Palestinians seek statehood, but Gaza is forgotten

[P F Tinmore]

"Abu Mazen's decision to go to the U.N. without consulting with Palestinian factions about the negative and positive impact of such a move and with only partial Arab, Islamic and international support is something very risky," said Hamas spokesman Fawzi Barhoum.

"We are talking about issues related to the fate of the Palestinian people," he said. "Such a move must be studied by experts and decisions should be taken by all the parties concerned, not individually."

Further complicating matters, the last time Palestinians held parliamentary elections, in 2006, Hamas won, and the group claims that it is thus the legitimate representative of the Palestinian people, not the Palestinian Authority. Abbas' government is internationally recognized and bankrolled by foreign aid, but his term has expired and he currently governs by decree, with Israel holding overall security control in the West Bank.

Awny Ouda, a 23-year-old student at Gaza's Islamic University, said he would not be satisfied with a state based on the lines Israel held before the 1967 war and wants one that replaces Israel.

"Abbas wants to give the remains of our lands and rights on a silver tray to the occupation," he said. "Recognizing the Palestinian state on the 1967 borders would deprive us of returning to our lands of 1948."

Palestinians seek statehood, but Gaza is forgotten - Yahoo! News

 

[JStone]

Gaza's deadly guardians - Times Online

 

[P F Tinmore]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGZgKLZE8hk]12 Sleepless Gaza Jerusalem.mpg - YouTube[/ame]

 

[JStone]

Hamas Bans Gaza Students Studying Abroad

Gaza's militant Hamas rulers have banned eight teenage students with scholarships to study in the U.S. from leaving the territory, a Palestinian rights group said Wednesday.



Hamas Bans Gaza Students Studying Abroad - ABC News

 

[P F Tinmore]

The sticky part is that Abbas left the government in June of 2007. His official term in office expired in Jan. 2009. Neither his prime minister nor any of his cabinet have been approved by parliament as required by their constitution.

Abbas has no authority to seek statehood.

What is going to happen if the UN accepts Palestine on the '67 borders and the government and the people say that is not what they want?

 

[JStone]

Hamas violently kick Palestinians out of homes and destroy them in Gaza

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMNnhTjkuAU]Hamas violently kick Palestinians out of homes and destroy them in Gaza - YouTube[/ame]

 

[mudwhistle]

Israeli legal experts traditionally resisted efforts to define the West Bank and Gaza Strip as “occupied” or falling under the main international treaties dealing with military occupation. Former Chief Justice of the Supreme Court Meir Shamgar wrote in the 1970s that there is no de jure applicability of the 1949 Fourth Geneva Convention regarding occupied territories to the case of the West Bank and Gaza Strip since the Convention:

… is based on the assumption that there had been a sovereign who was ousted and that he had been a legitimate sovereign.

In fact, prior to 1967, Jordan had occupied the West Bank and Egypt had occupied the Gaza Strip; their presence in those territories was the result of their illegal invasion in 1948. Jordan’s 1950 annexation of the West Bank was recognized only by Great Britain and Pakistan and rejected by the vast majority of the international community, including the Arab states.

International jurists generally draw a distinction between situations of “aggressive conquest” and territorial disputes that arise after a war of self-defense. Former US State Department Legal Advisor Stephen Schwebel, who later headed the International Court of Justice in the Hague, wrote in 1970 regarding Israel’s case:

Where the prior holder of territory had seized that territory unlawfully, the state which subsequently takes that territory in the lawful exercise of self-defense has, against that prior holder, better title.

Israel only entered the West Bank in 1967 after repeated Jordanian artillery fire and ground movements across the previous armistice lines; additionally, Iraqi forces crossed Jordanian territory and were poised to enter the West Bank. Under such circumstances, even the United Nations rejected Soviet efforts to have Israel branded as the aggressor in the Six-Day War.

Regardless of how many times the Palestinian Arabs claim otherwise, Israel cannot be characterized as a “foreign occupier” with respect to the West Bank and Gaza Strip. Fundamental sources of international legality decide the question in Israel’s favor. The last international legal allocation of territory that includes what is today the West Bank and Gaza Strip occurred with the League of Nations Mandate for Palestine which recognized Jewish national rights in the whole of the Mandated territory, including the sector east of the Jordan River, almost 80% of the original Mandated territory, that was given to Palestinian Arabs and Emir Abdullah to create the country of Trans-Jordan (later renamed Jordan). Moreover, the rights under the Mandate were preserved under the United Nations as well, according to Article 80 of the UN Charter, after the termination of the League of Nations in 1946.

It is important to observe that, from the time these territories were conquered by Jordan, Syria and Egypt in 1948 to the time they were gained by Israel in 1967, the territories were not refered to as “occupied” by the international community. Furthermore, the people living in those territories before 1967 were not called “Palestinians” as they are today; they were called Jordanians and Egyptians. (In fact, before Israel was founded Jews and Arabs alike who lived in the region were called Palestinians. The newspaper was the “Palestine Bulletin” and later the “Palestine Post” before becoming today’s “Jerusalem Post”, the Jewish-founded electric company was “Palestine Electric” and so on.) There was no call for “liberation” or “national rights” for the Arabs living there and no Palestinian nation was discussed.

Occupied Territories? | Palestine Facts

 

[P F Tinmore]

from the time these territories were conquered by Jordan, Syria and Egypt in 1948...

Conquered? None of those countries were at war with Palestine.

 

[JStone]

from the time these territories were conquered by Jordan, Syria and Egypt in 1948...

Conquered? None of those countries were at war with Palestine.

When was Palestine ever a nation? Prior to Israeli statehood in 1948, "Palestine" [just another name for Israel invented by the British] was controlled by the British from 1918 to 1948 under the British Mandate, subsequent to the end of WW I. Earlier, "Palestine" was under Ottoman rule for 400 years and was never identified as Palestine--the land was merely southern Syria and was governed, in fact, by Damascus.

So, when was Palestine a nation?

 

[P F Tinmore]

from the time these territories were conquered by Jordan, Syria and Egypt in 1948...

Conquered? None of those countries were at war with Palestine.

When was Palestine ever a nation? Prior to Israeli statehood in 1948, "Palestine" [just another name for Israel invented by the British] was controlled by the British from 1918 to 1948 under the British Mandate, subsequent to the end of WW I. Earlier, "Palestine" was under Ottoman rule for 400 years and was never identified as Palestine--the land was merely southern Syria and was governed, in fact, by Damascus.

So, when was Palestine a nation?

The League of Nations created the state of Palestine in 1922 when it defined the borders.

 

[JStone]

Conquered? None of those countries were at war with Palestine.

When was Palestine ever a nation? Prior to Israeli statehood in 1948, "Palestine" [just another name for Israel invented by the British] was controlled by the British from 1918 to 1948 under the British Mandate, subsequent to the end of WW I. Earlier, "Palestine" was under Ottoman rule for 400 years and was never identified as Palestine--the land was merely southern Syria and was governed, in fact, by Damascus.

So, when was Palestine a nation?

The League of Nations created the state of Palestine in 1922 when it defined the borders.

The League of Nations created the Jewish National Home and said not one word about Arabs or Palestinians.

So, again, when was Palestine ever a nation?

 

[P F Tinmore]

When was Palestine ever a nation? Prior to Israeli statehood in 1948, "Palestine" [just another name for Israel invented by the British] was controlled by the British from 1918 to 1948 under the British Mandate, subsequent to the end of WW I. Earlier, "Palestine" was under Ottoman rule for 400 years and was never identified as Palestine--the land was merely southern Syria and was governed, in fact, by Damascus.

So, when was Palestine a nation?

The League of Nations created the state of Palestine in 1922 when it defined the borders.

The League of Nations created the Jewish National Home and said not one word about Arabs or Palestinians.

So, again, when was Palestine ever a nation?

It is interesting how the world's criminal class consistently ignored the native Palestinians and created Israel inside the borders defined for Palestine in 1922.

 

[JStone]

The League of Nations created the state of Palestine in 1922 when it defined the borders.

The League of Nations created the Jewish National Home and said not one word about Arabs or Palestinians.

So, again, when was Palestine ever a nation?

It is interesting how the world's criminal class consistently ignored the native Palestinians and created Israel inside the borders defined for Palestine in 1922.

The League of Nations established the "Jewish National Home" and "Jew", "Jewish" and "Jewish National Home" are referenced 15 times in the League of Nations' document establishing the Jewish National Home.

Not one word referencing Arabs, Palestinians or Muslims.

Now, you know. There has never been a Palestine nation in history

 

[P F Tinmore]

The League of Nations created the Jewish National Home and said not one word about Arabs or Palestinians.

So, again, when was Palestine ever a nation?

It is interesting how the world's criminal class consistently ignored the native Palestinians and created Israel inside the borders defined for Palestine in 1922.

The League of Nations established the "Jewish National Home" and "Jew", "Jewish" and "Jewish National Home" are referenced 15 times in the League of Nations' document establishing the Jewish National Home.

Not one word referencing Arabs, Palestinians or Muslims.

Now, you know. There has never been a Palestine nation in history

His Majesty's Government are charged as the Mandatory authority "to secure the development of self governing institutions" in Palestine. Apart from this specific obligation, they would regard it as contrary to the whole spirit of the Mandate system that the population of Palestine should remain forever under Mandatory tutelage. It is proper that the people of the country should as early as possible enjoy the rights of self-government which are exercised by the people of neighbouring countries. His Majesty's Government are unable at present to foresee the exact constitutional forms which government in Palestine will eventually take, but their objective is self government, and they desire to see established ultimately an independent Palestine State. It should be a State in which the two peoples in Palestine, Arabs and Jews, share authority in government in such a way that the essential interests of each are shared.

The Avalon Project : British White Paper of 1939

 

[JStone]

It is interesting how the world's criminal class consistently ignored the native Palestinians and created Israel inside the borders defined for Palestine in 1922.

The League of Nations established the "Jewish National Home" and "Jew", "Jewish" and "Jewish National Home" are referenced 15 times in the League of Nations' document establishing the Jewish National Home.

Not one word referencing Arabs, Palestinians or Muslims.

Now, you know. There has never been a Palestine nation in history

His Majesty's Government are charged as the Mandatory authority "to secure the development of self governing institutions" in Palestine. Apart from this specific obligation, they would regard it as contrary to the whole spirit of the Mandate system that the population of Palestine should remain forever under Mandatory tutelage. It is proper that the people of the country should as early as possible enjoy the rights of self-government which are exercised by the people of neighbouring countries. His Majesty's Government are unable at present to foresee the exact constitutional forms which government in Palestine will eventually take, but their objective is self government, and they desire to see established ultimately an independent Palestine State. It should be a State in which the two peoples in Palestine, Arabs and Jews, share authority in government in such a way that the essential interests of each are shared.

The Avalon Project : British White Paper of 1939

You conveniently left a few items out.

Creation of Jewish National Home

Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country

Political conditions for Jewish national home and self-governing institutions

The Mandatory shall be responsible for placing the country under such political, administrative and economic conditions as will secure the establishment of the Jewish national home, as laid down in the preamble, and the development of self-governing institutions, and also for safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine, irrespective of race and religion.

The League of Nations created a Jewish National Home, not a Palestine nation.

In fact, every key figure involved is on record as stating the objective of the League of Nations was the eventuation of the Jewish National Home into a Jewish state, from President Woodrow Wilson, who founded the League of Nations, to British PM David Lloyd George to Winston Churchill, Secretary of Palestine.

 

[P F Tinmore]

The League of Nations established the "Jewish National Home" and "Jew", "Jewish" and "Jewish National Home" are referenced 15 times in the League of Nations' document establishing the Jewish National Home.

Not one word referencing Arabs, Palestinians or Muslims.

Now, you know. There has never been a Palestine nation in history

His Majesty's Government are charged as the Mandatory authority "to secure the development of self governing institutions" in Palestine. Apart from this specific obligation, they would regard it as contrary to the whole spirit of the Mandate system that the population of Palestine should remain forever under Mandatory tutelage. It is proper that the people of the country should as early as possible enjoy the rights of self-government which are exercised by the people of neighbouring countries. His Majesty's Government are unable at present to foresee the exact constitutional forms which government in Palestine will eventually take, but their objective is self government, and they desire to see established ultimately an independent Palestine State. It should be a State in which the two peoples in Palestine, Arabs and Jews, share authority in government in such a way that the essential interests of each are shared.

The Avalon Project : British White Paper of 1939

You conveniently left a few items out.

Creation of Jewish National Home

Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country

Political conditions for Jewish national home and self-governing institutions

The Mandatory shall be responsible for placing the country under such political, administrative and economic conditions as will secure the establishment of the Jewish national home, as laid down in the preamble, and the development of self-governing institutions, and also for safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine, irrespective of race and religion.

The League of Nations created a Jewish National Home, not a Palestine nation.

In fact, every key figure involved is on record as stating the objective of the League of Nations was the eventuation of the Jewish National Home into a Jewish state, from President Woodrow Wilson, who founded the League of Nations, to British PM David Lloyd George to Winston Churchill, Secretary of Palestine.

But this statement has not removed doubts, and His Majesty's Government therefore now declare unequivocally that it is not part of their policy that Palestine should become a Jewish State. They would indeed regard it as contrary to their obligations to the Arabs under the Mandate, as well as to the assurances which have been given to the Arab people in the past, that the Arab population of Palestine should be made the subjects of a Jewish State against their will.

 

[JStone]

His Majesty's Government are charged as the Mandatory authority "to secure the development of self governing institutions" in Palestine. Apart from this specific obligation, they would regard it as contrary to the whole spirit of the Mandate system that the population of Palestine should remain forever under Mandatory tutelage. It is proper that the people of the country should as early as possible enjoy the rights of self-government which are exercised by the people of neighbouring countries. His Majesty's Government are unable at present to foresee the exact constitutional forms which government in Palestine will eventually take, but their objective is self government, and they desire to see established ultimately an independent Palestine State. It should be a State in which the two peoples in Palestine, Arabs and Jews, share authority in government in such a way that the essential interests of each are shared.

The Avalon Project : British White Paper of 1939

You conveniently left a few items out.

Creation of Jewish National Home


Political conditions for Jewish national home and self-governing institutions

The Mandatory shall be responsible for placing the country under such political, administrative and economic conditions as will secure the establishment of the Jewish national home, as laid down in the preamble, and the development of self-governing institutions, and also for safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine, irrespective of race and religion.

The League of Nations created a Jewish National Home, not a Palestine nation.

In fact, every key figure involved is on record as stating the objective of the League of Nations was the eventuation of the Jewish National Home into a Jewish state, from President Woodrow Wilson, who founded the League of Nations, to British PM David Lloyd George to Winston Churchill, Secretary of Palestine.

But this statement has not removed doubts, and His Majesty's Government therefore now declare unequivocally that it is not part of their policy that Palestine should become a Jewish State. They would indeed regard it as contrary to their obligations to the Arabs under the Mandate, as well as to the assurances which have been given to the Arab people in the past, that the Arab population of Palestine should be made the subjects of a Jewish State against their will.

Incorrect.

The League of Nations called for the establishment of political and governmental institutions to create a Jewish National Home. Not one word about a Palestine nation

The Mandatory shall be responsible for placing the country under such political, administrative and economic conditions as will secure the establishment of the Jewish national home, as laid down in the preamble, and the development of self-governing institutions, and also for safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine, irrespective of race and religion.

The League of Nations wrote nothing about a Palestine nation nor are Palestinians mentioned.

Jews are mentioned 15 times in the establishment of the Jewish National Home.

You lost the debate.

 

[P F Tinmore]

You conveniently left a few items out.

Creation of Jewish National Home


Political conditions for Jewish national home and self-governing institutions


The League of Nations created a Jewish National Home, not a Palestine nation.

In fact, every key figure involved is on record as stating the objective of the League of Nations was the eventuation of the Jewish National Home into a Jewish state, from President Woodrow Wilson, who founded the League of Nations, to British PM David Lloyd George to Winston Churchill, Secretary of Palestine.

But this statement has not removed doubts, and His Majesty's Government therefore now declare unequivocally that it is not part of their policy that Palestine should become a Jewish State. They would indeed regard it as contrary to their obligations to the Arabs under the Mandate, as well as to the assurances which have been given to the Arab people in the past, that the Arab population of Palestine should be made the subjects of a Jewish State against their will.

Incorrect.

The League of Nations called for the establishment of political and governmental institutions to create a Jewish National Home. Not one word about a Palestine nation

The Mandatory shall be responsible for placing the country under such political, administrative and economic conditions as will secure the establishment of the Jewish national home, as laid down in the preamble, and the development of self-governing institutions, and also for safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine, irrespective of race and religion.

The League of Nations wrote nothing about a Palestine nation nor are Palestinians mentioned.

Jews are mentioned 15 times in the establishment of the Jewish National Home.

You lost the debate.

They were charged with creating a state.

safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine

The inhabitants of Palestine. Hmmm, that would be the Palestinians.

 

[JStone]

It is interesting how the world's criminal class consistently ignored the native Palestinians and created Israel inside the borders defined for Palestine in 1922.

The League of Nations established the "Jewish National Home" and "Jew", "Jewish" and "Jewish National Home" are referenced 15 times in the League of Nations' document establishing the Jewish National Home.

Not one word referencing Arabs, Palestinians or Muslims.

Now, you know. There has never been a Palestine nation in history

His Majesty's Government are charged as the Mandatory authority "to secure the development of self governing institutions" in Palestine. Apart from this specific obligation, they would regard it as contrary to the whole spirit of the Mandate system that the population of Palestine should remain forever under Mandatory tutelage. It is proper that the people of the country should as early as possible enjoy the rights of self-government which are exercised by the people of neighbouring countries. His Majesty's Government are unable at present to foresee the exact constitutional forms which government in Palestine will eventually take, but their objective is self government, and they desire to see established ultimately an independent Palestine State. It should be a State in which the two peoples in Palestine, Arabs and Jews, share authority in government in such a way that the essential interests of each are shared.

The Avalon Project : British White Paper of 1939

The link you posted is irrelevant as it is to the British White Paper, which was NOT issued by the League of Nations and, in fact, was non-binding.

The British were merely trustees of the League of Nations' Mandate for the establishment of a Jewish National Home and were not empowered to alter the League of Nations trust for the creation of the Jewiosh National Home.

You lost the debate.

 

[JStone]

But this statement has not removed doubts, and His Majesty's Government therefore now declare unequivocally that it is not part of their policy that Palestine should become a Jewish State. They would indeed regard it as contrary to their obligations to the Arabs under the Mandate, as well as to the assurances which have been given to the Arab people in the past, that the Arab population of Palestine should be made the subjects of a Jewish State against their will.

Incorrect.

The League of Nations called for the establishment of political and governmental institutions to create a Jewish National Home. Not one word about a Palestine nation



The League of Nations wrote nothing about a Palestine nation nor are Palestinians mentioned.

Jews are mentioned 15 times in the establishment of the Jewish National Home.

You lost the debate.

They were charged with creating a state.

safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine

The inhabitants of Palestine. Hmmm, that would be the Palestinians.

the British were charged with creating a Jewish National Home, not a Palestine nation.

There is nothing in the League of Nations' Mandate about a Palestine nation.

The Mandatory shall be responsible for placing the country under such political, administrative and economic conditions as will secure the establishment of the Jewish national home, as laid down in the preamble, and the development of self-governing institutions, and also for safeguarding the civil and religious rights of all the inhabitants of Palestine, irrespective of race and religion.

You lost the debate.