Our way or No way!!!!! Setting up new Iraqi government

[AtlantaWalter]

"...the United States and its allies are preparing to hand over sovereignty to the Iraqis by July 1, despite disagreements over the best way to choose a new government.


On Monday, U.S. administrator L. Paul Bremer said he would move to block any effort by Iraqi leaders to put Islamic law as the foundation of legislation in the interim constitution, which is supposed to take effect at the end of February.

However, Mohsen Abdel-Hamid, the current president of the Iraqi Governing Council and a Sunni Muslim hard-liner, has proposed making Islamic law the "principal basis" of legislation, which many Iraqi women's groups fear will threaten their legal rights.


"Our position is clear," Bremer said when asked what he would do if the Iraqis wrote Islamic law as the principal basis of the legal code. "It can't be law until I sign it."

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=540&e=2&u=/ap/20040217/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

This creates quite a conundrum!!! We "saved" them from a dictatorship that had been abusing them for years and now we tell them they need to set up a new government. The catch is it has to meet our approval and, as part of the deal, we want women to have equal rights, something that goes against their religious beliefs.

So, do they alter their religious beliefs or tell the U.S. to get the hell out of their country and allow them to set up a government as they see fit? I cannot see the U.S. just leaving without being certain that the new government meets our approval but neither can I see the Iraqis giving women equal rights?

Any suggestions??????? Can you force a democratic form of government on a peoples who have never known such a system? Is it a democracy if it is forced upon them?

 

[Sabir]

I think the US will get its way more or less but the constitution will be changed by the Iraqi gov when the US does leave.

Iraqi population is a long long way from being secular in selecting its government, I thing the religious leaders will eventually have enough influence to change any constitution more to their liking or they will keep the moderates from running the government effectively by using blocking tactics and mass protests.

 

[DKSuddeth]

In this instance I have to wholeheartedly agree with Bremer. the US didn't remove hussein so a bunch of over-religious fools could set back womens rights 100 years. Isnt that one of the reasons we never recognized the taliban as an official government?

 

[Scourge]

DK, I usually agree with you, but it isn't our right to impose our views on another country. We should definitely allow them to elect their own leaders, and if they elect an Islamic leader, then they've made their choice. As long as men AND women can vote and there is atleast a few choices, their decision should be their decision. I think we should just ensure a fair election where all votes count (Ha! imagine us doing that!) and leave them to their own governance. And if they hate us and refuse to do business with us then too bad for us. if they like us and play ball , great. But we need to see Iraq as a soveriegn nation at some point.

 

[OCA]

I'm all for getting out and letting them waste themselves or get some leader crazier than Hussein back in power but not before backing up a fleet of tankers in there and pumping a few billion barrels of oil as a parting gift hehehe lol

 

[Scourge]

For sure!!! that's why we invaded in the first place!!! LOL!!!
We should make a pile of the thousands of Iraqis we liberated off this mortal coil too, be a great photo op for Mr. pres!
'Welcome to freedom, American style. Ashes to ashes, dust to dust.'

 

[OCA]

You know that was satire but now that you mention it it wouldn't bother me if that was the reason in actuality. Hussein was basically holding that oil hostage by his refusal to go along with U.N. resolutions and be a good international boy. So we freed some oil hostages along with the Iraqi people, AWESOME! Now look what the illiterate villagers are doing though, they are sabotaging the oil pipelines and the wells, they're only real natural resource and their only product they can sell on the international market for money that is desperately needed by them all in the name of expelling the infidels. Makes sense doesn't it?

 

[freeandfun1]

OCA:

You just don't get the Islamists.... do you?

Do you think they (the Islamists, not the power brokers of the region such as the Saudi Ruling family, Chalabee (sic?) and the others...) give one damn bit about oil? Their entire destiny in life is to see the WORLD an Islamic one. They have no room for tolerance and if you think our leaving the area will make things all rosie for the U.S.A., you are as dillusional as I thought you are.

 

[OCA]

Do you selectively read as this is the second time you've misinterpreted me? What does the word satire mean to you? Certainly we aren't pulling out anytime soon but I sure as hell hope we aren't in that hell hole forever. The Iraqis sooner or later are going to have to get their shit together and fix their own nest. But in the meantime looks like we are there for the long haul.

In 2nd post which I think you missed I was merely pointing out the fact that the Iraqi's are biting the hand that feeds them and shitting in their own nest currently.

 

[freeandfun1]

You're right... I don't go back and read all the posts. I should and I will start trying. I will also stop addressing them to anybody specific unless I have an issue with a specific quote.

OOPS! I did have a quote from you to which I was replying directly.

AWESOME! Now look what the illiterate villagers are doing though, they are sabotaging the oil pipelines and the wells, they're only real natural resource and their only product they can sell on the international market for money that is desperately needed by them all in the name of expelling the infidels. Makes sense doesn't it?

Again, they don't give a shit about oil. But I do get your point....

 

[OCA]

Now that I know you're 6'2 and 240 i'm sort of regretting that post lol

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by Scourge
DK, I usually agree with you, but it isn't our right to impose our views on another country. We should definitely allow them to elect their own leaders, and if they elect an Islamic leader, then they've made their choice. As long as men AND women can vote and there is atleast a few choices, their decision should be their decision. I think we should just ensure a fair election where all votes count (Ha! imagine us doing that!) and leave them to their own governance. And if they hate us and refuse to do business with us then too bad for us. if they like us and play ball , great. But we need to see Iraq as a soveriegn nation at some point.

Pure democracy does not lead to results anyone would consider "always morally correct". It used to be that a majority believed slavery was ok. That didn't make it morally correct. They must have a constiution that guarantees basic human rights for all, and marriage for gays before we can let them vote.

 

[Scourge]

Yes... I think they can make their own constitution as long as international law isn't broken (no torture, etc.) as for gays marrying, nobody needs to say they CAN marry, as long as nobody can says the CAN'T. I think I'll go to Iraq for my sex change after all... the Netherlands is a bit on the pricy side...