Re-Institutionalizing the Caliphate

[syrenn]

What is this, the 14th century?

Even in 21st century the Vatican still has its legitimacy.
Time doesn't disable people's need for religious leadership.
Independent from religion, these kind of institutions are also a form of power by bundling otherwise aimless streams.

The vatican doesn't try and run your life. The vatican doesnt issue death warrants. They offer a religion and that is all. The vaticant doesn't try and take over governments. The vatican isnt trying to take over the wold.


And how big is vaticant city/state/country anyway? You all want a muslim world. Fine have one that size and stay inside the boundaries.

 

[Intense]

You seem to forget, being a control freak and all, simple logic Ekrem. Now if you were the Caliphate, would you appreciate the unwashed dictating where you should live, and how you should spend your time??? Of course not. Don't you owe the Caliphate the same courtesy??? Consider that.

The perfect Caliphate Candidate is busy Fucking up the US right now. He should be available in about 2 years. Throw in a few Arabian horses, some sheep and goats, and we will include Michele and her gift of organic gardening.

Seriously, Should you find a Caliphate, it would be respectful to allow him to plan his own course.

I didn't really understand the red part of your post.
If you can elaborate further, I can answer you.

Too many chef's spoil the recipe. Do you choose a Leader or a Follower? It is sincere advice.

 

[Intense]

What is this, the 14th century?

Even in 21st century the Vatican still has its legitimacy.
Time doesn't disable people's need for religious leadership.
Independent from religion, these kind of institutions are also a form of power by bundling otherwise aimless streams.

Islam is very different than Catholicism, Ekrem. The most obvious is that the Vatican is not a closed City to Non Catholics. What kind of access would you expect your Caliphate to have to Foreign Diplomats in Mecca? Again, why not Honor Him by letting Him decide for Himself what His needs are?

 

[daveman]

You want a Caliphate? Go for it. Just keep it to yourself, and don't expect people living in the 21st Century to play along.

 

[ekrem]

Too many chef's spoil the recipe. Do you choose a Leader or a Follower? It is sincere advice.

It is no secret, that social undercurrents in Muslim societies would prefer a Leader.
Personally, I like the direction of Gaullism and Peronism, and think, that my country is exactly following that path.

And I don't really know if an American really means the same thing as me, when I am talking about Caliphate.
To the too many chef thing. Precisely examined, there are only 2 Sunnite countries which have real legitimacy. Only Pakistan and Turkey were really founded out of people's mass movement, in a Muslim struggle against everything else. If I am wrong correct me.

 

[ekrem]

You want a Caliphate?

I think, that vast majority would want Caliphate.

Go for it.

The chances are high for it to happen.
The condition the Muslim world currently is in, is decreasing those chances.
But that is temporary.

Just keep it to yourself(...)

Don't worry, you won't be invited.

 

[ekrem]

Islam is very different than Catholicism, Ekrem. The most obvious is that the Vatican is not a closed City to Non Catholics. What kind of access would you expect your Caliphate to have to Foreign Diplomats in Mecca? Again, why not Honor Him by letting Him decide for Himself what His needs are?

The Caliphate was open to foreign Diplomats and Emissaries.
At least the Ottoman one. The Sultans were Caliphs and received them.
No different then the Pope, he also receives Muslims.

 

[Intense]

Too many chef's spoil the recipe. Do you choose a Leader or a Follower? It is sincere advice.

It is no secret, that social undercurrents in Muslim societies would prefer a Leader.
Personally, I like the direction of Gaullism and Peronism, and think, that my country is exactly following that path.

And I don't really know if an American really means the same thing as me, when I am talking about Caliphate.
To the too many chef thing. Precisely examined, there are only 2 Sunnite countries which have real legitimacy. Only Pakistan and Turkey were really founded out of people's mass movement, in a Muslim struggle against everything else. If I am wrong correct me.

You are the Authority on Islam, not I. You have much to work out in relation to countries like Indonesia. How important is it to them, if at all. You have different perspectives to explore, Religious, Political, Cultural, Social. What are the functions of the Position, and where best to set up shop? Why just one place? If there is one foundation, one would have the need to perform All related functions from there. To me, an Outsider, it would seem that regardless of the Host Country, there are People the Caliphate would need access to, that would not be possible in say Mecca. You need to work out your Logistics. I have enough to deal with concerning Popes.

 

[daveman]

You want a Caliphate?

I think, that vast majority would want Caliphate.

Of Muslims? Probably. Of humanity? No chance.

Go for it.

The chances are high for it to happen.
The condition the Muslim world currently is in, is decreasing those chances.
But that is temporary.

You can't stop progress, bub. How you gonna keep 'em down on the farm after they've seen the 21st Century?

Just keep it to yourself(...)

Don't worry, you won't be invited.

Then I won't have to send my regrets.

But if you think you can force it on anyone, you're not thinking at all.

 

[ekrem]

You are the Authority on Islam, not I. You have much to work out in relation to countries like Indonesia. How important is it to them, if at all. You have different perspectives to explore, Religious, Political, Cultural, Social. What are the functions of the Position, and where best to set up shop? Why just one place? If there is one foundation, one would have the need to perform All related functions from there. To me, an Outsider, it would seem that regardless of the Host Country, there are People the Caliphate would need access to, that would not be possible in say Mecca. You need to work out your Logistics. I have enough to deal with concerning Popes.

I am no authority on Islam, a scholar or something.
I know, what I pick up here and there.

I simply opened a thread, in full awareness, that the Ghook-Ropey fraction will show up.
But don't worry, I don't mix them up with what I consider Americans and hold their behavior against Americans.
That, off course, doesn't mean, that I am a real fan of Americans either.

The events in the 1st decade clearly show, that I should have sympathy with 'Joe Muslim' rather then 'Joe USA'. And down that line it has developed.
I don't really think good of 'you' (general).

 

[ekrem]

And to be precise, under Caliphate I understand a supranational institution with something like a Pope at its head.
In Muslim version it would be a Amir al-Mu'minin.
It simply means Leader of the Faithful
Amir al-Mu'minin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He unites and gives guidance to the faithful.
Under this context were also my questions in the first post, like 'can a Caliphate really be seperated from countries where the Caliphate will reside in', or will there be an intermixture giving the host-nation enormous power and those kind of question.

 

[Ropey]

And to be precise, under Caliphate

Another Turkish Caliphate?

No, thank you very much.

Warning Very Graphic Photos of the Turkish Ottoman Caliphates Slaughter of more than a million Armenians.

Click

 

[Avatar4321]

and who exactly would be the Caliph?

 

[Toro]

It is no secret, that social undercurrents in Muslim societies would prefer a Leader.
Personally, I like the direction of Gaullism and Peronism, and think, that my country is exactly following that path.

Peronism was a disaster.

Either the education system is bad wherever you are, or everything is bad wherever you such that Peronism would seem a better option.

 

[ekrem]

Peronism was a disaster.

Either the education system is bad wherever you are, or everything is bad wherever you such that Peronism would seem a better option.

Maybe it was a disaster for Argentine.
I like the idea behind Peronism, and the system which Turkey implements since foundation (Kemalism) is almost exactly the same ideology with the major difference that Kemalism was built around hardcore-secularism. Else, it is almost same.