Prophecy Clarified

[JohnGalt]

Originally posted by dilloduck
Knowing them and using them are two different things

That is why your arguments are so ineffective. You can't teach something well when you don't know it. They are two very identical things that are intertwined completely.

:wank:
It's like not KNOWING how to use your piece, and trying to TEACH a sex ed class. (just wanted to use that smily )

 

[Jackass]

Originally posted by NewGuy
How about you? Do you claim a faith?

I was raised a catholic...and still believe in the religion itself. The church though lost me a long time ago.

What about faith? Do you believe you have faith?

 

[Bullypulpit]

Originally posted by freeandfun1
Would it be better to die right or wrong?

Also, God promises those that choose 'good' eternal life. Don't get caught up in the life you live now and think about what could be!

I live a good and moral life, but I'm not even remotely Christian. Nor do I intend to become one. If your God is that petty and jealous, then He/She is far to human to be deserving of my praise.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by Zhukov
Eternal salvation.

Isn't that the whole point? The Christ died for your sins, and your acceptance of him insures life eternal. That eternal life being after this one of course.

It was my understanding that just about every religion concerned itself chiefly with the after-life.

Sure, most religions instruct behavior as it relates to this life, but only insofar as it pertains, ultimately, to the after-life.

How would you instruct behavior?

 

[freeandfun1]

Originally posted by Bullypulpit
I live a good and moral life, but I'm not even remotely Christian. Nor do I intend to become one. If your God is that petty and jealous, then He/She is far to human to be deserving of my praise.

If you have no religious beliefs, why do you have a pic of Bush with 666 on his forehead as an avatar?

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
the problem lies with telling someone else who believes in christ that he's wrong when he doesn't parrot you on everything. Would you tell the pope he's wrong if you disagreed with him on a point?

Do you really not know the answer to this? These are the peope telling us Catholics arent Christians. Despite there not being any rational explanation for it.

 

[Bullypulpit]

Originally posted by freeandfun1
If you have no religious beliefs, why do you have a pic of Bush with 666 on his forehead as an avatar?

Satire, and to irritate the faithful followers of Dubbyuh.

 

[freeandfun1]

Originally posted by Avatar4321
Do you really not know the answer to this? These are the peope telling us Catholics arent Christians. Despite there not being any rational explanation for it.

I haven't seen any posts (and do not recall any) that says Catholics are not Christian.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Jackass
I was raised a catholic...and still believe in the religion itself. The church though lost me a long time ago.

What about faith? Do you believe you have faith?

Born again Christian is the blanket term for me, I guess.

--Although there are a lot of new beliefs and behaviors with a "unity", or "word of faith" or other such craziness that I don't find Biblical and I cannot claim an association with.

I find myself in a league with people who tend to take a lot of heat for being rigidly in favor of going by only what is Biblical and proven Biblical.

 

[NewGuy]

These are the peope telling us Catholics arent Christians. Despite there not being any rational explanation for it.

Nobody reads anymore.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by NewGuy
How many times do I have to repeat ...."READ THE BOOK".

Since when did I say I was the authority.

You are really starting to look like a butthead the way you like to keep misrepresenting me and picking a fight.

Is that what you are trying to do all the time?

If so, at least admit it.

The problem is the fact that you are relying on the Book and not on God. Books have to be interpreted by imperfect men. Take the Pharisees for example. They knew the scriptures in and out. Yet, because of their interpretations they missed the Savior whom the scriptures testified. "Ye search the scriptures, for in them ye think ye have eternal life." I think the problem most people are having with you is that you interpret the Bible, and then pretend as if anyone who disagrees with your interpretation is not following the Bible.

Read the Bible all you want. Without the Spirit it wont do an iota of good. Even if every Bible in the world were destroyed, God can still continue His work. Thats why i cringe to see people relying on their interpretation of the Bible more than God. Thats what the Pharisees did.

 

[Jackass]

Originally posted by NewGuy
I find myself in a league with people who tend to take a lot of heat for being rigidly in favor of going by only what is Biblical and proven Biblical.

Im sorry...would that mean you dont have faith? Not trying to start anything here..just wondering.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by freeandfun1
Not lumping you in the same category, but you do realize that what you said is what the Muslims claim. They say God changed his mind and that is where Mohammed came from.

If one believes in the God of the Bible, then they must accept that he will not change his mind and that all others that proclaim that he has is a false prophet.

Going to have to clarify something. Where exactly do Muslims say God changed his mind? Their claim is that Judaism and Christianity were corrupted and the scriptures changed. How is that God changing his mind?

 

[freeandfun1]

Wouldn't God changing the scriptures require his having to change his mind after he said that he doesn't?

He Does Not Change
"I am the Lord. I do not change." (Malachi 3:6)
"Jesus the Messiah is the same yesterday, today, and forever." (Hebrews 13:8)

He Will Not Change His Mind
"God is not a man that He should lie, or a son of man that His purpose may be changed." (Numbers 23:19)

"He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world." (Ephesians 1:4)

He Will Not Change His Word
"I tell you the truth, till Heaven and Earth pass away, not one jot or one tittle from the law shall pass away until all is fulfilled." (Matthew 5:18)

"I the Lord have said the word and I will do it. I will not go back...my purpose will not be changed." (Ezekiel 24:14)

He Will Not Change His Plan
"God, by whom you have been marked out in His purpose, is unchanging, and He will make it complete." (I Thessalonians 5:24)

The Quran says in 4:157,
"They said, 'We killed the Messiah Jesus the Son of Mary, the Apostle of God' - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them."

This is an important claim because in the Quran, only Jesus’ enemies are said to have been fooled into thinking they crucified Him; not Jesus’ followers!

Naturally, if God wanted to thwart Jesus’ enemies into thinking this, and Jesus’ disciples professed Islam, then His disciples would not have been led astray. Why, after all, would God want to deceive those who have professed to believe the truth and follow His Apostle?

The Bible, however, tells a different story. It states that Jesus’ disciples saw Him die on the cross. John 19:26, 27 says, "When Jesus saw his mother there, and the disciple whom he loved (John) standing nearby..."

Women were among Jesus’ followers; and they saw Him die on the cross. John 19:25 reveals, "Near the cross of Jesus stood his mother, his mother's sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene."

These people all loved and followed Jesus. Those who followed Jesus were His disciples. It is hard to conceive that God, being a God of truth, would want to deceive those [who believe the truth] into thinking that Jesus died when He did not.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Avatar4321
The problem is the fact that you are relying on the Book and not on God. Books have to be interpreted by imperfect men. Take the Pharisees for example. They knew the scriptures in and out. Yet, because of their interpretations they missed the Savior whom the scriptures testified. "Ye search the scriptures, for in them ye think ye have eternal life." I think the problem most people are having with you is that you interpret the Bible, and then pretend as if anyone who disagrees with your interpretation is not following the Bible.

Your problem, then, would be that you think the Bible is not divine as it so claims, and therefore doubt Gods word. If you believe these men falible and therefore not inspired by God to have written it, you cannot explain the divinity nor the prophecy. You also go contrary to the Bible its self in that assumption.

In addition, you claim God then is only an experience. You discount the original texts.

The Bible was written in such a way it DOES prove its self, and interpretation is only interpretation when taken out of context.

Original Greek and Hebrew texts do not allow for interpretation.

Conversion of text creates that potential.

Read the Bible all you want. Without the Spirit it wont do an iota of good.

Really? Where does the Bible say that?

Even if every Bible in the world were destroyed, God can still continue His work. Thats why i cringe to see people relying on their interpretation of the Bible more than God. Thats what the Pharisees did.

I agree. How else do you show a non-believer that the Bible is true? If you can't, you cannot illustrate in any reasonable historical timeline or documentation that He exists. IF you want to debate divinity of the Bible open a thread and you will be quite surprised to learn it IS worthy of relying upon.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by freeandfun1
I haven't seen any posts (and do not recall any) that says Catholics are not Christian.

Not in this thread but there have been.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Jackass
Im sorry...would that mean you dont have faith? Not trying to start anything here..just wondering.

Nope.

I have faith.

I don't like not knowing WHY to everything, though.


I became a believer before knowing anything else about God except He existed and that He has a Bible with His words and a bit of His plan.

Having perspective of looking back into my life, I could see areas He must have been working.

Faith is not Blind. There is always reason.

Not having faith is impossible as well. There is always SOME level of faith.

We all have faith that the sun will not fall on us. We use reason and knowledge to show it is held in orbit.

That doesn't diminish our faith it will stay there, though.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Avatar4321
Not in this thread but there have been.

I have said and can verify "catholocism is not Christianity".

That does not = "catholics cannot be Christians".

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Your problem, then, would be that you think the Bible is not divine as it so claims, and therefore doubt Gods word. If you believe these men falible and therefore not inspired by God to have written it, you cannot explain the divinity nor the prophecy. You also go contrary to the Bible its self in that assumption.

In addition, you claim God then is only an experience. You discount the original texts.

The Bible was written in such a way it DOES prove its self, and interpretation is only interpretation when taken out of context.

Original Greek and Hebrew texts do not allow for interpretation.

Conversion of text creates that potential.



Really? Where does the Bible say that?



I agree. How else do you show a non-believer that the Bible is true? If you can't, you cannot illustrate in any reasonable historical timeline or documentation that He exists. IF you want to debate divinity of the Bible open a thread and you will be quite surprised to learn it IS worthy of relying upon.

Maybe if you wouldnt put words in peoples mouths you wouldnt have such a problem.

I did have to laugh when you were telling me Im the one who thinks God is only an experience. You are the one preaching the "Relationship with Christ" above all else. Terminology you dont find in the Bible.

Im trying to be nice with you. I dont Bible bash, but when i do i win.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Avatar4321
Maybe if you wouldnt put words in peoples mouths you wouldnt have such a problem.

I did have to laugh when you were telling me Im the one who thinks God is only an experience. You are the one preaching the "Relationship with Christ" above all else. Terminology you dont find in the Bible.

Really? Here is your post:

The problem is the fact that you are relying on the Book and not on God. Books have to be interpreted by imperfect men. Take the Pharisees for example. They knew the scriptures in and out. Yet, because of their interpretations they missed the Savior whom the scriptures testified. "Ye search the scriptures, for in them ye think ye have eternal life." I think the problem most people are having with you is that you interpret the Bible, and then pretend as if anyone who disagrees with your interpretation is not following the Bible.

Putting words in your mouth? Hardly.

I think you are confused about my perspective.

Im trying to be nice with you. I dont Bible bash, but when i do i win.

I wouldn't claim your lingo as being nice. If you want to get huffy now and "bash", feel free. I don't care if you normally "lose" or not.

I would personally like to see you try.

Be sure you clearly state your position and what your issue with my position is first, though since you have already gotten mixed up in this discussion which is only 2 posts long per side.