Questions.....RE: The Greenhouse Effect

[Toddsterpatriot]

Since you don't believe in physics, you have no basis for physics discussion except for anti-science trolling. You fantasize non-science in order to deny th e CMB actually does hit the earth and was discovered by actual observed and measured experiments on earth. You have not proved otherwise. We are getting bored of your current anti-science mantras. Got anything new?

"Believe" in physics? Are you kidding? The whole point of physics is to get beyond having to "believe". Belief is a religious term. Physics is about actual understanding via observation, experiment, testing and measurement. Physics doesn't require belief. Faith requires belief.

And again...its to bad that you can't grasp the concept of resonant frequencies.

And it is not me who is anti science. I am asking for you to provide evidence to support your claims...that is by definition, the way science works. You, on the other hand are asking me to believe...and when I won't take your claim on faith, you tell me that I don't "believe" in physics...as if physics required belief. Grab yourself a dictionary and look up the words physics and religion. Now tell me which one includes the word belief in the definition.

You are asking me to take a claim on faith with no actual observed, measured evidence in support of that claim....and as much as you wish it to be true...being fooled by instrumentation is not evidence.

Nope, you have nothing new. Just the same distractions and troll mentality.

You don't like that use of the word belief? OK. I will reword it. You don't accept the mathematical models of physics as a method for codifying experimental observations and measurements. That's ironic since you misuse the models right and left.

to bad that you can't grasp the concept of resonant frequencies

You are just being a troll again. We all know that the cold radiation must come through the warm atmosphere to be detected by the resonant amplifiers. You are pretending to confuse the actual radiation with the detection method. But you already know that, and prefer to be a troll.

Wow, look at you, how many posts now has SSDD stated all you have is a mathematical model and to actually post observed measured results? And still you fail to provide observations showing energy moving spontaneously from cold to warm. Fk dude, must be over 50 posts asking for that observation evidence. Still nothing. And if radiation must come through the atmosphere, then you should have observation of that! Post it. That wouldn’t be a mathematical model. Instead, it would be actually measured. I get it that confuses you

how many posts now has SSDD stated all you have is a mathematical model and to actually post observed measured results?

CMB was discovered using an actual telescope receiving actual radiation.

And if radiation must come through the atmosphere, then you should have observation of that!

Discovery of cosmic microwave background radiation - Wikipedia

asked and answered by him. Explained as well. In fact, as I stated, at least 50 times. so, the option is to either accept his response or find another option for discussion. cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over. You do know that right?

And since you can't seem to pull anything else, I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

asked and answered by him. Explained as well.

Yes, his "Waves were detected without hitting the telescope" claim was hilarious.

cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over.

Yes, I'll keep pointing out SSDD's errors, over and over.

I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

Right, keep ignoring the evidence, like the picture of the "cold energy" from space.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

has been thoroughly explained that what was recorded at that radio telescope was a resonant radio frequency...not CMB

A warm telescope at the bottom of a warmer atmosphere detected colder photons that didn't hit the telescope?

Wow!

Your explanation is a bit terse for those unfamiliar with the process. I will give a little detail on the CMB:

The Cosmic Microwave Background 101.

1. Radiation comes from a cold cosmic source at 2.7 degrees above absolute zero.
   
   
2. It penetrates to the earth surface at 300 degrees above absolute zero.
   
   
3. It then strikes a reflector at 300 degrees above absolute zero.
   
   
4. It focuses on a resonantly tuned amplifier at 4 degrees above absolute zero.
   
   
5. Those resonant radio frequency are recorded at several frequencies.
   
   
6. It was an observed, measured, repeatable experiment of radiation of a colder source hitting a warmer object.

SSDD admitted that many times, for example,

it has been thoroughly explained that what was recorded at that radio telescope was a resonant radio frequency.

We all agree with SSDD's statement. Compare step 5 above with his quote.

Why does SSDD deny the experiment? He never stated why. He just keeps trolling the same non-sequitur about step 5 being true, but step 6 being false. That is one characteristic of a troll.

That is clearly radiation from a much colder 2.7 degree K source hitting a much warmer 300 degree K detector. It was an observed, measured, repeated experiment. There are no theories, or models used in that experiment; just measurements.

Will it warm ice cubes? Not by a long shot. The earth radiates much more energy than it receives, so total energy moves from the warm earth to the cold source, and total energy never moves from the cold source to the earth. The second law is never violated.

Why does SSDD deny the experiment? He never stated why.

Because he'd be admitting his claim, "back radiation doesn't exist because the 2nd Law says radiation can't move from cold matter to warmer matter", was wrong.

 

[jc456]

"Believe" in physics? Are you kidding? The whole point of physics is to get beyond having to "believe". Belief is a religious term. Physics is about actual understanding via observation, experiment, testing and measurement. Physics doesn't require belief. Faith requires belief.

And again...its to bad that you can't grasp the concept of resonant frequencies.

And it is not me who is anti science. I am asking for you to provide evidence to support your claims...that is by definition, the way science works. You, on the other hand are asking me to believe...and when I won't take your claim on faith, you tell me that I don't "believe" in physics...as if physics required belief. Grab yourself a dictionary and look up the words physics and religion. Now tell me which one includes the word belief in the definition.

You are asking me to take a claim on faith with no actual observed, measured evidence in support of that claim....and as much as you wish it to be true...being fooled by instrumentation is not evidence.

Nope, you have nothing new. Just the same distractions and troll mentality.

You don't like that use of the word belief? OK. I will reword it. You don't accept the mathematical models of physics as a method for codifying experimental observations and measurements. That's ironic since you misuse the models right and left.

to bad that you can't grasp the concept of resonant frequencies

You are just being a troll again. We all know that the cold radiation must come through the warm atmosphere to be detected by the resonant amplifiers. You are pretending to confuse the actual radiation with the detection method. But you already know that, and prefer to be a troll.

Wow, look at you, how many posts now has SSDD stated all you have is a mathematical model and to actually post observed measured results? And still you fail to provide observations showing energy moving spontaneously from cold to warm. Fk dude, must be over 50 posts asking for that observation evidence. Still nothing. And if radiation must come through the atmosphere, then you should have observation of that! Post it. That wouldn’t be a mathematical model. Instead, it would be actually measured. I get it that confuses you

how many posts now has SSDD stated all you have is a mathematical model and to actually post observed measured results?

CMB was discovered using an actual telescope receiving actual radiation.

And if radiation must come through the atmosphere, then you should have observation of that!

Discovery of cosmic microwave background radiation - Wikipedia

asked and answered by him. Explained as well. In fact, as I stated, at least 50 times. so, the option is to either accept his response or find another option for discussion. cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over. You do know that right?

And since you can't seem to pull anything else, I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

asked and answered by him. Explained as well.

Yes, his "Waves were detected without hitting the telescope" claim was hilarious.

cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over.

Yes, I'll keep pointing out SSDD's errors, over and over.

I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

Right, keep ignoring the evidence, like the picture of the "cold energy" from space.

I'll have ignored your evidence when you present some. tick tock bubba

 

[jc456]

has been thoroughly explained that what was recorded at that radio telescope was a resonant radio frequency...not CMB

A warm telescope at the bottom of a warmer atmosphere detected colder photons that didn't hit the telescope?

Wow!

Your explanation is a bit terse for those unfamiliar with the process. I will give a little detail on the CMB:

The Cosmic Microwave Background 101.

1. Radiation comes from a cold cosmic source at 2.7 degrees above absolute zero.
   
   
2. It penetrates to the earth surface at 300 degrees above absolute zero.
   
   
3. It then strikes a reflector at 300 degrees above absolute zero.
   
   
4. It focuses on a resonantly tuned amplifier at 4 degrees above absolute zero.
   
   
5. Those resonant radio frequency are recorded at several frequencies.
   
   
6. It was an observed, measured, repeatable experiment of radiation of a colder source hitting a warmer object.

SSDD admitted that many times, for example,

it has been thoroughly explained that what was recorded at that radio telescope was a resonant radio frequency.

We all agree with SSDD's statement. Compare step 5 above with his quote.

Why does SSDD deny the experiment? He never stated why. He just keeps trolling the same non-sequitur about step 5 being true, but step 6 being false. That is one characteristic of a troll.

That is clearly radiation from a much colder 2.7 degree K source hitting a much warmer 300 degree K detector. It was an observed, measured, repeated experiment. There are no theories, or models used in that experiment; just measurements.

Will it warm ice cubes? Not by a long shot. The earth radiates much more energy than it receives, so total energy moves from the warm earth to the cold source, and total energy never moves from the cold source to the earth. The second law is never violated.

Why does SSDD deny the experiment? He never stated why.

Because he'd be admitting his claim, "back radiation doesn't exist because the 2nd Law says radiation can't move from cold matter to warmer matter", was wrong.

back radiation doesn't exist. You can't post any evidence. still waiting tick tock.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Nope, you have nothing new. Just the same distractions and troll mentality.

You don't like that use of the word belief? OK. I will reword it. You don't accept the mathematical models of physics as a method for codifying experimental observations and measurements. That's ironic since you misuse the models right and left.

to bad that you can't grasp the concept of resonant frequencies

You are just being a troll again. We all know that the cold radiation must come through the warm atmosphere to be detected by the resonant amplifiers. You are pretending to confuse the actual radiation with the detection method. But you already know that, and prefer to be a troll.

Wow, look at you, how many posts now has SSDD stated all you have is a mathematical model and to actually post observed measured results? And still you fail to provide observations showing energy moving spontaneously from cold to warm. Fk dude, must be over 50 posts asking for that observation evidence. Still nothing. And if radiation must come through the atmosphere, then you should have observation of that! Post it. That wouldn’t be a mathematical model. Instead, it would be actually measured. I get it that confuses you

how many posts now has SSDD stated all you have is a mathematical model and to actually post observed measured results?

CMB was discovered using an actual telescope receiving actual radiation.

And if radiation must come through the atmosphere, then you should have observation of that!

Discovery of cosmic microwave background radiation - Wikipedia

asked and answered by him. Explained as well. In fact, as I stated, at least 50 times. so, the option is to either accept his response or find another option for discussion. cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over. You do know that right?

And since you can't seem to pull anything else, I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

asked and answered by him. Explained as well.

Yes, his "Waves were detected without hitting the telescope" claim was hilarious.

cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over.

Yes, I'll keep pointing out SSDD's errors, over and over.

I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

Right, keep ignoring the evidence, like the picture of the "cold energy" from space.

I'll have ignored your evidence when you present some. tick tock bubba

 

[jc456]

Wow, look at you, how many posts now has SSDD stated all you have is a mathematical model and to actually post observed measured results? And still you fail to provide observations showing energy moving spontaneously from cold to warm. Fk dude, must be over 50 posts asking for that observation evidence. Still nothing. And if radiation must come through the atmosphere, then you should have observation of that! Post it. That wouldn’t be a mathematical model. Instead, it would be actually measured. I get it that confuses you

how many posts now has SSDD stated all you have is a mathematical model and to actually post observed measured results?

CMB was discovered using an actual telescope receiving actual radiation.

And if radiation must come through the atmosphere, then you should have observation of that!

Discovery of cosmic microwave background radiation - Wikipedia

asked and answered by him. Explained as well. In fact, as I stated, at least 50 times. so, the option is to either accept his response or find another option for discussion. cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over. You do know that right?

And since you can't seem to pull anything else, I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

asked and answered by him. Explained as well.

Yes, his "Waves were detected without hitting the telescope" claim was hilarious.

cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over.

Yes, I'll keep pointing out SSDD's errors, over and over.

I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

Right, keep ignoring the evidence, like the picture of the "cold energy" from space.

I'll have ignored your evidence when you present some. tick tock bubba

nothing, just like normal. thanks.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

how many posts now has SSDD stated all you have is a mathematical model and to actually post observed measured results?

CMB was discovered using an actual telescope receiving actual radiation.

And if radiation must come through the atmosphere, then you should have observation of that!

Discovery of cosmic microwave background radiation - Wikipedia

asked and answered by him. Explained as well. In fact, as I stated, at least 50 times. so, the option is to either accept his response or find another option for discussion. cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over. You do know that right?

And since you can't seem to pull anything else, I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

asked and answered by him. Explained as well.

Yes, his "Waves were detected without hitting the telescope" claim was hilarious.

cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over.

Yes, I'll keep pointing out SSDD's errors, over and over.

I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

Right, keep ignoring the evidence, like the picture of the "cold energy" from space.

I'll have ignored your evidence when you present some. tick tock bubba

nothing, just like normal. thanks.

Nothing? LOL!

That's a map of microwave radiation, received over a 9 year period, of the Universe.

Only one of the coolest things ever recorded in the history of science.

I'm not surprised you can't understand any of it.

 

[jc456]

asked and answered by him. Explained as well. In fact, as I stated, at least 50 times. so, the option is to either accept his response or find another option for discussion. cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over. You do know that right?

And since you can't seem to pull anything else, I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

asked and answered by him. Explained as well.

Yes, his "Waves were detected without hitting the telescope" claim was hilarious.

cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over.

Yes, I'll keep pointing out SSDD's errors, over and over.

I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

Right, keep ignoring the evidence, like the picture of the "cold energy" from space.

I'll have ignored your evidence when you present some. tick tock bubba

nothing, just like normal. thanks.

Nothing? LOL!

That's a map of microwave radiation, received over a 9 year period, of the Universe.

Only one of the coolest things ever recorded in the history of science.

I'm not surprised you can't understand any of it.

it's a picture. LOL

 

[Sunsettommy]

asked and answered by him. Explained as well. In fact, as I stated, at least 50 times. so, the option is to either accept his response or find another option for discussion. cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over. You do know that right?

And since you can't seem to pull anything else, I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

asked and answered by him. Explained as well.

Yes, his "Waves were detected without hitting the telescope" claim was hilarious.

cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over.

Yes, I'll keep pointing out SSDD's errors, over and over.

I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

Right, keep ignoring the evidence, like the picture of the "cold energy" from space.

I'll have ignored your evidence when you present some. tick tock bubba

nothing, just like normal. thanks.

Nothing? LOL!

That's a map of microwave radiation, received over a 9 year period, of the Universe.

Only one of the coolest things ever recorded in the history of science.

I'm not surprised you can't understand any of it.

Nice photo, but you didn't post a link for it.

 

[jc456]

asked and answered by him. Explained as well.

Yes, his "Waves were detected without hitting the telescope" claim was hilarious.

cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over.

Yes, I'll keep pointing out SSDD's errors, over and over.

I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

Right, keep ignoring the evidence, like the picture of the "cold energy" from space.

I'll have ignored your evidence when you present some. tick tock bubba

nothing, just like normal. thanks.

Nothing? LOL!

That's a map of microwave radiation, received over a 9 year period, of the Universe.

Only one of the coolest things ever recorded in the history of science.

I'm not surprised you can't understand any of it.

Nice photo, but you didn't post a link for it.

or a data plot.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

asked and answered by him. Explained as well.

Yes, his "Waves were detected without hitting the telescope" claim was hilarious.

cause all you're doing is repeating yourself over and over and over and over.

Yes, I'll keep pointing out SSDD's errors, over and over.

I supposed you will never convince him or me about energy moving from cold to warm spontaneously.

Right, keep ignoring the evidence, like the picture of the "cold energy" from space.

I'll have ignored your evidence when you present some. tick tock bubba

nothing, just like normal. thanks.

Nothing? LOL!

That's a map of microwave radiation, received over a 9 year period, of the Universe.

Only one of the coolest things ever recorded in the history of science.

I'm not surprised you can't understand any of it.

Nice photo, but you didn't post a link for it.

Discovery of cosmic microwave background radiation - Wikipedia

 

[Sunsettommy]

I'll have ignored your evidence when you present some. tick tock bubba

nothing, just like normal. thanks.

Nothing? LOL!

That's a map of microwave radiation, received over a 9 year period, of the Universe.

Only one of the coolest things ever recorded in the history of science.

I'm not surprised you can't understand any of it.

Nice photo, but you didn't post a link for it.

Discovery of cosmic microwave background radiation - Wikipedia

I have known about this discovery since the 1980's but not convinced it is from the big bang event, since they have not eliminated the obvious alternative possibilities.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

nothing, just like normal. thanks.

Nothing? LOL!

That's a map of microwave radiation, received over a 9 year period, of the Universe.

Only one of the coolest things ever recorded in the history of science.

I'm not surprised you can't understand any of it.

Nice photo, but you didn't post a link for it.

Discovery of cosmic microwave background radiation - Wikipedia

I have known about this discovery since the 1980's but not convinced it is from the big bang event, since they have not eliminated the obvious alternative possibilities.

Such as...……?

 

[Crick]

Oh yes, such as. I am dying to hear these "obvious alternative possibilities". Let me guess. RF resonance?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Right there...to bad you can't read an equation....

I can read an equation. The equation doesn't say one way flow.
Neither does anything else. Your faith is touching, and apparently singular. Weird.

Of course it does...it says that the output of the radiator is dependent upon the temperature difference between the radiator and its surroundings....which expression in that equation do you think describes the output of the surroundings to the radiator relative to the energy being received from the radiator?

then there is every observation and measurement ever made...

Of course there have been many examples of 2 way flow provided. Flow of radiation from cooler to warmer.
CMB is one of the most famous. How did that "cool energy" get permission to flow toward our hot atmosphere
in order to hit the radio telescope used by Penzias and Wilson?

been through that till it is pointless to go though it further...CMB was first detected via a resonant radio frequency...if you want to detect the actual CMB IR radiation, you must have an instrument cooled to less than 2.75K...

if you want to detect the actual CMB IR radiation, you must have an instrument cooled to less than 2.75K...

Over two decades later, working at Bell Labs in Holmdel, New Jersey, in 1964, Arno Penzias and Robert Wilson were experimenting with a supersensitive, 6 meter (20 ft) horn antenna originally built to detect radio waves bounced off Echo balloon satellites. To measure these faint radio waves, they had to eliminate all recognizable interference from their receiver. They removed the effects of radar and radio broadcasting, and suppressed interference from the heat in the receiver itself by cooling it with liquid helium to −269 °C, only 4 K above absolute zero.

Discovery of cosmic microwave background radiation - Wikipedia

Hmmmmm……...