Permanent War?: Has The Military Industrial Complex Finally Achieved Its Goal?

[BluePhantom]

Does anyone on this Board right now remember a time when we weren't bombing & killing somewhere around the world? I think this is an interesting question.

According to my research the last time would have been 2000. The last string of years was 1996-1998 and before that was 1984-1987 with the exception of bombing Libya which was one day on April 15, 1986.

 

[paulitician]

Does anyone on this Board right now remember a time when we weren't bombing & killing somewhere around the world? I think this is an interesting question.

According to my research the last time would have been 2000. The last string of years was 1996-1998 and before that was 1984-1987 with the exception of bombing Libya which was one day on April 15, 1986.

Just a few minor discrepencies in your time-frames but i get your point. Bombings and military actions were taking place during some of the time-frames you listed though. And don't forget we had a No-Fly Zone in place over Iraq for many years and we regularly bombed them. If there were respites,they were very brief respites. some of

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

According to my research the last time would have been 2000. The last string of years was 1996-1998 and before that was 1984-1987 with the exception of bombing Libya which was one day on April 15, 1986.

There are some discrepencies in your time-frames. Bombings and military actions were taking place during those time-frames you listed. And don't forget we had a No-Fly Zone in place over Iraq for many years and we regularly bombed them. If there were respites,they were very brief respites.

No, let’s accept his data as accurate.

That’s 13 of the last 27 years – nearly half - the Nation was involved in some military action; all engagements were unnecessary, others illegal, and all having noting to do with addressing a threat to the United States.

This constitutes permanent war, and is clearly unacceptable.

 

[Sirkarl101]

The now generation are sick of the bullshit wars and conflicts and are not going to stand for empty conflicts.

 

[paulitician]

The now generation are sick of the bullshit wars and conflicts and are not going to stand for empty conflicts.

No offense,but i think you're mistaken. The now generation is just doing what most did before them. They'll support any foreign intervention just as long as it's their team doing the intervening. It's still all about that 'D' & 'R' thing. Yesterday's 'Anti-War' folks are today's 'Chickenhawk Warmongers.' Just look around and see who today's biggest Chickenhawks are. You'll be very surprised to find out who they are. So i'm not nearly as opitimistic as you are.

 

[pvsi.]

I'm just interesting in hearing what others think about this question. It does seem to me that we are in a permanent state of War. I don't believe there are any Citizens left who actually remember a time when we weren't bombing and at War with someone. So,has the Military Industrial Complex finally achieved its goal of permanent War?

Nothing lasts forever. once people will find their leader, things are easy to get back to normal

 

[paulitician]

I'm just interesting in hearing what others think about this question. It does seem to me that we are in a permanent state of War. I don't believe there are any Citizens left who actually remember a time when we weren't bombing and at War with someone. So,has the Military Industrial Complex finally achieved its goal of permanent War?

Nothing lasts forever. once people will find their leader, things are easy to get back to normal

People have been saying that very same thing for many many years. When's it gonna happen? And will the Military Industrial Complex ever let that happen?

 

[paulitician]

I'm actually pretty surprised there are 5 No votes. Hmm?

 

[francoHFW]

The Iraq War, the stupidest war EVER, is over. The afghan war will take a while to end, but I believe that's it. Getting rid of Gaddafi was a unique situation. Small country, within range of EU, along sea. As long as we keep the Pub chickenhawks out of power. They START wars, Dems FINISH them. Bosnia, Iraq, Afghan, Libya, AlQaeda.

 

[dilloduck]

War keeps unemployment in check. Gotta have it. What would the arms manufacturers do without one. ( I wish I had the patent on AK-47's )

 

[R.C. Christian]

Does anyone on this Board right now remember a time when we weren't bombing & killing somewhere around the world? I think this is an interesting question.

My great uncle does. He was born in 1913. His life changed at Pearl Harbor.

 

[grunt11b]

I'm just interesting in hearing what others think about this question. It does seem to me that we are in a permanent state of War. I don't believe there are any Citizens left who actually remember a time when we weren't bombing and at War with someone. So,has the Military Industrial Complex finally achieved its goal of permanent War?

They cannot blame Bush anymore, Obama owns these babies. It's up to him to pull the troops out. He is only pulling them out of Iraq to prep to reinsert them into Iran if need be, and knowing that warmongering buffoon there will be a need soon.

 

[paulitician]

Some people will always cling to that old Republican vs. Democrat thing but our permanent state of War goes well beyond that. The Military Industrial Complex makes the call on that. Politicians come and go and it doesn't matter whether they're Republican or Democrat. They're not the real decision-makers on this. Decisions on War are made for them by others.

 

[BluePhantom]

The Iraq War, the stupidest war EVER, is over. The afghan war will take a while to end, but I believe that's it. Getting rid of Gaddafi was a unique situation. Small country, within range of EU, along sea. As long as we keep the Pub chickenhawks out of power. They START wars, Dems FINISH them. Bosnia, Iraq, Afghan, Libya, AlQaeda.

Really? Might I suggest you do some research on the Vietnam War, the Korean War, the First Sumatran Expedition, the Black Hawk War, the Second Seminole War, the Third Seminole War, The Mexican-American War, Red Cloud's War, the Spanish-American War, the occupation of Haiti, occupation of the Dominican-Republic, Operation Uphold Democracy, Operation Noble Anvil, and of course the Civil War.

Democrats don't start wars my ass. Or let me guess...those were all Bush's fault, right?

 

[paulitician]

Conspiracy Theory got 4 Votes? That's pretty funny but also sad.

 

[dblack]

Conspiracy Theory got 4 Votes? That's pretty funny but also sad.

I can sort of understand that. Some people sell the idea as a conspiracy - as though there is a cabal of leaders meeting in secret to ensure that we start unnecessary wars. And that's pretty unlikely.

More likely, it's simply a by product of our political structure. Complex systems can exhibit a 'will' of their own that often runs counter to the intentions of everyone in the system. I suspect that's a more likely account of why the our policy trends the way it does.

 

[paulitician]

Conspiracy Theory got 4 Votes? That's pretty funny but also sad.

I can sort of understand that. Some people sell the idea as a conspiracy - as though there is a cabal of leaders meeting in secret to ensure that we start unnecessary wars. And that's pretty unlikely.

More likely, it's simply a by product of our political structure. Complex systems can exhibit a 'will' of their own that often runs counter to the intentions of everyone in the system. I suspect that's a more likely account of why the our policy trends the way it does.

Good observation. Thanks.

 

[BluePhantom]

Conspiracy Theory got 4 Votes? That's pretty funny but also sad.

I can sort of understand that. Some people sell the idea as a conspiracy - as though there is a cabal of leaders meeting in secret to ensure that we start unnecessary wars. And that's pretty unlikely.

More likely, it's simply a by product of our political structure. Complex systems can exhibit a 'will' of their own that often runs counter to the intentions of everyone in the system. I suspect that's a more likely account of why the our policy trends the way it does.

To a large extent I would agree with you. I would also say that in many ways we really don't have a lot of choice. The world economy depends on the American market and spendthrift consumers for their survival so when we go to shit everyone goes to shit. That means we are really stuck in a position where we are forced to maintain strong interests in foreign nations to balance it out and also to ensure that things work in our favor. We also give the rest of the world a "big bad monster" to blame everything on but just you watch what would happen if we suddenly said "we aint getting involved in anything anymore". The world would go bat shit (and not in a good way).

 

[paulitician]

Imagine a time of no War in this country? Can you even imagine that? And if you can't,what does that say about our country?

 

[dblack]

To a large extent I would agree with you. I would also say that in many ways we really don't have a lot of choice. The world economy depends on the American market and spendthrift consumers for their survival so when we go to shit everyone goes to shit. That means we are really stuck in a position where we are forced to maintain strong interests in foreign nations to balance it out and also to ensure that things work in our favor. We also give the rest of the world a "big bad monster" to blame everything on but just you watch what would happen if we suddenly said "we aint getting involved in anything anymore". The world would go bat shit (and not in a good way).

Nah.. I don't buy that. Our foreign policy is geared to protect "our" privileged status, no doubt, but clearly other nations aren't enthusiastic about working toward that goal. And that arrogance is costing us. I do agree that there would be plenty of people complaining if we pulled back, lots of unscrupulous people are invested in our little game, on all sides, but that's no reason not to do the right thing. The world certainly wouldn't go 'bat shit'.

We can be good neighbors, stay engaged in foreign affairs and protect ourselves without ruling the world. That will require a change in attitude that 'warfare state' Republicans (and to be frank, most Democrats) are loathe to accept, but I think it's utterly necessary if we plan to hold things together.