Ptsd And Weapons Possession

[whitehall]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

Wrong, one must have reasonable grounds for claiming someone lose their rights due to mental illness. If you suspect someone report them and let the authorities decide what to do. In the US one does not have to justify the use of their rights, one must justify taking rights away. Further Psychiatrists do not decide if one loses their rights a Court does that. A Judge must rule you incompetent.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

Combat veterans don't need a gun to kill you.

 

[whitehall]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

Wrong, one must have reasonable grounds for claiming someone lose their rights due to mental illness. If you suspect someone report them and let the authorities decide what to do. In the US one does not have to justify the use of their rights, one must justify taking rights away. Further Psychiatrists do not decide if one loses their rights a Court does that. A Judge must rule you incompetent.

Wrong gunny. The ATF form asks if the applicant is currently undergoing treatment for mental illness. Crazy people are (rightfully) denied permission to purchase a firearm. There is no further judicial review. Now, if the government decides to confiscate weapons it is another issue.

 

[whitehall]

Restricting weapons purchases by persons with mental illness is a well established legal issue and almost nobody would argue the point. The fact that the defense in a double murder would center around PTSD is an indication that it is a serious mental condition.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

Wrong, one must have reasonable grounds for claiming someone lose their rights due to mental illness. If you suspect someone report them and let the authorities decide what to do. In the US one does not have to justify the use of their rights, one must justify taking rights away. Further Psychiatrists do not decide if one loses their rights a Court does that. A Judge must rule you incompetent.

Wrong gunny. The ATF form asks if the applicant is currently undergoing treatment for mental illness. Crazy people are (rightfully) denied permission to purchase a firearm. There is no further judicial review. Now, if the government decides to confiscate weapons it is another issue.

I suggest you read the LAW. One must be adjudged mentally incompetent to be denied their 2nd amendment rights.

 

[whitehall]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

Wrong, one must have reasonable grounds for claiming someone lose their rights due to mental illness. If you suspect someone report them and let the authorities decide what to do. In the US one does not have to justify the use of their rights, one must justify taking rights away. Further Psychiatrists do not decide if one loses their rights a Court does that. A Judge must rule you incompetent.

Wrong gunny. The ATF form asks if the applicant is currently undergoing treatment for mental illness. Crazy people are (rightfully) denied permission to purchase a firearm. There is no further judicial review. Now, if the government decides to confiscate weapons it is another issue.

I suggest you read the LAW. One must be adjudged mentally incompetent to be denied their 2nd amendment rights.

That's simply not true gunny. Court ordered psychiatric treatment is included in the instant name check and it prevents persons who are being treated for mental disorder from purchasing a firearm.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

Wrong, one must have reasonable grounds for claiming someone lose their rights due to mental illness. If you suspect someone report them and let the authorities decide what to do. In the US one does not have to justify the use of their rights, one must justify taking rights away. Further Psychiatrists do not decide if one loses their rights a Court does that. A Judge must rule you incompetent.

Wrong gunny. The ATF form asks if the applicant is currently undergoing treatment for mental illness. Crazy people are (rightfully) denied permission to purchase a firearm. There is no further judicial review. Now, if the government decides to confiscate weapons it is another issue.

I suggest you read the LAW. One must be adjudged mentally incompetent to be denied their 2nd amendment rights.

That's simply not true gunny. Court ordered psychiatric treatment is included in the instant name check and it prevents persons who are being treated for mental disorder from purchasing a firearm.

Court ordered as by a JUDGE. Just seeing a shrink does not bar you. But you keep claiming otherwise.

 

[westwall]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

Wrong, one must have reasonable grounds for claiming someone lose their rights due to mental illness. If you suspect someone report them and let the authorities decide what to do. In the US one does not have to justify the use of their rights, one must justify taking rights away. Further Psychiatrists do not decide if one loses their rights a Court does that. A Judge must rule you incompetent.

Wrong gunny. The ATF form asks if the applicant is currently undergoing treatment for mental illness. Crazy people are (rightfully) denied permission to purchase a firearm. There is no further judicial review. Now, if the government decides to confiscate weapons it is another issue.

I suggest you read the LAW. One must be adjudged mentally incompetent to be denied their 2nd amendment rights.

That's simply not true gunny. Court ordered psychiatric treatment is included in the instant name check and it prevents persons who are being treated for mental disorder from purchasing a firearm.

Untrue. A person must be adjudicated in a Court of Law to be mentally incompetent. Period end of story. The guy that shot up the university a few years ago was in therapy IIRC and he didn't show up on the instant check. You're simply wrong.

 

[Toronado3800]

Help me out.

Suffering from PTSD officially rightfully gets you some disability, correct?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Help me out.

Suffering from PTSD officially rightfully gets you some disability, correct?

And your point?

 

[Toronado3800]

Help me out.

Suffering from PTSD officially rightfully gets you some disability, correct?

And your point?

Well at some point if you are suffering PTSD you have said you have mental problems. I am sure there are tons of forms to get the disability from it and a few tests.

Can we just say anyone who is determined to be disabled due to PTSD is ineligible to own a gun? Heck, I'll give PTSD disability victims $1,000 more a year in exchange if that keeps whoever their lobbying group is happy. Lord knows the poor bastards deserve more.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Help me out.

Suffering from PTSD officially rightfully gets you some disability, correct?

And your point?

Well at some point if you are suffering PTSD you have said you have mental problems. I am sure there are tons of forms to get the disability from it and a few tests.

Can we just say anyone who is determined to be disabled due to PTSD is ineligible to own a gun? Heck, I'll give PTSD disability victims $1,000 more a year in exchange if that keeps whoever their lobbying group is happy. Lord knows the poor bastards deserve more.

Nope doesn't work that way. Once again for the slow and stupid, a JUDGE must rule you incompetent. Just because something disables you does not make you incompetent. I have delusional paranoia and recurring major depression am rated at 70 percent by VA and paid at the 100 percent rate. I can still own possess and carry firearms. And my shrink does not disagree. Nor my therapist.

 

[westwall]

Help me out.

Suffering from PTSD officially rightfully gets you some disability, correct?

So does suffering from a missing limb.

 

[jon_berzerk]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

Wrong, one must have reasonable grounds for claiming someone lose their rights due to mental illness. If you suspect someone report them and let the authorities decide what to do. In the US one does not have to justify the use of their rights, one must justify taking rights away. Further Psychiatrists do not decide if one loses their rights a Court does that. A Judge must rule you incompetent.

Wrong gunny. The ATF form asks if the applicant is currently undergoing treatment for mental illness. Crazy people are (rightfully) denied permission to purchase a firearm. There is no further judicial review. Now, if the government decides to confiscate weapons it is another issue.

The ATF form asks if the applicant is currently undergoing treatment for mental illness.


which form asks that

https://www.atf.gov/files/forms/download/atf-f-4473-1.pdf

 

[Toronado3800]

Help me out.

Suffering from PTSD officially rightfully gets you some disability, correct?

And your point?

Well at some point if you are suffering PTSD you have said you have mental problems. I am sure there are tons of forms to get the disability from it and a few tests.

Can we just say anyone who is determined to be disabled due to PTSD is ineligible to own a gun? Heck, I'll give PTSD disability victims $1,000 more a year in exchange if that keeps whoever their lobbying group is happy. Lord knows the poor bastards deserve more.

Nope doesn't work that way. Once again for the slow and stupid, a JUDGE must rule you incompetent. Just because something disables you does not make you incompetent. I have delusional paranoia and recurring major depression am rated at 70 percent by VA and paid at the 100 percent rate. I can still own possess and carry firearms. And my shrink does not disagree. Nor my therapist.

Oh wow. Sorry to hear all that.

I understand the difference between disabled and incompetent in a physical vs mental sense. I do not understand what paranoia and depression are like personally. The thought of it terrifies me. You well and earned the disability it sounds like.

Maybe I just think of movies too much or something when I hear PTSD. It sounds terrible though. I don't understand how it can be so terrible yet not affect the gun thing.

Oh well. That is my limitation of understanding.

Best of luck man.

 

[whitehall]

Help me out.

Suffering from PTSD officially rightfully gets you some disability, correct?

And your point?

Well at some point if you are suffering PTSD you have said you have mental problems. I am sure there are tons of forms to get the disability from it and a few tests.

Can we just say anyone who is determined to be disabled due to PTSD is ineligible to own a gun? Heck, I'll give PTSD disability victims $1,000 more a year in exchange if that keeps whoever their lobbying group is happy. Lord knows the poor bastards deserve more.

Nope doesn't work that way. Once again for the slow and stupid, a JUDGE must rule you incompetent. Just because something disables you does not make you incompetent. I have delusional paranoia and recurring major depression am rated at 70 percent by VA and paid at the 100 percent rate. I can still own possess and carry firearms. And my shrink does not disagree. Nor my therapist.

We are talking about two different things. You can be arrested for lying about your mental condition on an ATF form. Surely everyone cares about crazy people buying firearms. The maniac who was responsible for the worst school shooting in history wasn't a Vet but he slipped through the system and was able to purchase firearms even though he was insane because privacy issues about mental illness trumped the safety of citizens. The loophole has been corrected in Virginia and court ordered psychiatric counseling shows up in the instant name check. You can prevent criminals and mental patients from purchasing firearms by the instant name check but it does take a court order to confiscate firearms.

 

[Defiant1]

Help me out.

Suffering from PTSD officially rightfully gets you some disability, correct?

And your point?

Well at some point if you are suffering PTSD you have said you have mental problems. I am sure there are tons of forms to get the disability from it and a few tests.

Can we just say anyone who is determined to be disabled due to PTSD is ineligible to own a gun? Heck, I'll give PTSD disability victims $1,000 more a year in exchange if that keeps whoever their lobbying group is happy. Lord knows the poor bastards deserve more.

Nope doesn't work that way. Once again for the slow and stupid, a JUDGE must rule you incompetent. Just because something disables you does not make you incompetent. I have delusional paranoia and recurring major depression am rated at 70 percent by VA and paid at the 100 percent rate. I can still own possess and carry firearms. And my shrink does not disagree. Nor my therapist.

We are talking about two different things. You can be arrested for lying about your mental condition on an ATF form. Surely everyone cares about crazy people buying firearms. The maniac who was responsible for the worst school shooting in history wasn't a Vet but he slipped through the system and was able to purchase firearms even though he was insane because privacy issues about mental illness trumped the safety of citizens. The loophole has been corrected in Virginia and court ordered psychiatric counseling shows up in the instant name check. You can prevent criminals and mental patients from purchasing firearms by the instant name check but it does take a court order to confiscate firearms.

A person has their right to vote terminated if they are adjudicated mentally incompetent. Should we lower that standard to persons who are receiving treatment for mental illness?

If not, why not? The right to bear arms is unalienable, the right to vote is not.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

In Feb of 2013 a former Marine named Eddie Ray Routh murdered former Navy Seal Chris Kyle and another Veteran Chad Littlefield at a gun range in Texas. The motive was unclear but the attorneys for Routh will base their defense on PTSD. Former Marine Sgt. (wrong way) Tahmooressi ended up in Mexico with a trunk full of weapons. His defense ....PTSD. Wouldn't it be prudent to prevent PTSD patients from possessing deadly weapons until they are cleared by government psychiatrists?

Wrong, one must have reasonable grounds for claiming someone lose their rights due to mental illness. If you suspect someone report them and let the authorities decide what to do. In the US one does not have to justify the use of their rights, one must justify taking rights away. Further Psychiatrists do not decide if one loses their rights a Court does that. A Judge must rule you incompetent.

Wrong gunny. The ATF form asks if the applicant is currently undergoing treatment for mental illness. Crazy people are (rightfully) denied permission to purchase a firearm. There is no further judicial review. Now, if the government decides to confiscate weapons it is another issue.

Incorrect.

The 4473 asks nothing about currently receiving mental health treatment:

“Have you ever been adjudicated mentally defective (which includes a determination by a court, board, commission, or other lawful authority that you are a danger to yourself or to others or are incompetent to manage your own affairs) OR have you ever been committed to a mental institution? (See Instructions for Question 11.f.)”

Only after someone has been afforded due process can an issue of mental health be a factor in determining whether or not one may be allowed possession of a firearm.

 

[Toronado3800]

I need to learn more about this PTSD to determine how I really feel. Can a person with PTSD get a job flying an airliner or driving a bus? Win custody of their kids? Does PTSD cover a wide variety of conditions?