Open letter to the people of Spain

[smellthecoffee]

Originally posted by jimnyc
There is absolutely nothing in there showing they have taken over any resources. I'm not looking for words, I'm looking for cold hard facts and data.

I would have thought that oil is about the only resource the country has. You had referred to Europe's vested intrest in Iraqi oil. I responded with the question of who controlled the resources now. I refer to oil as almost sole resource. The billions of dollars in contracts to rebuild the country we bombed into the stoneage have gone to massive US companies. America then gets the UN to remove sanctions on Iraq and oil production overseen by the USA funds the repairations. Not to mention the haliburtan and subsidiaries fuel deals from Kuwait and feeding the forces and so on. This war has been of tremendous benefit to the Bush cronies. Not so good for Iraqi casualties or US personel but VERY profitable for the select group of Bush family friends.

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by smellthecoffee
I would have thought that oil is about the only resource the country has. You had referred to Europe's vested intrest in Iraqi oil. I responded with the question of who controlled the resources now. I refer to oil as almost sole resource. The billions of dollars in contracts to rebuild the country we bombed into the stoneage have gone to massive US companies. America then gets the UN to remove sanctions on Iraq and oil production overseen by the USA funds the repairations. Not to mention the haliburtan and subsidiaries fuel deals from Kuwait and feeding the forces and so on. This war has been of tremendous benefit to the Bush cronies. Not so good for Iraqi casualties or US personel but VERY profitable for the select group of Bush family friends.

What companies and exactly how much have they profited thus far?

 

[smellthecoffee]

Originally posted by jimnyc
What companies and exactly how much have they profited thus far?

WASHINGTON, October 30, 2003 — More than 70 American companies and individuals have won up to $8 billion in contracts for work in postwar Iraq and Afghanistan over the last two years, according to a new study by the Center for Public Integrity. Those companies donated more money to the presidential campaigns of George W. Bush—a little over $500,000—than to any other politician over the last dozen years, the Center found.

Kellogg, Brown & Root, the subsidiary of Halliburton—which Vice President Dick Cheney led prior to being chosen as Bush's running mate in August 2000—was the top recipient of federal contracts for the two countries, with more than $2.3 billion awarded to the company. Bechtel Group, a major government contractor with similarly high-ranking ties, was second at around $1.03 billion.

However, dozens of lower-profile, but well-connected, companies shared in the reconstruction bounty. Their tasks ranged from rebuilding Iraq's government, police, military and media to providing translators for use in interrogations and psychological operations. There are even contractors to evaluate the contractors. (See company list.)

Nearly 60 percent of the companies had employees or board members who either served in or had close ties to the executive branch for Republican and Democratic administrations, for members of Congress of both parties, or at the highest levels of the military.

The results of the Center's six-month investigation provide the most comprehensive list to date of American contractors in the two nations that were attacked in Washington's war on terror. Based on the findings, it did not appear that any one government agency knew the total number of contractors or what they were doing. Congressional sources said they hoped such a full picture would emerge from the General Accounting Office, which has begun investigating the postwar contracting process amid allegations of fraud and cronyism.

http://www.publicintegrity.org/wow/

 

[smellthecoffee]

Bush's corporate and Oil buddies have won big time with this very profitable war. I hope everyone feels happy with diminished civil rights, fear mongering and propaganda, and the loss of more than 500 American lives all to ensure even more money for some of the most morally bankrupt people in the world.
The United States of Haliburtan - The land of the free (money that is).
We need to bring these crooks to account!!!

 

[jimnyc]

I asked for profits, not what the contracts were worth. Are you saying they weren't qualified for thes jobs or that they didn't do the work they were contracted for?

 

[sitarro]

Originally posted by smellthecoffee
Bush's corporate and Oil buddies have won big time with this very profitable war. I hope everyone feels happy with diminished civil rights, fear mongering and propaganda, and the loss of more than 500 American lives all to ensure even more money for some of the most morally bankrupt people in the world.
The United States of Haliburtan - The land of the free (money that is).
We need to bring these crooks to account!!!

First of all smell,
How can you continue to misspell the name Halliburton even as you quote articles that spell it correctly ? This would indicate a total lack of attention to detail , that hurts your arguments against this corporation . If you did pay any attention to details you would know that Halliburton is not only the best equipped to do the job but also the most qualified . Hiring any other companies would cost more in the long run . Halliburton and it's subsidaries have a long and distinguished relationship with the military , especially the Army Corp. of Engineers . They have a huge presence around the world that allows them to handle the jobs they are contracted to do most efficiently . You make the mistake of thinking a corporation like Halliburton is merely a bunch of suits(very Nader like) , it isn't . It employes thousands of some of the hardest working individuals on the planet . You disrespect all of these good people with your pathetic little rants and I personally find you to be a horrendous bore . You don't know what you are talking about so I would advise you to stop before you make an even larger ass out of yourself than you have already . That is just my opinion, take it or leave it .
I definitely smell something and it isn't coffee .

 

[smellthecoffee]

Originally posted by sitarro
If you did pay any attention to details you would know that Halliburton is not only the best equipped to do the job but also the most qualified .

Halliburton has been awarded the dontract to fight oil fires and then re-cap. They have NO expertise in this area and are sub-contracting the work whilst still making a wedge on the deal. If you honestly believe that there is no "sweet dealing" for the Bush buddies you have to be the most gullible person on the planet. This is a war specifically enacted FOR PROFIT. Jim asks where is the profit? It's in the very action of flattening someones house and then asking them to pay you to fix it! The hard working americans employed by these corporate ogres don't come into play on the morality of this issue. clearly YOU, sitarro, are tarred with the same brush.Profit before morals. Bomb Iraq into the middle ages and profit off the rebuilding. Shame on you. I don't even blame Bush jnr. he is a puppet controlled by his daddy's pals the truly toxic ones are Rumsfeld, Cheney and Rice.
This illegal war has set back the war on terror and raped a country of it's resource. Yes...the world is better off without Saddam but it would be even better without the Bush Administration. Evil people use the weapons available. In the case of Saddam... there were none, In the case of bush and co every weapon and dirty politic imaginable. The World Bank and IMF will be in there ringing every cent out of Iraq. DO YOUR HOMEWORK PEOPLE. Look at Indonesia in November 1967. It has all been done before. And before you dare to critique my input examine the facts Sitarro. Maybe you are getting bored because you don't have much of an attention span. Too much Fox will do that to you! As was stated in the 911 commission hearings " ...fox should say fair and balanced occasionally"
You need to look at the facts and re-assess your position rather than blindly follow the rubbish you are told by Hannity.
Ill informed dullards like yourself are an annoyance.

 

[Syntax_Divinity]

I don't know enough about this issue to chime in. But it's nice to see an actual debate, even though it gets tedious and semantic at times. It looks like coffee is kicking ass. The conservatives sure do outnumber the liberals and moderates on these forums though.

 

[sitarro]

I thought I smelled something offensive , then I noticed you have attempted to form a reply to my post . Ya know smelly it would almost be worth my time to produce word drawings that you could understand but it is not . Just know that I have worked in and around the oilfield industry for over two decades . The wealth of information that you don't possesss about this subject is typical of the anticorporate , anti American business , anti American Defense crowd you obviously get your propaganda from . :nine:

 

[sitarro]

Gee smell , the kid that supports that loser Nader thinks that YOU are kicking ass . Now that's funny ! You've convinced the teenager , want to try the adults?

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by Syntax_Divinity
It looks like coffee is kicking ass.

You chastise RWA in another thread for avoiding your questions and now you say this guy is kicking ass when he is still avoiding my questions. You're a funny guy, but obviously uninformed.

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by smellthecoffee
This illegal war has set back the war on terror and raped a country of it's resource.

Without using your rhetoric and without op/ed articles, please show me how their resources have been 'raped'.

 

[jimnyc]

Let me try this from a different angle, smellthecoffee.

If not Halliburton, tell me who you think should have received the contracts that they got. My position is that they are the most experienced to get the job done in an efficient manner.

That's the bottom line here, isn't it, to get the jobs done properly in the most efficient manner?

So before we continue on myths that this was all some sort of conspiracy between the administration and big oil companies - please display to us what companies would be MORE qualified than Halliburton and just how they would be more efficient.

And you still haven't showed me any net profits. I'm sure they did profit, but I also think anyone who performs such a great service deserves to get paid for the work they do. I just think you see the word 'billions' in their contracts and have no clue as to what they actually profit from that. Can you fill us in on what it costs Halliburton to setup shop in Iraq? How many people are on their payroll and what has that cost Halliburton?

If you can't answer these questions, specifically, then there is really no point in continuing with you.

 

[sitarro]

I find it amazing how so many want to fault Halliburton for being not only the best equipped but also the ones with the most experience and personnel to do the job right the first time . To the second guessers that want to accuse Halliburton of overcharging , I'm curious , how much would you charge to work in a war zone . I know if I was bidding on any work in Iraq I would multiply any bid by at least four .
Smell would like to pretend that the United States bombed Iraq into the stone age but once again he's incorrect . Iraq's infrastructure was in serious disarray before the first bomb was dropped. Electricity was rationed to a few hours a day . Clean water was unheard of except at Saddam's palaces .The oil fields were barely functioning , they are already producing more than their prewar production figures .I don't have the link but there were 2 articles posted last week that detailed all that has improved , one was from Iraqi paper and the other was from a Seattle paper. I will try to find them so you will have more positive information that you won't read.
The most important thing about Halliburton is the amount of Americans that they employ , most with above average pay and benifits.

 

[jimnyc]

Sure, let's pay them minimum wage for working in a war zone.

Rebels Blow Up an Oil Well in North Iraq

BAGHDAD, Iraq - Insurgents bombed an oil well in northern Iraq (news - web sites), sparking a fire that raged for 24 hours before being extinguished, a senior Iraqi security official said. West of Baghdad, U.S. Marines and gunmen fought an hour-long battle Friday that left four Iraqis dead and six wounded, a doctor said.

The fighting occurred in the town of Fallujah in the so-called Sunni Triangle, where support for Saddam Hussein (news - web sites) was strong and rebels often carry out attacks against American forces.

Witnesses said heavy gunfire and explosions were heard when Marines moved into the center of the city. American troops rarely venture into downtown Fallujah, one of the most dangerous areas in Iraq for the U.S. military.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=5&u=/ap/20040326/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_7

 

[jimnyc]

Another good article about Halliburton and the contracts.

The Clinton administration made the same calculation in its own dealings with Halliburton. The company had won the LOGCAP in 1992, then lost it in 1997. The Clinton administration nonetheless awarded a no-bid contract to Halliburton to continue its work in the Balkans supporting the U.S. peacekeeping mission there because it made little sense to change midstream. According to Byron York, Al Gore's reinventing-government panel even singled out Halliburton for praise for its military logistics work.

So, did Clinton and Gore involve the United States in the Balkans to benefit Halliburton? That charge makes as much sense as the one that Democrats are hurling at Bush now. Would that they directed more of their outrage at the people in Iraq who want to sabotage the country's oil infrastructure, rather than at the U.S. corporation charged with helping repair it.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/richlowry/rl20030918.shtml

 

[Syntax_Divinity]

I never claimed to be informed about this subject. Thanks for saying I'm funny though!! By the way, what does the fact that I'm a teenager have to do with anything. RWA isn't a teen, and I kick his ass all over the place. So whateva'

 

[Avatar4321]

You know, its amzing how many people can complain about the economy doing bad while they have been on a crusade against business for the last 30 years.

 

[sitarro]

Love your signature quotes Avatar . Wouldn't it be fun to introduce Thomas Sowell and William Joyce at a party .