President Bush, Iraq and the Election

[CSM]

sorry, wade, the first time i read your message I read that :

Think about it, the French, English, German, European, and even most of the world's population all agree on one thing - the Americans only pursue their own interests without concern for any kind of morals and are not to be trusted or respected in any way. The Americans care only for themselves, tout high ideals, but act in the most base fassion of any modern nation when it comes to foriegn affairs.


wow ! I still read that !

So why don't all those wonderful nations just get themselves together and come over here to the good old USA and try to kick our collective selfish asses?

Dont trust the USA, don't trade with the USA and don't bother at all with the USA. I like that idea. In fact, I hope that is exactly what happens. Oh, by the way, since so much of the world's population hates the US, I guess they are all going to stop taking military and economic aid from the US because obviously the US only has that "filthy" oil money. I suppose too, that the UN will be moving their headquarters to some nice European country, since it is obvious that the US is not the kind of country that should belong to such a fine world organization. While the rest of the world is at it, I guess they are going to stop all cultural and scientific exchanges and forbid immigration to the US because it is such a horrible place.

PE, you have given me so many good ideas!

 

[padisha emperor]

I guess they are going to stop all cultural and scientific exchanges

scientific, yes.
cultural...with USA ? haha

 

[CSM]

scientific, yes.
cultural...with USA ? haha

No arrogance there.

 

[Zhukov]

cultural...with USA ? haha

Ah, culture, the quintessential European standard.

But I will certainly concede the point. In general Europeans are much more cultured than Americans. Take the Nazis for example, they were great connoisseurs of the arts.

 

[CSM]

Ah, culture, the quintessential European standard.

But I will certainly concede the point. In general Europeans are much more cultured than Americans. Take the Nazis for example, they were great connoisseurs of the arts.

I guess it depends on your definition of culture.

 

[padisha emperor]

for culture ?
No arrogance.
reality


US universities are excellent - Yale, Harvard, Princetown, Berkeley,West Point... - but the school before them is bad bad bad.
A US pupil of 18 had the level of a french pupil of 15. (my ENGLISH teacher when I was 17 said that to us.....and she LOVES USA)

the problem is that they - universities - ar eexpensive, so much expensive....only the rich or the people helped by the sate can go here.

So a big quantity of people can not go here.
In France - and Europe - it is cheaper (300 euros for a year, and sometimes less : 150), and the universities are very good too.


And, not arrogance here, the US culture is more the fast food, hamburger, and Baywatch than the things called by a lot "the true culture".
(don't say that US culture is shit : lots of good guys : Twain, Whistler..................the european is more known, more reputed...
)

 

[Annie]

for culture ?
No arrogance.
reality


US universities are excellent - Yale, Harvard, Princetown, Berkeley,West Point... - but the school before them is bad bad bad.
A US pupil of 18 had the level of a french pupil of 15. (my ENGLISH teacher when I was 17 said that to us.....and she LOVES USA)

the problem is that they - universities - ar eexpensive, so much expensive....only the rich or the people helped by the sate can go here.

So a big quantity of people can not go here.
In France - and Europe - it is cheaper (3000 euros for a year, and sometimes less : 150), and the universities are very good too.


And, not arrogance here, the US culture is more the fast food, hamburger, and Baywatch than the things called by a lot "the true culture".
(don't say that US culture is shit : lots of good guys : Twain, Whistler..................the european is more known, more reputed...
)

LOL Trust me PE, you are being misled. If a child in US wants/capable of university, can gain with low income parents. I have 3 children in university, my income w/kids is below poverty level. Yes, they will have loans, but not burdensome for college grad.

 

[wade]

LOL Trust me PE, you are being misled. If a child in US wants/capable of university, can gain with low income parents. I have 3 children in university, my income w/kids is below poverty level. Yes, they will have loans, but not burdensome for college grad.

They are going to top Univeristies? They are not having to work while in school? Non study related (such as in a lab) employement is a huge burdon to any serious student.

And tuitions are far higher now than when I was in the UC system. When I was a student tuition and fees ran about $1000 for 9 months (3 quarters on the quarter system). Today tuition and fees run about $4500, but for foreign students (which is what I think the person you were replying to was refering to) it's a wopping $24,000 for 9 months!

So tuition and fees for American citizens has risen about four fold in about 25 years, which seems reasonable until you consider the fact that over the last 25 years the lowest 70% of American families have seen no increase, or a decrease, in real income. Children of familes above the poverty/low income line (which I guess exludes you) are generally not elidgable for assitances other than merit bases scholarships. This means that a family earning $35,000/yr is going to have a very hard time putting more than one kid through college.

I went through the UC system with a scolarship but even so I ended up having to work and take out loans to make ends meet. It ended up taking me 7 years, two in the lab (slave labor - but the best part of my education), and I left college with over $15,000 in debts. I made $34,000 my first year out of college so the debt was not that big a deal ($100 or so per month if I recall). But have you looked at what a fresh out of college undergrad is making now days?

Wade.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Is anyone else tired of wade's gloom and doom scenarios?

 

[wade]

You mean is anyone else tired of having reality pointed out for them?

 

[rtwngAvngr]

You mean is anyone else tired of having reality pointed out for them?

Hey look, the sky is falling.


That's right wade. We will all fail without socialists coming in and "levelling the playing field". You should take this material on the road, it's a real hoot!

 

[padisha emperor]

I did a mistake, the french universities cost not 3000 euros, but 300....I 've edit my post too.

Are the movies about US schools correct about the US learnig ? erxample : in a tV serie, when you see a maths class of 17/18 years old. it is faithfull compared with reality ?

 

[Comrade]

I did a mistake, the french universities cost not 3000 euros, but 300....I 've edit my post too.

And the adage is you get what you pay for.

To be honest, I can't think of one prestiguous French university whatsoever, off the top of my head. I'm sure there are a few, but damned if I can recall one offhand, like I could for other countries.

Are the movies about US schools correct about the US learnig ? erxample : in a tV serie, when you see a maths class of 17/18 years old. it is faithfull compared with reality ?

Some don't try and some can't 'get it', but that's not an American novelty at all, is it?

Americans can throw down on Math along the top Europeans... hell, the Asian-Americans alone could stand against all of Europe. But indivually, some on both sides struggle in pre-Algebra and others are taking Calculus prep courses by Sophomore year. I certainly did.

 

[padisha emperor]

I pay 300 euros for the inscription in 2nd year of studies, and the university of Aix en Provence is one of the best in Europe for the law studies, the 2nd of France after Paris.

For the French great schools : After 2 years of preparatory classes, you have to pass an exam for these schools. It is hard. really hard, to have the best ones.

Economy and trade : HEC (Haute Ecole de Commerce) ; ESCP (Ecole Superieure de Commerce de Paris) ; EM Lyon (Ecole de Mannagement de Lyon), EDEC, ESSEC.

Sciences (physic, mathematics.....) : ENS (Ecole Normale Superieure) ; Ecole des Mines et Ponts ; Ecole Polytechnique (founded by Napoléon, here is the elite of the young scientific students, really famous)

Great and best Faculties and Universities :

Law : ASSAS (Paris) , Faculté de Droit U III d'Aix en Provence , mine , Sorbone (Paris)

History : Sorbone (Paris) ; Faculté de Lettres U III d'Aix en Provence - U III : For Universitiy III, it is the same group of faculty : like a campus, but not al in the same place.)

Medicine : Paris, Marseille, Lyon......(they depend of great hospitals often)



And i asked you about the level of the 17/18 US pupils because in a serie, i see a 17/18 boy in a 17/18 class who was unable to do a factorisation ( (3x + 5)(2x + 9) ), and they learn it, how to do it. I was surprised : in France, we learn it when we are 12 or 13. And they were unable to solve some problem, elemantary...

So, I asked you, and please be objective and tell the truth, was it exceptional or it is like that ?

 

[Comrade]

I pay 300 euros for the inscription in 2nd year of studies, and the university of Aix en Provence is one of the best in Europe for the law studies, the 2nd of France after Paris.

For the French great schools : After 2 years of preparatory classes, you have to pass an exam for these schools. It is hard. really hard, to have the best ones.

Economy and trade : HEC (Haute Ecole de Commerce) ; ESCP (Ecole Superieure de Commerce de Paris) ; EM Lyon (Ecole de Mannagement de Lyon), EDEC, ESSEC.

Sciences (physic, mathematics.....) : ENS (Ecole Normale Superieure) ; Ecole des Mines et Ponts ; Ecole Polytechnique (founded by Napoléon, here is the elite of the young scientific students, really famous)

Great and best Faculties and Universities :

Law : ASSAS (Paris) , Faculté de Droit U III d'Aix en Provence , mine , Sorbone (Paris)

History : Sorbone (Paris) ; Faculté de Lettres U III d'Aix en Provence - U III : For Universitiy III, it is the same group of faculty : like a campus, but not al in the same place.)

Medicine : Paris, Marseille, Lyon......(they depend of great hospitals often)

Do they get more foriegn pupils than top US or UK schools? That's the only real way to judge how great they are.

And i asked you about the level of the 17/18 US pupils because in a serie, i see a 17/18 boy in a 17/18 class who was unable to do a factorisation ( (3x + 5)(2x + 9) ), and they learn it, how to do it. I was surprised : in France, we learn it when we are 12 or 13. And they were unable to solve some problem, elemantary...

So, I asked you, and please be objective and tell the truth, was it exceptional or it is like that ?

Most Amercans learn basic algebra in their Sophomore year of High School, which would be 15-16 year olds. I started two years early in grade school, and imagine some never really get to it... but's that's how it goes worldwide.

You're saying they teach algebra to 12 year old Europeans as a standard now? I can't believe it without a link.

 

[Annie]

Do they get more foriegn pupils than top US or UK schools? That's the only real way to judge how great they are.



Most Amercans learn basic algebra in their Sophomore year of High School, which would be 15-16 year olds. I started two years early in grade school, and imagine some never really get to it... but's that's how it goes worldwide.

You're saying they teach algebra to 12 year old Europeans as a standard now? I can't believe it without a link.

Welcome to my world Comrade. We too are teaching algebra at 12, pre-Algebra at 11. (6th and 7th). YOU are getting long in the tooth dear.

 

[Comrade]

Welcome to my world Comrade. We too are teaching algebra at 12, pre-Algebra at 11. (6th and 7th). YOU are getting long in the tooth dear.

How about Geometry. Is that still the next year after?

 

[Annie]

How about Geometry. Is that still the next year after?

After pre-Algebra, the kids are tracked. Some into Algebra, lower into Algebra 1. The 7th in Algebra, do Geometry 8th grade.

Algebra 1 leads to Algebra 2. Then to Algebra freshman year. They meet the 'old world' then. Geometry 2nd year HS.

 

[Comrade]

After pre-Algebra, the kids are tracked. Some into Algebra, lower into Algebra 1. The 7th in Algebra, do Geometry 8th grade.

Algebra 1 leads to Algebra 2. Then to Algebra freshman year. They meet the 'old world' then. Geometry 2nd year HS.

I suppose I don't recall much of the basic kiddie algebra but I sure remember Freshman math as the first time I had to think much on it.

 

[Annie]

I suppose I don't recall much of the basic kiddie algebra but I sure remember Freshman math as the first time I had to think much on it.

Hey, not being math gifted, actually not math competant, I was lucky to get through trig. Now I have 2 gifted kids. I was so confused when after doing geometry freshman year, then they went back to 'algebra'. Then Calc. Then another type of calc. Did they rename trig, algebra? Never did get it straight.

Now I do know that when both went to university, math requirements were all waived. For some reason, they both like taking math, to pad their GPA.