Our greatest President

USA Today/Gallup Poll. Feb. 6-7, 2009. N=1,018 adults nationwide. MoE ± 3.

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"Thinking now about some of the past presidents -- If you had to choose, which one of these U.S. presidents would you regard as the greatest: George Washington, Abraham Lincoln, Franklin Roosevelt, John Kennedy, or Ronald Reagan?"

Reagan 24%

Kennedy 22%

Lincoln 22%

Roosevelt 18%

Washington 9%

Presidents & History

I knew that it had to be Reagan when you had posted this. Fuck Republican Revisionist history, Reagan was a failure of a President in many aspects.

Lincoln was a racist who took away many civil liberties and I'm not sure about FDR but he took away many American civil liberties himself.

Washington should be ahead both of those but Washington had his own problems too. (His treatment of Native Americans come to mind).

Kennedy did too actually, his worst was he couldn't keep in his pants and his father's backdoor deals with the mob. Though both Jack and Bobby didn't find out about those until much later so I suppose it cannot be counted against them really.

You can't judge men from two centuries ago by today's standards. It removes them from the context of the times they lived in.
 
The idea that Washington, Jackson, Lincoln should have been preserving Native American lands is absurd. I'm not condoning the 18th or 19th C mindsets, in light of the 20th and 21st, but to condemn those presidents with todays standards is nonsense. We are what we are.

It's totally feasible that in the future there will be those that say that the paying 'homage' to Islamic sensibilities was warped. On the other hand, it may be that there was not enough reaching out.

There's a difference between purchasing the lands for a fair price and raiding their lands/raping their women/killing them/and of course things like the Trail of Tears.

Those four didn't have to preserve the land, but they didn't have to take it the way they did either Annie. I know you're one of those types who give our government the benefit of the doubt in not giving the Indians blankets with all those diseases too.

Fact of the matter is, the American Government with the help of many Americans committed Genocide against the Native Americans.

Speaking of revisionist history ....

Those indians were doing some raiding and raping and burning of their own. How do you purchase land at a fair price from a people that believe that personal ownership of land is an absurd notion?

By the rules of their times, yes, they DID have to take it the way they did. It's the history of Man. The strong move out the weak. Those Native Americans didn't have to kill off the Native Americans that were here before them, but they did.

You are again incorrect about the genocide. Whites wanted them out of the way, and unable to pose a threat. They didn't care how.

Again, you cannot judge people outside the context of their time. Had you lived in the early 1800s you TOO would have believed Native Americans to be inferior and in your way.
 
Speaking of revisionist history ....

Those indians were doing some raiding and raping and burning of their own. How do you purchase land at a fair price from a people that believe that personal ownership of land is an absurd notion?

By the rules of their times, yes, they DID have to take it the way they did. It's the history of Man. The strong move out the weak. Those Native Americans didn't have to kill off the Native Americans that were here before them, but they did.

You are again incorrect about the genocide. Whites wanted them out of the way, and unable to pose a threat. They didn't care how.

Again, you cannot judge people outside the context of their time. Had you lived in the early 1800s you TOO would have believed Native Americans to be inferior and in your way.

I'm not saying that the Indians were all innocent, not by far.

That's true, they thought nothing of ownership of the land, rather believing it was a loan from future generations. However, we could of treated many of them better then we did back then.

And that's not necessary true, not everybody back then thought that Native Americans were in their way and meant to be killed. However, if something like the Trail of Tears did happen today; it would be considered Genocide.

Yes, it is partly unfair to judge these men based on their times; however if we are going to judge them together with the current men of these times then some sort of standard does need to be set.
 
like FDR trying to expand the Supreme Court when he didn't get his way? There's a reason the 22nd amendment was passed.. I don't know if I agree with it, but I mean the other branches of government thought FDR was too powerful.

That's exactly it, FDR was very patient after awhile because he knew he'd eventually be able to fill the Supreme Court with his flunkies.

It was very similar to Dubya's "My way or the Highway"

No FDR tried to INCREASE the number of Judges on the Court to have his way right away. Patient my ass.
 
Historians ratings of US President, 2009;

As someone who wasn't alive during his presidency, I am surprised that Nixon, the only President to resign, isn't even in the Bottom 15. Anyone care to explain that to me?

He was a great President, his only problem was paranoia and covering up for stooges. After he resigned he was still a great Statesman and came back into influence later in life.
 
like FDR trying to expand the Supreme Court when he didn't get his way? There's a reason the 22nd amendment was passed.. I don't know if I agree with it, but I mean the other branches of government thought FDR was too powerful.

That's exactly it, FDR was very patient after awhile because he knew he'd eventually be able to fill the Supreme Court with his flunkies.

He was nearly impeached for this, you do get it?

and?

as opposed to the USA Today Survey, he's considered one of the greatest presidents, with Lincoln at number one.

As for Roosevelt almost getting impeached, they'd have NEVER impeached him. a) he never packed the court; he just threatened to. b) he was a popular four term president. NO ONE was impeaching him. That's a lot of sound and fury.
 
That's exactly it, FDR was very patient after awhile because he knew he'd eventually be able to fill the Supreme Court with his flunkies.

He was nearly impeached for this, you do get it?

and?

as opposed to the USA Today Survey, he's considered one of the greatest presidents, with Lincoln at number one.

As for Roosevelt almost getting impeached, they'd have NEVER impeached him. a) he never packed the court; he just threatened to. b) he was a popular four term president. NO ONE was impeaching him. That's a lot of sound and fury.

I don't trust surveys of regular Americans about who the best President is, if that is what USA today survey polled. Most Americans are ignorant of history.

He wasn't impeached partly because both houses were controlled by democrats. They did stop him from loading the court, which nether party would do today if they were in that same situation.
 

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