On the "War on Terrorism"

[Helios]

Salvete populi,

One of the greatest capitalists in American history, Henry Ford, once said: "It is well that the people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."


In the beginning, there was ignorance. Once they had the America people so dumbed down that they had no voice, they began using their second favorite tool: fear. A good strong foothold in spawning fear was 9/11 (which is a whole other interesting story). Fear is in turn combined with misinformation in the years leading up to the war in Afghanistan and Iraq, creating a general atmosphere of panic, which was used to justify plunging the country into two costly (1 trillion dollars a year spent maintaining our empire), ill-advised and completely unjustified wars based on lies and half-truths.

Just to get one thing straight, I don't blame Bush personally for anything that's gone wrong in this country. I pity the moronic speech-impeded man, he has no real power, and is only the mouthpiece of a corrupt government and of the corrupt business interests and bankers that control it. I also don't blame our loyal troops, who believe in what they are fighting for and have sacrificed more than I can imagine in America's misguided wars.

So Bush announces the "War on Terrorism," partially to ease people's fear, partially to create more fear and confusion. First off, how can one conduct a "War on Terrorism"? Terrorism is an idea, a tactic, and cannot be targeted by an army, cannot even be targeted by the smartest bomb in the world. It is, however, useful to say you are fighting a tactic, because one can easily extend this war to other countries under the banner of "Terrorism."

The War on Terrorism was initiated primarily to:

• Protect the interests of oil companies, and their rich executives
• Justify taking away American civil liberties and rights guaranteed by the Constitution
• Protect the interests of the defense industry, which has made profits of 100's of billions of dollars off the Iraq War alone
• To lower the value of the currency and create inflation. Through inflation, which causes an increase in America's debt to the Federal Reserve, is money in the pocket for the banking interests that run this nation.

War has, throughout America's past, always been a tool of the rich for extorting money from the poor and middle class. They use the money of the working class to finance their highly profitable enterprises, using their war hawking propaganda to push the country in line behind them. When it's from history its called propaganda, but if it's current it's called news. On top of all this, 99.9% of the U.S. Army and the Marine Corps is from working class backgrounds.

First Afghanistan, now Iraq. What's next, ladies and gentlemen? Iran? Syria? Pakistan? North Korea? All of the above? Wake up, America, and realize you are being told the same bullshit story that has been repeated throughout history!

"There was, and still is, no "war on terrorism". Instead, we have watched a variation of the great imperial game of swapping "bad" terrorists for "good" terrorists, while untold numbers of innocent people have paid with their lives..." - John Pilger



Helios

 

[shepherdboy]

The Islamist filth were invading Christian lands for 480 years before the first Holy Crusade against the heathen was launched and yet its liberal shit in the west who apologize for the Crusades.Thank Almighty God for El Cid and the Brotherhood of Christ who fought against islamic murder and slavery.

 

[Helios]

The Islamist filth were invading Christian lands for 480 years before the first Holy Crusade against the heathen was launched and yet its liberal shit in the west who apologize for the Crusades.Thank Almighty God for El Cid and the Brotherhood of Christ who fought against islamic murder and slavery.

I disagree. We should bring our troops home today. Yesterday. There was no good reason for going to Iraq, and nothing good will come of it. Killing is but a politician's end to his means. A politician is but a businessman's end to his means. There is no right in war, only wrong. I ask myself why you are so hateful... humor or genuine emotional problems?

 

[eots]

I disagree. We should bring our troops home today. Yesterday. There was no good reason for going to Iraq, and nothing good will come of it. Killing is but a politician's end to his means. A politician is but a businessman's end to his means. There is no right in war, only wrong. I ask myself why you are so hateful... humor or genuine emotional problems?

but what about the surge ?....what about the recent reduction in the death toll...?...what about all the great news coming out of Iraq ?..oh a lets not forget womans rights..we have to stop the talaban so their daughters can wear low cut jeans and whale tales and get abortions on demand !

 

[Helios]

but what about the surge ?....what about the recent reduction in the death toll...?...what about all the great news coming out of Iraq ?..oh a lets not forget womans rights..we have to stop the talaban so their daughters can wear low cut jeans and whale tales and get abortions on demand !

I must say the "Surge" tactic will only be effective as long as we are "surging." Are we going to keep surging till the sun burns out or what? We are merely suppressing the enemy with these new troops... they are not the kind of enemy that can be defeated by more troops. Gorilla warfare. Remember? That's what the U.S. used to defeat the big bad British empire, wasn't it?

 

[Zoomie1980]

I must say the "Surge" tactic will only be effective as long as we are "surging." Are we going to keep surging till the sun burns out or what? We are merely suppressing the enemy with these new troops... they are not the kind of enemy that can be defeated by more troops. Gorilla warfare. Remember? That's what the U.S. used to defeat the big bad British empire, wasn't it?

Actually that was true, early on, but by 1780 the continental army had grown strong enough to begin facing the British straight on in classic 18th century warfare. Those tactics bought the time for the army to finally get it together.

The same thing happened in N. Vietnam. The NVA was a piss poor force for most of the war. TET was a massive failure for them. But they outlasted the US politically without ever winning a single traditional battle. By the time we left, the NVA was a pretty solid functional Army, and without the US presence, they had no trouble beating back the worthless SVA.

Well funded and manned insurgencies take, on average, historically, between 15 to 30 years to crack. So we have quite a bit of time yet to finish this job.

 

[Zoomie1980]

I disagree. We should bring our troops home today. Yesterday. There was no good reason for going to Iraq, and nothing good will come of it. Killing is but a politician's end to his means. A politician is but a businessman's end to his means. There is no right in war, only wrong. I ask myself why you are so hateful... humor or genuine emotional problems?

Maintain the unrestrained flow of oil from the Persian Gulf is absolutely vital to the survival of the US, and in turn, the global economy. That may not be the reason given at the start, but it is the strategic reason why we are there and why James Baker, way back in PG I, stated we had to go the last time. This is just a continuation of that....which was only a cease fire...which Saddam broke, 1057 times.

But yes, there is a VERY GOOD reason we are there. Oil. IN fact, it is the only REAL reason. But it's perfectly good enough for anyone with a brain larger than a walnut.

 

[Dr Grump]

Actually that was true, early on, but by 1780 the continental army had grown strong enough to begin facing the British straight on in classic 18th century warfare. Those tactics bought the time for the army to finally get it together.

The same thing happened in N. Vietnam. The NVA was a piss poor force for most of the war. TET was a massive failure for them. But they outlasted the US politically without ever winning a single traditional battle. By the time we left, the NVA was a pretty solid functional Army, and without the US presence, they had no trouble beating back the worthless SVA.

Well funded and manned insurgencies take, on average, historically, between 15 to 30 years to crack. So we have quite a bit of time yet to finish this job.

Both your examples bring me to the conclusion that eventually the insurgents will form an army that will kick the US's butt...

 

[Zoomie1980]

Both your examples bring me to the conclusion that eventually the insurgents will form an army that will kick the US's butt...

The insurgents lack the resources of a nation-state or major nation-state ally. N Vietnam had the Soviet Union. In Burma in the 1920's, the native insurgents did not have a powerful nation-state behind them and by 1935 the British had largely put that one down....but then the Japanese arrived seven years later.

It took the British about 15 years to put down Zulu and other native tribal insurgencies in Africa back in the late 19th century. They had no powerful nation-state backing them, either.

These insurgents, likewise have only Iran....a fairly weak and easily isolated nation-state backing them.

 

[Dr Grump]

The insurgents lack the resources of a nation-state or major nation-state ally. N Vietnam had the Soviet Union. In Burma in the 1920's, the native insurgents did not have a powerful nation-state behind them and by 1935 the British had largely put that one down....but then the Japanese arrived seven years later.

It took the British about 15 years to put down Zulu and other native tribal insurgencies in Africa back in the late 19th century. They had no powerful nation-state backing them, either.

These insurgents, likewise have only Iran....a fairly weak and easily isolated nation-state backing them.

I disagree re Iran. If a small state like Syria can back Palestinian groups in Lebanon, then a major player like Iran can arm the insurgents til the cows come home. The biggest problem with Iraq is that it is really three nations in one....

 

[Zoomie1980]

I disagree re Iran. If a small state like Syria can back Palestinian groups in Lebanon, then a major player like Iran can arm the insurgents til the cows come home. The biggest problem with Iraq is that it is really three nations in one....

Iran is a third world basket case with a broke economy. Syria was never a challenge to Israel. I was a FAC for the Israeli Air Force in the 1982 war. Israel sent 36 F16's and 12 KFIRS up and shot down the entire Syrian air force, 82 MIG 21's, MIG-23's and MIG 25's without a single loss. And walked right into Beirut, unmollested. They did it again about year and a half ago. The Syrians are now gone. Five times since the formation of Israel after WWII the combined forces of the Arab world went up against the tiny Jewish state and they got the asses kicked BADLY all five times.

No, these hapless 10th century dolts can't fight their way out of a paper bag. Iran has no military power at all. And for a major oil exporter, they have no money either. They spend it all on financing hopeless terrorist groups and a nuclear program that will go nowhere.

 

[steeliniraq]

Salvete populi,

One of the greatest capitalists in American history, Henry Ford, once said: "It is well that the people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."


In the beginning, there was ignorance. Once they had the America people so dumbed down that they had no voice, they began using their second favorite tool: fear. A good strong foothold in spawning fear was 9/11 (which is a whole other interesting story). Fear is in turn combined with misinformation in the years leading up to the war in Afghanistan and Iraq, creating a general atmosphere of panic, which was used to justify plunging the country into two costly (1 trillion dollars a year spent maintaining our empire), ill-advised and completely unjustified wars based on lies and half-truths.

Just to get one thing straight, I don't blame Bush personally for anything that's gone wrong in this country. I pity the moronic speech-impeded man, he has no real power, and is only the mouthpiece of a corrupt government and of the corrupt business interests and bankers that control it. I also don't blame our loyal troops, who believe in what they are fighting for and have sacrificed more than I can imagine in America's misguided wars.

So Bush announces the "War on Terrorism," partially to ease people's fear, partially to create more fear and confusion. First off, how can one conduct a "War on Terrorism"? Terrorism is an idea, a tactic, and cannot be targeted by an army, cannot even be targeted by the smartest bomb in the world. It is, however, useful to say you are fighting a tactic, because one can easily extend this war to other countries under the banner of "Terrorism."

The War on Terrorism was initiated primarily to:

• Protect the interests of oil companies, and their rich executives
• Justify taking away American civil liberties and rights guaranteed by the Constitution
• Protect the interests of the defense industry, which has made profits of 100's of billions of dollars off the Iraq War alone
• To lower the value of the currency and create inflation. Through inflation, which causes an increase in America's debt to the Federal Reserve, is money in the pocket for the banking interests that run this nation.

War has, throughout America's past, always been a tool of the rich for extorting money from the poor and middle class. They use the money of the working class to finance their highly profitable enterprises, using their war hawking propaganda to push the country in line behind them. When it's from history its called propaganda, but if it's current it's called news. On top of all this, 99.9% of the U.S. Army and the Marine Corps is from working class backgrounds.

First Afghanistan, now Iraq. What's next, ladies and gentlemen? Iran? Syria? Pakistan? North Korea? All of the above? Wake up, America, and realize you are being told the same bullshit story that has been repeated throughout history!

"There was, and still is, no "war on terrorism". Instead, we have watched a variation of the great imperial game of swapping "bad" terrorists for "good" terrorists, while untold numbers of innocent people have paid with their lives..." - John Pilger



Helios

Im not going to try and change your position on this issue. All I am going to ask you is would we be at war if we weren't attacked on 9/11? Another question I would like to ask is how can people not get rich off of war? Like any other business people profit off of war. We live in a Capitalistic country where business rules the day. If we weren't attacked we wouldn't be at war right now. The first question is a yes or no not a bunch of blah blah.

 

[Zoomie1980]

Im not going to try and change your position on this issue. All I am going to ask you is would we be at war if we weren't attacked on 9/11? Another question I would like to ask is how can people not get rich off of war? Like any other business people profit off of war. We live in a Capitalistic country where business rules the day. If we weren't attacked we wouldn't be at war right now. The first question is a yes or no not a bunch of blah blah.

It would been very hard for Bush to go to war either against the Talaban or Saddam. Having large American bases closer to Iran and Central Asia has been a long term strategic goal of the Pentagon since the 1980's. We just lacked the pretexts for getting them and the Soviet threat prevented it as well. The Soviets fell in 1989 but we still just couldn't walk in. 9/11 gave us the pretext.

We now have some of the largest bases in the entire world surrounding Iran on three sides....and another huge American base in Kazakhstan. Get out a map and you'll see that base sits right on the hub of access to the vast untapped oil fields of the Aral-Caspian sea, coveted by Russia, China and India....and now we have the bases, and they don't....

 

[Helios]

Im not going to try and change your position on this issue. All I am going to ask you is would we be at war if we weren't attacked on 9/11?

9/11 has absolutely nothing to do with the Iraq War, so your question makes no sense.

Another question I would like to ask is how can people not get rich off of war?

... no one EXCEPT the oil and war industry is booming right now.. they get rich, but at the expense of a failing economy, a crashing dollar, and over a million civilian casualties.

Like any other business people profit off of war. We live in a Capitalistic country where business rules the day. If we weren't attacked we wouldn't be at war right now. The first question is a yes or no not a bunch of blah blah.

If by "blah blah" you mean intelligent discourse, I'm afraid I can't oblige.

 

[shepherdboy]

I disagree. We should bring our troops home today. Yesterday. There was no good reason for going to Iraq, and nothing good will come of it. Killing is but a politician's end to his means. A politician is but a businessman's end to his means. There is no right in war, only wrong. I ask myself why you are so hateful... humor or genuine emotional problems?

I wonder if you believe in the false assumption that mankind wants to live in peace with himself and his neighboring nations? One only has to look at history to se how that does not play out to well. Then maybe you are one of those dreamers that believes in a utopia world where all of mankind can work out his differences through diplomacy. I guess you never travel abroad to other nations to see that those idea would get you killed. Then again maybe you never served this country in combat to know that some people don't care about your freedom or your idea of peace. In fact they just want you to believe and practice their ideology, and if you don't want to submit, well then you are beheaded. Nick Berg shared many of your good nature idea's for mankind and how U.S. foreign policy should be practiced. Like him and many others who thought they could convince the world of a utopia of peace and partnership of good will to mankind was killed simply for expressing those idea's. Be thankful you live in a country that protects you and gives you freedom of speech even to be on a message board to vent your philosophies and idea's. And remember that all nation act in the best interest of their selves. The U.S. at this point in time just does it better then anyone else. But know this, for example. If France, Germany, Russia, China, you name it could manipulate the world markets, energies, natural resources and the world economy like the U.S., they would. Everyone hates the top player but all want to be on top. Look at history and tell me if I am wrong.

 

[shepherdboy]

It would been very hard for Bush to go to war either against the Talaban or Saddam. Having large American bases closer to Iran and Central Asia has been a long term strategic goal of the Pentagon since the 1980's. We just lacked the pretexts for getting them and the Soviet threat prevented it as well. The Soviets fell in 1989 but we still just couldn't walk in. 9/11 gave us the pretext.

We now have some of the largest bases in the entire world surrounding Iran on three sides....and another huge American base in Kazakhstan. Get out a map and you'll see that base sits right on the hub of access to the vast untapped oil fields of the Aral-Caspian sea, coveted by Russia, China and India....and now we have the bases, and they don't....

Its nice to see that some have the intelligence and understanding of how the world functions. Well said.

 

[rayboyusmc]

Thank Almighty God for El Cid and the Brotherhood of Christ who fought against islamic murder and slavery.

You have to be shitting me. I don't think God was involved in that at all. Have the balls to stand up for your beliefs without trying to say God loves you or US better than them. Might as well be a frigging Islamist Yee Had Ist.

 

[Helios]

I wonder if you believe in the false assumption that mankind wants to live in peace with himself and his neighboring nations? One only has to look at history to se how that does not play out to well. Then maybe you are one of those dreamers that believes in a utopia world where all of mankind can work out his differences through diplomacy. I guess you never travel abroad to other nations to see that those idea would get you killed. Then again maybe you never served this country in combat to know that some people don't care about your freedom or your idea of peace. In fact they just want you to believe and practice their ideology, and if you don't want to submit, well then you are beheaded. Nick Berg shared many of your good nature idea's for mankind and how U.S. foreign policy should be practiced. Like him and many others who thought they could convince the world of a utopia of peace and partnership of good will to mankind was killed simply for expressing those idea's. Be thankful you live in a country that protects you and gives you freedom of speech even to be on a message board to vent your philosophies and idea's. And remember that all nation act in the best interest of their selves. The U.S. at this point in time just does it better then anyone else. But know this, for example. If France, Germany, Russia, China, you name it could manipulate the world markets, energies, natural resources and the world economy like the U.S., they would. Everyone hates the top player but all want to be on top. Look at history and tell me if I am wrong.

. Where to begin, where to begin...

You think peace is unrealistic? Well, I think war is unrealistic. I think anyone believing that humanity can continue to destroy one another with bigger and bigger bombs, biological weapons and hostile invasions, is not familiar with the real world. More and more war, more and more suffering: when does it end? You only support war because you have never seen it up close. I have, and let me tell you it's not as rosy and exciting as your feeble mind imagines it.

I am thankful for living in a society that still has a semblance of free speech, even though it is being taken away day by day by the very dictators you elect.

You think the U.S. is still the top player, you make me laugh. I'm willin' to bet you've never been to another country. Most of European countries are ahead of the states in: health care, cutting taxes, public infrastructure, education, literacy rates, and happiness polls. So unless top player means most arrogant oppressor of the globe, you are sadly mistaken citizen.

But looking beyond all that, steps are already being taken behind closed doors to create the NAU, the EU is already in place. Global Government is much closer than anyone would care to know. And then we shall see about your freedom of speech.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

. Where to begin, where to begin...

You think peace is unrealistic? Well, I think war is unrealistic. I think anyone believing that humanity can continue to destroy one another with bigger and bigger bombs, biological weapons and hostile invasions, is not familiar with the real world. More and more war, more and more suffering: when does it end? You only support war because you have never seen it up close. I have, and let me tell you it's not as rosy and exciting as your feeble mind imagines it.

I am thankful for living in a society that still has a semblance of free speech, even though it is being taken away day by day by the very dictators you elect.

You think the U.S. is still the top player, you make me laugh. I'm willin' to bet you've never been to another country. Most of European countries are ahead of the states in: health care, cutting taxes, public infrastructure, education, literacy rates, and happiness polls. So unless top player means most arrogant oppressor of the globe, you are sadly mistaken citizen.

But looking beyond all that, steps are already being taken behind closed doors to create the NAU, the EU is already in place. Global Government is much closer than anyone would care to know. And then we shall see about your freedom of speech.

Your fantasy world gets weirder and stranger with every post.

 

[Helios]

Your fantasy world gets weirder and stranger with every post.

Your posts continue to decline in length, intelligence and logic. Are you actually here to argue any particular point, or just to broadly and ignorantly criticize opinions you don't understand or agree with?