Real ID about to take a hit

[Oddball]

I don't think it's a red herring at all.. Every single effort to prevent another 9-11 is protested by somebody, rejected by somebody blocked by somebody,, so we are back to "it's almost as if these loons want another attack" innit? seems to me to be that way,,

Do you realize you're making the same basic arguments that the global warming moonbats and socialized medicine zombies make??

"If you're not on my side, you must be in favor of my mythical worst-case scenario coming to pass".

 

[WillowTree]

I don't think it's a red herring at all.. Every single effort to prevent another 9-11 is protested by somebody, rejected by somebody blocked by somebody,, so we are back to "it's almost as if these loons want another attack" innit? seems to me to be that way,,

Do you realize you're making the same basic arguments that the global warming moonbats and socialized medicine zombies make??

"If you're not on my side, you must be in favor of my mythical worst-case scenario coming to pass".

no,, I didn't realize that.. let's try another tact.. come up with a plan to keep this country safe.. (and that's the stated task of the US Gov.) that somebody will not object to, reject, protest. what would your plan look like? Prove I'm wrong.

 

[Oddball]

Another red herring.....Nobody has to come up with another plan to see that the one you're supporting is tyrannical. It's also a typical argument that you'd get from an anti-gun wingnut.

Moreover, you're expecting the same people to "keep you safe" who can't keep recreational drugs (which have no choice or ability to act independently) out of the country or even deliver the mail.

 

[DamnYankee]

It's almost as if these loons want us to be attacked again innit?

You just go against anything they do without considering it, huh?

The reality is, it won't stop anything. Safety is never 100% protection ... and ID's are just too damned easy to forge no matter what system. I will not however pay to give the government more control or responsibility for my life, if you like having the government in complete control of everything, sign up, otherwise leave the rest of us alone.

Maybe, but in this case, being a firm believer that Real ID, in its entirety, is a good thing, I have to wonder why the reluctance of the Feds to put their money where their mouths are.

 

[DamnYankee]

slow down willow, This Id act which has started in my state is so they can scan you going through the border.

Do you think they would hesitate to scan you at a tea party to see which of you is in attendance?

It's also to prevent fraudulent access to vital records -- you know.... phoney birth or marriage or death certificates? You remember those, don't you? The counterfeit birth certificates, illegally sold, that were then used to obtain phony U. S. passports and DLs, by terrorists that hyjacked the planes on 9/11???

 

[WillowTree]

Another red herring.....Nobody has to come up with another plan to see that the one you're supporting is tyrannical. It's also a typical argument that you'd get from an anti-gun wingnut.

Moreover, you're expecting the same people to "keep you safe" who can't keep recreational drugs (which have no choice or ability to act independently) out of the country or even deliver the mail.

Not honest to criticize every move the gov. officials take to try to prevent 9-11 but then say,, you don't have to have a plan.. which boils down to "do nothing" dosen't it? you cannot articulate a single action that the US gov. can take to prevent 9-11?

 

[Oddball]

It's also to prevent fraudulent access to vital records -- you know.... phoney birth or marriage or death certificates? You remember those, don't you? The counterfeit birth certificates, illegally sold, that were then used to obtain phony U. S. passports and DLs, by terrorists that hyjacked the planes on 9/11???

Since when did any law protect anyone from the actions of criminals??

 

[Oddball]

Not honest to criticize every move the gov. officials take to try to prevent 9-11 but then say,, you don't have to have a plan.. which boils down to "do nothing" dosen't it? you cannot articulate a single action that the US gov. can take to prevent 9-11?

They had all the laws they needed to prevent 9/11™....Yet they failed.

If anyone did nothing, it was those who were charged with "keeping us safe".

Only in gubmint is failure presented as evidence that you need even more power and/or money.

 

[DamnYankee]

It's also to prevent fraudulent access to vital records -- you know.... phoney birth or marriage or death certificates? You remember those, don't you? The counterfeit birth certificates, illegally sold, that were then used to obtain phony U. S. passports and DLs, by terrorists that hyjacked the planes on 9/11???

Since when did any law protect anyone from the actions of criminals??

Well, let's see.... no law is perfect, but included in this law is a provision that all persons who handle/work with vital statistics be subject to a Federal background check. Would tend to weed out those who have already have a criminal record or who fit a profile that indicates they may be persuaded to break the law. Then there's the vital records facility security issue, which, for one thing, would make it no longer possible for vital records staff to conduct business out of their homes. You think, maybe, either of two (of many) issues, may be a deterrent?

 

[Oddball]

Yeah....And assault weapons bans are a deterrent to drive-bys in Compton.

 

[DamnYankee]

Yeah....And assault weapons bans are a deterrent to drive-bys in Compton.

Deflection.

If you'd like to discuss assault weapons bans, and their stupidity, I'd be more than happy to do so elsewhere.

 

[Oddball]

Deflection nothing.

It's a demonstration that you're using the same kinds of flawed logic that gun control loons use.

 

[Sweet Willy]

It's also to prevent fraudulent access to vital records -- you know.... phoney birth or marriage or death certificates? You remember those, don't you? The counterfeit birth certificates, illegally sold, that were then used to obtain phony U. S. passports and DLs, by terrorists that hyjacked the planes on 9/11???

Since when did any law protect anyone from the actions of criminals??

Well, let's see.... no law is perfect, but included in this law is a provision that all persons who handle/work with vital statistics be subject to a Federal background check. Would tend to weed out those who have already have a criminal record or who fit a profile that indicates they may be persuaded to break the law. Then there's the vital records facility security issue, which, for one thing, would make it no longer possible for vital records staff to conduct business out of their homes. You think, maybe, either of two (of many) issues, may be a deterrent?

But who will do the back ground check on the background checkers checker? And the guy that does that check obviously can't be trusted to check the background checker without first having a checker's checker's back ground checked by another checker. And then that guy? I wouldn't trust him at all. We need to check him too. But what if he was inclined to let a checker check, without being thoroughly checked and then that checker let's checker under him slide and the first checker turns out to have been caught cheating in 8th grade and he let's Ethel in Podunk, Ohio take a job at the court house even though he knows she once snuck into the Senior dance when she was only a sophomore.

It's a recipe for disaster.

 

[Full-Auto]

Since when did any law protect anyone from the actions of criminals??

Well, let's see.... no law is perfect, but included in this law is a provision that all persons who handle/work with vital statistics be subject to a Federal background check. Would tend to weed out those who have already have a criminal record or who fit a profile that indicates they may be persuaded to break the law. Then there's the vital records facility security issue, which, for one thing, would make it no longer possible for vital records staff to conduct business out of their homes. You think, maybe, either of two (of many) issues, may be a deterrent?

But who will do the back ground check on the background checkers checker? And the guy that does that check obviously can't be trusted to check the background checker without first having a checker's checker's back ground checked by another checker. And then that guy? I wouldn't trust him at all. We need to check him too. But what if he was inclined to let a checker check, without being thoroughly checked and then that checker let's checker under him slide and the first checker turns out to have been caught cheating in 8th grade and he let's Ethel in Podunk, Ohio take a job at the court house even though he knows she once snuck into the Senior dance when she was only a sophomore.

It's a recipe for disaster.

LOL you just described NICS

 

[DamnYankee]

Deflection nothing.

It's a demonstration that you're using the same kinds of flawed logic that gun control loons use.

Great.... An anarchist or a libertarian?

 

[DamnYankee]

Since when did any law protect anyone from the actions of criminals??

Well, let's see.... no law is perfect, but included in this law is a provision that all persons who handle/work with vital statistics be subject to a Federal background check. Would tend to weed out those who have already have a criminal record or who fit a profile that indicates they may be persuaded to break the law. Then there's the vital records facility security issue, which, for one thing, would make it no longer possible for vital records staff to conduct business out of their homes. You think, maybe, either of two (of many) issues, may be a deterrent?

But who will do the back ground check on the background checkers checker? And the guy that does that check obviously can't be trusted to check the background checker without first having a checker's checker's back ground checked by another checker. And then that guy? I wouldn't trust him at all. We need to check him too. But what if he was inclined to let a checker check, without being thoroughly checked and then that checker let's checker under him slide and the first checker turns out to have been caught cheating in 8th grade and he let's Ethel in Podunk, Ohio take a job at the court house even though he knows she once snuck into the Senior dance when she was only a sophomore.

It's a recipe for disaster.

Yeah.... I'm aware that the CIA and the FBI have no fuckin' credibility. Just ask Bush.

 

[Oddball]

Deflection nothing.

It's a demonstration that you're using the same kinds of flawed logic that gun control loons use.

Great.... An anarchist or a libertarian?

Talk about deflection!!!!

You're recycling arguments that well-established authoritarian crackpots use to justify their paternalistic authoritarian tyranny, and I'm the anarchist?!?!?!?!???

Yer killin' me!!!

 

[Sweet Willy]

Deflection nothing.

It's a demonstration that you're using the same kinds of flawed logic that gun control loons use.

Great.... An anarchist or a libertarian?

Dude is right on this one. We already had most of these guys on the radar before 9/11. It wasn't that our radar system wasn't good enough. Just that no one was paying attention to it at the right level. Hell, there are stacks and stacks of memos filed by "checkers" who had checked over these guys and reported them. We had reports to the White House that said "HEY!! SOMEONE IS TALKING ABOUT FLYING PLANES INTO TALL BUILDINGS".

We have plenty of checkers, checking on shit that needs to be checked. Now if you can concvince a politician to do a damn thing about it.

 

[DamnYankee]

It's also to prevent fraudulent access to vital records -- you know.... phoney birth or marriage or death certificates? You remember those, don't you? The counterfeit birth certificates, illegally sold, that were then used to obtain phony U. S. passports and DLs, by terrorists that hyjacked the planes on 9/11???

Since when did any law protect anyone from the actions of criminals??

Well, let's see.... no law is perfect, but included in this law is a provision that all persons who handle/work with vital statistics be subject to a Federal background check. Would tend to weed out those who have already have a criminal record or who fit a profile that indicates they may be persuaded to break the law. Then there's the vital records facility security issue, which, for one thing, would make it no longer possible for vital records staff to conduct business out of their homes. You think, maybe, either of two (of many) issues, may be a deterrent?

Yeah....And assault weapons bans are a deterrent to drive-bys in Compton.

Deflection nothing.

It's a demonstration that you're using the same kinds of flawed logic that gun control loons use.

Great.... An anarchist or a libertarian?

Talk about deflection!!!!

You're recycling arguments that well-established authoritarian crackpots use to justify their paternalistic authoritarian tyranny, and I'm the anarchist?!?!?!?!???

Yer killin' me!!!

No, I asked you a question. Two in fact. No problem....

 

[WillowTree]

Deflection nothing.

It's a demonstration that you're using the same kinds of flawed logic that gun control loons use.

Great.... An anarchist or a libertarian?

Dude is right on this one. We already had most of these guys on the radar before 9/11. It wasn't that our radar system wasn't good enough. Just that no one was paying attention to it at the right level. Hell, there are stacks and stacks of memos filed by "checkers" who had checked over these guys and reported them. We had reports to the White House that said "HEY!! SOMEONE IS TALKING ABOUT FLYING PLANES INTO TALL BUILDINGS".

We have plenty of checkers, checking on shit that needs to be checked. Now if you can concvince a politician to do a damn thing about it.

What we have/had Sweet Willy was "Failure to Communicate.