Ramos, Compean Pardon?

[Article 15]

no it doesn't---they can be pardoned no matter how it went down.

I believe that in order to be pardoned you have to admit guilt.

 

[sky dancer]

no it doesn't---they can be pardoned no matter how it went down.

They will not be pardoned.

 

[dilloduck]

I believe that in order to be pardoned you have to admit guilt.

clemency----whatever----hide and watch. They will walk.

 

[Valerie]

no it doesn't---they can be pardoned no matter how it went down.

Alright, I get you. Still matters, though!

 

[sky dancer]

Alright, I get you. Still matters, though!

Hypocrisy matters.

Law and order types always make exceptions for their political 'heroes'. When law enforcement doesn't have to abide by the law--we have problems having the law respected.

 

[dilloduck]

Hypocrisy matters.

Law and order types always make exceptions for their political 'heroes'.

So did our blow job president.

 

[sky dancer]

So did our blow job president.

As I recall the right wing made mincemeat out of President Clinton, dildoluck. Not that there is much comparison between firing 15 shots at an unarmed man with his back to you fleeing, not reporting the shoot and picking up your shell cases to cover it up.

 

[Valerie]

Hypocrisy matters.

Law and order types always make exceptions for their political 'heroes'. When law enforcement doesn't have to abide by the law--we have problems having the law respected.

Yes, I'm all for law and order. That's why it's so important to not cross the line those agents crossed. Law enforcement officers have a duty and are not above the law.

 

[dilloduck]

As I recall the right wing made mincemeat out of President Clinton, dildoluck. Not that there is much comparison between firing 15 shots at an unarmed man with his back to you fleeing, not reporting the shoot and picking up your shell cases to cover it up.

chop away---presidents play God as their terms end. Blow Job Bill let Rich et al walk. Now you will watch criminals walk.

 

[sky dancer]

chop away---presidents play God as their terms end. Blow Job Bill let Rich et al walk. Now you will watch criminals walk.

You ought to put that post in the Poet's Corner.

 

[dilloduck]

You ought to put that post in the Poet's Corner.

it doesn't seem to have that ------"angst".
but feel free to use it if it works for ya !

 

[sky dancer]

it doesn't seem to have that ------"angst".
but feel free to use it if it works for ya !

It doesn't need to have 'angst'. The post reads like a poem. I like it.

 

[dilloduck]

It doesn't need to have 'angst'. The post reads like a poem. I like it.

well---I'll wait til I get a bunch of em and make a Dillo's finest.

 

[sky dancer]

well---I'll wait til I get a bunch of em and make a Dillo's finest.

Yes. You must. You're a natural.

 

[Againsheila]

If he didn't have a gun, they had no authority to shoot him.

The trial is after the fact.

I was being sarcastic. Repeat drug smugglers ALWAYS carry guns. BTW, even if he didn't have a gun, they had the authority to shoot him as long as they believe he had one and it was pointed it at them. The doctor said the wound was consistent with someone who was turning while running away as if pointing something behind him.

The fact that you believe a repeat drug smuggler who we know lied on the stand when he said this was his first on only time he ever smuggled drugs, over the word of the border patrol officers is rather frightening. The prosecuted KNEW the drug smuggler was lying and didn't say anything. That to me is not a fair trial, do you think it's a fair trial?

 

[Againsheila]

So, how do YOU know? Did you follow him?

You think that last sentence stands up as proof in a court of law that those agents had authority to shoot him? The law is the law and you can't just kill someone if you are not imminently threatened, just because they are an illegal alien does not make their life worthless.

I'm giving the benefit of the doubt to the border patrol agents, not to the criminal repeat drug smuggler. The doctor's testimony pretty much makes their story a lot easy to believe than the drug smugglers.

Unless of course, you'd rather believe a repeat criminal over the border patrol officers.

BTW, this isn't about being an illegal alien. If he was an American, I'd still side with the border patrol. The doctor's testimony said the wound was consistant someone who was turning while running away, as if to point something behind him. Now even if it wasn't a gun, they had the right to shoot as long as they believe it was a gun.

Do you not remember the case of the cops that shot the deaf guy? He was reaching into his pocket for his card that says he's deaf and they thought he was going for a gun. They shot him dead. It was determined to be justified, though I know the cops felt really bad. Not sure I could go back to work after that, but had they been wrong and they not shot, the cops would have been dead.

Why do you keep ignoring the doctor's testimony as well as the fact that the repeat drug dealer LIED on the stand and the prosecuting attorney KNEW he was lying?

 

[Againsheila]

Get over it sheila. It's over.

Funny how your heart is all for illegals, but not for our border patrol agents that were unjustly imprisoned.

It's not over as long as they are in prison. It won't even be over after they get out. There was a miscarriage of justice in this case and that's a black mark on our system.

 

[Againsheila]

I realize this isn't a new article, but I haven't heard of the outcome of this case and I feel there is some really good information in here that some people should read.

New Ethics Complaint Targets Ramos-Compean Prosecutor

New Ethics Complaint Targets Ramos-Compean Prosecutor
By Online Wednesday, May 14, 2008


Tell Congress to Urge President Bush to pardon agents Ramos-Compean.

FAXDC.com wants to send this urgent and personalized Blast Fax message to all 535 members of the House and Senate for YOU.

Alert: A Christian pastor says he has filed an ethics complaint with the Texas Bar Association seeking an investigation into U.S. Attorney Johnny Sutton’s “willfully misleading” statements in the case against former U.S. Border Patrol agents Ignacio Ramos and Jose Compean.

Don Swarthout, president of Christians Reviving America’s Values, today confirmed his ethics complaint cites Sutton’s actions in the case in which Ramos and Compean were convicted of shooting at a drug smuggler who had dropped a load of marijuana near the Texas border and was fleeing back into Mexico.

An announcement from his organization confirmed, “Swarthout charges Sutton’s office willfully misled the jury in order to convicted Border Patrol Agents Ignacio Ramos and Jose Compean.”

On Feb. 17, 2005, Ramos and Compean pursued Osvaldo Aldrete-Davila on foot after Aldrete-Davila abandoned a van containing 743 pounds of marijuana worth an estimated $1 million. During the chase, Ramos shot at Aldrete-Davila in the belief that the smuggler had drawn a gun of his own. Aldrete-Davila escaped across the border, and Ramos assumed Aldrete-Davila was unhurt. In fact, Aldrete-Davila had been shot in the buttock.

Sutton’s office later charged Ramos and Compean violated Border Patrol policy by pursuing Aldrete-Davila without supervisor approval, moving spent shell casings and improperly reporting the fired shots. Aldrete-Davila was granted immunity to testify against the agents. Ramos and Compean currently are in solitary confinement in maximum-security prisons.

Their cases are on appeal before the 5th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals.

“This whole case stinks to the highest parts of heaven,” Swarthout said. “How is it possible in America to convict two border agents for simply doing their jobs and send them to prison for 11 and 12 years? How is it possible for Johnny Sutton’s office to ruin the lives of two of our border agents based on the word of a known Mexican drug smuggler? Why did Johnny Sutton’s office twist the facts of this case and hide evidence simply to get a conviction?” Swarthout said.

Officials with the Texas State Bar said they could not comment on complaints about inappropriate behavior unless a public penalty was imposed on an offender. And a spokeswoman for the federal office for Sutton said the media officer was out of the office today, and no one else could respond to questions.

Swarthout said he wrote to the prosecutor’s office, including information about the situation.

“This just doesn’t add up,” he said.

He cited inconsistencies: Why would a drug ring trust a newcomer, or unknown, with drugs worth nearly $1 million. Why do several jurors report they were pressured into a guilty verdict?

“There is a reason behind it somewhere,” he said.

Swarthout compared Sutton to Duke lacrosse rape case prosecutor Mike Nifong, who has faced a series of penalties for allegedly withholding evidence that could have cleared the defendants.

Swarthout also said nearly 100 members of Congress have reviewed the case and have asked President Bush to pardon the two.

“These … elected officials represent both Democrats and Republicans. All of them agree Johnny Sutton’s prosecution leaves a lot of unanswered questions,” Swarthout’s statement said.

“Known drug smuggler Aldrete-Davila was portrayed by Sutton as almost an ‘innocent bystander.’ In fact, he was involved in a second drug delivery to the United States during Sutton’s prosecution of Ramos and Compean. This fact was covered up by Sutton’s office,” he continued. “It may be possible for reasonable people to disagree about whether Sutton’s statements constitute ‘outright lies.’ However, the facts now in the public domain make it abundantly clear Sutton’s statements were willfully misleading to the jury and that is the basis of this ethics complaint.”

The group run by Swarthout, a Christian minister who has been active on a number of social issues, including organized opposition to the San Diego Padres’ outreach to the California homosexual community, also addresses issues involving the ACLU and radical Islam.

Sutton was nominated in 2001 by Bush to serve as U.S. prosecutor in western Texas. He also serves on the attorney general’s advisory committee to set policies and programs of the federal department.

It was reported that when the White House said the agents, if they want clemency, must ask for it.

“There is a process under which anyone can apply for a pardon or a commutation. And if they want to take advantage of that process, they’re absolutely welcome to,” said White House spokeswoman Dana Perino, responding to a question from Les Kinsolving.

“Now that Mr. Aldrete-Davila, the drug smuggler in the Ramos-Compean case, has admitted running drugs and conspiracy, will the president review his decision against a pardon, commutation or other clemency for the two Border Patrol agents jailed for shooting at this drug smuggler as he fled back into Mexico after abandoning a load of drugs in the United States?” Kinsolving asked.

Perino said she would “encourage anyone to look at the facts in the case as laid out by the attorney general – by the county – district attorney – I’m sorry, the U.S. attorney in that area.”

Sutton has been described by Bush as a “dear friend.”

Aldrete-Davila has admitted possession of a controlled substance, conspiracy to import a controlled substance and conspiracy to distribute. The marijuana he admitted smuggling into the U.S. came after he testified against Ramos and Compean under a grant of immunity from Sutton.

Mychal Massie, the chief of the nonprofit and nonpartisan Project 21, has called on President Bush to pardon the agents.

He noted Aldrete-Davila’s sentencing is scheduled in July.

“It is time to prove that he [Bush] places the welfare of American communities and those men and women who risk their lives to protect them over the welfare of lying illicit drug smugglers,” Massie said. “Pardon Ramos and Compean now, Mr. President!”

“It cannot be overstated that President Bush’s stolid indifference thus far toward the suffering of these brave protectors of our borders and their families, while simultaneously seeking special dispensation for illegal immigrants, is unconscionable,” Massie has said. “Now it appears that the burden to be borne by agents Ramos and Compean for unknowingly wounding a now admitted drug criminal as he fled from justice across the border is going to be greater than that to be borne by the criminal himself.”

The Ramos and Compean convictions have been questioned by many who point out that during the trial, jurors were not told of Aldrete-Davila’s continued drug trafficking. Jurors also were unaware that a fellow agent who testified against Ramos and Compean is a life-long friend of Aldrete-Davila – a violation of Border Patrol policy in itself.

T.J. Bonner, president of the National Border Patrol Council, a labor union, testified before the U.S. Senate that a medical examination of Aldrete-Davila supported the agents’ description of events and complied with Border Patrol and Justice Department policies. (WND.com)

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