Police "mistake" speech impediment for disrespect

Never said that I would actively engage in that behavior but I have cops treat me like shit every time I come into contact with them. They are rarely polite in the manner that they approach you and nothing is worse than having to sit through one of their sermons. My basic premise is that this guy should have his ass nailed to the wall hard for his actions as the boy did NOTHING illegal or even wrong. Yet here we have people here willing to defend the cop. Hell no. he has the position and authority and when that is abused there should be no slack in punishment. Cops tend to act the way they do specifically because they are able to get away with these type of actions. You thing that this is the FIRST time that he 'ruffed up' someone for not licking his ass. I highly doubt it. This just hits big because the kid was disables so he has zero recourse to explain it away.

All I was saying is what defense attorneys always tend to recommend. Don't give the cops any reasons, even if they're being authoritarian jerks, they may not get nailed the first couple of times but eventually it catches up with them, I've seen it happen.
Most cops don't act like this, most remember the fact they are here to serve and protect, unfortunately there are the others who start believing serve and protect is command and demand, most of those eventually get weeded out.
Now part of you statement begs the question, why do you have so much interaction with the police, especially from a seemingly negative standpoint?
I hope the officers in question receives a fair hearing and if found to be in willful violation of the law are punished to the fullest extent of the law.

That is all well and good but the OP is coming at this from the other side: AFTER the fact. You do have the right to act like an idiot. You may pay a price for being an idiot BUT that does not give the cop the right to abuse his power. We need to acknowledge that.

Where in any of my posts did I say any different? :eusa_eh:
 
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A little perspective, the ATF tried to force an American citizen to become an informant on an alleged "white supremacy" group when he visited their display at a county fair. The ATF's ignorant assumption led to entrapment of the citizen and the death of his son and wife and the legendary siege at Ruby Ridge. A couple of years later the same federal law enforcement agency decided to raid a religious compound in Waco Tx. The raid was based on faulty information and an arrogant need to make a media splash and it led to the deaths of 89 men women and children killed by tanks and poison gas. Barely a month ago information came to light that the same federal police force (ATF) sold 2,000 illegal weapons to Mexican thugs in a crazy plan to trace them. Hundreds of Mexican civilians were killed with the weapons and at least one US Border Patrol Officer> It kind of brings the overblown incident regarding the kid with a speech impediment into perspective. It's all really about politics when you get right down to it.
 
All I was saying is what defense attorneys always tend to recommend. Don't give the cops any reasons, even if they're being authoritarian jerks, they may not get nailed the first couple of times but eventually it catches up with them, I've seen it happen.
Most cops don't act like this, most remember the fact they are here to serve and protect, unfortunately there are the others who start believing serve and protect is command and demand, most of those eventually get weeded out.
Now part of you statement begs the question, why do you have so much interaction with the police, especially from a seemingly negative standpoint?
I hope the officers in question receives a fair hearing and if found to be in willful violation of the law are punished to the fullest extent of the law.

That is all well and good but the OP is coming at this from the other side: AFTER the fact. You do have the right to act like an idiot. You may pay a price for being an idiot BUT that does not give the cop the right to abuse his power. We need to acknowledge that.

IF I pull a Colt45 shaped cigarette lighter out of my pocket when a cop walks up on my car after pulling me over I might get shot.

IF I act like an idiot and make a cop nervous I might get tazed or sprayed.

Right on the officer's part? Eh, an A+ officer having an A+ day would figure things out.

60% of the time an average officer would figure things out.

I can see things from the other fella's point of view so I realize this.

Young boys, they can't. Haven't seen the world through enough different eyes or have been stuck behind a Nintendo all their lives so they act all foolish counting on what "ideally" other folks would do.

Sure if I'm a cop who tazes a retarded man with a M16 replica air soft rifle I expect to have some explaining to do or end up behind a desk. Stuff happens though.

I do say if an officer tells you to put your hands on the hood or lie still on the ground in the mud or else he will spray you and you don't, it is your own dumb fault. That man behind the badge is human.

And I say that if he sprays me for disobeying an order he should be fired. Unfortunately, the world I live in sees it differently, so I make up for it by arguing with people who think I should obey cops who are having a bad day. Then I go trolling the streets looking for disgruntled cops to piss off in the hope I can get rich suing one.

Something you might want to think about is that every time one of those cops does do something stupid the taxpayers end up paying for it, sometimes to the tune of millions of dollars. It would be a lot cheaper to teach cops to take the bad stuff in stride than pay for their screw ups after the fact.
 
That is all well and good but the OP is coming at this from the other side: AFTER the fact. You do have the right to act like an idiot. You may pay a price for being an idiot BUT that does not give the cop the right to abuse his power. We need to acknowledge that.

IF I pull a Colt45 shaped cigarette lighter out of my pocket when a cop walks up on my car after pulling me over I might get shot.

IF I act like an idiot and make a cop nervous I might get tazed or sprayed.

Right on the officer's part? Eh, an A+ officer having an A+ day would figure things out.

60% of the time an average officer would figure things out.

I can see things from the other fella's point of view so I realize this.

Young boys, they can't. Haven't seen the world through enough different eyes or have been stuck behind a Nintendo all their lives so they act all foolish counting on what "ideally" other folks would do.

Sure if I'm a cop who tazes a retarded man with a M16 replica air soft rifle I expect to have some explaining to do or end up behind a desk. Stuff happens though.

I do say if an officer tells you to put your hands on the hood or lie still on the ground in the mud or else he will spray you and you don't, it is your own dumb fault. That man behind the badge is human.

And I say that if he sprays me for disobeying an order he should be fired. Unfortunately, the world I live in sees it differently, so I make up for it by arguing with people who think I should obey cops who are having a bad day. Then I go trolling the streets looking for disgruntled cops to piss off in the hope I can get rich suing one.

Something you might want to think about is that every time one of those cops does do something stupid the taxpayers end up paying for it, sometimes to the tune of millions of dollars. It would be a lot cheaper to teach cops to take the bad stuff in stride than pay for their screw ups after the fact.

And I say that if he sprays me for disobeying an order he should be fired?

My man, how often do you get pulled over and not have bad things happen? Are your job skills so limited this is your only chance at getting money to retire on?

This is a really interesting bit of personal insight into who I am on line with.
 
IF I pull a Colt45 shaped cigarette lighter out of my pocket when a cop walks up on my car after pulling me over I might get shot.

IF I act like an idiot and make a cop nervous I might get tazed or sprayed.

Right on the officer's part? Eh, an A+ officer having an A+ day would figure things out.

60% of the time an average officer would figure things out.

I can see things from the other fella's point of view so I realize this.

Young boys, they can't. Haven't seen the world through enough different eyes or have been stuck behind a Nintendo all their lives so they act all foolish counting on what "ideally" other folks would do.

Sure if I'm a cop who tazes a retarded man with a M16 replica air soft rifle I expect to have some explaining to do or end up behind a desk. Stuff happens though.

I do say if an officer tells you to put your hands on the hood or lie still on the ground in the mud or else he will spray you and you don't, it is your own dumb fault. That man behind the badge is human.

And I say that if he sprays me for disobeying an order he should be fired. Unfortunately, the world I live in sees it differently, so I make up for it by arguing with people who think I should obey cops who are having a bad day. Then I go trolling the streets looking for disgruntled cops to piss off in the hope I can get rich suing one.

Something you might want to think about is that every time one of those cops does do something stupid the taxpayers end up paying for it, sometimes to the tune of millions of dollars. It would be a lot cheaper to teach cops to take the bad stuff in stride than pay for their screw ups after the fact.

And I say that if he sprays me for disobeying an order he should be fired?

My man, how often do you get pulled over and not have bad things happen? Are your job skills so limited this is your only chance at getting money to retire on?

This is a really interesting bit of personal insight into who I am on line with.

That is the point, stuff like this only happens with bad cops. It does not happen with good cops having a bad day, or even average cops having a good day, it only happens with bad cops. Period.

Stop making excuses for the bad cops and get them off the street. Period.
 
The world is not Leave It to Beaver black and white sometimes.

Good wide receivers drop balls. Albert Pujols strikes out a few times a year with the bases loaded.

Hell, I like to think I am good at my job but every once in awhile...

None the less, I do agree that when officers make mistakes we all pay. Lets try to make sure them mistakes don't happen to our expense even if our wives or mothers may be able to sue lol
 
That is all well and good but the OP is coming at this from the other side: AFTER the fact. You do have the right to act like an idiot. You may pay a price for being an idiot BUT that does not give the cop the right to abuse his power. We need to acknowledge that.

IF I pull a Colt45 shaped cigarette lighter out of my pocket when a cop walks up on my car after pulling me over I might get shot.

IF I act like an idiot and make a cop nervous I might get tazed or sprayed.

Right on the officer's part? Eh, an A+ officer having an A+ day would figure things out.

60% of the time an average officer would figure things out.

I can see things from the other fella's point of view so I realize this.

Young boys, they can't. Haven't seen the world through enough different eyes or have been stuck behind a Nintendo all their lives so they act all foolish counting on what "ideally" other folks would do.

Sure if I'm a cop who tazes a retarded man with a M16 replica air soft rifle I expect to have some explaining to do or end up behind a desk. Stuff happens though.

I do say if an officer tells you to put your hands on the hood or lie still on the ground in the mud or else he will spray you and you don't, it is your own dumb fault. That man behind the badge is human.

And I say that if he sprays me for disobeying an order he should be fired. Unfortunately, the world I live in sees it differently, so I make up for it by arguing with people who think I should obey cops who are having a bad day. Then I go trolling the streets looking for disgruntled cops to piss off in the hope I can get rich suing one.

Something you might want to think about is that every time one of those cops does do something stupid the taxpayers end up paying for it, sometimes to the tune of millions of dollars. It would be a lot cheaper to teach cops to take the bad stuff in stride than pay for their screw ups after the fact.

Once again, so as not to (continue) to be misunderstood I am not defending bad cops or cops who had a bad hair day. This is simply for perspective reasons only. Got it??!!
Like the industry you work in, the vast majority of people in that industry appear to be human, well the same goes for law enforcement. There are cops who understand the moral and legal limits of their authority and work within those limitations, there are cops who don't truly understand those limitations and unfortunately often exceed them and finally there are those cops who don't care and willfully bend and break those boundaries every day.
Oh and I've already explained why cops should be obeyed, obviously you didn't or don't want to understand it. Here's a hint: Witnesses, even eye witnesses are notoriously unreliable because people tend see with their perception rather than with their eyes and might perceive what you are doing as wrong.
Family member testimony in defense of loved ones of is often taken with a grain of salt, most strangers would perceive your actions and attitude towards the officers in a negative light if you were "belligerent" but that depends on where you are and who they are.
The officers in this incident very definitely appear to have crossed the line and exceeded their authority. If there are multiple, similar complaints against them they will be suspended until the IA investigation is completed and recommendations made. For most it's often just a suspension with loss of pay, no retraining, nothing to really get them to understand what they did wrong. Most cops are not the purposeful authority abusers and instead of firing them need to be retrained so they understand their limitations. By the way I'm not making that claim in this case. Hopefully that clarifies what I have been trying to get across.
 
What is needed is a more diligent screening process for applicants to the police academies around the country. Just like the most likely place to find an arson is the Fire Department, the most likely place to find an authoritarian personality type is behind a police badge.
 
IF I pull a Colt45 shaped cigarette lighter out of my pocket when a cop walks up on my car after pulling me over I might get shot.

IF I act like an idiot and make a cop nervous I might get tazed or sprayed.

Right on the officer's part? Eh, an A+ officer having an A+ day would figure things out.

60% of the time an average officer would figure things out.

I can see things from the other fella's point of view so I realize this.

Young boys, they can't. Haven't seen the world through enough different eyes or have been stuck behind a Nintendo all their lives so they act all foolish counting on what "ideally" other folks would do.

Sure if I'm a cop who tazes a retarded man with a M16 replica air soft rifle I expect to have some explaining to do or end up behind a desk. Stuff happens though.

I do say if an officer tells you to put your hands on the hood or lie still on the ground in the mud or else he will spray you and you don't, it is your own dumb fault. That man behind the badge is human.

And I say that if he sprays me for disobeying an order he should be fired. Unfortunately, the world I live in sees it differently, so I make up for it by arguing with people who think I should obey cops who are having a bad day. Then I go trolling the streets looking for disgruntled cops to piss off in the hope I can get rich suing one.

Something you might want to think about is that every time one of those cops does do something stupid the taxpayers end up paying for it, sometimes to the tune of millions of dollars. It would be a lot cheaper to teach cops to take the bad stuff in stride than pay for their screw ups after the fact.

Once again, so as not to (continue) to be misunderstood I am not defending bad cops or cops who had a bad hair day. This is simply for perspective reasons only. Got it??!!
Like the industry you work in, the vast majority of people in that industry appear to be human, well the same goes for law enforcement. There are cops who understand the moral and legal limits of their authority and work within those limitations, there are cops who don't truly understand those limitations and unfortunately often exceed them and finally there are those cops who don't care and willfully bend and break those boundaries every day.
Oh and I've already explained why cops should be obeyed, obviously you didn't or don't want to understand it. Here's a hint: Witnesses, even eye witnesses are notoriously unreliable because people tend see with their perception rather than with their eyes and might perceive what you are doing as wrong.
Family member testimony in defense of loved ones of is often taken with a grain of salt, most strangers would perceive your actions and attitude towards the officers in a negative light if you were "belligerent" but that depends on where you are and who they are.
The officers in this incident very definitely appear to have crossed the line and exceeded their authority. If there are multiple, similar complaints against them they will be suspended until the IA investigation is completed and recommendations made. For most it's often just a suspension with loss of pay, no retraining, nothing to really get them to understand what they did wrong. Most cops are not the purposeful authority abusers and instead of firing them need to be retrained so they understand their limitations. By the way I'm not making that claim in this case. Hopefully that clarifies what I have been trying to get across.

I understand your point, but I want to add some perspective of my own.

LAPD and and Sheriff's Department are changing their policies toward misconduct.

A growing number of Los Angeles police officers who have used excessive force, driven while intoxicated, falsely imprisoned people or committed other serious misconduct are being let off without punishment as part of a new, controversial approach to discipline at the LAPD.

Instead of handing down suspensions without pay, as was the norm for such offenses, police officials increasingly are putting officers on notice that another gaffe of the same sort will bring a severe penalty and possible termination.

The strategy, called a "conditional official reprimand" in LAPD jargon, is the centerpiece of a philosophical change to discipline the department has been rolling out slowly in recent years. The new model, police officials say, is more effective at improving officers' behavior and allows the department to get rid of incorrigible cops more swiftly than before.

But as the use of conditional reprimands has jumped dramatically — 14 were issued in 2008 compared to 109 in 2010 — they have drawn scrutiny and criticism from the Police Commission, the civilian panel that oversees the department. At a public meeting late last month, commissioners raised concerns over the use of the reprimands to resolve serious offenses, for which they believe officers should be punished more harshly.

Discipline in the LAPD: New discipline policy at LAPD results in some officers avoiding punishment - latimes.com

They want us to believe that not taking cops that break the law off the streets is better than taking them off the streets.

Sorry, I do not buy that. I am generally not an advocate of zero tolerance, but we should have some sort of zero tolerance when it comes to police actually breaking the law, not a policy that says "If you do it again we might think less of you."

How effective is that policy in dealing with bad cops?

The parents of a Compton teen fatally shot by a Los Angeles County Sheriff's deputy are expected to get half a million dollars in a settlement that comes on the heels of a dramatic mistrial earlier this year, according to sources close to the case.

In March, a judge abruptly ended the wrongful death case of Avery Cody Jr. after the attorney for the slain 16-year-old's family announced in court that he had a videotape that he said contradicted sworn statements made by the deputy.

The video, according to the attorney, showed Deputy Sergio Reyes touching Cody's body after he shot the youth, even though Reyes said in sworn statements that he never touched the body. The surprise evidence was the second instance in which the deputy's account of the 2009 shooting and its aftermath appeared to be contradicted by video evidence.

The other was the deputy's statement that he took cover behind a metal newspaper rack; it was refuted by surveillance video from a nearby doughnut shop. Attorneys said Reyes made the statement to exaggerate the danger the deputy felt he was in when he shot Cody.

Sheriff's Department settlement: Parents of Avery Cody, shot to death by a deputy, are expected to get a $500,000 settlement - latimes.com

The deputy lied, and got caught because one of those unreliable witnesses you just mentioned had a cellphone and recorded the incident. Why do you think police departments across the country are arresting people who try to record what they do on duty?

This particular cop lied twice, and is still on the streets. Apparently shooting unarmed citizens and lying about it are within the Sheriff Department guidelines and policy. That tells me the policy needs to change. If you add in the fact that the LASD is the nation's largest police force, and many departments model their policies on them, it is even more imperative.
 
What is needed is a more diligent screening process for applicants to the police academies around the country. Just like the most likely place to find an arson is the Fire Department, the most likely place to find an authoritarian personality type is behind a police badge.

Capitalism says if we raise officer salaries we will get more candidates to.choose from and can pick better ones
 
What is needed is a more diligent screening process for applicants to the police academies around the country. Just like the most likely place to find an arson is the Fire Department, the most likely place to find an authoritarian personality type is behind a police badge.

Capitalism says if we raise officer salaries we will get more candidates to.choose from and can pick better ones

Capitalism does not say that because capitalism does not talk.
 
There's a difference between making a legit, on-the-job mistake when confronted with a decision, and deciding to actively pursue the continuance of a self-created downward spiral of a situation at the expense of the people who pay your salary, i.e; literally chasing your mistake down the street. These self-destructive cops weren't forced into a stressful situation; they chose to go out of their way to create something out of nothing. No execuse for that; terminable offense imo.

There's enough people looking for jobs these days -- willing and capable of being cops -- that the bar should be set a bit higher for cops today. Problem is, these substandard cops already entrenched can't actually lose their job no matter how pathetic their performance. The only way they can assuredly be replaced is if they're convicted of a felony, and they know that. So be it, then. Over-prosecute the shitty cops, replace them with better cops, and save taxpayer dollars in the long run.
 
"The bar should be set higher for Cops". The bi-polar left wing might agree to set the bar higher while we are systematically lowering the bar. Lefties believe Blacks are undereducated even though they see success stories like Clarence Thomas and Dr. Condie Rice so they lower the standards in order to recruit people based on the color of their skins. It's not the pay scale that causes Police Officers to make mistakes in judgment. It's lack of training or sub-standard training. Fire the Cops who make serious mistakes and go back and fire the people who are charged with the responsibility of educating Police Officers to deal with real life situations. Keep firing the Cops and the training officers until the situation is resolved.
 

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