Pander to me!

[JakeStarkey]

Hispanics assimilate as quickly as any other ethnic group, I am thinking.

When circumstances are the same.

When are they not? They assimilate the same, perhaps even more quickly.

 

[Unkotare]

Hispanics assimilate as quickly as any other ethnic group, I am thinking.

When circumstances are the same.

When are they not?

There can be a great many differing circumstances that may affect the rate and ultimate success of assimilation.

These include, but are not limited to:

-The availability of goods, services, information, and communication of and from the person's native culture.

-The existence of a large, supportive, and stable community representing the person's native culture within the new country.

-The person's attitude (influenced in many ways) toward the new culture and language.

-The environment within which the person lives and works outside the home.

-The existence or absence of family and friends who can serve as an example of assimilation and its benefits.

And there's a bunch more

 

[JakeStarkey]

When circumstances are the same.

When are they not?

There can be a great many differing circumstances that may affect the rate and ultimate success of assimilation.

These include, but are not limited to:

-The availability of goods, services, information, and communication of and from the person's native culture.

-The existence of a large, supportive, and stable community representing the person's native culture within the new country.

-The person's attitude (influenced in many ways) toward the new culture and language.

-The environment within which the person lives and works outside the home.

-The existence or absence of family and friends who can serve as an example of assimilation and its benefits.

And there's a bunch more

But nothing supports that such is a major barrier or an important impetus to assimilation.

Give us some solid objective evidence.

 

[GuyPinestra]

LOL! right wingers, they never know what in the hell they are talking about.

"The survey showed 64-percent overall support for the directive and 66-percent backing by independents."

Voters approve of President Obama’s immigration order, 2 to 1, poll shows - Political Intelligence - A national political and campaign blog from The Boston Globe - Boston.com

64% of democrats is a pretty good number, now go peddle your bullshit somewhere else.

That's 64% overall with a 66% backing by the independents you claimed went "ta ta"
It's best to actually have a clue what you are talking about before posting

For those figures to be accurate you'd have to have well over 50% of Repiublicans supporting it, too. Somehow, I just don't see it happening.

Your poll numbers are BULLSHIT!!

 

[Black_Label]

64% of democrats is a pretty good number, now go peddle your bullshit somewhere else.

That's 64% overall with a 66% backing by the independents you claimed went "ta ta"
It's best to actually have a clue what you are talking about before posting

For those figures to be accurate you'd have to have well over 50% of Repiublicans supporting it, too. Somehow, I just don't see it happening.

Your poll numbers are BULLSHIT!!

Would you care to explain, with factual evidence, how the "poll numbers are bullshit"? Or are you just putting the right wing ignorance and stupidity on full display once again?

 

[GuyPinestra]

When are they not?

There can be a great many differing circumstances that may affect the rate and ultimate success of assimilation.

These include, but are not limited to:

-The availability of goods, services, information, and communication of and from the person's native culture.

-The existence of a large, supportive, and stable community representing the person's native culture within the new country.

-The person's attitude (influenced in many ways) toward the new culture and language.

-The environment within which the person lives and works outside the home.

-The existence or absence of family and friends who can serve as an example of assimilation and its benefits.

And there's a bunch more

But nothing supports that such is a major barrier or an important impetus to assimilation.

Give us some solid objective evidence.

Try the La Raza studies courses pushed in Tuscon, Arizona, dipshit. There is no assimilation when your educational aim is to create hatred rather than Americanism.

Fucking IDIOT!!!

 

[Unkotare]

When are they not?

There can be a great many differing circumstances that may affect the rate and ultimate success of assimilation.

These include, but are not limited to:

-The availability of goods, services, information, and communication of and from the person's native culture.

-The existence of a large, supportive, and stable community representing the person's native culture within the new country.

-The person's attitude (influenced in many ways) toward the new culture and language.

-The environment within which the person lives and works outside the home.

-The existence or absence of family and friends who can serve as an example of assimilation and its benefits.

And there's a bunch more

But nothing supports that such is a major barrier or an important impetus to assimilation.

Give us some solid objective evidence.

Many studies support all of the above. I didn't just make it up, champ.

 

[JakeStarkey]

There can be a great many differing circumstances that may affect the rate and ultimate success of assimilation.

These include, but are not limited to:

-The availability of goods, services, information, and communication of and from the person's native culture.

-The existence of a large, supportive, and stable community representing the person's native culture within the new country.

-The person's attitude (influenced in many ways) toward the new culture and language.

-The environment within which the person lives and works outside the home.

-The existence or absence of family and friends who can serve as an example of assimilation and its benefits.

And there's a bunch more

But nothing supports that such is a major barrier or an important impetus to assimilation.

Give us some solid objective evidence.

Many studies support all of the above. I didn't just make it up, champ.

Then give us the sources as long as they are not from wikiipedia or made up informational videos. Really, I would like to look at them.

 

[whitehall]

You have to factor in the total slobbering support of the majority of the mainstream media. It doesn't matter what Barry Hussein says or does. Obama policies resulted in the deaths of perhaps hundreds of innocent Mexican citizens with the F/F mess but he can count on the liberal media to spin every story it his favor and the majority of the people who get their information from the liberal media will accept the half truths as the truth.

 

[Unkotare]

But nothing supports that such is a major barrier or an important impetus to assimilation.

Give us some solid objective evidence.

Many studies support all of the above. I didn't just make it up, champ.

Then give us the sources as long as they are not from wikiipedia or made up informational videos. Really, I would like to look at them.

If you're really interested, start by reviewing the work of Gordon way back in 1964, then move on to the research done by Keefe and Padilla around 1987, Yinger in 1981, and Shaull and Gramann in 1998.

If you're interested specifically in how attitude toward the target culture affects second language acquisition, just google that topic and you'll find no end of studies addressing the topic.

I told you I didn't just make this up.

 

[JakeStarkey]

None of the works give comparative information with other cultures in terms of Hispanic assimilation and acculturation. I suspect that Hispanics assimilate more quickly than the Irish, Germans, or Jews, for instance, and I certainly have seen nothing to contradict that. A review of titles of various sources do indicate that Hispanics are assimilating on their own terms, probably because of their vast numbers unlike those of other ethnicities in the past. I doubt nothing will stop this type of assimilation. Any attempt by either party to force Hispanics into molds formed in the past for acculturation and assimilation will merely drive them into the other party. As Hispanics constitute about one of every seven Americans, their cultural subset portends great changes in the American narrative. I suggest that we in the Republican Party reach out to serve their particular needs, and I believe Romney will do exactly that when he becomes president.

===

Interesting but does nothing about Hispanic assimilation into American US culture and we are almost fifty years past that. Milton Gordon (1964) proposed that assimilation can be described as a series of stages through which an individual must pass. These three stages are behavioral assimilation (acculturation), structural assimilation (social assimilation), and marital assimilation of the individuals of the minority society and individuals of the dominant society. Although this proposal has been criticized, it does indicate that there is a continuum through which individuals pass, beginning with acculturation and ending with complete assimilation ( Gordon 1964: 71). Diffusionism and Acculturation - Anthropological Theories - Department of Anthropology - The University of Alabama

I agree with the concept that acculturation and assimilation may be more difficult than earlier perceived, but this is not a comparative for Hispanic and earlier cultures that assimilated into the mainstream American culture. Acculturation, Social Identity, and Social Cognition: A New Perspective, by Amado M. Padilla [and] William Perez Stanford University The authors argue in this article that new approaches are needed in the study of psychological acculturation. They posit that a new model of psychological acculturation should incorporate contemporary work in social and cognitive psychology. The model they present builds on previous research in the areas of social cognition, cultural competence, social identity, and social stigma. Each of these perspectives is discussed in accordance with its relevance to the acculturative processes operating in immigrants. They hypothesize that acculturation is more difficult for those persons who must cope with the stigma of being different because of skin color, language, ethnicity, and so forth. Finally, the
authors believe that the theoretical framework present here will lead to more productive
insights into the adaptation process of immigrants than has heretofore been the case. http://www.stanford.edu/~apadilla/PadillaPerez03a.pdf

Yinger talks about cultural and structural assimilation but makes no assumption compartively about Hispanic/Latino assimilation with other earlier ethnicity. Race and Ethnic Relations: American and Global Perspectives - Martin N. Marger - Google Books

Once again, nothing comparative in assimilation and acculturation, and this work is very, very limited to subject. Shaull and Gramann's writing on "Latino Knowledge and Attitudes toward Natural Resources and the Environment". http://www.ag-communicators.org/ise/Docs/NaturalResourcesProposal.pdf

 

[Unkotare]

None of the works give comparative information with other cultures in terms of Hispanic assimilation and acculturation. I suspect that Hispanics assimilate more quickly than the Irish, Germans, or Jews, for instance, and I certainly have seen nothing to contradict that.

If you are insisting on making this about a competition between immigrant groups to assimilate you are alone in that agenda. I just informed you about factors that play a role in the rate and ultimate success of assimilation. If you persist in pushing your change of subject you'll need to prove your claim - which you obviously haven't, and which I'm not particularly interested in anyway since it is rather pointless.





















And yes, it is obvious why you are trying so hard to change the subject...

 

[flacaltenn]

You're quite right to call it back to OP.. But you should know that there's really no defense for political pandering.. You pretty much have to change the subject, or try to redefine it Clinton Style, or make the argument that the "other side does it more"...

What are some nifty political euphemisms for pandering? Maybe "celebrating"? spotlighting? Hmmm.

I went and looked it up -- evidently described in a student site for Dante's work...

•In answer to Dante’s "plain speech," Venedico responds reluctantly. He admits that he pandered his sister Ghisolabella into doing sexual favors for a Marquis. (Just for reference, "panderer" is a euphemism for "pimp." So this is the pouch of pimps.)

PIMPING --- there you go..

 

[JakeStarkey]

I asked Unkotare for material on assmiliation by Hispanics in comparison with other groups. Unkotare supposedly gave it to me, I replied, and then he lied that this is not what he is discussing. Unkotare apparently cannot discuss this OP by giving reputable evidence.

I will keep posting back to this # in refutation until he does come up with material that supports his position. Everything that I have posted is verbatim in full. Nothing is misrepresented. Anyone can read from above and understand clearly.

The fact is that Hispanics assimilate more quickly than other immigrant groups have generally yet retains much of its Latino heritage.

Unkotare: If you are insisting on making this about a competition between immigrant groups to assimilate you are alone in that agenda. I just informed you about factors that play a role in the rate and ultimate success of assimilation. If you persist in pushing your change of subject you'll need to prove your claim - which you obviously haven't, and which I'm not particularly interested in anyway since it is rather pointless. And yes, it is obvious why you are trying so hard to change the subject...

Starkey: But nothing supports that such is a major barrier or an important impetus to assimilation. //// Give us some solid objective evidence.

Unkotare: Many studies support all of the above. I didn't just make it up, champ.

Starkey: Then give us the sources as long as they are not from wikiipedia or made up informational videos. Really, I would like to look at them.

Unkotare: If you're really interested, start by reviewing the work of Gordon way back in 1964, then move on to the research done by Keefe and Padilla around 1987, Yinger in 1981, and Shaull and Gramann in 1998.

Starkey None of the works give comparative information with other cultures in terms of Hispanic assimilation and acculturation. I suspect that Hispanics assimilate more quickly than the Irish, Germans, or Jews, for instance, and I certainly have seen nothing to contradict that. A review of titles of various sources do indicate that Hispanics are assimilating on their own terms, probably because of their vast numbers unlike those of other ethnicities in the past. I doubt nothing will stop this type of assimilation. Any attempt by either party to force Hispanics into molds formed in the past for acculturation and assimilation will merely drive them into the other party. As Hispanics constitute about one of every seven Americans, their cultural subset portends great changes in the American narrative. I suggest that we in the Republican Party reach out to serve their particular needs, and I believe Romney will do exactly that when he becomes president.

===

Starkey: Interesting but does nothing about Hispanic assimilation into American US culture and we are almost fifty years past that. “Milton Gordon(1964) proposed that assimilation can be described as a series of stages through which an individual must pass. These three stages are behavioral assimilation (acculturation), structural assimilation (social assimilation), and marital assimilation of the individuals of the minority society and individuals of the dominant society. Although this proposal has been criticized, it does indicate that there is a continuum through which individuals pass, beginning with acculturation and ending with complete assimilation ( Gordon 1964: 71). Diffusionism and Acculturation - Anthropological Theories - Department of Anthropology - The University of Alabama”

I agree with the concept that acculturation and assimilation may be more difficult than earlier perceived, but this is not a comparative for Hispanic and earlier cultures that assimilated into the mainstream American culture. ”Acculturation, Social Identity, and Social Cognition: A New Perspective, by Amado M. Padilla [and] William Perez Stanford University The authors argue in this article that new approaches are needed in the study of psychological acculturation. They posit that a new model of psychological acculturation should incorporate contemporary work in social and cognitive psychology. The model they present builds on previous research in the areas of social cognition, cultural competence, social identity, and social stigma. Each of these perspectives is discussed in accordance with its relevance to the acculturative processes operating in immigrants. They hypothesize that acculturation is more difficult for those persons who must cope with the stigma of being different because of skin color, language, ethnicity, and so forth. Finally, the authors believe that the theoretical framework present here will lead to more productive insights into the adaptation process of immigrants than has heretofore been the case.” http://www.stanford.edu/~apadilla/PadillaPerez03a.pdf”

Yinger talks about cultural and structural assimilation but makes no assumption comparatively about Hispanic/Latino assimilation with other earlier ethnicity. Race and Ethnic Relations: American and Global Perspectives - Martin N. Marger - Google Books

Starkey: Once again, nothing comparative in assimilation and acculturation, and this work is very, very limited to subject. Shaull and Gramann's writing on "Latino Knowledge and Attitudes toward Natural Resources and the Environment". http://www.ag-communicators.org/ise/...esProposal.pdf

 

[Unkotare]

I asked Unkotare for material on assmiliation by Hispanics in comparison with other groups.

NO, I informed you about factors that may affect the rate and ultimate success of assimilation for any immigrant group. You asked for sources to learn more about something you didn't know much about, so I provided some. You then replied as if arguing against the position that 'Hispanics' assimilate more slowly than other immigrant groups, although no one had actually made that argument. You further began to argue in favor of the notion that 'Hispanics' assimilate more quickly than other immigrant groups, although no one had posed this question and you have failed to provide any proof of it.

If you are having a separate argument with someone in your head you don't need to be online for it. The whole 'comparison' thing is inside your head. I just informed you about factors relating to assimilation in general. That is the reality of the situation. If you want to fabricate things to argue against - AGAIN - leave me out of it.

 

[Unkotare]

The fact is that Hispanics assimilate more quickly than other immigrant groups have .

If you want to change the topic to this claim then it is up to you to support it.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Unkotare, I asked for something specific and you responded.

I wrote earlier ~ Starkey: But nothing supports that such is a major barrier or an important impetus to assimilation. //// Give us some solid objective evidence.

You then gave me the sources, none of which shows Hispanics are having a major barrier to assimilation.

That's fine. I already knew that.

 

[Unkotare]

Unkotare, I asked for something specific and you responded.

I wrote earlier ~ Starkey: But nothing supports that such is a major barrier or an important impetus to assimilation. //// Give us some solid objective evidence.
.

Your own quote contains no reference to comparative rates of assimilation among different immigrant groups. You decided to change the subject right around there. I informed you about some of the factors that affect assimilation, and they do - for everyone to whom those factors apply.

 

[bripat9643]

Everyone bitches about how phoney and dishonest politicians are, but would they behave the way they do if it weren't effective? Just months before the election obama suddenly cares about Latino-Americans? Could this shit be more transparent? Instead of being offended that some BS pol takes them for such fools, people eat it up like they can't get enough.


We get the clowns we deserve.

Obama really got to you all, didn't he.. Good.

The smell of a dead cow also gets to me.

 

[Unkotare]

If you insist on changing the subject:

Study: Some immigrants assimilate faster - USATODAY.com

Civic Report 53 | Measuring Immigrant Assimilation in the United States

http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/cgi/v...ch="latino immigrants assimilate more slowly"

HispanicTrending: Hispanic immigrants seen as slow to assimilate into American society