Privatization works?

uscitizen

Senior Member
May 6, 2007
45,940
4,925
48
My Shack
Aug 19, 4:01 PM EDT


Arizona official: State didn't detect prison flaws

By FELICIA FONSECA and PAUL DAVENPORT
Associated Press Writers

PHOENIX (AP) -- A privately operated Arizona prison where three inmates escaped last month, setting off a massive search, had poor operational practices that led to the unstaffing of a perimeter post, the state's prison director said Thursday.

The state Corrections Department released a report on security at the Kingman prison Thursday.

Numerous false alarms led to lax responses by prison personnel, Corrections Department Director Charles Ryan said. He also cited operational practices that led to a gap in permitted staffing during an evening when the July 30 escape occurred.

The three escapees from the prison's medium-security unit included two convicted of murder. Two of the three convicts have been recaptured, and authorities have linked some of the escapees to the killing of an Oklahoma couple.

Ryan said 148 inmates were being transferred to other prisons because of new restrictions on which inmates can be assigned to the Kingman facility, which has both minimum- and medium-security units.

He said his department has accepted a security improvement plan by the facility's operator, Centerville, Utah-based Management & Training Corp.

"This is a terrible tragedy, and the department and the contractor have a lot of work to do," Ryan said, referring to the killing of the Oklahoma couple linked to two of the escapees.

The burned bodies of Greg and Linda Haas of Tecumseh, Okla., were found Aug. 4 on a remote ranch near Santa Rosa, N.M. They had been traveling to Colorado on an annual camping trip.

TBO.com - News From AP
 
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6CkltzGAxY]YouTube - A Bit of Fry and Laurie - Privatization of the Police Force[/ame]
 
I think if the private entity was negligent in the duties, they should be held legally liable. It can be sorted out in court. Very sad.

I know Thousand Trails does nothing to enforce the 10mph no wake zone at my favorite camping spot now far from here. The end of the lake where the campground sits is off limits to fast boating. A bunch of us were not too well pleased to see jet skiers and water skiers there on my last camping trip. That part of the lake is only about a 10th of the lake. But, the forest service is absent because they've signed over administration of the campsite to Thousand Trails, and they don't care.
 
If anyone has questions on how privatized prisons have performed just google and do research.

Strangely enough a private prison in eastern KY was housing prisoners from HI?
How fair is that to the families of the prisoners and such?

btw the private prison has since lost it's charter due to sexual improprieties by guards.
 
Aug 19, 4:01 PM EDT


Arizona official: State didn't detect prison flaws

By FELICIA FONSECA and PAUL DAVENPORT
Associated Press Writers

PHOENIX (AP) -- A privately operated Arizona prison where three inmates escaped last month, setting off a massive search, had poor operational practices that led to the unstaffing of a perimeter post, the state's prison director said Thursday.

The state Corrections Department released a report on security at the Kingman prison Thursday.

Numerous false alarms led to lax responses by prison personnel, Corrections Department Director Charles Ryan said. He also cited operational practices that led to a gap in permitted staffing during an evening when the July 30 escape occurred.

The three escapees from the prison's medium-security unit included two convicted of murder. Two of the three convicts have been recaptured, and authorities have linked some of the escapees to the killing of an Oklahoma couple.

Ryan said 148 inmates were being transferred to other prisons because of new restrictions on which inmates can be assigned to the Kingman facility, which has both minimum- and medium-security units.

He said his department has accepted a security improvement plan by the facility's operator, Centerville, Utah-based Management & Training Corp.

"This is a terrible tragedy, and the department and the contractor have a lot of work to do," Ryan said, referring to the killing of the Oklahoma couple linked to two of the escapees.

The burned bodies of Greg and Linda Haas of Tecumseh, Okla., were found Aug. 4 on a remote ranch near Santa Rosa, N.M. They had been traveling to Colorado on an annual camping trip.

TBO.com - News From AP
what's the escape percentage from government run prisons versus private? Second, who's been fired from private prisons versus federal ones for allowing mistakes. Can government employees be fired like this/for this? And what kind of operation costs do they have versus private management versus public? Are they as efficient?

Your have created a false comparison and strawman argument unless you provide similar opposing data.
 
what's the escape percentage from government run prisons versus private? Second, who's been fired from private prisons versus federal ones for allowing mistakes. Can government employees be fired like this/for this? And what kind of operation costs do they have versus private management versus public? Are they as efficient?

Your have created a false comparison and strawman argument unless you provide similar opposing data.

I don't understand why you are saying some of this, especially the "you have created a false comparison and strawman argument". He has not made ANY argument at all, and his only comparison was posed as a question. Since when does asking peoples opinions mean a declaration of aggression? uscitizen was just making a thread about this to open up the idea of comparing public and private prisons, don't accuse him of false comparison.

Also, don't be a hypocrite by calling it a strawman argument (although it wasn't an argument in the first place). Your entire argument portion of your post was questions that you didn't answer, and you probably couldn't unless you are an expert on prison functions, in which case you should have stated so. Under the assumption that you don't know any more about the prison system in the U.S. than uscitizen I am accuseing your post of complete hypocrisy, bigotry (assuming an argument where there is none in this case), and down right ignorance. I won't accuse you personally of this because that would be presumptuous and would make me a bigot, however I WILL call you out on this foolish post you wrote.
 
Privatization never works.

We should nationalize everything, starting with fast food. Every fast food restaurant should produce the same government-regulated burgers and fries.

Next, we should nationalize cellular companies. Every American should have a government-spec cellphone, so that every American can finally purchase a reliable, functional cellphone.

Last, but certainly not least, we need to nationalize the internet. Imagine just how much faster the internet would be, if Google, Yahoo, MSN, and the dozens of other bothersome sites were all replaced by a single federal search engine? Further, our patriotic regulators in Washington would ensure that Americans won't accidentally access illegal materials.
 
I also think it is interesting that the Governor's Chief of Staff used to by a lobbyist for a private prison company, and I believe his wife still is.
When Arizona sold it's prisons, who do they sell them to? I have been meaning to look, but keep forgetting.
 
what's the escape percentage from government run prisons versus private? Second, who's been fired from private prisons versus federal ones for allowing mistakes. Can government employees be fired like this/for this? And what kind of operation costs do they have versus private management versus public? Are they as efficient?

Your have created a false comparison and strawman argument unless you provide similar opposing data.

I don't understand why you are saying some of this, especially the "you have created a false comparison and strawman argument". He has not made ANY argument at all, and his only comparison was posed as a question. Since when does asking peoples opinions mean a declaration of aggression? uscitizen was just making a thread about this to open up the idea of comparing public and private prisons, don't accuse him of false comparison.

Also, don't be a hypocrite by calling it a strawman argument (although it wasn't an argument in the first place). Your entire argument portion of your post was questions that you didn't answer, and you probably couldn't unless you are an expert on prison functions, in which case you should have stated so. Under the assumption that you don't know any more about the prison system in the U.S. than uscitizen I am accuseing your post of complete hypocrisy, bigotry (assuming an argument where there is none in this case), and down right ignorance. I won't accuse you personally of this because that would be presumptuous and would make me a bigot, however I WILL call you out on this foolish post you wrote.
Under the assumption that you don't know any more about the prison system in the U.S. than uscitizen I am accuseing your post of complete hypocrisy, bigotry (assuming an argument where there is none in this case), and down right ignorance.

Wow, stupidity AND acting like a typical liberal racist in one quick sentence. Don't have any info or facts so you smear your opponent who exposes your preferred argument to some basic critical thinking. Pull that race card any faster with no reason?

I won't accuse you personally of this because that would be presumptuous and would make me a bigot, however I WILL call you out on this foolish post you wrote.

You are both a bigot and a fool. If race wasn't a critical importance to you, you would not have mentioned it where I had not. You have ignored every aspect of my question on what the alternative of government run prisons is for fair comparison. No, you just went back to try and rebuild the strawman that privatized prisons are the worst ways to run a prison without any consideration for how bad the alternative may be.

Oh, and as for my knowledge of the federal prison system... I have family that are involved in running one. No I won't tell you who or where for their safety.
 
Last edited:
I don't understand why you are saying some of this, especially the "you have created a false comparison and strawman argument". He has not made ANY argument at all, and his only comparison was posed as a question. Since when does asking peoples opinions mean a declaration of aggression? uscitizen was just making a thread about this to open up the idea of comparing public and private prisons, don't accuse him of false comparison.

Also, don't be a hypocrite by calling it a strawman argument (although it wasn't an argument in the first place). Your entire argument portion of your post was questions that you didn't answer, and you probably couldn't unless you are an expert on prison functions, in which case you should have stated so. Under the assumption that you don't know any more about the prison system in the U.S. than uscitizen I am accuseing your post of complete hypocrisy, bigotry (assuming an argument where there is none in this case), and down right ignorance. I won't accuse you personally of this because that would be presumptuous and would make me a bigot, however I WILL call you out on this foolish post you wrote.
Under the assumption that you don't know any more about the prison system in the U.S. than uscitizen I am accuseing your post of complete hypocrisy, bigotry (assuming an argument where there is none in this case), and down right ignorance.

Wow, stupidity AND acting like a typical liberal racist in one quick sentence. Don't have any info or facts so you smear your opponent who exposes your preferred argument to some basic critical thinking. Pull that race card any faster with no reason?

I won't accuse you personally of this because that would be presumptuous and would make me a bigot, however I WILL call you out on this foolish post you wrote.

You are both a bigot and a fool. If race wasn't a critical importance to you, you would not have mentioned it where I had not. You have ignored every aspect of my question on what the alternative of government run prisons is for fair comparison. No, you just went back to try and rebuild the strawman that privatized prisons are the worst ways to run a prison without any consideration for how bad the alternative may be.

Oh, and as for my knowledge of the federal prison system... I have family that are involved in running one. No I won't tell you who or where for their safety.

What?...... when did I bring up race? what.....? This makes no sense? If you referred to the fact that I accused your post of bigotry, that doesn't mean racism. Look up the definition of the word my friend. I was merely pointing out the bigotry that you assume an argument purely because of the liberal tone.

You did this assumption again on this post when you said I "went back to [argue]... that privatized prisons are the worst way to run a prison."
NOWHERE in my post did I make any argument about which system was better. I was simply pointing out your hypocrisy and defending someone's honest question. I actually believe that private prisons are a good idea, I just wish they were better regulated (my reasoning is that I don't want people who guard prisoners to have strong enough unions to strike for extended periods).

Now shut up and read the posts before you talk about things that don't exist you PARTISAN BIGOT.

Also, the fact that you have family in the business (is it a business? idk) is irrelevant unless you have consulted them for your posts. Since you have not quoted them, bringing them up is false support, like a cripple miming out the use of crutches (which your posts and opinions are in desperate need of).
 
Here's the problem with uscitizen's nonsense: problems exist in non-privatized prisons (and all other non-privatized endeavors as well).

Privatization doesn't ensure PERFECTION, but it does improve ACCOUNTABILITY. A private company that doesn't perform to reasonable standards can be terminated as a privatized provider. When things go wrong in government run programs, a public scapegoat is usually just shuffled off to another job. The program then continues in its typical less than effective mode.
 
Last edited:
What?...... when did I bring up race? what.....? This makes no sense? If you referred to the fact that I accused your post of bigotry, that doesn't mean racism. Look up the definition of the word my friend. I was merely pointing out the bigotry that you assume an argument purely because of the liberal tone.

Whine much? Mince terms with someone who gives a fuck.

Now shut up and read the posts before you talk about things that don't exist you PARTISAN BIGOT.

ROFL... Butch up sally frillypants. You aren't going to last long here thinking you can tell people to shut the fuck up. You got pwned and now you're crying about it. Boo fucking hoo hoo hoo.

Oh and when your rep power is less than 3, you probably shouldn't be playing that game. Soon you'll end up with a negative rep rating before you can say "oh shit I'm a dumfuk".

Also, the fact that you have family in the business (is it a business? idk) is irrelevant unless you have consulted them for your posts.

It was implied I knew nothing about the prison system. I refuted the claim. The fact you can't hack someone calling your bullshit is a bonus. And think for one second will you if possible? If I quote my family member who works in a federal prison I endanger them. We're not talking about a cub scout troop here.

Since you have not quoted them, bringing them up is false support, like a cripple miming out the use of crutches (which your posts and opinions are in desperate need of).

Quid pro quo, Clarise. You've got nothing but a lot of Little Richard impersonations of him screaming "Shut up". Let's see your links backing your point... Assuming you actually HAVE a point.

And for this, you've earned your first lolcat mocking.

funny-pictures-cats-share-basket-unhappily.jpg
 
There have been prison breaks from government run prisons too, there is no such thing as a fail proof system but the one thing I see about this case is government placing murderers in medium security prisons to begin with.
 

Forum List

Back
Top