when you try and reference their sources?

I asked you these before and you ran like the little punk you are....
 

So you decided to change to different link rather than answer for the last one?

Not surprising.. You always show your cowardly nature...

Did you notice the viglink popup on that last link he provided?

//api.viglink.com/api/click?format=go&drKey=773&loc=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.usmessageboard.com%2Fenvironment%2F192317-reasons-for-staying-on-the-fence-with-respect-to-cagw.html%23post4370308&v=1&libid=1320581349753&out=http%3A%2F%2Fadsabs.harvard.edu%2Ffull%2F1990MNRAS.242..224E&ref=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.usmessageboard.com%2Fnewreply.php%3Fdo%3Dnewreply%26p%3D4369581&title=Reasons%20for%20Staying%20on%20the%20Fence%20with%20Respect%20to%20CAGW%20-%20US%20Message%20Board%20-%20Political%20Discussion%20Forum&txt=1990MNRAS.242..224E%20Page%20224&jsonp=vglnk_jsonp_13205813626731
 
Last edited:
Ian, I did read the whole thing. And one of the other statements in that paper was that the climate predictions up to this point have been pretty much spot on. But he thinks that the coming years will see a decline in the rate of increase in the warming because of what he thinks the present climatologists have failed to include in their models. Within five years we will find out how well his hypothesis stands up.



Why wait 5 years?

We have had thirty years to examine the predictions based on the scenarios from your guru, Dr. Hansen. Based on his scenarios, his predictions were wrong.

This article seems to examine actual facts and make reasonable conclusions based upon them.

The long history of the planet seems to falsify your predictions and yet you cling to them. Why might this be?
 
Matt Ridley's informative lecture is worth reading. I hope a video comes out.

- Bishop Hill blog - Scientific*heresy

some qoutes-

What sustains pseudoscience is confirmation bias. We look for and welcome the evidence that fits our pet theory; we ignore or question the evidence that contradicts it. We all do this all the time. It’s not, as we often assume, something that only our opponents indulge in. I do it, you do it, it takes a superhuman effort not to do it. That is what keeps myths alive, sustains conspiracy theories and keeps whole populations in thrall to strange superstitions.

Bertrand Russell* pointed this out many years ago: “If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence.”
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts", said Richard Feynman.

Lesson 6. Never rely on the consensus of experts about the future. Experts are worth listening to about the past, but not the future. Futurology is pseudoscience.


“In the idealised situation that the climate response to a doubling of atmospheric CO2 consisted of a uniform temperature change only, with no feedbacks operating…the global warming from GCMs would be around 1.2°C.” Paragraph 8.6.2.3.

Now the paragraph goes on to argue that large, net positive feedbacks, mostly from water vapour, are likely to amplify this. But whereas there is good consensus about the 1.2 C, there is absolutely no consensus about the net positive feedback, as the IPCC also admits. Water vapour forms clouds and whether clouds in practice amplify or dampen any greenhouse warming remains in doubt.

So to say there is a consensus about some global warming is true; to say there is a consensus about dangerous global warming is false.

The sensitivity of the climate could be a harmless 1.2C, half of which has already been experienced, or it could be less if feedbacks are negative or it could be more if feedbacks are positive. What does the empirical evidence say? Since 1960 we have had roughly one-third of a doubling, so we must have had almost half of the greenhouse warming expected from a doubling – that’s elementary arithmetic, given that the curve is agreed to be logarithmic. Yet if you believe the surface thermometers* (the red and green lines), we have had about 0.6C of warming in that time, at the rate of less than 0.13C per decade – somewhat less if you believe the satellite thermometers (the blue and purple lines).
So we are on track for 1.2C*. We are on the blue line, not the red line*.
Does it matter? Suppose I am right that much of what passes for mainstream climate science is now infested with pseudoscience, buttressed by a bad case of confirmation bias, reliant on wishful thinking, given a free pass by biased reporting and dogmatically intolerant of dissent. So what?

After all there’s pseudoscience and confirmation bias among the climate heretics too.

Well here’s why it matters. The alarmists have been handed power over our lives; the heretics have not. Remember Britain’s unilateral climate act is officially expected to cost the hard-pressed UK economy £18.3 billion a year for the next 39 years and achieve an unmeasurably small change in carbon dioxide levels.

I highly recommend reading the whole thing



I've got to spread some rep around....
 

Forum List

Back
Top