Oil prices are dropping...

[jreeves]

Bloomberg.com: Worldwide
July 16 (Bloomberg) -- Crude oil futures fell more than $4 a barrel in New York after a surprise increase in U.S. inventories and as a slowing U.S. economy sapped demand for energy.

Supplies rose 2.95 million barrels to 296.9 million barrels last week, an Energy Department report showed. Stockpiles were forecast to drop 2.2 million barrels, according to a Bloomberg survey. Fuel demand averaged 20.3 million barrels a day in the past four weeks, down 2 percent from 2007, the department said.

``The inventory numbers are starting to reflect the bad macro-economic news,'' said Michael Lynch, president of Strategic Energy & Economic Research in Winchester, Massachusetts. ``Not only did we get a surprise build in crude-oil stocks, the products were also up nicely.''

Crude oil for August delivery fell $4.14, or 3 percent, to settle at $134.60 a barrel at 3 p.m. on the New York Mercantile Exchange. Prices dropped 7.3 percent since July 14, the biggest two-day decline since January 2007. Futures are up 81 percent from a year ago.

Oil today fell as low as $132 a barrel, more than 10 percent below the record of $147.27 reached on July 11. A drop of that magnitude is commonly referred to as a correction.



I believe right now is the time for Congress to lift the ban on offshore drilling. I think it would send oil prices plummetting.

 

[Charles_Main]

They are dropping mainly because people are feeling the crunch all around the world and using less.

So much for supply and Demand not effecting the price as some would have us believe.

I agree completely about announcing the lifting of the Congressional Ban on drilling, The mere act of saying so will lower the price we all pay.

 

[Paulie]

They are dropping mainly because people are feeling the crunch all around the world and using less.

So much for supply and Demand not effecting the price as some would have us believe.

I agree completely about announcing the lifting of the Congressional Ban on drilling, The mere act of saying so will lower the price we all pay.

I disagree. Since when is Congress' "word" good for anything?

When they break ground for new drilling and refinery construction, the market will respond.

But there's still the issue of the Dollar and inflation. Inflation is going to raise the price of oil, just like it raises the price of gold. Deficit budgets, national debt doubling...all those things are killing the Dollar, and oil is not going to respond favorably until the Dollar is treated the way it should be treated.

 

[Article 15]

But there's still the issue of the Dollar and inflation. Inflation is going to raise the price of oil, just like it raises the price of gold. Deficit budgets, national debt doubling...all those things are killing the Dollar, and oil is not going to respond favorably until the Dollar is treated the way it should be treated.

Ayup ...

Now if that could only fit that on a bumper sticker ...

 

[Wow]

Bloomberg.com: Worldwide
July 16 (Bloomberg) -- Crude oil futures fell more than $4 a barrel in New York after a surprise increase in U.S. inventories and as a slowing U.S. economy sapped demand for energy.

Supplies rose 2.95 million barrels to 296.9 million barrels last week, an Energy Department report showed. Stockpiles were forecast to drop 2.2 million barrels, according to a Bloomberg survey. Fuel demand averaged 20.3 million barrels a day in the past four weeks, down 2 percent from 2007, the department said.

``The inventory numbers are starting to reflect the bad macro-economic news,'' said Michael Lynch, president of Strategic Energy & Economic Research in Winchester, Massachusetts. ``Not only did we get a surprise build in crude-oil stocks, the products were also up nicely.''

Crude oil for August delivery fell $4.14, or 3 percent, to settle at $134.60 a barrel at 3 p.m. on the New York Mercantile Exchange. Prices dropped 7.3 percent since July 14, the biggest two-day decline since January 2007. Futures are up 81 percent from a year ago.

Oil today fell as low as $132 a barrel, more than 10 percent below the record of $147.27 reached on July 11. A drop of that magnitude is commonly referred to as a correction.



I believe right now is the time for Congress to lift the ban on offshore drilling. I think it would send oil prices plummetting.

This was the biggest decline in oil prices in 18 years.
Bush's actions did make a difference and now it's up to Democrats to keep it going down.
I wonder if Democrats will do nothing to lift the ban?

 

[Ravi]

This was the biggest decline in oil prices in 18 years.
Bush's actions did make a difference and now it's up to Democrats to keep it going down.
I wonder if Democrats will do nothing to lift the ban?

You're blaming Bush for the dismal economy and high gasoline prices?

Sweet!

 

[Wow]

You're blaming Bush for the dismal economy and high gasoline prices?

Sweet!

Even if Democrats lift the ban, environmentalists (Leftist Lawyers) will sue to block the action.
Since Democrats took over Congress, oil prices tripled and gasoline prices doubled.
By the way, why are Democrats blocking nuclear energy and wind farm energy?
France gets 80% of their power from nuclear energy and Italy is now going nuclear.
Democrats are still living in the 60s.
Democrats want to increase oil company profits and then take these profits at the expense of the American people.

 

[Diuretic]

Since Democrats took over Congress, oil prices tripled and gasoline prices doubled.

Riiiight - that's why all of us outside the US are noticing increased prices. If only you'd kept the Republicans in Congress, none of this would have happened!

 

[Ravi]

Dems control the world!

Sweet!

 

[Wow]

Dems control the world!

Sweet!

What dismal economy?
I'm seeing huge Corporate profits, oil has fallen $17 a barrel, Dow up 185.

Where is this recession?

Phil Gramm is right. You are an American whiner.

 

[Charles_Main]

I still think this is more a product of good old supply and Demand. Price goes up, people us less, price goes down. Of course that would kinda mess up the ideas of those who say drilling and increasing domestic supply would not lower prices eh. Or for that matter that building new refineries would not lower the price or Gas(not oil). TO me it does not take much thought to see when your refineries are at near capacity to refine Oil into gas, that building a few more would be wise.

 

[editec]

Could this mean that the bubble is leaking?

One can certainly hope so.

 

[Charles_Main]

Don't hold you breath, until be address the Debt, and thereby the weak dollar, things will not improve much on any front.

 

[Wow]

Could this mean that the bubble is leaking?

One can certainly hope so.

The Texas Energy Commission approved $4 Billion of wind farm contracts today!

This will be the largest wind farm in the world.

Environmentalists will fight it by declaring that doves are an endangered species....or some crap like that!

 

[Paulie]

Don't hold you breath, until be address the Debt, and thereby the weak dollar, things will not improve much on any front.

There are forces within the market that could cause the price to drop regardless of the Dollar, but that drop would certainly be short lived so long as the Dollar continues to be treated the way it currently is.

Everyone here thinks all this bullshit about building refineries, drilling here at home, etc, is going to magically make the problem go away. It will definitely bring the prices down, but it most certainly won't KEEP them down.

 

[Charles_Main]

There are forces within the market that could cause the price to drop regardless of the Dollar, but that drop would certainly be short lived so long as the Dollar continues to be treated the way it currently is.

Everyone here thinks all this bullshit about building refineries, drilling here at home, etc, is going to magically make the problem go away. It will definitely bring the prices down, but it most certainly won't KEEP them down.

I agree, however I do not think that is a argument not to do those things. With out even thinking about the price of oil and Gas, I can think of a very good reason to drill here.

To stop sending billions of dollars over there, to people who would use it to hurt us. To lower the trade deficit, and remove the need to even care what happens in the middle east. If we got 75% of our oil here instead of there, we would not even be having these debates, or be in Iraq for that matter.

I'm just saying

 

[Paulie]

I agree, however I do not think that is a argument not to do those things. With out even thinking about the price of oil and Gas, I can think of a very good reason to drill here.

To stop sending billions of dollars over there, to people who would use it to hurt us. To lower the trade deficit, and remove the need to even care what happens in the middle east. If we got 75% of our oil here instead of there, we would not even be having these debates, or be in Iraq for that matter.

I'm just saying

Don't get it twisted dude, I definitely favor drilling here at home and building refineries, but I'm just pointing out to the rest of the pie in the sky posters here that it's not going to keep the prices down long term.

How hard is it for people to understand that the world's number one import/export, the very thing that human life on this planet depends on, being pegged to the Dollar as it is, will naturally respond to the condition of the currency it is pegged to?

Look at the price of oil in gold. It barely changes throughout history. The line on the chart wavers slightly here and there, but ultimately, oil is always a constant price in gold. That's because gold holds a constant value historically, and goods do not necessarily "raise" in price. What happens is, the currency they are pegged to loses value, and therefore more currency is required to pay for those goods. Looking at how goods are priced in gold over, say, the last 100 years is a great example.

Read through this thread, specifically the OP: http://www.usmessageboard.com/economy/53981-maybe-ron-paul-was-right.html

Here's a chart that's included in that thread, just to preview. It shows oil since 1/1/2001 priced in USD, Euro, and Gold. Gold is the purple line. Notice how it stays constant, while the currencies that are being inflated are causing the price of oil to "rise". But how did the price "rise"? It didn't rise compared to gold. The currencies merely lost value, and hence, more were required to purchase oil.

 

[Charles_Main]

Don't get it twisted dude, I definitely favor drilling here at home and building refineries, but I'm just pointing out to the rest of the pie in the sky posters here that it's not going to keep the prices down long term.

How hard is it for people to understand that the world's number one import/export, the very thing that human life on this planet depends on, being pegged to the Dollar as it is, will naturally respond to the condition of the currency it is pegged to?

Look at the price of oil in gold. It barely changes throughout history. The line on the chart wavers slightly here and there, but ultimately, oil is always a constant price in gold. That's because gold holds a constant value historically, and goods do not necessarily "raise" in price. What happens is, the currency they are pegged to loses value, and therefore more currency is required to pay for those goods. Looking at how goods are priced in gold over, say, the last 100 years is a great example.

Read through this thread, specifically the OP: http://www.usmessageboard.com/economy/53981-maybe-ron-paul-was-right.html

Here's a chart that's included in that thread, just to preview. It shows oil since 1/1/2001 priced in USD, Euro, and Gold. Gold is the purple line. Notice how it stays constant, while the currencies that are being inflated are causing the price of oil to "rise". But how did the price "rise"? It didn't rise compared to gold. The currencies merely lost value, and hence, more were required to purchase oil.

sorry, man I was not implying you were against Drilling here, Was just pointing out that some use what you said as an argument not to.

 

[editec]

No argument that the price of oil and the relative value of the dollar are linked, but the SPIKE in oil prices exceeds the devaluation of the dollar by about fifty fucking times in the last year.

The bubble bursts when the market realizes that they have invested too heavily in the future price of oil.

I suspect (hope) that is happening right now.

The price of oil dropped from its all time high (was it up to 149?) to 129.96 as of 15 minutes ago.

I think it really ought to go down to about $80 when/if all the speculative bullshit gets wringed out of the spot price.

I'd expect to see some sympathetic downturns in the prices of commodities, too, ( gold and silver, for example) if the price of oil collapses, which is damned well better, BTW.

If the price of oil completely blows out, expect the next dumb assed sheeple's bubble (this is for someone who asked, BTW ) to be in things like airlines and other industries stocks which were being killed on the spike in oil prices.

 

[Paulie]

No argument that the price of oil and the relative value of the dollar are linked, but the SPIKE in oil prices exceeds the devaluation of the dollar by about fifty fucking times in the last year.

Not necessarily.

Here's oil's trend:

And here's USD vs. Oil from the 2nd half of last year:

Look at the trend between USD and Oil. They move almost in lockstep with one another. It's unmistakable. That's the market reacting normally. Give me one good reason why not to be invested in energy right now?

I think it really ought to go down to about $80 when/if all the speculative bullshit gets wringed out of the spot price.

That's all well and good, but what keeps oil down after THAT?

I'd expect to see some sympathetic downturns in the prices of commodities, too, ( gold and silver, for example) if the price of oil collapses, which is damned well better, BTW.

How will gold and silver come down? Unless the Fed starts taking immediate deflationary actions like raising rates, gold and silver have nowhere to go but up. And smart investors who don't eat the government's bullshit for breakfast, lunch, and dinner will even be wary of rate hikes, and I wouldn't be surprised to see PM's and even the Dollar make no real significant moves...for at least the first few rate hikes, anyway. I suspect it may be why the Fed hasn't made any move to raise rates just yet. They are scared that a rate hike will not have an effect on the Dollar, and the PR mess it could cause. It's still not bad to hold PM's though. It will NEVER be bad to hold PM's.