Pastor Orders His Flock to Beat Gay Couple Arriving At Church

[Dr.Drock]

You can't reason with a troll, Doc. Just troll him mercilessly, until he can no longer take it, and deletes System 32.

Yeah i know, I've learned that you can't just talk prejudice people out of their prejudices.

Prejudices are obtained through ignorance, ignorance can only be fixed in certain people by real life experience.

I'm guessing that you're prejudiced in thinking that you're smarter than most people on here. You will never eliminate prejudice or judgment from the human condition, there's not one human being currently on the planet that is free from doing either.

Well then you would guess incorrectly. I haven't said a word about being smarter than another person, I can't be held responsible for what the voice in your head drums up with zero evidence and then the other voice in your head laughing at what the original voice said.

I'm talking about Tank, Joe and the other bigot in this thread making excuses and downplaying what the idiot prejudice attackers did here.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Forgive them, good doctor, for they know not what they do.

I understand what you're saying, but I'm only attributing this to Avatar because he said it.

Just personally you'll never hear me (a non-religious person) say, "I want you (religious person) to become better by dropping your religion."

And you're welcome to say it, many atheists do on a regular basis, doesn't mean that the person you're directing it has to be offended. If you're comfortable in your own skin and mature in your beliefs, you saying that to them would mean absolutely nothing. No one has a right to not be offended, so suck it up and act like an adult.

You thinking I'm offended is just another scenario you've dreamed up in your head, which by just a couple posts on this thread already you've showed that to be a normal thing with you.

I'm not the least bit offended, but Avatar was clearly saying that making a non-christian into a christian makes them better, which is of course saying christians are better than non-christians.

 

[Dr.Drock]

So what would you suggest would be the appropriate way to change minds and hearts if you can't tell them the truth without being offended?

The truth is the truth. It doesn't change because we accept it or not. Wanting people to learn that so they can grow and become better people is arrogant?

Maybe I'm naive then. Because i generally think that if you want people to be better, that's a good thing. I'm not going to get upset if you wish id leave my faith. you are wrong about it making me better but the fact that you care about me would be more important.

When you experience the Holy Spirit, you can't help but want to share the Gospel with everyone. You want them to feel the joy and love you feel from God. You want them to be blessed. You can't simply be content to bless yourself and your family. You want your friends and even your enemies to be blessed. It's just not possibly to feel that power and not want to share it.

Maybe I need more tact, though I sincerely am disappointed that I haven't gained it by now.

Im sorry if i came across as attacking or arrogant. That wasnt my intention. Clearly i still have more to learn.

Isn't the above line that I bolded and underlined Avatar saying that christians are better than non-christians?

I'm curious... is anyone ever 'better' than someone else? Or are we all the same?

No we're not all the same, yes in my opinion people are better than other people, but you can't categorically say someone is better purely by their choice of belief or non-belief, that's bigotry.

 

[BDBoop]

Isn't the above line that I bolded and underlined Avatar saying that christians are better than non-christians?

I found it to be moreso in the following paragraph. "Because i generally think that if you want people to be better, that's a good thing." That's judging.

Nobody on this planet will ever be on such a high moral plane that they can then decide who among 'the least of us' needs to be "better." - and here's why.

When you get to where you're going spiritually, all this minutiae doesn't matter. It's not important. You stop looking at behaviors, and start looking at hearts. You operate from a space of Grace, not condemnation.

But you see everything as a 'condemnation' or as a 'judgment', so it really wouldn't matter either way. There's no way that Av could tell you what he is saying is 'truth' without offending you because you already think you're smarter and better than him, do you not? When you stop judging people then maybe you can preach. If you say you're above it yourself, or that you don't do it, then you're a liar.

So far, you're two-for-two on the erroneous front.

Curious - for a mod, we sure don't see much of you. What's up with that, home skillet?

 

[Newby]

I understand what you're saying, but I'm only attributing this to Avatar because he said it.

Just personally you'll never hear me (a non-religious person) say, "I want you (religious person) to become better by dropping your religion."

And you're welcome to say it, many atheists do on a regular basis, doesn't mean that the person you're directing it has to be offended. If you're comfortable in your own skin and mature in your beliefs, you saying that to them would mean absolutely nothing. No one has a right to not be offended, so suck it up and act like an adult.

You thinking I'm offended is just another scenario you've dreamed up in your head, which by just a couple posts on this thread already you've showed that to be a normal thing with you.

I'm not the least bit offended, but Avatar was clearly saying that making a non-christian into a christian makes them better, which is of course saying christians are better than non-christians.

I think it is you who is coming up with things in his head, good doctor, I never said I thought you were offended? So, I'm not sure where you're coming to that conclusion from. I was referring to the comment that you said no one would ever hear you say, I was commenting that many other atheists do say exactly that, but that doesn't mean that the person to whom it was aimed at has to be offended. I'm not offended when an atheist offers up in a surperior manner how stupid it is to believe in God because I'm mature in my beliefs and I don't allow what some ignorant stranger to have any affect on me.

And Avatar was saying that because to him it simply is the truth, he meant no offense by it, but unfortunately Ms. Boop doesn't seem to understand that.

 

[Dr.Drock]

And you're welcome to say it, many atheists do on a regular basis, doesn't mean that the person you're directing it has to be offended. If you're comfortable in your own skin and mature in your beliefs, you saying that to them would mean absolutely nothing. No one has a right to not be offended, so suck it up and act like an adult.

You thinking I'm offended is just another scenario you've dreamed up in your head, which by just a couple posts on this thread already you've showed that to be a normal thing with you.

I'm not the least bit offended, but Avatar was clearly saying that making a non-christian into a christian makes them better, which is of course saying christians are better than non-christians.

I think it is you who is coming up with things in his head, good doctor, I never said I thought you were offended? So, I'm not sure where you're coming to that conclusion from. I was referring to the comment that you said no one would ever hear you say, I was commenting that many other atheists do say exactly that, but that doesn't mean that the person to whom it was aimed at has to be offended. I'm not offended when an atheist offers up in a surperior manner how stupid it is to believe in God because I'm mature in my beliefs and I don't allow what some ignorant stranger to have any affect on me.

And Avatar was saying that because to him it simply is the truth, he meant no offense by it, but unfortunately Ms. Boop doesn't seem to understand that.

Thanks for the reply, but i'll let Avatar clear it up. The post seemed pretty black and white to me.

A person who's non-christian<that same person if he/she were christian

 

[Newby]

I found it to be moreso in the following paragraph. "Because i generally think that if you want people to be better, that's a good thing." That's judging.

Nobody on this planet will ever be on such a high moral plane that they can then decide who among 'the least of us' needs to be "better." - and here's why.

When you get to where you're going spiritually, all this minutiae doesn't matter. It's not important. You stop looking at behaviors, and start looking at hearts. You operate from a space of Grace, not condemnation.

But you see everything as a 'condemnation' or as a 'judgment', so it really wouldn't matter either way. There's no way that Av could tell you what he is saying is 'truth' without offending you because you already think you're smarter and better than him, do you not? When you stop judging people then maybe you can preach. If you say you're above it yourself, or that you don't do it, then you're a liar.

So far, you're two-for-two on the erroneous front.

Curious - for a mod, we sure don't see much of you. What's up with that, home skillet?

So, you're claiming that you don't judge anyone, ever? Yeah, okay, keep your head in the sand girl, you do seem happy there.

And I really don't think it's any of your business how often I'm around, or why I'm around when I am, you really should get your ego back into the proper place and worry about your own life and not mine. And how mature, we've resorted to name calling now as well?

 

[Lokiate]

So what would you suggest would be the appropriate way to change minds and hearts if you can't tell them the truth without being offended?

The truth is the truth. It doesn't change because we accept it or not. Wanting people to learn that so they can grow and become better people is arrogant?

Maybe I'm naive then. Because i generally think that if you want people to be better, that's a good thing. I'm not going to get upset if you wish id leave my faith. you are wrong about it making me better but the fact that you care about me would be more important.

When you experience the Holy Spirit, you can't help but want to share the Gospel with everyone. You want them to feel the joy and love you feel from God. You want them to be blessed. You can't simply be content to bless yourself and your family. You want your friends and even your enemies to be blessed. It's just not possibly to feel that power and not want to share it.

Maybe I need more tact, though I sincerely am disappointed that I haven't gained it by now.

Im sorry if i came across as attacking or arrogant. That wasnt my intention. Clearly i still have more to learn.

Isn't the above line that I bolded and underlined Avatar saying that christians are better than non-christians?

I'm curious... is anyone ever 'better' than someone else? Or are we all the same?

Is anyone better than someone else? Yes, but not because of religious or political ideology.

 

[BDBoop]

But you see everything as a 'condemnation' or as a 'judgment', so it really wouldn't matter either way. There's no way that Av could tell you what he is saying is 'truth' without offending you because you already think you're smarter and better than him, do you not? When you stop judging people then maybe you can preach. If you say you're above it yourself, or that you don't do it, then you're a liar.

So far, you're two-for-two on the erroneous front.

Curious - for a mod, we sure don't see much of you. What's up with that, home skillet?

So, you're claiming that you don't judge anyone, ever? Yeah, okay, keep your head in the sand girl, you do seem happy there.

And I really don't think it's any of your business how often I'm around, or why I'm around when I am, you really should get your ego back into the proper place and worry about your own life and not mine. And how mature, we've resorted to name calling now as well?

Really, I said that? Hmmm ... three-for-three, home skillet.

 

[Newby]

Isn't the above line that I bolded and underlined Avatar saying that christians are better than non-christians?

I'm curious... is anyone ever 'better' than someone else? Or are we all the same?

Is anyone better than someone else? Yes, but not because of religious or political ideology.

When is someone 'better' then? Why are your moral distinctions for 'better' any 'better' than anyone elses?

 

[Newby]

So far, you're two-for-two on the erroneous front.

Curious - for a mod, we sure don't see much of you. What's up with that, home skillet?

So, you're claiming that you don't judge anyone, ever? Yeah, okay, keep your head in the sand girl, you do seem happy there.

And I really don't think it's any of your business how often I'm around, or why I'm around when I am, you really should get your ego back into the proper place and worry about your own life and not mine. And how mature, we've resorted to name calling now as well?

Really, I said that? Hmmm ... three-for-three, home skillet.

Oh, okay, so you do actually judge other people? Yes or no?

 

[BDBoop]

Everybody does. But you knew that. Even what you're doing right now, in this thread, is judging.

 

[Newby]

Everybody does. But you knew that. Even what you're doing right now, in this thread, is judging.

Yeah, but I'm not the holier-than-thou person putting someone else down for their judgments in this thread, you are. I'm sure you've heard the phrase that those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, you're throwing a lot of stones at Avatar, so don't be upset when you get some thrown back your way.

 

[Wumplestiltskin]

Pastor Orders His Flock to Beat Gay Couple Arriving At Church | Addicting Info

Oh, okay! One of them was his son. Now I understand.

Not.

"Grace Fellowship" my ass.

You worded it wrong. Christian Taliban leader issues fatwa.

 

[Immanuel]

If that were my church, the Sunday before this incident would have been the last time I would have graced their sanctuary with my presence.

Somewhere along the line, the pastor seems to have lost connection with the teachings of the Lord.

Immie

I agree.
I am wondering if this incident would have happened if one of the gay men had NOT been the pastor's son.

Grace Fellowship Church in Fruitland, TN

Is everyone SURE this isn't an onion story?

No, I am not 100% certain, but I did spend some time looking last night for a reliable news source that covered it. Finally, like on the 4th or 5th page of Google, I found a TV station that covered it. That doesn't make this a legitimate story, but it does give it a little more credibility.

Immie

 

[Dr.Drock]

If that were my church, the Sunday before this incident would have been the last time I would have graced their sanctuary with my presence.

Somewhere along the line, the pastor seems to have lost connection with the teachings of the Lord.

Immie

I agree.
I am wondering if this incident would have happened if one of the gay men had NOT been the pastor's son.

Grace Fellowship Church in Fruitland, TN

Is everyone SURE this isn't an onion story?

No, I am not 100% certain, but I did spend some time looking last night for a reliable news source that covered it. Finally, like on the 4th or 5th page of Google, I found a TV station that covered it. That doesn't make this a legitimate story, but it does give it a little more credibility.

Immie

It is interesting that the mainstream media isn't covering this. I'm always told the mainstream media pushes the "gay agenda", is super liberal, etc etc.

 

[Immanuel]

It comes off as extremely arrogant, which can certainly be interpreted as an attack. It would be like me, as an atheist, telling you that I hope you learn one of these days to abandon your silly superstition and embrace the truth. I just want you to be better than you currently are, so isn't that love?

Hopefully that explains to you why having a preachy, know-it-all, holier than thou attitude isn't exactly the best approach to changing hearts and minds.

So what would you suggest would be the appropriate way to change minds and hearts if you can't tell them the truth without being offended?

The truth is the truth. It doesn't change because we accept it or not. Wanting people to learn that so they can grow and become better people is arrogant?

Maybe I'm naive then. Because i generally think that if you want people to be better, that's a good thing. I'm not going to get upset if you wish id leave my faith. you are wrong about it making me better but the fact that you care about me would be more important.

When you experience the Holy Spirit, you can't help but want to share the Gospel with everyone. You want them to feel the joy and love you feel from God. You want them to be blessed. You can't simply be content to bless yourself and your family. You want your friends and even your enemies to be blessed. It's just not possibly to feel that power and not want to share it.

Maybe I need more tact, though I sincerely am disappointed that I haven't gained it by now.

Im sorry if i came across as attacking or arrogant. That wasnt my intention. Clearly i still have more to learn.

Isn't the above line that I bolded and underlined Avatar saying that christians are better than non-christians?

Isn't it obvious though that liberals think they are better than everyone else? So, what is your point? Why do you attack Avatar for his honest concern for others and put up with people like rdean and TDM who actually pretend to be so much better than everyone else?

Avatar portrays honest concern for others while TDM and rdean are nothing short of arrogant in their attitudes.

Immie

 

[Dr.Drock]

So what would you suggest would be the appropriate way to change minds and hearts if you can't tell them the truth without being offended?

The truth is the truth. It doesn't change because we accept it or not. Wanting people to learn that so they can grow and become better people is arrogant?

Maybe I'm naive then. Because i generally think that if you want people to be better, that's a good thing. I'm not going to get upset if you wish id leave my faith. you are wrong about it making me better but the fact that you care about me would be more important.

When you experience the Holy Spirit, you can't help but want to share the Gospel with everyone. You want them to feel the joy and love you feel from God. You want them to be blessed. You can't simply be content to bless yourself and your family. You want your friends and even your enemies to be blessed. It's just not possibly to feel that power and not want to share it.

Maybe I need more tact, though I sincerely am disappointed that I haven't gained it by now.

Im sorry if i came across as attacking or arrogant. That wasnt my intention. Clearly i still have more to learn.

Isn't the above line that I bolded and underlined Avatar saying that christians are better than non-christians?

Isn't it obvious though that liberals think they are better than everyone else? So, what is your point? Why do you attack Avatar for his honest concern for others and put up with people like rdean and TDM who actually pretend to be so much better than everyone else?

Immie

I think you have me mistaken for someone else. I rarely if ever respond to RDean and TruthMatters because they're hypocritical idiots. The fantasy world they live in is anything attached to democrats=moral/great/heavenly and anything attached to republicans=immoral/terrible/satanic. Their partisanship has replaced their moral compass, at least in terms of how they talk on this board.

I respond to Avatar because I respect him, but if he truly thinks christians are better than non-christians, than I can't express how much I disagree with him on that.

 

[BDBoop]

Everybody does. But you knew that. Even what you're doing right now, in this thread, is judging.

Yeah, but I'm not the holier-than-thou person putting someone else down for their judgments in this thread, you are. I'm sure you've heard the phrase that those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, you're throwing a lot of stones at Avatar, so don't be upset when you get some thrown back your way.

4-for-4, as I am not upset.

Are you always this 'off'?

 

[Lokiate]

When is someone 'better' then?

When they are more capable than others.

Why are your moral distinctions for 'better' any 'better' than anyone elses?

When did I ever say they were, assumptions McGee?