President Obama Challenges states to come up with better plan: Vermont does.

Here? Are you in Vermont?

oops...yes, I am. That might help explain my posts a bit better;)

Truth be told, I grew up in California and my dad worked for the phone company. We had an HMO called Kaiser Permanente which in my humble opinion was phenomenal. If I could be assured that our hospitals were going to be run with the efficiency of Kaiser, I would be jumping for joy and lobbying for the change without a moment's hesitation. Note: not everyone who had Kaiser agrees with me.

But, what I foresee is a government run health insurance company without any of the checks and balances offered by the free market and that is what scares the shit out of me.

Immie

Kaiser is actually a far larger insurer than any system in Vermont will cover - I believe it's got something like 7.5M subscribers, and our entire state is only 620,000 people. Kaiser, however, made a lot of the efficiency advancements that a single-payer system will help create: a streamlined system where the doctors, hospitals, insurers and providers are all part of the same system.

In my humble opinion, health insurance and health care delivery can never be efficiently distributed strictly through the free market. But that's another discussion...

Interesting conversation nonetheless.
 
While other states are busy crushing unions, denying people healthcare, like Jan Brewer, which resulted in the deaths of two people and cutting taxes on the rich (Can we guess what party or ideology these people embrace), Vermont actually took up Obama's challenge and went with single payer.

About fucking time.

Vt. House Passes Single-Payer Health Care Bill - News Story - WPTZ Plattsburgh

MONTPELIER, Vt. -- After hours of debate, the Vermont House of Representatives approved a bill that would create a single-payer health care system in Vermont.

It passed 92-49. In a meeting right after the vote, the house speaker, the governor and others who worked on the bill called it a historic moment for Vermont.

"Become the first state in the country to make the first substantive step to deliver a health care system where health care will be a right and not a privilege," said Gov. Peter Shumlin.

:clap2:

This is what the Dems should have passed.
 
Here? Are you in Vermont?

oops...yes, I am. That might help explain my posts a bit better;)

Truth be told, I grew up in California and my dad worked for the phone company. We had an HMO called Kaiser Permanente which in my humble opinion was phenomenal. If I could be assured that our hospitals were going to be run with the efficiency of Kaiser, I would be jumping for joy and lobbying for the change without a moment's hesitation. Note: not everyone who had Kaiser agrees with me.

But, what I foresee is a government run health insurance company without any of the checks and balances offered by the free market and that is what scares the shit out of me.

Immie

Kaiser is actually a far larger insurer than any system in Vermont will cover - I believe it's got something like 7.5M subscribers, and our entire state is only 620,000 people. Kaiser, however, made a lot of the efficiency advancements that a single-payer system will help create: a streamlined system where the doctors, hospitals, insurers and providers are all part of the same system.

In my humble opinion, health insurance and health care delivery can never be efficiently distributed strictly through the free market. But that's another discussion...

Interesting conversation nonetheless.

Regarding the free market and health insurance/health care delivery, I would agree with you in regards to our current setup which is the only thing we have.

That being said, I fear not having any checks and balances and I cannot foresee Congress allowing any if they can get away with it.

Immie
 
While other states are busy crushing unions, denying people healthcare, like Jan Brewer, which resulted in the deaths of two people and cutting taxes on the rich (Can we guess what party or ideology these people embrace), Vermont actually took up Obama's challenge and went with single payer.

About fucking time.

Vt. House Passes Single-Payer Health Care Bill - News Story - WPTZ Plattsburgh

MONTPELIER, Vt. -- After hours of debate, the Vermont House of Representatives approved a bill that would create a single-payer health care system in Vermont.

It passed 92-49. In a meeting right after the vote, the house speaker, the governor and others who worked on the bill called it a historic moment for Vermont.

"Become the first state in the country to make the first substantive step to deliver a health care system where health care will be a right and not a privilege," said Gov. Peter Shumlin.

:clap2:

Now watch:

There's going to be a huge national attempt to undermine and discredit this, which will show how a lot of these "tenther" Republicans are a bunch of hypocrites.
Nahhhhhhhhhhh......it's lookin' like they've taken to their (typical) roach-routine....

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916.gif
 
Doesn't make your point at all. Initially Nixon was going to require that all American corporations provide healthcare to their employees. The HMO idea was one brought by "free marketeers" and they pointed out that there would be a profit motive that would make them viable.

What we have now is something that cannot be sustained. One of the biggest causes of bankruptcy in this country is catastrophic illness. Add in emergency room care is an extreme expense to tax payers. I, for one, don't agree with Obamacare/Romneycare. It should be single payer. But it's far better then what we had before.

Oh brother. Ted Kennedy was the sponsor of the 1973 HMO Act.

A Timeline of Kennedy's Health Care Achievements And Disappointments - Kaiser Health News

As usual, government intervention in the private market failed to deliver the promised benefits and caused unintended consequences, but Congress never blames itself for the problems created by bad laws.

And? What's your point about old Teddy..

That's rough that you still don't get it. Try this:

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Logic-Dummies-Mark-Zegarelli/dp/0471799416]Amazon.com: Logic For Dummies (9780471799412): Mark Zegarelli: Books[/ame]
 
While other states are busy crushing unions, denying people healthcare, like Jan Brewer, which resulted in the deaths of two people and cutting taxes on the rich (Can we guess what party or ideology these people embrace), Vermont actually took up Obama's challenge and went with single payer.

About fucking time.

Vt. House Passes Single-Payer Health Care Bill - News Story - WPTZ Plattsburgh

MONTPELIER, Vt. -- After hours of debate, the Vermont House of Representatives approved a bill that would create a single-payer health care system in Vermont.

It passed 92-49. In a meeting right after the vote, the house speaker, the governor and others who worked on the bill called it a historic moment for Vermont.

"Become the first state in the country to make the first substantive step to deliver a health care system where health care will be a right and not a privilege," said Gov. Peter Shumlin.

:clap2:

Now watch:

There's going to be a huge national attempt to undermine and discredit this, which will show how a lot of these "tenther" Republicans are a bunch of hypocrites.
....OR, we might see a rerun of what happened, in Canada!!!

"Douglas's number one concern was the creation of Medicare. In the summer of 1962, Saskatchewan became the centre of a hard-fought struggle between the provincial government, the North American medical establishment, and the province's physicians, who brought things to a halt with the 1962 Saskatchewan Doctors' Strike. The doctors believed their best interests were not being met and feared a significant loss of income as well as government interference in medical care decisions even though Douglas agreed that his government would pay the going rate for service that doctors charged. The medical establishment claimed that Douglas would import foreign doctors to make his plan work and used racist images to try to scare the public. Their defenders have also argued that private or government medical insurance plans covered 60 to 63 percent of the Saskatchewan population before Medicare legislation was introduced.

The success of the province's public health care program was not lost on the federal government. Another Saskatchewan politician, newly elected Prime Minister John Diefenbaker, decreed in 1958 that any province seeking to introduce a hospital plan would receive 50 cents on the dollar from the federal government.

In 1966, the Liberal minority government of Lester B. Pearson created such a program, with the federal government paying 50% of the costs and the provinces the other half. So, the adoption of healthcare across Canada ended up being the work of three men with diverse political ideals - Tommy Douglas, John Diefenbaker and Lester Pearson."


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfEFwbRBupk]YouTube - Kiefer Sutherland introduces the Tommy Douglas Showcase[/ame]


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:woohoo: . :woohoo: . :woohoo: . :woohoo: . :woohoo:
 
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