Public servants should be paid more

[DaGoose]

Why do people presume that money is the only benefit we can get? Isnt service for services sake enough?

You're kidding, right? There is no way you are suggesting that we would find unpaid volunteers to pick up garbage?

When do you start?

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[DaGoose]

The argument that public employees pay taxes so we should pay them more is specious.

The government takes our money to pay public employees then the government takes taxes from the public employees.

Well folks those taxes taken from public employees are still money that was taken from us first.

We should be privatizing many public services.

Many cities and Towns are already privatizing.

Sand Point, GA is a case in point. The mayor and Town leaders polled the citizens on privatizing their public works. They got the approval and did so.

The Town is saving money. They are getting things done faster, better and cheaper. The citizens in Sand Point are very happy with the savings and the service they are getting.

Wonder if the idea would catch on in CAli, NY, NJ and ILL??

One can hope.

Been there, done that.

•An audit report from the Wisconsin Legislative Audit Bureau revealed that the state's department of transportation wasted more than $1 million by outsourcing almost half its engineering work to private contractors over the past five years. The audit found that about 60% of these outsourced jobs could have been done at a lower cost by state workers, which would have saved the state $1.2 million.

•In February 2009, Chicago and Chicago Parking Meters LLC signed a 75-year concession agreement for the operation of Chicago's 36,000 parking meters. Along with many problems related to malfunctioning meters, rates have significantly increased, causing many residents to think twice before parking in the city. Many stores and merchants in the area complain that the rates have decreased business. In some parts of the city, rates increased in the first months to 28 quarters ($7) for 2 hours of parking time. The parking charges also have been extended to 7 days a week and for more hours during the day.

Privatization Myths Debunked | In the Public Interest

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[DaGoose]

No, Republicans hate other people making money. I mean they need a pay raise because they are so poor at 174K a year but teachers are very rich at 51K a year. See I am a master of Republican logic. I could be a republican candidate. Lets see.

In NYC, 35% of the population is on welfare.

There are 360,000 public employees in the city of NY, or 1 in 40 of the population.

5 of the highest-real estate taxed counties in the US are in NYS.

1% of NYC's population pays over 50% of its taxes.

NYPD can retire after 20 years on the job - at any age.

In 2001, NYC spent $1.5 billion on pensions - it now spends over $10 billion, a number that will grow to more than half the budget in a few years.

NYS lost more people than other state in the US since 2000.

There are middle school teachers in NYS earning over $150K per year.

Over the last 10 years, upstate NY has endured a reduced children population - yet there were more than 5,000 additional teachers hired there over this same time period.

Are you still here wasting our time with your BS, or do you plan on addressing the facts, like how public employee unions are a total fucking cancer on our society?

I see you have never lived in NYC.

But I don't see a problem with a teacher earning 150K meaning they are pretty good at their job considering the average pay is 60K a year in a very expensive city. But they are making bank for sure.

But I don't understand your rant for the "facts" considering I just gave your misleading "fact" the truth.

So try again.

Ya....I'd like to see a link.

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[WillowTree]

The argument that public employees pay taxes so we should pay them more is specious.

The government takes our money to pay public employees then the government takes taxes from the public employees.

Well folks those taxes taken from public employees are still money that was taken from us first.

We should be privatizing many public services.

Absolutely we should. If public employees want to form unions and gouge us for more more more to the point of bankruptcy then we friggin don't need em no more.

 

[DaGoose]

The argument that public employees pay taxes so we should pay them more is specious.

The government takes our money to pay public employees then the government takes taxes from the public employees.

Well folks those taxes taken from public employees are still money that was taken from us first.

We should be privatizing many public services.

Absolutely we should. If public employees want to form unions and gouge us for more more more to the point of bankruptcy then we friggin don't need em no more.

Ya...we all know that costs never rise for private companies. Their costs of doing business such as fuel, insurance, health care never go up. And we all know that their employees NEVER get any wage increases.

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[iamwhatiseem]

No they don't. Not all of them anyway.
Take school administrators...most of them make outrageous salaries with diamond clad, gold lined early retirement plans. Many of them only work 5-10 years in the position but get a VERY generous pension that rivals a full pension plan in the private sector.
Many of them have armies of assistance that do most of the grunt work they are responsible for. (paper work is immense in school systems)
In a good week, they might do 10 hours of actual-real work...and I am being liberal.
As an example in a small school system in our area there is one high school, one junior high and only two grade schools. The population of the town is only around 7-8000.
His wages and benefits (as published annually in the newspaper)
Salary - slightly over $100,000
Monthly "car allowance" - $500 per month.
401k monthly compensation while in the position - $1500 ($18k annually)
Full benefits while in the position at no cost to him.
If in the position for 10 years - full pension plan.

And I should mention this is a county where the average household income is only $36,280

 

[WillowTree]

The argument that public employees pay taxes so we should pay them more is specious.

The government takes our money to pay public employees then the government takes taxes from the public employees.

Well folks those taxes taken from public employees are still money that was taken from us first.

We should be privatizing many public services.

Absolutely we should. If public employees want to form unions and gouge us for more more more to the point of bankruptcy then we friggin don't need em no more.

Ya...we all know that costs never rise for private companies. Their costs of doing business such as fuel, insurance, health care never go up. And we all know that their employees NEVER get any wage increases.

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hey! fucktard! Pay attention. We're talking about taxpayers here and what we can afford.. What fucking part of bankrupt is it that you don't understand???? Moron.

 

[signelect]

New York is in the tank because the libs run the state so they are right where they voted to be. Texas has problems but compared to NY we are doing great, um, conservative state. I wonder if there is nay correlation. Rudy is the only good thing that has happened to NY in a long time.

 

[DaGoose]

No they don't. Not all of them anyway.
Take school administrators...most of them make outrageous salaries with diamond clad, gold lined early retirement plans. Many of them only work 5-10 years in the position but get a VERY generous pension that rivals a full pension plan in the private sector.
Many of them have armies of assistance that do most of the grunt work they are responsible for. (paper work is immense in school systems)
In a good week, they might do 10 hours of actual-real work...and I am being liberal.
As an example in a small school system in our area there is one high school, one junior high and only two grade schools. The population of the town is only around 7-8000.
His wages and benefits (as published annually in the newspaper)
Salary - slightly over $100,000
Monthly "car allowance" - $500 per month.
401k monthly compensation while in the position - $1500 ($18k annually)
Full benefits while in the position at no cost to him.
If in the position for 10 years - full pension plan.

And I should mention this is a county where the average household income is only $36,280

You won't get a HUGE argument from me on school administrators or even superintendents/regional superintendents. But I will say that their salaries/benefits are not TOO out of line given their level of education. Whether they earn it or not is another argument. Kind of like CEO's.

.

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[Skull Pilot]

Many cities and Towns are already privatizing.

Sand Point, GA is a case in point. The mayor and Town leaders polled the citizens on privatizing their public works. They got the approval and did so.

The Town is saving money. They are getting things done faster, better and cheaper. The citizens in Sand Point are very happy with the savings and the service they are getting.

Wonder if the idea would catch on in CAli, NY, NJ and ILL??

One can hope.

Been there, done that.

•An audit report from the Wisconsin Legislative Audit Bureau revealed that the state's department of transportation wasted more than $1 million by outsourcing almost half its engineering work to private contractors over the past five years. The audit found that about 60% of these outsourced jobs could have been done at a lower cost by state workers, which would have saved the state $1.2 million.

•In February 2009, Chicago and Chicago Parking Meters LLC signed a 75-year concession agreement for the operation of Chicago's 36,000 parking meters. Along with many problems related to malfunctioning meters, rates have significantly increased, causing many residents to think twice before parking in the city. Many stores and merchants in the area complain that the rates have decreased business. In some parts of the city, rates increased in the first months to 28 quarters ($7) for 2 hours of parking time. The parking charges also have been extended to 7 days a week and for more hours during the day.

Privatization Myths Debunked | In the Public Interest

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Do your few examples factor in the cost of pensions and health care retirement benefits?

We pay for public employees long after they stop working.

 

[DaGoose]

Absolutely we should. If public employees want to form unions and gouge us for more more more to the point of bankruptcy then we friggin don't need em no more.

Ya...we all know that costs never rise for private companies. Their costs of doing business such as fuel, insurance, health care never go up. And we all know that their employees NEVER get any wage increases.

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hey! fucktard! Pay attention. We're talking about taxpayers here and what we can afford.. What fucking part of bankrupt is it that you don't understand???? Moron.

Hmm...fucktard? LOL

My point was (and you missed which is not surprising) that even with private companies (doing business for state and local government) costs increase. And those increased costs WILL be passed onto the taxpayers (you and me).

So the argument for privatization is hollow. It's not the saving grace you make it out to be.

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[DaGoose]

One can hope.

Been there, done that.

•An audit report from the Wisconsin Legislative Audit Bureau revealed that the state's department of transportation wasted more than $1 million by outsourcing almost half its engineering work to private contractors over the past five years. The audit found that about 60% of these outsourced jobs could have been done at a lower cost by state workers, which would have saved the state $1.2 million.

•In February 2009, Chicago and Chicago Parking Meters LLC signed a 75-year concession agreement for the operation of Chicago's 36,000 parking meters. Along with many problems related to malfunctioning meters, rates have significantly increased, causing many residents to think twice before parking in the city. Many stores and merchants in the area complain that the rates have decreased business. In some parts of the city, rates increased in the first months to 28 quarters ($7) for 2 hours of parking time. The parking charges also have been extended to 7 days a week and for more hours during the day.

Privatization Myths Debunked | In the Public Interest

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Do your few examples factor in the cost of pensions and health care retirement benefits?

We pay for public employees long after they stop working.

And you are saying that private companies DON'T have employee pensions and health care benefits that are figured into the cost of their bids?

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[Skull Pilot]

Been there, done that.



Privatization Myths Debunked | In the Public Interest

.

Do your few examples factor in the cost of pensions and health care retirement benefits?

We pay for public employees long after they stop working.

And you are saying that private companies DON'T have employee pensions that are figured into the cost of their bids?

.

Most private companies do not offer pensions opting for defined contribution retirement plans such as 401Ks.

 

[DaGoose]

Do your few examples factor in the cost of pensions and health care retirement benefits?

We pay for public employees long after they stop working.

And you are saying that private companies DON'T have employee pensions that are figured into the cost of their bids?

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Most private companies do not offer pensions opting for defined contribution retirement plans such as 401Ks.

Which may add to the cost depending on the company match and how much the company must pay for plan administration and investment. But even THAT cost would have to be passed onto the taxpayers.

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[signelect]

What is the problem. Most public workers are better paid, more benefits and health care than the private sector workers. Most fireman don't pay SS tax's. ?Why not? Don't give me the garbage about the risk. They chose the job and they knew what they were signing up for, don't start crying now. No one in private sector employment get the vacation time and I can assure you that they work hard. I talked to a woman in the IRS a week ago, she was rude and told me that the IRS does not make mistake although they sent me money that they later said was a mistake and I had to give it back with out any documentation.

 

[Skull Pilot]

And you are saying that private companies DON'T have employee pensions that are figured into the cost of their bids?

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Most private companies do not offer pensions opting for defined contribution retirement plans such as 401Ks.

Which may add to the cost depending on the company match and how much the company must pay for plan administration and investment. But even THAT cost would have to be passed onto the taxpayers.

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You don't know much about a 401K do you?

Matches generally are a few percent and administration costs are typically less than a few thousand a year. Given that many people don't participate the cost of a 401K is negligible compared to the cost of guaranteeing a retiree 80% of his income plus health benefits which is pretty standard for public employees.

 

[DaGoose]

What is the problem. Most public workers are better paid, more benefits and health care than the private sector workers. Most fireman don't pay SS tax's. ?Why not? Don't give me the garbage about the risk. They chose the job and they knew what they were signing up for, don't start crying now. No one in private sector employment get the vacation time and I can assure you that they work hard. I talked to a woman in the IRS a week ago, she was rude and told me that the IRS does not make mistake although they sent me money that they later said was a mistake and I had to give it back with out any documentation.

If firemen do not pay SS taxes then they don't collect either, do they? You just made a GREAT argument as to WHY their pensions should be a bit better than most. My wife, as a public school teacher is the same way. She cannot collect SS and what's more she cannot collect suvivor benefits from mine, either.

And I won't "give you the garbage about the risk". But I will say that I would not want to depend on a 65 year old man in full turn out gear to pull me out of a burning building. Public safety is the reason you get them out earlier than most and then you replace them with newer employees that are lower on the wage scale.

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[DaGoose]

Most private companies do not offer pensions opting for defined contribution retirement plans such as 401Ks.

Which may add to the cost depending on the company match and how much the company must pay for plan administration and investment. But even THAT cost would have to be passed onto the taxpayers.

.

You don't know much about a 401K do you?

Matches generally are a few percent and administration costs are typically less than a few thousand a year. Given that many people don't participate the cost of a 401K is negligible compared to the cost of guaranteeing a retiree 80% of his income plus health benefits which is pretty standard for public employees.

I have close to a half-million reasons why I know plenty about 401k's. And anyplace that does not provide at least a 50% match has a POS 401k program. Mine is 100% up to 6%.

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[Toro]

Professionals in the public services are generally underpaid. No doubt about that.

 

[KissMy]

Professionals in the public services are generally underpaid. No doubt about that.

Bull, There are people begging for those cushy jobs with golden retirements.