Peter Schiff Challenges Alan Greenspan

[georgephillip]

Apply the North Dakota model to California's revenue and capital base and $4 trillion in lending capacity in 2009 would have resulted.

In the summer of '09 California had to resort to IOUs when Congress and Wall Street refused a request to cover a $26 billion deficit.

The same congress that wasted little time coming up with $700 billion for Wall Street banks responsible for our Great Crisis.

For nearly a century, North Dakota, on a much smaller scale and with a much smaller population, has proven there is an alternative private bankers.

 

[antagon]

if all states were like north dakota, we'd have an economy not unlike canada's, probably inferior yet. if states with product like north dakota's performed like california we'd be out of reach of china and japan by good measure.

i'm not sure if these hardcore conservative principles really transfer to california and the other states which drive the US economy. instead, they kind of leach off it.

 

[georgephillip]

if all states were like north dakota, we'd have an economy not unlike canada's, probably inferior yet. if states with product like north dakota's performed like california we'd be out of reach of china and japan by good measure.

i'm not sure if these hardcore conservative principles really transfer to california and the other states which drive the US economy. instead, they kind of leach off it.

Does any of the following sound correct to you?

"Money is just a ticket, a receipt for work performed and goods delivered. We can fund the work we need done by creating our own credit. The real promise of publicly-owned banking is not that they can bail out sub-prime borrowers but that they can jump start the economy by creating real wealth.

"They can provide the liquidity to put labor and materials together, allowing the economy to grow and build.

"Our private profit-driven banking sector has been bleeding weath from the rest of the economy.

"Public-interest banks can transfuse the economy with the credit it needs to flourish and be productive once again."

 

[Neubarth]

There are many devils lurking in the "baisis of credit" details.

Instead of private banks earning profit on interest bearing debt instruments, the state could fund mortgages at 2% interest, with credit card interest capped at 6%.

Farid A. Kahavari who's running in the Democratic gubernatorial primary in Florida claims:

"We can pay 6% interest on savings. Using the same fractional reserve system as all banks, we can create $900 of new money for every $100 of deposits. We can loan that $900 in the form of 2% fixed rate 15 year mortgages...and the state can earn $12 every year for every $100 in deposits.

"That means Floridians can save billions of dollars per year while the state earns billions making it possible for them."

Ahhhhh, yes. The insanity of the Socialist Crowd who think the STATE is the answer to all problems. It is fairly universally understood that the STATE is usually the most inefficient means of running business or government.

Tell that to North Dakota, one of only two states currently able to meet its budget.

In 1919 hard core conservatives in ND told Wall Street to drop dead.

It's time for the other 49 states to catch up.

North Dakota is predominantly Northern Central European Farmer transplants to America. A more fiscally conservative crowd has never been found.

 

[antagon]

if all states were like north dakota, we'd have an economy not unlike canada's, probably inferior yet. if states with product like north dakota's performed like california we'd be out of reach of china and japan by good measure.

i'm not sure if these hardcore conservative principles really transfer to california and the other states which drive the US economy. instead, they kind of leach off it.

Does any of the following sound correct to you?

"Money is just a ticket, a receipt for work performed and goods delivered. We can fund the work we need done by creating our own credit. The real promise of publicly-owned banking is not that they can bail out sub-prime borrowers but that they can jump start the economy by creating real wealth.

"They can provide the liquidity to put labor and materials together, allowing the economy to grow and build.

"Our private profit-driven banking sector has been bleeding weath from the rest of the economy.

"Public-interest banks can transfuse the economy with the credit it needs to flourish and be productive once again."

the SBA?

 

[georgephillip]

Give me a clue...

SBA?

 

[antagon]

sorry, i mean, sounds like the small business administration. how much further do you propose the government go to directly feed credit to the economy. student loans, sba, homeloans... theyve had these bases covered directly or via proxy for decades.

 

[editec]

SCHIFF CHRONICALLY PASSES THE BLAME. There are things that Greenspan could do and things that he could not do. Schiff mistakenly thinks that Greenspan was all knowing and deliberately kept interest rates too low for too long. That was not the case, as Alan raised interest rates as he felt they could have an effect on the speed of growth of the economy. Nobody is perfect and nobody is totally clairvoyant. Only Schiff thinks he is. AND he is wrong.

Except he was right, unfortunately. Which goes to show that artificial tampering with the interest rate is the problem in the first place.

How could you NOT "artificially tamper" with the interest rate, Kevin?

As long as we have a central bank, I mean, isn't every rate by fiat?

Understand I am NOT defending Greenspan, here. (far from it!)

I just don't know what you mean, by "artificial rates" in this case.

 

[editec]

There are many devils lurking in the "baisis of credit" details.

Instead of private banks earning profit on interest bearing debt instruments, the state could fund mortgages at 2% interest, with credit card interest capped at 6%.

Farid A. Kahavari who's running in the Democratic gubernatorial primary in Florida claims:

"We can pay 6% interest on savings. Using the same fractional reserve system as all banks, we can create $900 of new money for every $100 of deposits. We can loan that $900 in the form of 2% fixed rate 15 year mortgages...and the state can earn $12 every year for every $100 in deposits.

"That means Floridians can save billions of dollars per year while the state earns billions making it possible for them."

Ahhhhh, yes. The insanity of the Socialist Crowd who think the STATE is the answer to all problems. It is fairly universally understood that the STATE is usually the most inefficient means of running business or government.

But to really fuck things up, what you need is corrupt private business working hand in hand with corrupt GOVERNMENT.

And that is obviously what we have NOW.

We are more corrupted than any banana republic in South America.

The primary difference is our system is so corrupt that the wholesale theft of this nation's wealth is LEGAL.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

SCHIFF CHRONICALLY PASSES THE BLAME. There are things that Greenspan could do and things that he could not do. Schiff mistakenly thinks that Greenspan was all knowing and deliberately kept interest rates too low for too long. That was not the case, as Alan raised interest rates as he felt they could have an effect on the speed of growth of the economy. Nobody is perfect and nobody is totally clairvoyant. Only Schiff thinks he is. AND he is wrong.

Except he was right, unfortunately. Which goes to show that artificial tampering with the interest rate is the problem in the first place.

How could you NOT "artificially tamper" with the interest rate, Kevin?

As long as we have a central bank, I mean, isn't every rate by fiat?

Understand I am NOT defending Greenspan, here. (far from it!)

I just don't know what you mean, by "artificial rates" in this case.

Let real savings set the interest rate rather than inflation.

 

[georgephillip]

If it's true that today's debts--and property prices--are growing at compound interest, beyond the ability of economies to produce a net economic surplus to pay, I think we are very close to reaching mathematical limits to our debt burden.

Take student loans, for example. Slipped into Obama's reconciliation "fix" of the health care reform bill was legislation empowering the federal government to lend directly to students.

Treasury will lend the money for this program to the Education Department at 2.8% interest.

Student will repay at 6.8%.

Education keeps the 4% spread to help impoverished students.

"If the Education Department were to set up its own bank, on the model of the Green Bank in the Energy Bill, it could generate even more money for higher education."

For nearly a century, Treasury and the Fed have been loaning money into circulation. Our currency is worth 5% what it was in 1913, and our democracy is rapidly transforming into an oligarchy.

What I'm suggesting is it's time to tax the rich instead of borrowing from them.