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1) The PA is honoring someone, by naming a public square after them, who mass murdered 37 civilians on a public bus, including one american
Yes. So?
2) The Irgun attacks a military target from the Brits who were vicious occupiers. These scumbags put holocaust survivors in detention camps, that were worse than the German POW comps.
You've gone off the deep end sweetcheeks....care to support that statement?
I guess it's ok that Irgun (comprised of some of those holocaust survivors) killed bunches of innocent civilians in market place bombings and bus bombings and...oh wait....that's just like what the Palestinians have done...
Also the Brits are a naked show of imperalism. They were indeed occupiers. With the jews it was their land. With the british it wasn't. Their homeland was thousands of miles away.
The point is that Israel should not give on ince to the PA, whose only goal is the complete destruction of Israel, and the fact that they honor a mass murderer shows this.
Read slowly maybe you will get it, maybe not.
Nah...the only point is the one on your head
1) The PA is honoring someone, by naming a public square after them, who mass murdered 37 civilians on a public bus, including one american
Yes. So?
So...the PA is obviously not interested in peace. There goal is the complete destruction of Israel. The fact, that they name a public square after a person who mass murdered everyone on a public bus, shows the type of people that they are.
You've gone off the deep end sweetcheeks....care to support that statement?
Well, sugar tushy, I already posted, this, but i'll make it a little bigger. Maybe you won't miss it this time.
Cyprus internment camps - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Cyprus internment camps were operated by the British for internment of Jewish immigrants who attempted to immigrate to the Mandatory Palestine during the 1940s in violation of immigration quotas set for Jews. In spite of repeated requests to lift restrictions to save lives otherwise lost in the the Holocaust, and later the plight of thousands of displaced Holocaust survivors, the British still enforced the quotas set in the White Paper of 1939. Jews escaping Europe in the Beriha and attempting Aliyah Bet were detained at sea or after landing, and held indefinitely and without trial in prison camps on nearby British-controlled Cyprus.
Where transport ships were intercepted on the high seas by the British Royal Navy, those ships that did not sink (many were old and not seaworthy vessels) were escorted to Cyprus where internment camps were constructed for up to 30,000 detainees. They consisted almost entirely of Holocaust survivors. Funds for maintenance of the camps were taken from taxes collected from the Jewish population of Palestine.
The first camps were constructed by German prisoners of war (POWs). Conditions for POW's were determined by the Third Geneva Convention; there was no equivalent convention for imprisoned civilians so the German POWs were generally treated far better than the Jews.[1] Use of POWs for construction purposes was eventually halted as it interfered with British de-Nazification programmes.[citation needed] Jewish inmates did not take the German presence very well either. [2][3]
Because of pressure from the United States and in response to the recommendations of the Anglo-American Committee of Inquiry, Britain agreed to allow 1,000 Jews a month into Palestine. To reduce pressure in Cyprus (there was fear of a Communist led Cypriot uprising[4]), half that quota, 500 Jews a month, were allowed in from Cyprus. That meant that most Cyprus internees expected to spend a couple of years there before being allowed into Palestine.
In August 1947 the New York Times reported that 16,000 were being held in the camps and that 4,000 were children.[5]
In November 1947 the United Nations voted to recommend the UNSCOP plan in Palestine, which called for the establishment of a Jewish state, including a harbor into which Jews could immigrate. Britain refused to implement this point before the mandate ended, leading to accusations that the British government was in contravention of the United Nations decision. The Soviet Union responded to the British failure by allowing Jewish illegal migration to depart from Romania.
Despite donations from Jewish charities in the United States and contributions from the Jewish Agency in Palestine, conditions in the camps were hard. The camps lacked proper supplies of running water, soap, clothes, sheets and there were complaints regarding inadequate food supplies. Most of the inmates were deeply traumatized Holocaust survivors including large numbers of orphan children.
Camp inmates did not face the kind of viciousness or deprivation associated with Nazi concentration camps. The American Jewish Joint Distribution Committee was allowed to supplement the diet and provide support to camp inmates. Volunteers from Palestine were allowed to live in the camps and these included educators, nurses and doctors. The volunteers were unpaid and shared the inmates living conditions, except that they could take occasional holidays while the inmates could not leave.
Over time 50,000 people were imprisoned in the camps and several thousand children were born there. At its peak the camps held almost 10% of the population of Cyprus. Even after the establishment of the state of Israel the British government continued to hold 8,000 Jewish men of "military age" and 3,000 of their wives in order to prevent them joining the 1948 Arab-Israeli war. During this period inmates were held under conditions of indefinite detention with no known release date. They were eventually released in February 1949, following the British government's decision to recognize the state of Israel
I guess it's ok that Irgun (comprised of some of those holocaust survivors) killed bunches of innocent civilians in market place bombings and bus bombings and...oh wait....that's just like what the Palestinians have done...
The Irgun only attacked military targets.
Your little factoids always seem to miss some crucial information. Like when you mentioned that they bombed the hotel, but you forgot to mention that it was the british military HQ.
Also, you also seem to forget to mention why the jews bombed the hotel.
You should really see a doc about your forgetfulness.
You're just full of excuses aren't you? Are you ever going to be able to dig yourself out of this hole?
The point is that Israel should not give on ince to the PA, whose only goal is the complete destruction of Israel, and the fact that they honor a mass murderer shows this.
Read slowly maybe you will get it, maybe not.
Nah...the only point is the one on your head
Once again, Israel would be nuts to keep away the precious land it has to terrorists, whose goal is the destruction of Israel, and they want to continue to target civilians and kill as many as possible.
Hello?? The intelligence branch is part of the military too.
Motivation for the bombing
Irgun committed the attack in response to Operation Agatha, known within Israel then and now as "Black Saturday".[6] British troops had searched the Jewish Agency on June 29 and confiscated large quantities of documents about the group's operations and links with violent groups. The intelligence information was taken to the King David Hotel building in Jerusalem.[7]
The building contained the British military command and their Criminal Investigation Division.[7] Security analyst Bruce Hoffman has written that the "Hotel housed the nerve centre of British rule in Palestine".[8] Specifically, the Irgun aimed at destroying the southern wing of the hotel, which housed the Mandate's intelligence records about Irgun, the Hagana, Lehi, and other Jewish paramilitary groups.[6]
The arabs that were killed in Irgun attacks were ones holding guns and trying to kill jews.
3 Arabs were killed by a bomb detonated in a bus in Jerusalem.
Unspecified number of Arabs killed by a bomb that was thrown into a crowded Arab market place in Jerusalem.
43 Arabs were killed by a bomb at a marketplace in Haifa
5 Arabs were killed by a mine detonated at the Rex cinema in Jerusalem.
18 Arabs and 5 Jews were killed by two simultaneous bombs in the Arab melon market in Haifa.
Ya...sure, they were all holding guns....
Try to follow. It requires logic.
...waiting for logic.....
waiting
waiting
waiting
process cancelled due to insufficient data.
If only he had done it by dropping a bomb from an airplane, he'd be an American hero.
Good point.
BTW, this "terrorist" was a 19 y.o. girl defending her country.
Dalal Mughrabi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
How does mass mudering 37 unarmed civlians on a pubic bus defend a country?
The point is that the PA publically honors mass muderers.
And people expect Israel to give away the precious land it has for vague promises of peace from mass murderers, who publically acknowledge, and even name a public square, in honor of a scumbag who murders 37 civilians on a public bus.
So does Israel: Israel celebrates Irgun hotel bombers - Telegraph
A bit hypocritical to get all upset about it.
Good point.
BTW, this "terrorist" was a 19 y.o. girl defending her country.
Dalal Mughrabi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
How does mass mudering 37 unarmed civlians on a pubic bus defend a country?
How does mass murdering a thousand civilians in Gaza defend a country?
The point is that the PA publically honors mass muderers.
And people expect Israel to give away the precious land it has for vague promises of peace from mass murderers, who publically acknowledge, and even name a public square, in honor of a scumbag who murders 37 civilians on a public bus.
So does Israel: Israel celebrates Irgun hotel bombers - Telegraph
A bit hypocritical to get all upset about it.
Not even close. The bombing of the King David Hotel was a strike against the British colonial government in Palestine and was a part of an ongoing campaign to drive the British out after Britain's 1939 announcement that it would not allow the establishment of Jewish homeland in Palestine, reneging on its own 1917 pledge to help the Jews to establish a homeland there and in violation of its obligations under the League of Nations Mandate for Palestine. This decision by the British was in response to the Arab uprising of the late 1930's. While some civilians died in the attack, it was the colonial government that was targeted in a reasonable expectation that this strike would materially advance the cause of Jewish nationalism.
By contrast, Dalal Mughrabi did not target the Israeli government, military or civilian, but random Jews she and her gang happened to come across, and there could not have been a reasonable expectation that these 37 random killings could have advanced the cause of Arab nationalism. The people she killed were not killed because of what they had done but because of who they were: Jews. Calling these killings acts of terrorism ascribes to them a sense of purpose no reasonable person could expect them to achieve: they were hate crimes, nothing more.
To try to justify, or even to explain them, by saying Mughrabi killed 37 random Jews because of feelings of anger or pain over the perceived injustices to Arabs is the moral equivalent of trying to justify or explain acts of violence against random gays because of fears gays may be seducing or molesting children or acts of violence against random African Americans because of a belief they are raping white women. All of these are hate crimes and none of them were committed in a reasonable expectation of advancing a cause. The moral and political equivalent of dedicating a square in Ramallah to Mughrabi on the anniversary of her killing of 37 random Jews would not be the bombing of the King David Hotel but if the Israeli government named a square in Jerusalem after Baruch Goldstein and dedicated it on the anniversary of his massacre of 29 Arabs at the Cave of the Patriarchs.
This action by the Abbas government amounts to an official and public embrace of hate crimes against Jews and makes the notion that the Palestinians are prepared to live in peace next to Israel bizarre and the idea that there can be a peaceful single state solution even more bizarre. If this action stands, it will be impossible to take the Abbas government seriously when it talks about peace, and the fact that the Obama administration chose to ignore Israeli requests to urge Abbas to cancel this incitement to hatred of and violence against Jews makes it equally impossible to take the Obama administration seriously when it talks about peace.
so does israel: israel celebrates irgun hotel bombers - telegraph
a bit hypocritical to get all upset about it.
not even close. The bombing of the king david hotel was a strike against the british colonial government in palestine and was a part of an ongoing campaign to drive the british out after britain's 1939 announcement that it would not allow the establishment of jewish homeland in palestine, reneging on its own 1917 pledge to help the jews to establish a homeland there and in violation of its obligations under the league of nations mandate for palestine. This decision by the british was in response to the arab uprising of the late 1930's. While some civilians died in the attack, it was the colonial government that was targeted in a reasonable expectation that this strike would materially advance the cause of jewish nationalism.
By contrast, dalal mughrabi did not target the israeli government, military or civilian, but random jews she and her gang happened to come across, and there could not have been a reasonable expectation that these 37 random killings could have advanced the cause of arab nationalism. The people she killed were not killed because of what they had done but because of who they were: Jews. Calling these killings acts of terrorism ascribes to them a sense of purpose no reasonable person could expect them to achieve: They were hate crimes, nothing more.
To try to justify, or even to explain them, by saying mughrabi killed 37 random jews because of feelings of anger or pain over the perceived injustices to arabs is the moral equivalent of trying to justify or explain acts of violence against random gays because of fears gays may be seducing or molesting children or acts of violence against random african americans because of a belief they are raping white women. All of these are hate crimes and none of them were committed in a reasonable expectation of advancing a cause. The moral and political equivalent of dedicating a square in ramallah to mughrabi on the anniversary of her killing of 37 random jews would not be the bombing of the king david hotel but if the israeli government named a square in jerusalem after baruch goldstein and dedicated it on the anniversary of his massacre of 29 arabs at the cave of the patriarchs.
This action by the abbas government amounts to an official and public embrace of hate crimes against jews and makes the notion that the palestinians are prepared to live in peace next to israel bizarre and the idea that there can be a peaceful single state solution even more bizarre. If this action stands, it will be impossible to take the abbas government seriously when it talks about peace, and the fact that the obama administration chose to ignore israeli requests to urge abbas to cancel this incitement to hatred of and violence against jews makes it equally impossible to take the obama administration seriously when it talks about peace.
How does mass mudering 37 unarmed civlians on a pubic bus defend a country?
How does mass murdering a thousand civilians in Gaza defend a country?
I don't know. Who did it?
Not really, the hotel was the military British headquarters. It was a military target. They were also given 3 warnings.
There is considerable evidence that the warnings were not given appropriately (to people who could act on it) nor with enough time to act. As for it being a "military target" - a considerable number of innocent civilians were killed.
Apparently, you think that is ok and something to be publically honored.
I just love how you guys try to excuse terrorism.
CMike also has said that our Men on The USS Liberty got what they deserved. Go on and Ask him? He's has no allegiance to The United States of America whatsoever unless it serves the interests of Israel. ~BH
By contrast, Dalal Mughrabi did not target the Israeli government, military or civilian, but random Jews she and her gang happened to come across,
By contrast, Dalal Mughrabi did not target the Israeli government, military or civilian, but random Jews she and her gang happened to come across,
In 1978, Mughrabi, whose remains were returned to Lebanon on Wednesday, led a team of 13 Palestinian and Lebanese fighters who landed at Jaffa beach intent on attacking the ministry of defense in Tel Aviv.
Along a coastal highway, Mughrabi's team hijacked two buses filled with Israeli soldiers.
Israel-Hezbollah prisoner swap - SFGate
Palestinian death squad lands in Israel with a savage message
Their orders were to kill until they themselves were killed. And thus last week a Palestinian suicide mission left a grisly trail of carnage along Israel's main coastal highway from Haifa to Tel Aviv. Slipping ashore from the Mediterranean on the afternoon of the Sabbath, the terrorists hijacked two buses filled with tourists and sightseers, took them on a wild ride down the road toward Tel Aviv, shooting along the way at everyone in sight, and finally destroyed one bus in an orgy of fire and death. Official statistics put the dead at 37 (all but a few of them civilians, among them at least 10 children) and 76 wounded—a toll that exceeded the 1972 Munich massacre (11 dead) and the slaughter at a Ma'alot school in 1974 (26). It was the worst terrorist attack in Israel's history.
The commandos were carefully chosen and highly trained for their suicidal mission. The plan called for them to seize a bus and use it as a shooting platform to aim at anybody, civilian or military, who happened to come along the highway. Their only purpose was to kill as many Israelis as possible. If they could carry it off, they were to take the bus into the very center of Tel Aviv and continue the carnage until they were wiped out.
The death squad, consisting of 11 terrorists, two of them women, is believed to have been launched from a ship offshore, from which they put out in two Zodiak commando boats, loaded down with Kalashnikov rifles, RPG light montars and high explosives. In late afternoon they beached near a kibbutz called Ma'agan Mikha'el, then walked less than a mile up to the four-lane highway. After opening fire at passing traffic, they hijacked a white Mercedes taxi, killing its occupants. Setting off down the highway toward Tel Aviv, they met a bus on its way to Haifa. They fired at the bus, wounding its driver and some passengers and forcing it to a stop. One of the passengers on the bus was Avraham Shamir, 42, who was returning to his home in Haifa from a visit to the stalactite caves near Jerusalem. After first ordering everyone off the bus, said Shamir, the terrorists "ordered us all back on, turned the bus around by crossing the traffic island dividing the highway, and headed southward, yelling 'To Tel Aviv, to Tel Aviv!' "
The pattern of random terror continued for nearly 30 miles. Witnesses said the gunmen fired machine guns and threw grenades at passing cars from the hijacked bus. Some passengers inside the bus were fired on, and at least one body was dumped along the way. An American youth who was driving from Tel Aviv to Haifa with his family reported seeing "a car standing on the other side of the highway and a body lying near by. Moments later," he said, "I saw a bus zigzagging toward our side of the highway. When we came close it stopped. Somebody came down from the front door of the bus with a submachine gun and shot at us. All the windows were smashed and the glass fell on us. My father shouted, 'Look at my arm!' I pushed him aside and took the wheel. He had a huge hole in his chest. My brother, who had been sleeping in the back seat, was in terrible condition. When we reached the hospital, I asked the doctor if my father and brother had a chance. He said, 'Sorry, son. Both are dead.' "
Farther down the highway, the commandeered bus met another bus, also heading toward Haifa. The terrorists stopped this bus too, and forced its passengers to crowd onto the first one. The hostages now numbered 71, and the police were on the trail. The bus approached one hastily erected checkpoint and careened right through it. Then, just outside Tel Aviv, police set up a roadblock, seeded the highway with nails, and positioned themselves alongside. There the wild trail of terror finally came to an end. By that time, reported TIME Correspondent David Halevy, who was the only reporter on the scene, "the highway looked like a slaughterhouse. It was worse than anything I saw at the school shot up by terrorists in Ma'alot."
TIME's Halevy managed to get past the Israeli guards and observe the shooting and explosions at first hand. Reports he: "I finally got close enough to the bus to see at least five bodies burning inside. The rear windows were blasted out and the barrel of a machine-gun was poking out. A child aged seven or eight was lying on the asphalt, a bullet hole in its head. Three women in a nearby ditch screamed for help. I helped them limp to waiting ambulances. A young couple emerged from the ditch screaming, 'We had two children in the bus.' The woman was hysterical. 'Where are my children, my children?' she cried. The husband was steely calm. 'If my children are dead,' he said with eerie softness, 'I'll kill all the Arabs in the world.' "
MIDDLE EAST: A Sabbath of Terror
Monday, Mar. 20, 1978
MIDDLE EAST: A Sabbath of Terror
Monday, Mar. 20, 1978
An article written a little over a week after the events took place?
Right, I'm sure that nobody has been able to gain more insight into the incident in the 30 years between then and now.
Well, sugar tushy, I already posted, this, but i'll make it a little bigger. Maybe you won't miss it this time.
From your source:
Camp inmates did not face the kind of viciousness or deprivation associated with Nazi concentration camps. The American Jewish Joint Distribution Committee was allowed to supplement the diet and provide support to camp inmates. Volunteers from Palestine were allowed to live in the camps and these included educators, nurses and doctors. The volunteers were unpaid and shared the inmates living conditions, except that they could take occasional holidays while the inmates could not leave.
Yet another pathetic attempt at inappropriate Nazi comparisons.
The Irgun only attacked military targets.
Your little factoids always seem to miss some crucial information. Like when you mentioned that they bombed the hotel, but you forgot to mention that it was the british military HQ.
Perhaps you can explain how a busfull of civilains or a croweded market place constituted a military target?
Also, you also seem to forget to mention why the jews bombed the hotel.
You should really see a doc about your forgetfulness.
You should get a refund on your education. Go back and re-read my posts.
Once again, Israel would be nuts to keep away the precious land it has to terrorists, whose goal is the destruction of Israel, and they want to continue to target civilians and kill as many as possible.
Once again, you are deflecting and obfuscating in your attempt to justify terrorism.
Hello?? The intelligence branch is part of the military too.
Motivation for the bombing
Irgun committed the attack in response to Operation Agatha, known within Israel then and now as "Black Saturday".[6] British troops had searched the Jewish Agency on June 29 and confiscated large quantities of documents about the group's operations and links with violent groups. The intelligence information was taken to the King David Hotel building in Jerusalem.[7]
The building contained the British military command and their Criminal Investigation Division.[7] Security analyst Bruce Hoffman has written that the "Hotel housed the nerve centre of British rule in Palestine".[8] Specifically, the Irgun aimed at destroying the southern wing of the hotel, which housed the Mandate's intelligence records about Irgun, the Hagana, Lehi, and other Jewish paramilitary groups.[6]
3 Arabs were killed by a bomb detonated in a bus in Jerusalem.
Unspecified number of Arabs killed by a bomb that was thrown into a crowded Arab market place in Jerusalem.
43 Arabs were killed by a bomb at a marketplace in Haifa
5 Arabs were killed by a mine detonated at the Rex cinema in Jerusalem.
18 Arabs and 5 Jews were killed by two simultaneous bombs in the Arab melon market in Haifa.
Ya...sure, they were all holding guns....
Try to follow. It requires logic.
...waiting for logic.....
waiting
waiting
waiting
process cancelled due to insufficient data.
And those arabs were not civilians.
You got logic, you don't seem to be able to comprehend it.
The point is that the PA publically honors mass muderers.
And people expect Israel to give away the precious land it has for vague promises of peace from mass murderers, who publically acknowledge, and even name a public square, in honor of a scumbag who murders 37 civilians on a public bus.
So does Israel: Israel celebrates Irgun hotel bombers - Telegraph
A bit hypocritical to get all upset about it.
Not even close. The bombing of the King David Hotel was a strike against the British colonial government in Palestine and was a part of an ongoing campaign to drive the British out after Britain's 1939 announcement that it would not allow the establishment of Jewish homeland in Palestine, reneging on its own 1917 pledge to help the Jews to establish a homeland there and in violation of its obligations under the League of Nations Mandate for Palestine. This decision by the British was in response to the Arab uprising of the late 1930's. While some civilians died in the attack, it was the colonial government that was targeted in a reasonable expectation that this strike would materially advance the cause of Jewish nationalism.
By contrast, Dalal Mughrabi did not target the Israeli government, military or civilian, but random Jews she and her gang happened to come across, and there could not have been a reasonable expectation that these 37 random killings could have advanced the cause of Arab nationalism. The people she killed were not killed because of what they had done but because of who they were: Jews. Calling these killings acts of terrorism ascribes to them a sense of purpose no reasonable person could expect them to achieve: they were hate crimes, nothing more.
To try to justify, or even to explain them, by saying Mughrabi killed 37 random Jews because of feelings of anger or pain over the perceived injustices to Arabs is the moral equivalent of trying to justify or explain acts of violence against random gays because of fears gays may be seducing or molesting children or acts of violence against random African Americans because of a belief they are raping white women. All of these are hate crimes and none of them were committed in a reasonable expectation of advancing a cause. The moral and political equivalent of dedicating a square in Ramallah to Mughrabi on the anniversary of her killing of 37 random Jews would not be the bombing of the King David Hotel but if the Israeli government named a square in Jerusalem after Baruch Goldstein and dedicated it on the anniversary of his massacre of 29 Arabs at the Cave of the Patriarchs.
This action by the Abbas government amounts to an official and public embrace of hate crimes against Jews and makes the notion that the Palestinians are prepared to live in peace next to Israel bizarre and the idea that there can be a peaceful single state solution even more bizarre. If this action stands, it will be impossible to take the Abbas government seriously when it talks about peace, and the fact that the Obama administration chose to ignore Israeli requests to urge Abbas to cancel this incitement to hatred of and violence against Jews makes it equally impossible to take the Obama administration seriously when it talks about peace.
