On American Reason

JMJames

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May 12, 2012
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On American Reason.

It’s hard to believe that many people in the world still give their faith to religion. Especially in this country. America, a nation founded on imagination, on philosophy, on rationality, and healthy skepticism. We are—or at least were—a nation with minds as free and wild and untamed as the land itself. What place does religion have in such a wide and untamed place? Surely, the belief or, more appropriately, the dry faith in religion should shrivel up and die in the hot sands of the American prairies. It doesn’t though. In fact, it thrives in the dry scrutiny of the desert like the burrobush. Growing thick and proud. It’s a weed with shallow roots.

We Americans are blessed with a great land. A land which stretches far and wide, and is plenty bountiful. Much of the land though, is rather arid. It’s difficult to farm the land in our country but, with hard work and perseverance, many people make it work. They forged for themselves a land that is fertile from land that was sterile. The same applies to the American mind. We are a country that is relatively new in the global macrocosm. Our forbearers came to this country with nothing. They came with no plan beyond escaping a life that didn’t work for them. Our country was planted in that infertile ground. From this arid rocky land, our forefathers forged a fertile nation. They created a place where we could grow free of the taint of forced thought, free of taxation without representation, free of the implications of institution. Free of the oppressive things that came with being European.

Our country has come to a point where we have forgotten those American ideals. Many Americans are allowing themselves to believe that this country was founded on the tenets of Christianity. Many would have you believe that our founding fathers were themselves God-fearing. This is certainly a powerful notion. But in actuality, these people are telling a counter-narrative, one in which they can’t be wrong. They are reading history in a way which sounds good and supports their own counter-narrative. They are backing it up with “irrefutable” facts based on their rigorous but ultimately erroneous readings of history. Should “circular logic” have a more precise definition, I haven’t heard it.

What these people don’t realize is that the earliest Americans had no fear of God. In fact, our founding fathers were quite outspoken in their non-Christian belief. Thomas Jefferson himself said: "Christianity is the most perverted system that ever shone on man." Jefferson was of course a founding father, the chief author of the Declaration of Independence and the third president of the United States. And he was not alone in his sentiments. Surely, there’s a reason many people believe that we are a Christian nation. But that reason doesn’t exist in reality. Unfortunately for us, Jefferson is dead. But so is Abraham.

I implore my fellow Americans to realize that we are not living in a Christian nation. We are living in a nation where we are allowed to think freely. We are allowed to go beyond the crushing yoke of theology.
 
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Wow. Cant even get the first paragraph right. You do realize that our nation was founded upon religion right? That's why it's protected in the First amendment from Federal Government interference. Because our Founders knew how important it was to rely on Divine Providence.

Mr. President:

The small progress we have made after 4 or five weeks close attendance & continual reasonings with each other -- our different sentiments on almost every question, several of the last producing as many noes as ays, is methinks a melancholy proof of the imperfection of the Human Understanding. We indeed seem to feel our own wont of political wisdom, since we have been running about in search of it. We have gone back to ancient history for models of government, and examined the different forms of those Republics which having been formed with the seeds of their own dissolution now no longer exist. And we have viewed Modern States all round Europe, but find none of their Constitutions suitable to our circumstances.

In this situation of this Assembly groping as it were in the dark to find political truth, and scarce able to distinguish it when to us, how has it happened, Sir, that we have not hitherto once thought of humbly applying to the Father of lights to illuminate our understandings? In the beginning of the contest with G. Britain, when we were sensible of danger we had daily prayer in this room for the Divine Protection. -- Our prayers, Sir, were heard, and they were graciously answered. All of us who were engaged in the struggle must have observed frequent instances of a Superintending providence in our favor. To that kind providence we owe this happy opportunity of consulting in peace on the means of establishing our future national felicity. And have we now forgotten that powerful friend? or do we imagine that we no longer need His assistance.

I have lived, Sir, a long time and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth -- that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have been assured, Sir, in the sacred writings that "except the Lord build they labor in vain that build it." I firmly believe this; and I also believe that without his concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better than the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our little partial local interests; our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall be become a reproach and a bye word down to future age. And what is worse, mankind may hereafter this unfortunate instance, despair of establishing Governments by Human Wisdom, and leave it to chance, war, and conquest.

I therefore beg leave to move -- that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and its blessings on our deliberations, be held in this Assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the Clergy of this City be requested to officiate in that service.

Ben Franklin
 
Wow. Cant even get the first paragraph right. You do realize that our nation was founded upon religion right? That's why it's protected in the First amendment from Federal Government interference. Because our Founders knew how important it was to rely on Divine Providence.

Mr. President:

The small progress we have made after 4 or five weeks close attendance & continual reasonings with each other -- our different sentiments on almost every question, several of the last producing as many noes as ays, is methinks a melancholy proof of the imperfection of the Human Understanding. We indeed seem to feel our own wont of political wisdom, since we have been running about in search of it. We have gone back to ancient history for models of government, and examined the different forms of those Republics which having been formed with the seeds of their own dissolution now no longer exist. And we have viewed Modern States all round Europe, but find none of their Constitutions suitable to our circumstances.

In this situation of this Assembly groping as it were in the dark to find political truth, and scarce able to distinguish it when to us, how has it happened, Sir, that we have not hitherto once thought of humbly applying to the Father of lights to illuminate our understandings? In the beginning of the contest with G. Britain, when we were sensible of danger we had daily prayer in this room for the Divine Protection. -- Our prayers, Sir, were heard, and they were graciously answered. All of us who were engaged in the struggle must have observed frequent instances of a Superintending providence in our favor. To that kind providence we owe this happy opportunity of consulting in peace on the means of establishing our future national felicity. And have we now forgotten that powerful friend? or do we imagine that we no longer need His assistance.

I have lived, Sir, a long time and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth -- that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have been assured, Sir, in the sacred writings that "except the Lord build they labor in vain that build it." I firmly believe this; and I also believe that without his concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better than the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our little partial local interests; our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall be become a reproach and a bye word down to future age. And what is worse, mankind may hereafter this unfortunate instance, despair of establishing Governments by Human Wisdom, and leave it to chance, war, and conquest.

I therefore beg leave to move -- that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and its blessings on our deliberations, be held in this Assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the Clergy of this City be requested to officiate in that service.

Ben Franklin

No, that's not true at all. But thanks for taking the time to respond. Our founding fathers found the value in not giving our minds wholly to the superstitions of religion.
 
President Jefferson was against organized religion.
The majority of all of our Founder's believed in God.
Jefferson approved of Jesus moral philosophy, without the miracles (which he did not believe in). That's why he wrote his own bible.
Our founders based our form of Government for the people to have morals.
What are morals?
The ten commandments

If you don't believe in God that part can be ignored.
The rest are morals.
work for 6 days, rest for at least on 1 day
Do not cheat on anyone, wife or business partners
Do not lie
Tell the truth
Honor your parents
Do not steal
Don't be jealous of neighbors or anyone else.
Don't murder

Without these basic principles that has held us together as a nation our constitution does not work.
 
Wow. Cant even get the first paragraph right. You do realize that our nation was founded upon religion right? That's why it's protected in the First amendment from Federal Government interference. Because our Founders knew how important it was to rely on Divine Providence.

Mr. President:

The small progress we have made after 4 or five weeks close attendance & continual reasonings with each other -- our different sentiments on almost every question, several of the last producing as many noes as ays, is methinks a melancholy proof of the imperfection of the Human Understanding. We indeed seem to feel our own wont of political wisdom, since we have been running about in search of it. We have gone back to ancient history for models of government, and examined the different forms of those Republics which having been formed with the seeds of their own dissolution now no longer exist. And we have viewed Modern States all round Europe, but find none of their Constitutions suitable to our circumstances.

In this situation of this Assembly groping as it were in the dark to find political truth, and scarce able to distinguish it when to us, how has it happened, Sir, that we have not hitherto once thought of humbly applying to the Father of lights to illuminate our understandings? In the beginning of the contest with G. Britain, when we were sensible of danger we had daily prayer in this room for the Divine Protection. -- Our prayers, Sir, were heard, and they were graciously answered. All of us who were engaged in the struggle must have observed frequent instances of a Superintending providence in our favor. To that kind providence we owe this happy opportunity of consulting in peace on the means of establishing our future national felicity. And have we now forgotten that powerful friend? or do we imagine that we no longer need His assistance.

I have lived, Sir, a long time and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth -- that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have been assured, Sir, in the sacred writings that "except the Lord build they labor in vain that build it." I firmly believe this; and I also believe that without his concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better than the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our little partial local interests; our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall be become a reproach and a bye word down to future age. And what is worse, mankind may hereafter this unfortunate instance, despair of establishing Governments by Human Wisdom, and leave it to chance, war, and conquest.

I therefore beg leave to move -- that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and its blessings on our deliberations, be held in this Assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the Clergy of this City be requested to officiate in that service.

Ben Franklin

No, that's not true at all. But thanks for taking the time to respond. Our founding fathers found the value in not giving our minds wholly to the superstitions of religion.

Our Founding Fathers were individuals, they didn't do 'group think'.... hence, they founded a country as a Republic, a nation of laws.... where people are free to worship or not in whatever way they deem fit.

Here's a novel idea... since you respect the Founders so much... why don't you follow their principles and mind your own fucking business about what other people do or do not believe.
 
Our Founding Fathers were individuals, they didn't do 'group think'.... hence, they founded a country as a Republic, a nation of laws.... where people are free to worship or not in whatever way they deem fit.

Here's a novel idea... since you respect the Founders so much... why don't you follow their principles and mind your own fucking business about what other people do or do not believe.

Mind my own business? I'm sorry, I'm not going to sit back and watch my country become overcome with religious unreason. I don't care what people do in their own home, it's what they bring into the public sphere is what I'm talking about here. Just have to spell things out for some people I guess.
 
Our Founding Fathers were individuals, they didn't do 'group think'.... hence, they founded a country as a Republic, a nation of laws.... where people are free to worship or not in whatever way they deem fit.

Here's a novel idea... since you respect the Founders so much... why don't you follow their principles and mind your own fucking business about what other people do or do not believe.

Mind my own business? I'm sorry, I'm not going to sit back and watch my country become overcome with religious unreason. I don't care what people do in their own home, it's what they bring into the public sphere is what I'm talking about here. Just have to spell things out for some people I guess.

Then America is not the right country for you. I suggest you find one more appropriate.... North Korea might suit you.
 
President Jefferson was against organized religion.
The majority of all of our Founder's believed in God.
Jefferson approved of Jesus moral philosophy, without the miracles (which he did not believe in). That's why he wrote his own bible.
Our founders based our form of Government for the people to have morals.
What are morals?
The ten commandments

If you don't believe in God that part can be ignored.
The rest are morals.
work for 6 days, rest for at least on 1 day
Do not cheat on anyone, wife or business partners
Do not lie
Tell the truth
Honor your parents
Do not steal
Don't be jealous of neighbors or anyone else.
Don't murder

Without these basic principles that has held us together as a nation our constitution does not work.

Morals have existed before the ten commandments. Morals exist without the ten commandments even today all over the world. The ten commandments are your belief, not a code of law. I know that morals are required to maintain a society. But they aren't always based on superstitions.
 
Our Founding Fathers were individuals, they didn't do 'group think'.... hence, they founded a country as a Republic, a nation of laws.... where people are free to worship or not in whatever way they deem fit.

Here's a novel idea... since you respect the Founders so much... why don't you follow their principles and mind your own fucking business about what other people do or do not believe.

Mind my own business? I'm sorry, I'm not going to sit back and watch my country become overcome with religious unreason. I don't care what people do in their own home, it's what they bring into the public sphere is what I'm talking about here. Just have to spell things out for some people I guess.

Then America is not the right country for you. I suggest you find one more appropriate.... North Korea might suit you.

Oh, I'm sorry, being secular is un-American. I think I know what kind of person I'm talking to now.
 
Our Founding Fathers were individuals, they didn't do 'group think'.... hence, they founded a country as a Republic, a nation of laws.... where people are free to worship or not in whatever way they deem fit.

Here's a novel idea... since you respect the Founders so much... why don't you follow their principles and mind your own fucking business about what other people do or do not believe.

Mind my own business? I'm sorry, I'm not going to sit back and watch my country become overcome with religious unreason. I don't care what people do in their own home, it's what they bring into the public sphere is what I'm talking about here. Just have to spell things out for some people I guess.

See, you prove my point with your biased opinion.
 
On American Reason.

It’s hard to believe that many people in the world still give their faith to religion. Especially in this country. America, a nation founded on imagination, on philosophy, on rationality, and healthy skepticism. We are—or at least were—a nation with minds as free and wild and untamed as the land itself. What place does religion have in such a wide and untamed place? Surely, the belief or, more appropriately, the dry faith in religion should shrivel up and die in the hot sands of the American prairies. It doesn’t though. In fact, it thrives in the dry scrutiny of the desert like the burrobush. Growing thick and proud. It’s a weed with shallow roots.

We Americans are blessed with a great land. A land which stretches far and wide, and is plenty bountiful. Much of the land though, is rather arid. It’s difficult to farm the land in our country but, with hard work and perseverance, many people make it work. They forged for themselves a land that is fertile from land that was sterile. The same applies to the American mind. We are a country that is relatively new in the global macrocosm. Our forbearers came to this country with nothing. They came with no plan beyond escaping a life that didn’t work for them. Our country was planted in that infertile ground. From this arid rocky land, our forefathers forged a fertile nation. They created a place where we could grow free of the taint of forced thought, free of taxation without representation, free of the implications of institution. Free of the oppressive things that came with being European.

Our country has come to a point where we have forgotten those American ideals. Many Americans are allowing themselves to believe that this country was founded on the tenets of Christianity. Many would have you believe that our founding fathers were themselves God-fearing. This is certainly a powerful notion. But in actuality, these people are telling a counter-narrative, one in which they can’t be wrong. They are reading history in a way which sounds good and supports their own counter-narrative. They are backing it up with “irrefutable” facts based on their rigorous but ultimately erroneous readings of history. Should “circular logic” have a more precise definition, I haven’t heard it.

What these people don’t realize is that the earliest Americans had no fear of God. In fact, our founding fathers were quite outspoken in their non-Christian belief. Thomas Jefferson himself said: "Christianity is the most perverted system that ever shone on man." Jefferson was of course a founding father, the chief author of the Declaration of Independence and the third president of the United States. And he was not alone in his sentiments. Surely, there’s a reason many people believe that we are a Christian nation. But that reason doesn’t exist in reality. Unfortunately for us, Jefferson is dead. But so is Abraham.

I implore my fellow Americans to realize that we are not living in a Christian nation. We are living in a nation where we are allowed to think freely. We are allowed to go beyond the crushing yoke of theology.

Thanks for a thought provoking thead/post. I would like to have the quote from Jefferson sourced.
 
President Jefferson was against organized religion.
The majority of all of our Founder's believed in God.
Jefferson approved of Jesus moral philosophy, without the miracles (which he did not believe in). That's why he wrote his own bible.
Our founders based our form of Government for the people to have morals.
What are morals?
The ten commandments

If you don't believe in God that part can be ignored.
The rest are morals.
work for 6 days, rest for at least on 1 day
Do not cheat on anyone, wife or business partners
Do not lie
Tell the truth
Honor your parents
Do not steal
Don't be jealous of neighbors or anyone else.
Don't murder

Without these basic principles that has held us together as a nation our constitution does not work.

Morals have existed before the ten commandments. Morals exist without the ten commandments even today all over the world. The ten commandments are your belief, not a code of law. I know that morals are required to maintain a society. But they aren't always based on superstitions.

Then why have so many societies failed ?
 

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