On this day in 1943: Lt. Kennedy helps save the crew of PT-109

[Liminal]

You have to separate the legend of PT 109 into two parts. First you have to analyze the crash and then you can get to the survival part. It's almost laughable that the JFK defenders would suggest that barnacle growth impeded the PT Boat's ability to get out of the way of a destroyer.

You were the one who brought up 'barnacle growth'- and suggested that it may have slowed the PT 109 down.

You of course can create any fan fiction you want regarding what happened to the PT 109- but that is all it is- fan fiction.

According to the reports- PT 109 was leading a squad of 3 boats, when the destroyer surprised them- the other two boats were able to successfully take evasive action.

But you just go ahead creating your fan fiction- nothing says respect more than Monday Morning quarterbacking what happened in combat 70 years ago.

More nit wit speculation.

 

[whitehall]

You have to separate the legend of PT 109 into two parts. First you have to analyze the crash and then you can get to the survival part. It's almost laughable that the JFK defenders would suggest that barnacle growth impeded the PT Boat's ability to get out of the way of a destroyer. What's left? The crew was asleep and they were run over by a Japanese destroyer before they had a chance to get underway. JFK fought his back pain and acted heroically and saved at least one crew member from drowning. He is still responsible for the loss of his Boat and the crew members who didn't survive.

Yeah they should have made Kennedy sign a statement-of-charges as they might have done with every pilot that lost an airplane or admiral that lost an aircraft carrier. Then too there was all those American paratroopers shot down by American antiaircraft guns. I think in combat situations the loss of a tank is bad news but it's part of the game.

Captain McVay was convicted of failing to conform to policy with a a zig zag course when the Indianapolis was sunk by a Japanese torpedo. Maybe it was a bum rap but the Military wasn't as stupid as you seem to allege. They were able to determine the difference between a freaking Pilot who lost a plane and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

 

[Liminal]

You have to separate the legend of PT 109 into two parts. First you have to analyze the crash and then you can get to the survival part. It's almost laughable that the JFK defenders would suggest that barnacle growth impeded the PT Boat's ability to get out of the way of a destroyer. What's left? The crew was asleep and they were run over by a Japanese destroyer before they had a chance to get underway. JFK fought his back pain and acted heroically and saved at least one crew member from drowning. He is still responsible for the loss of his Boat and the crew members who didn't survive.

Yeah they should have made Kennedy sign a statement-of-charges as they might have done with every pilot that lost an airplane or admiral that lost an aircraft carrier. Then too there was all those American paratroopers shot down by American antiaircraft guns. I think in combat situations the loss of a tank is bad news but it's part of the game.

Captain McVay was convicted of failing to conform to policy with a a zig zag course when the Indianapolis was sunk by a Japanese torpedo. Maybe it was a bum rap but the Military wasn't as stupid as you seem to allege. They were able to determine the difference between a freaking Pilot who lost a plane and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

More stupid speculation.

 

[whitehall]

You have to separate the legend of PT 109 into two parts. First you have to analyze the crash and then you can get to the survival part. It's almost laughable that the JFK defenders would suggest that barnacle growth impeded the PT Boat's ability to get out of the way of a destroyer. What's left? The crew was asleep and they were run over by a Japanese destroyer before they had a chance to get underway. JFK fought his back pain and acted heroically and saved at least one crew member from drowning. He is still responsible for the loss of his Boat and the crew members who didn't survive.

Yeah they should have made Kennedy sign a statement-of-charges as they might have done with every pilot that lost an airplane or admiral that lost an aircraft carrier. Then too there was all those American paratroopers shot down by American antiaircraft guns. I think in combat situations the loss of a tank is bad news but it's part of the game.

Captain McVay was convicted of failing to conform to policy with a a zig zag course when the Indianapolis was sunk by a Japanese torpedo. Maybe it was a bum rap but the Military wasn't as stupid as you seem to allege. They were able to determine the difference between a freaking Pilot who lost a plane and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

More stupid speculation.

You gotta ask yourself what the hell ever happened to the American education system when people seem to think that they are responding to an argument about a historic event by posting "more stupid speculation". What a shame.

 

[Liminal]

You have to separate the legend of PT 109 into two parts. First you have to analyze the crash and then you can get to the survival part. It's almost laughable that the JFK defenders would suggest that barnacle growth impeded the PT Boat's ability to get out of the way of a destroyer. What's left? The crew was asleep and they were run over by a Japanese destroyer before they had a chance to get underway. JFK fought his back pain and acted heroically and saved at least one crew member from drowning. He is still responsible for the loss of his Boat and the crew members who didn't survive.

Yeah they should have made Kennedy sign a statement-of-charges as they might have done with every pilot that lost an airplane or admiral that lost an aircraft carrier. Then too there was all those American paratroopers shot down by American antiaircraft guns. I think in combat situations the loss of a tank is bad news but it's part of the game.

Captain McVay was convicted of failing to conform to policy with a a zig zag course when the Indianapolis was sunk by a Japanese torpedo. Maybe it was a bum rap but the Military wasn't as stupid as you seem to allege. They were able to determine the difference between a freaking Pilot who lost a plane and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

More stupid speculation.

You gotta ask yourself what the hell ever happened to the American education system when people seem to think that they are responding to an argument about a historic event by posting "more stupid speculation". What a shame.

If only you actually knew some history, you might be able to discuss historic events and people intelligently. What a shame.

 

[whitehall]

You have to separate the legend of PT 109 into two parts. First you have to analyze the crash and then you can get to the survival part. It's almost laughable that the JFK defenders would suggest that barnacle growth impeded the PT Boat's ability to get out of the way of a destroyer. What's left? The crew was asleep and they were run over by a Japanese destroyer before they had a chance to get underway. JFK fought his back pain and acted heroically and saved at least one crew member from drowning. He is still responsible for the loss of his Boat and the crew members who didn't survive.

Yeah they should have made Kennedy sign a statement-of-charges as they might have done with every pilot that lost an airplane or admiral that lost an aircraft carrier. Then too there was all those American paratroopers shot down by American antiaircraft guns. I think in combat situations the loss of a tank is bad news but it's part of the game.

Captain McVay was convicted of failing to conform to policy with a a zig zag course when the Indianapolis was sunk by a Japanese torpedo. Maybe it was a bum rap but the Military wasn't as stupid as you seem to allege. They were able to determine the difference between a freaking Pilot who lost a plane and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

More stupid speculation.

You gotta ask yourself what the hell ever happened to the American education system when people seem to think that they are responding to an argument about a historic event by posting "more stupid speculation". What a shame.

If only you actually knew some history, you might be able to discuss historic events and people intelligently. What a shame.

Angry rhetoric ain't gonna get you a passing grade in history 101 and don't even think about pursuing a career in anything but burger flipping.

 

[Liminal]

Yeah they should have made Kennedy sign a statement-of-charges as they might have done with every pilot that lost an airplane or admiral that lost an aircraft carrier. Then too there was all those American paratroopers shot down by American antiaircraft guns. I think in combat situations the loss of a tank is bad news but it's part of the game.

Captain McVay was convicted of failing to conform to policy with a a zig zag course when the Indianapolis was sunk by a Japanese torpedo. Maybe it was a bum rap but the Military wasn't as stupid as you seem to allege. They were able to determine the difference between a freaking Pilot who lost a plane and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

More stupid speculation.

You gotta ask yourself what the hell ever happened to the American education system when people seem to think that they are responding to an argument about a historic event by posting "more stupid speculation". What a shame.

If only you actually knew some history, you might be able to discuss historic events and people intelligently. What a shame.

Angry rhetoric ain't gonna get you a passing grade in history 101 and don't even think about pursuing a career in anything but burger flipping.

But politically motivated revisionist speculation evidently enhances the substantiation. Based on what I've seen so far, I'd be very surprised if some foundation hadn't already offered funding for you to start your own think tank.

 

[whitehall]

Captain McVay was convicted of failing to conform to policy with a a zig zag course when the Indianapolis was sunk by a Japanese torpedo. Maybe it was a bum rap but the Military wasn't as stupid as you seem to allege. They were able to determine the difference between a freaking Pilot who lost a plane and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

More stupid speculation.

You gotta ask yourself what the hell ever happened to the American education system when people seem to think that they are responding to an argument about a historic event by posting "more stupid speculation". What a shame.

If only you actually knew some history, you might be able to discuss historic events and people intelligently. What a shame.

Angry rhetoric ain't gonna get you a passing grade in history 101 and don't even think about pursuing a career in anything but burger flipping.

But politically motivated revisionist speculation evidently enhances the substantiation. Based on what I've seen so far, I'd be very surprised if some foundation hadn't already offered funding for you to start your own think tank.

Why do you want pursue idiotic offensive phrases like "politically motivated speculation" instead of enjoying a lively exchange of opinions on the history channel? You almost gotta laugh that this is what might pass for a passing grade in the politically motivated excuse for a history education these days.

 

[Camp]

You have to separate the legend of PT 109 into two parts. First you have to analyze the crash and then you can get to the survival part. It's almost laughable that the JFK defenders would suggest that barnacle growth impeded the PT Boat's ability to get out of the way of a destroyer. What's left? The crew was asleep and they were run over by a Japanese destroyer before they had a chance to get underway. JFK fought his back pain and acted heroically and saved at least one crew member from drowning. He is still responsible for the loss of his Boat and the crew members who didn't survive.

Yeah they should have made Kennedy sign a statement-of-charges as they might have done with every pilot that lost an airplane or admiral that lost an aircraft carrier. Then too there was all those American paratroopers shot down by American antiaircraft guns. I think in combat situations the loss of a tank is bad news but it's part of the game.

Captain McVay was convicted of failing to conform to policy with a a zig zag course when the Indianapolis was sunk by a Japanese torpedo. Maybe it was a bum rap but the Military wasn't as stupid as you seem to allege. They were able to determine the difference between a freaking Pilot who lost a plane and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

Odd that you would use the Indianapolis as an example of Navy efficiency. Arguments were made that McVay was used as a scapegoat to cover up the Navy's failure to even know the Indianapolis had been sunk and was responsible for leaving the crew stranded in the ocean to be eaten by sharks day after day with the Navy making no attempt to rescue them because they did not know where the ship was or what had happened to it.

 

[Liminal]

More stupid speculation.

You gotta ask yourself what the hell ever happened to the American education system when people seem to think that they are responding to an argument about a historic event by posting "more stupid speculation". What a shame.

If only you actually knew some history, you might be able to discuss historic events and people intelligently. What a shame.

Angry rhetoric ain't gonna get you a passing grade in history 101 and don't even think about pursuing a career in anything but burger flipping.

But politically motivated revisionist speculation evidently enhances the substantiation. Based on what I've seen so far, I'd be very surprised if some foundation hadn't already offered funding for you to start your own think tank.

Why do you want pursue idiotic offensive phrases like "politically motivated speculation" instead of enjoying a lively exchange of opinions on the history channel? You almost gotta laugh that this is what might pass for a passing grade in the politically motivated excuse for a history education these days.

History Channel? Yeah, that's the problem, the History Channel is probably your primary source of information. Maybe Kennedy was influenced by Ancient Aliens.

 

[Syriusly]

[and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

Ah Whitehall's fan fiction again.

He loves to imagine he was there and creates a whole world where he can blame Kennedy's for everything.

 

[Syriusly]

You have to separate the legend of PT 109 into two parts. First you have to analyze the crash and then you can get to the survival part. It's almost laughable that the JFK defenders would suggest that barnacle growth impeded the PT Boat's ability to get out of the way of a destroyer. What's left? The crew was asleep and they were run over by a Japanese destroyer before they had a chance to get underway. JFK fought his back pain and acted heroically and saved at least one crew member from drowning. He is still responsible for the loss of his Boat and the crew members who didn't survive.

Yeah they should have made Kennedy sign a statement-of-charges as they might have done with every pilot that lost an airplane or admiral that lost an aircraft carrier. Then too there was all those American paratroopers shot down by American antiaircraft guns. I think in combat situations the loss of a tank is bad news but it's part of the game.

Captain McVay was convicted of failing to conform to policy with a a zig zag course when the Indianapolis was sunk by a Japanese torpedo. Maybe it was a bum rap but the Military wasn't as stupid as you seem to allege. They were able to determine the difference between a freaking Pilot who lost a plane and a diletante rich kid who was already busted from a job in Naval intelligence and got his crew killed because everyone was sleeping and his Boat got run over.

More stupid speculation.

You gotta ask yourself what the hell ever happened to the American education system when people seem to think that they are responding to an argument about a historic event by posting "more stupid speculation". What a shame.

All you have been posting is stupid speculation about Kennedy and his crew.

 

[Synthaholic]

On this day in 1943: Lt. Kennedy helps save the crew of PT-109


Democrats = courage.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Come on folks. P.T. boats are made for speed and agility and not a single one was ever run over by a big hulking destroyer that needs three football fields to make a turn. Therefore JFK's Boat was asleep in the shipping channels without a soul awake until the freaking ship was on them and it was too late.

Torpedo boats, either US PTs, British MTBs or German S (E) boats were ambush predators. They didn't roar around looking for targets, they sat on shipping routes waiting for prey. Both the MTBs and PTs were throuobreds with aircraft England that needed constant maintenance. The 109 just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, the destroyer didn't spot the boat until just before the collision. As for the poster implying that ships are noises. He's wrong, a turbine driven ship is almost silent except near the stacks and exhaust fans that cool the boiler rooms.

 

[westwall]

Torpedo boats, either US PTs, British MTBs or German S (E) boats were ambush predators. They didn't roar around looking for targets, they sat on shipping routes waiting for prey. Both the MTBs and PTs were throuobreds with aircraft England that needed constant maintenance. The 109 just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, the destroyer didn't spot the boat until just before the collision. As for the poster implying that ships are noises. He's wrong, a turbine driven ship is almost silent except near the stacks and exhaust fans that cool the boiler rooms.

Add to the fact that with the marine growth on the hulls that slowed the MTBs down tremendously.

They were lucky if they could do 20 knots. Cruising along at low speed, in poor visibility, if the Japanese spotted the PT boat first, they most certainly could be rammed.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Odd that you would use the Indianapolis as an example of Navy efficiency. Arguments were made that McVay was used as a scapegoat to cover up the Navy's failure to even know the Indianapolis had been sunk and was responsible for leaving the crew stranded in the ocean to be eaten by sharks day after day with the Navy making no attempt to rescue them because they did not know where the ship was or what had happened to it.

The Navy sent a valuable heavy cruiser out without a single destroyer as an anti-sub escort, then court martialed the skipper of the cruiser for being sunk by a sub that he couldn't detect or avoid.