Poll: What should we do with guns?

[AmyNation]

Here's yet another link to back up my claim.

Citizens for saftey Illegal Guns

 

[tjvh]

If you don't like that link, I can provide more

http://www.mayorsagainstillegalguns.org/downloads/pdf/inside-straw-purchases.pdf


Crimnials get guns from dealers, either purchasing them illegally or stealing them from dealers. That's where a majority of illegal guns come from. It's a fact.

Now, I have repeatedly stated I'm not in favor of gun bans. Again, I'm not in favor of gun bans.

However that doesn't make me blind to the fact that banning guns would reduce gun crime.

You sure that the majority of criminals steal their guns from dealers? Seems more likely they steal them from people's residences.

 

[AmyNation]

If you don't like that link, I can provide more

http://www.mayorsagainstillegalguns.org/downloads/pdf/inside-straw-purchases.pdf


Crimnials get guns from dealers, either purchasing them illegally or stealing them from dealers. That's where a majority of illegal guns come from. It's a fact.

Now, I have repeatedly stated I'm not in favor of gun bans. Again, I'm not in favor of gun bans.

However that doesn't make me blind to the fact that banning guns would reduce gun crime.

You sure that the majority of criminals steal their guns from dealers? Seems more likely they steal them from people's residences.

My 1st link states that in fact, less than 15% of all illegal guns are stolen from your average citizen, and if you think about it, it makes sense. Criminals dont know, typically, which homes have a gun they can steal, and which don't. However you can get large quantities of weapons from gun dealers.

 

[DiamondDave]

Here's yet another link to back up my claim.

Citizens for saftey Illegal Guns

Yes.. I have seen that one.. it really does not back up your claim like you say

Banning guns from sale will not reduce crime... the weapons will come from another source.. not to mention the MILLIONS of firearms that are already on the street...

All it will accomplish is making it harder for the law abiding to protect themselves, in your little attempt to allegedly protect them more

 

[AmyNation]

It will reduce gun crime.

Look at any country where guns are completely illegal, their gun crime is nothing like ours. Again, I have never said all gun crime will disappear, of course criminals will find ways to get guns, but it won't be as easy as it is now, hence the dramatic drop in gun crime.

 

[tjvh]

It will reduce gun crime.

Look at any country where guns are completely illegal, their gun crime is nothing like ours. Again, I have never said all gun crime will disappear, of course criminals will find ways to get guns, but it won't be as easy as it is now, hence the dramatic drop in gun crime.

You're more than welcome to relocate somewhere else if that's what makes you feel safe- until then, the Constitution is pretty clear and I'd appreciate if those who dislike my Rights to own guns kindly keep their distaste of my Constitutional Rights to themselves and take their tyrannical agendas elsewhere... Thanks.

 

[g5000]

regulate all public firearms - lever / bolt action, 6 round maximum, chamber fed.

No, no, no. Muskets only. And they have to be at least six feet long so they can't be concealed. Nothing else. And only knives with a blade less than 4 inches.


.

 

[g5000]

It will reduce gun crime.

Look at any country where guns are completely illegal, their gun crime is nothing like ours. Again, I have never said all gun crime will disappear, of course criminals will find ways to get guns, but it won't be as easy as it is now, hence the dramatic drop in gun crime.

Countries with harsher hate speech laws probably also have less hate crimes.

Would you see this as a good thing, too?

.

 

[Pogo]

It will reduce gun crime.

Look at any country where guns are completely illegal, their gun crime is nothing like ours. Again, I have never said all gun crime will disappear, of course criminals will find ways to get guns, but it won't be as easy as it is now, hence the dramatic drop in gun crime.

"Easy" is the key word here.

All Adam Lanza had to do was raid his mother's gun shelf. All Jovan Belcher had to do was decide which of his eight (eight!) guns to use. All Jacob Roberts had to do was steal an AR-15 from a friend. All Harris and Klebold had to do was buy from two unlicensed sellers. The basic problem isn't so much that guns are deadly; it's that they're everywhere.

What sets gun violence apart is not anything to do with Constitutional issues or self-defense... it's spontaneity -- it's done in an instant on the slightest whim and a few seconds later there's no turning back (which explains why all of these guys and so many others make themselves the last cadaver when they're finally cornered. This is why the tired old argument that "people kill by other methods" doesn't work. No other method is this quick. And in a society based on instant gratification, that's crucial.

And I might add, that sort of spontaneity simply did not exist in the 18th Century when the Second Amendment was written. They had no concept of concealed pistols, drive-bys, automatic weapons, even the accuracy of the Minie ball hadn't yet been invented. It's impossible to make the argument that what the 2nd Amendment addressed had anything remotely to do with protecting the right of events like Newtown, Clackamas, and Tucson to take place.

 

[AmyNation]

It will reduce gun crime.

Look at any country where guns are completely illegal, their gun crime is nothing like ours. Again, I have never said all gun crime will disappear, of course criminals will find ways to get guns, but it won't be as easy as it is now, hence the dramatic drop in gun crime.

Countries with harsher hate speech laws probably also have less hate crimes.

Would you see this as a good thing, too?

.

I don't see either as a good thing.

 

[AmyNation]

It will reduce gun crime.

Look at any country where guns are completely illegal, their gun crime is nothing like ours. Again, I have never said all gun crime will disappear, of course criminals will find ways to get guns, but it won't be as easy as it is now, hence the dramatic drop in gun crime.

You're more than welcome to relocate somewhere else if that's what makes you feel safe- until then, the Constitution is pretty clear and I'd appreciate if those who dislike my Rights to own guns kindly keep their distaste of my Constitutional Rights to themselves and take their tyrannical agendas elsewhere... Thanks.

 

[sfcalifornia]

Leave the second amendment alone. We have sufficient gun laws on the books now.

Start banning these HIGH DEFINITION, hyper realistic, blood bath video games where kids can RAPE, STEAL and KILL everything in the game, INCLUDING CHILDREN AND POLICE, and get a handle on all the KILLING and culture of VIOLENT movies DRAMATIZING KILLING coming out of hollyweird. When was the last time these sick fuckers made a WHOLESOME movie that you could take the whole family to? When was the last movie that didn't have the word FUCK in it or some QUEER?

The problem is NOT gun ownership. The problem is the person WIELDING the gun and what has made them what they are. THAT is where the problem with this NEW culture of YOUNG KILLER gun violence is coming from. It's got NOTHING to do with the firearms or the laws governing them.

The same video games are available in nearly every advanced society that produces the consoles they are played on. Look it up.

Somehow, Finland doesn't seem to have a monthly massacre problem. Neither does Germany, Holland, Japan, Singapore, Australia, Austria, Russia, England, France, Spain, Luxembourg, Andorra, Italy, Belarus, Norway, Scotland, Wales, Brazil, Greece, Switzerland, Romania, Hungary, or Indonesia.

The only difference between their kids and our kids in this realm is that their country doesn't have this 2nd Amendment.

And most of those countries have mandatory military service.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

No, i have not. However my husband owns one, and my sister has her own little arsenal. That doesnt change the fact that the majority of illegal guns are purchased from dealers.

frontline: hot guns: "How Criminals Get Guns" | PBS

"In fact, there are a number of sources that allow guns to fall into the wrong hands, with gun thefts at the bottom of the list. Wachtel says one of the most common ways criminals get guns is through straw purchase sales. A straw purchase occurs when someone who may not legally acquire a firearm, or who wants to do so anonymously, has a companion buy it on their behalf. According to a 1994 ATF study on "Sources of Crime Guns in Southern California," many straw purchases are conducted in an openly "suggestive" manner where two people walk into a gun store, one selects a firearm, and then the other uses identification for the purchase and pays for the gun. Or, several underage people walk into a store and an adult with them makes the purchases. Both of these are illegal activities.

The next biggest source of illegal gun transactions where criminals get guns are sales made by legally licensed but corrupt at-home and commercial gun dealers. Several recent reports back up Wachtel's own studies about this, and make the case that illegal activity by those licensed to sell guns, known as Federal Firearms Licensees (FFLs), is a huge source of crime guns and greatly surpasses the sale of guns stolen from John Q. Citizen. Like bank robbers, who are interested in banks, gun traffickers are interested in FFLs because that's where the guns are. This is why FFLs are a large source of illegal guns for traffickers, who ultimately wind up selling the guns on the street."

Your own link proves you wrong.

ATF officials say that only about 8% of the nation's 124,000 retail gun dealers sell the majority of handguns that are used in crimes. They conclude that these licensed retailers are part of a block of rogue entrepreneurs tempted by the big profits of gun trafficking.

Read it again.

Let me ask you a question, do you know the definitions of the words "legitimate" and "rogue." Wouldn't a rouge holder of an FFL be, by definition, the exact opposite of legitimate?

 

[AmyNation]

Let me as you something, do you know the definition of "licensed dealer"?

Obviously if someone is selling guns to criminals, they aren't a law abiding gun dealer. However they are still, a licensed dealer, legimately allowed to sell guns.

 

[PredFan]

What should we do with guns?

Collect as many as you can.

 

[Pogo]

Leave the second amendment alone. We have sufficient gun laws on the books now.

Start banning these HIGH DEFINITION, hyper realistic, blood bath video games where kids can RAPE, STEAL and KILL everything in the game, INCLUDING CHILDREN AND POLICE, and get a handle on all the KILLING and culture of VIOLENT movies DRAMATIZING KILLING coming out of hollyweird. When was the last time these sick fuckers made a WHOLESOME movie that you could take the whole family to? When was the last movie that didn't have the word FUCK in it or some QUEER?

I was actually with you until you got to the "fuck and queer" part, where you put the gun to the head of your own argument and blew it away. Not sure how you manage to stretch violence and sex into the same thing. Whatever you were going for, it didn't work. Which is a shame because it started out so well.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Let me as you something, do you know the definition of "licensed dealer"?

Obviously if someone is selling guns to criminals, they aren't a law abiding gun dealer. However they are still, a licensed dealer, legimately allowed to sell guns.

Your statement was that criminals get their weapons from legitimate dealers. You were wrong, just admit it and move on, you will feel better.

 

[AmyNation]

Except, I'm not. But thanks

 

[sfcalifornia]

What should we do with guns?

Collect as many as you can.

That's pretty much what the declining number of gun owners are doing.

Analysis: Fewer U.S. gun owners own more guns - CNN.com

 

[Againsheila]