“occupy protests” are bull.

[BDBoop]

You're absolutely right. I'd be shaking the dust off my shoes in their general direction as well.

They won't succeed, this lot you refer to. They're too busy cutting off noses to spite faces.

 

[deepthunk]

You're absolutely right. I'd be shaking the dust off my shoes in their general direction as well.

They won't succeed, this lot you refer to. They're too busy cutting off noses to spite faces.

Well, in all fairness I didn’t mean to suggest that these issues automatically exists with all occupy protests everywhere. I just worry that they might and that concerns me, because if we the people are ever going to do anything to rein in this counties frightening march toward corporate control and fascism, we need to do it now, before things get so bad that it’s too late.

 

[deepthunk]

There are a few more things I would like to say about this issue before I let the matter drop.
I noted on the news this morning that some in the press are now wink_2 starting to catch on to the fact that a percentage, if not the majority of the protesters are actually just homeless people with nothing better to do. A little fact that may also be of interest to certain people is that the protesters (at least the ones here in Tucson, and likely elsewhere as well) are giving food to the public without any concern what-so-ever about health codes or food safety standards, in fact on Saturday I noted that they had slices of fruit out that were covered in flies and they just batted the flies off and gave it out anyway. I say it might be of interest because they would likely lose a number of their “supporters” if they were no longer giving out free food, of course those might be supporters that some would prefer they have, but I leave that to the discretion of those who are more informed.
The reason I’m stating the above, and that which follows is because I happen to know that a number of representatives of lobbyists and special interest groups prowl this forum pushing their agendas and gauging the opinions of the politically opinionated, as a result there is in fact at least a slim chance that what I’m writing might actually be read by one or more of the organizers that perpetrated this little scam and I have a thing or two I would like to say to them directly.
1. When you treat people like crap by looking down your nose at them or being dismissive, most people (myself included) get angry. When a moderate average person walks into a protest that said person can plainly see is dominated by liberals, and those liberals treat them like crap, it doesn’t win you any votes. Lest we forget, the enemy of my enemy is my ally, if liberals are going to assume someone is their enemy because their clean cut and clean shaven, because their wearing work clothes, or for any reason, it tends to push people over to the conservative side who would not go there otherwise. This is extremely important because the moderate majority of Americans really are fed up with the corporate corruption in Washington, as a result a lot of moderates (who may not look like they would support you but do) are likely to be drawn to those protests and democrats can ill afford to alienate voters at this time (not that I don’t have a beef or two with the elected democrats but I’ll get to that in a moment).
2. This issue is important and the appearance and behavior of the protesters are making it appear that anyone who opposes corporate control and corruption in Washington is “just some liberal wacko”, and in reality that is not the case. Furthermore the protesters are clouding the real and vital underlying issue by putting their often irrelevant and sometimes silly personal agendas ahead of the overarching issue their purportedly trying to address. That pushes away people who would support the protesters on the issue of corporate corruption, but will not support every agenda item they try to throw on top of it.
3. Last but certainly not least. While the issue of corporate corruption in Washington is vital and must be addressed for the good of this country (and possibly the entire world), I do NOT support the democrats using this as a wedge issue to “energize their base”. The reason is that liberal officials are every bit as guilty of taking corporate bribes (in the form of campaign contributions, perks, cushy jobs, and so forth) as conservatives are, and when they play innocent while pretending that their somehow different, they mislead the American people into believing that the issue has been addressed when it is in fact worse than ever.
Back in the election of ’92 when Ross Perot was running for office, he was asked in a debate about the then proposed legislation called NAFTA, Ross Perot’s response was that if NAFTA passed, we would “hear the giant sucking sound of American jobs being sucked across our southern border”. While I may not have supported Perot (had I even been old enough to vote at the time), and would not have stated it so colorfully, with hindsight there is no doubt in my mind that what-so-ever that he was absolutely right. That bill had total bipartisan support, and that bill (along with most other free trade agreements) cost not only the working class in general, but a number of union workers their jobs. I for one think it’s high time that labor unions stop for a moment and take a long hard look at the fact that democrats have repeatedly taken their financial, moral, and electoral support while secretly bending them over the proverbial table and screwing them (along with a lot of other people who gave them support).
The reason that democrats supported NAFTA and numerous, similar pieces of legislation (including the free trade agreement with South Korea that Obama recently signed) is the same reason republicans have supported them, because corporations who were looking to outsource jobs for profit bribed them with campaign contributions to do so.
Like so many of the policies corporations lobby for, these trade agreements are bad for America as a whole because they cost the wages of the lower fifty percent of earners resulting in reductions in consumer spending, because consumer spending is 70% of economic activity, this hurts the economy as a whole and therefore (when one steps back to look at the big picture) hurts the vary corporations and wealthy citizens that lobby for them. Furthermore, if a foreign enemy with a significant navy (such as the one china is building at this very moment) were to cut us off from our foreign trade partners, the American economy would collapse overnight because the vast majority of the goods we buy and sell are made overseas. As a result, these trade agreements not only hurt the country economically, they place us in a position of tactical vulnerability, and therefore they are harmful to the entire nation and everyone in it. Unfortunately however, the corporations, wealthy citizens, and elected officials who decide these policies are simply too blinded by their own greed to recognize that what they’re doing is ultimately going to result in economic, social, and (god help us if it does) strategic military disaster.
Furthermore, there is no doubt in my mind that the real reason democrats recently caved on the issue of revenue increases, is because not only do the top 2% contribute to their campaigns from time to time, most democrats are rich enough too themselves benefit directly from those tax breaks. There is no doubt in my mind that the end result of that cave in (along with the political game the republicans chose to play to begin with), was the economy taking far more damage than it would have otherwise (even if there had been a government shutdown)
The above stated reasons (along with the fact that the protesters pissed me off) is why I would try to undermine the protest in spite of the fact that I support them in opposing corporate corruption in Washington, because this issue is too vital to be used for political gain, made light of, or clouded with irrelevant side issue’s. In my humble opinion, ending that corporate corruption is nothing short of vital to the very survival of the United States of America, and I put that above any and all other concerns.
My message to democrats is simple, you (just like the republicans) need to clean up your act and start putting the needs of the country above your own personal greed. Of course that’s not going to happen unless we have a real, unbiased, and focused effort to address this very bipartisan problem. Sadly, since the golden rule in America is that he (or she) who has the gold makes the rule, that would require someone with the necessary resources to wake up and realize it would be in their own best interests to do so, and I can’t imagine who that might be.

 

[BDBoop]

There are a few more things I would like to say about this issue before I let the matter drop.

I noted on the news this morning that some in the press are now wink_2 starting to catch on to the fact that a percentage, if not the majority of the protesters are actually just homeless people with nothing better to do. A little fact that may also be of interest to certain people is that the protesters (at least the ones here in Tucson, and likely elsewhere as well) are giving food to the public without any concern what-so-ever about health codes or food safety standards, in fact on Saturday I noted that they had slices of fruit out that were covered in flies and they just batted the flies off and gave it out anyway. I say it might be of interest because they would likely lose a number of their “supporters” if they were no longer giving out free food, of course those might be supporters that some would prefer they have, but I leave that to the discretion of those who are more informed.

The reason I’m stating the above, and that which follows is because I happen to know that a number of representatives of lobbyists and special interest groups prowl this forum pushing their agendas and gauging the opinions of the politically opinionated, as a result there is in fact at least a slim chance that what I’m writing might actually be read by one or more of the organizers that perpetrated this little scam and I have a thing or two I would like to say to them directly.

1. When you treat people like crap by looking down your nose at them or being dismissive, most people (myself included) get angry. When a moderate average person walks into a protest that said person can plainly see is dominated by liberals, and those liberals treat them like crap, it doesn’t win you any votes. Lest we forget, the enemy of my enemy is my ally, if liberals are going to assume someone is their enemy because their clean cut and clean shaven, because their wearing work clothes, or for any reason, it tends to push people over to the conservative side who would not go there otherwise. This is extremely important because the moderate majority of Americans really are fed up with the corporate corruption in Washington, as a result a lot of moderates (who may not look like they would support you but do) are likely to be drawn to those protests and democrats can ill afford to alienate voters at this time (not that I don’t have a beef or two with the elected democrats but I’ll get to that in a moment).

2. This issue is important and the appearance and behavior of the protesters are making it appear that anyone who opposes corporate control and corruption in Washington is “just some liberal wacko”, and in reality that is not the case. Furthermore the protesters are clouding the real and vital underlying issue by putting their often irrelevant and sometimes silly personal agendas ahead of the overarching issue their purportedly trying to address. That pushes away people who would support the protesters on the issue of corporate corruption, but will not support every agenda item they try to throw on top of it.

3. Last but certainly not least. While the issue of corporate corruption in Washington is vital and must be addressed for the good of this country (and possibly the entire world), I do NOT support the democrats using this as a wedge issue to “energize their base”. The reason is that liberal officials are every bit as guilty of taking corporate bribes (in the form of campaign contributions, perks, cushy jobs, and so forth) as conservatives are, and when they play innocent while pretending that their somehow different, they mislead the American people into believing that the issue has been addressed when it is in fact worse than ever.

Back in the election of ’92 when Ross Perot was running for office, he was asked in a debate about the then proposed legislation called NAFTA, Ross Perot’s response was that if NAFTA passed, we would “hear the giant sucking sound of American jobs being sucked across our southern border”. While I may not have supported Perot (had I even been old enough to vote at the time), and would not have stated it so colorfully, with hindsight there is no doubt in my mind that what-so-ever that he was absolutely right. That bill had total bipartisan support, and that bill (along with most other free trade agreements) cost not only the working class in general, but a number of union workers their jobs. I for one think it’s high time that labor unions stop for a moment and take a long hard look at the fact that democrats have repeatedly taken their financial, moral, and electoral support while secretly bending them over the proverbial table and screwing them (along with a lot of other people who gave them support).

The reason that democrats supported NAFTA and numerous, similar pieces of legislation (including the free trade agreement with South Korea that Obama recently signed) is the same reason republicans have supported them, because corporations who were looking to outsource jobs for profit bribed them with campaign contributions to do so.

Like so many of the policies corporations lobby for, these trade agreements are bad for America as a whole because they cost the wages of the lower fifty percent of earners resulting in reductions in consumer spending, because consumer spending is 70% of economic activity, this hurts the economy as a whole and therefore (when one steps back to look at the big picture) hurts the vary corporations and wealthy citizens that lobby for them. Furthermore, if a foreign enemy with a significant navy (such as the one china is building at this very moment) were to cut us off from our foreign trade partners, the American economy would collapse overnight because the vast majority of the goods we buy and sell are made overseas. As a result, these trade agreements not only hurt the country economically, they place us in a position of tactical vulnerability, and therefore they are harmful to the entire nation and everyone in it. Unfortunately however, the corporations, wealthy citizens, and elected officials who decide these policies are simply too blinded by their own greed to recognize that what they’re doing is ultimately going to result in economic, social, and (god help us if it does) strategic military disaster.

Furthermore, there is no doubt in my mind that the real reason democrats recently caved on the issue of revenue increases, is because not only do the top 2% contribute to their campaigns from time to time, most democrats are rich enough too themselves benefit directly from those tax breaks. There is no doubt in my mind that the end result of that cave in (along with the political game the republicans chose to play to begin with), was the economy taking far more damage than it would have otherwise (even if there had been a government shutdown)

The above stated reasons (along with the fact that the protesters pissed me off) is why I would try to undermine the protest in spite of the fact that I support them in opposing corporate corruption in Washington, because this issue is too vital to be used for political gain, made light of, or clouded with irrelevant side issue’s. In my humble opinion, ending that corporate corruption is nothing short of vital to the very survival of the United States of America, and I put that above any and all other concerns.

My message to democrats is simple, you (just like the republicans) need to clean up your act and start putting the needs of the country above your own personal greed. Of course that’s not going to happen unless we have a real, unbiased, and focused effort to address this very bipartisan problem. Sadly, since the golden rule in America is that he (or she) who has the gold makes the rule, that would require someone with the necessary resources to wake up and realize it would be in their own best interests to do so, and I can’t imagine who that might be.

Sorry, just avoiding a 'teal deer' moment so I can actually read the post.

 

[Sallow]

Since I live in Tucson Arizona and since the issue of wealth (especially corporate wealth) corrupting Washington has been a high priority for me for years, I’ve visited the “Occupy Tucson” protest several times this week, and in fact just spent the day there. Frankly I’ve been growing more and more frustrated and disheartened, this protest just isn’t what it appears to be from watching it on the news.
As it turns out this protest is neither as spontaneous nor as open and democratic as the protesters lead us to believe.
The protest was sponsored by a handful of ranking members of the local democratic party, that in itself is not a bad thing of course, but in reality most of the protesters are just homeless people who would be camping outside anyway but stay in the park now because the protests organizers feed them right there (and they couldn’t care less about the same citations they get all the time anyway).
Those four or five ranking local democrats paid for everything and control everything, even in the so called “general assembly”; they immediately silence anyone who opposes anything on their agenda including issues they have which have nothing to do with corporate corruption, disagrees with them with regards to their approach to the protest, or even disagrees with their handling of any logistical issues.
The fact is, while I remain steadfast in my opposition to corporate control of Washington, extremists from the far left have taken total control of the protest and as a moderate I feel completely out of place, and even a little ostracized by the extremists.
Suffice to say I’m a little disappointed as I would like to support the protesters because the issue of corporate power and control of Washington is critical and needs to be addressed, however I don’t support the banning of raising animals for food because I like steak, and I don’t belong at that protest any more than I belong at a tea party convention. That leaves me wondering, if I don’t belong at their event, and can’t support all, or even the majority of the issues their protesting, how can I support them? Obviously I cannot.

For bull they are going global.

There's "Occupy <something>" in nearly every corner of the world.

It's not the astroturf of the Tea Party pissed about a black president and possible mortgage bailouts. This is really pissed off people pissed off at the right elements.

 

[deepthunk]

Lol, sorry, I actually had paragraph spaces in there but they somehow disappeared when I posted. Oh well, thanks.

 

[BDBoop]

Lol, sorry, I actually had paragraph spaces in there but they somehow disappeared when I posted. Oh well, thanks.

I know! I could see the return, but not the necessary double-space to avoid my eyeballs bleeding.

 

[deepthunk]

Since I live in Tucson Arizona and since the issue of wealth (especially corporate wealth) corrupting Washington has been a high priority for me for years, I’ve visited the “Occupy Tucson” protest several times this week, and in fact just spent the day there. Frankly I’ve been growing more and more frustrated and disheartened, this protest just isn’t what it appears to be from watching it on the news.
As it turns out this protest is neither as spontaneous nor as open and democratic as the protesters lead us to believe.
The protest was sponsored by a handful of ranking members of the local democratic party, that in itself is not a bad thing of course, but in reality most of the protesters are just homeless people who would be camping outside anyway but stay in the park now because the protests organizers feed them right there (and they couldn’t care less about the same citations they get all the time anyway).
Those four or five ranking local democrats paid for everything and control everything, even in the so called “general assembly”; they immediately silence anyone who opposes anything on their agenda including issues they have which have nothing to do with corporate corruption, disagrees with them with regards to their approach to the protest, or even disagrees with their handling of any logistical issues.
The fact is, while I remain steadfast in my opposition to corporate control of Washington, extremists from the far left have taken total control of the protest and as a moderate I feel completely out of place, and even a little ostracized by the extremists.
Suffice to say I’m a little disappointed as I would like to support the protesters because the issue of corporate power and control of Washington is critical and needs to be addressed, however I don’t support the banning of raising animals for food because I like steak, and I don’t belong at that protest any more than I belong at a tea party convention. That leaves me wondering, if I don’t belong at their event, and can’t support all, or even the majority of the issues their protesting, how can I support them? Obviously I cannot.

For bull they are going global.

There's "Occupy <something>" in nearly every corner of the world.

It's not the astroturf of the Tea Party pissed about a black president and possible mortgage bailouts. This is really pissed off people pissed off at the right elements.

oh I know a lot of people are pissed and I’m one of them ( that’s also why the protesters message of peace and love doesn’t fly with me).
Having said that however, I know for a fact that the issue has been hijacked by democrats hoping to energize their base before the next election, and that’s why I say their bull. It’s not that the issue of corporate corruption is bull, the problem I have is that the protesters (that I have encountered) and all the little side issues they keep injecting into the discussion are bull.
To truly be successful the protesters need to come from both sides of the isle and be focused solely on the issue at hand, not totally left wing and shouting about everything from eat natural foods to save the bull weevil.

 

[Sallow]

Since I live in Tucson Arizona and since the issue of wealth (especially corporate wealth) corrupting Washington has been a high priority for me for years, I’ve visited the “Occupy Tucson” protest several times this week, and in fact just spent the day there. Frankly I’ve been growing more and more frustrated and disheartened, this protest just isn’t what it appears to be from watching it on the news.
As it turns out this protest is neither as spontaneous nor as open and democratic as the protesters lead us to believe.
The protest was sponsored by a handful of ranking members of the local democratic party, that in itself is not a bad thing of course, but in reality most of the protesters are just homeless people who would be camping outside anyway but stay in the park now because the protests organizers feed them right there (and they couldn’t care less about the same citations they get all the time anyway).
Those four or five ranking local democrats paid for everything and control everything, even in the so called “general assembly”; they immediately silence anyone who opposes anything on their agenda including issues they have which have nothing to do with corporate corruption, disagrees with them with regards to their approach to the protest, or even disagrees with their handling of any logistical issues.
The fact is, while I remain steadfast in my opposition to corporate control of Washington, extremists from the far left have taken total control of the protest and as a moderate I feel completely out of place, and even a little ostracized by the extremists.
Suffice to say I’m a little disappointed as I would like to support the protesters because the issue of corporate power and control of Washington is critical and needs to be addressed, however I don’t support the banning of raising animals for food because I like steak, and I don’t belong at that protest any more than I belong at a tea party convention. That leaves me wondering, if I don’t belong at their event, and can’t support all, or even the majority of the issues their protesting, how can I support them? Obviously I cannot.

For bull they are going global.

There's "Occupy <something>" in nearly every corner of the world.

It's not the astroturf of the Tea Party pissed about a black president and possible mortgage bailouts. This is really pissed off people pissed off at the right elements.

oh I know a lot of people are pissed and I’m one of them ( that’s also why the protesters message of peace and love doesn’t fly with me).
Having said that however, I know for a fact that the issue has been hijacked by democrats hoping to energize their base before the next election, and that’s why I say their bull. It’s not that the issue of corporate corruption is bull, the problem I have is that the protesters (that I have encountered) and all the little side issues they keep injecting into the discussion are bull.
To truly be successful the protesters need to come from both sides of the isle and be focused solely on the issue at hand, not totally left wing and shouting about everything from eat natural foods to save the bull weevil.

And what? The Republicans didn't "hijack" (for lack of a better term because I think they actually manufactured the Tea Party) a movement?

It would be stupid for them not to. They also seem to be the party that wants to do something about regulations. Republicans just bray on and on about the "cost of doing business" due to regulations. That's nuts. Those regulations wouldn't need to be in place if people weren't so fucking greedy. Even Greenspan was amazed.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Since I live in Tucson Arizona and since the issue of wealth (especially corporate wealth) corrupting Washington has been a high priority for me for years, I’ve visited the “Occupy Tucson” protest several times this week, and in fact just spent the day there. Frankly I’ve been growing more and more frustrated and disheartened, this protest just isn’t what it appears to be from watching it on the news.
As it turns out this protest is neither as spontaneous nor as open and democratic as the protesters lead us to believe.
The protest was sponsored by a handful of ranking members of the local democratic party, that in itself is not a bad thing of course, but in reality most of the protesters are just homeless people who would be camping outside anyway but stay in the park now because the protests organizers feed them right there (and they couldn’t care less about the same citations they get all the time anyway).
Those four or five ranking local democrats paid for everything and control everything, even in the so called “general assembly”; they immediately silence anyone who opposes anything on their agenda including issues they have which have nothing to do with corporate corruption, disagrees with them with regards to their approach to the protest, or even disagrees with their handling of any logistical issues.
The fact is, while I remain steadfast in my opposition to corporate control of Washington, extremists from the far left have taken total control of the protest and as a moderate I feel completely out of place, and even a little ostracized by the extremists.
Suffice to say I’m a little disappointed as I would like to support the protesters because the issue of corporate power and control of Washington is critical and needs to be addressed, however I don’t support the banning of raising animals for food because I like steak, and I don’t belong at that protest any more than I belong at a tea party convention. That leaves me wondering, if I don’t belong at their event, and can’t support all, or even the majority of the issues their protesting, how can I support them? Obviously I cannot.

Good for you for actually going though and checking it out. Too bad its not for you.

I would suggest doing the same thing at a tea party rally....from your post it seems you may like them a lot more than the OWS people.....both groups are mad at how things are but have a totally different message and approach to it.

OWS: Things suck, its wall-streets fault, people should give me more than I'm getting
TEA: Things suck, its big govts fault, government should shrink and get out of my way so I can get more than I'm getting.

 

[deepthunk]

I just finished writing the following to print out and post up at occupy Tucson in desperate hopes of saving the protest. I would like some opinions and/or suggestions before I print it. Anyone?

-------------------

As a shameless Star Trek fan, I've seen the movie star trek 6 so many times I couldn't possibly hope to count them all, and in that movie there is a line spoken (or rather angrily shouted) by one of the Klingon's in that film that says simply, "we are betrayed!" Those simple words may not amount to an eloquent rousing speech, however when it comes to the relationship between the Democratic Party and the occupy protesters it says enough.

Ladies and gentlemen, we are betrayed.

While the protests organizers have tried to maintain the illusion that this protest is led by its members through direct democracy, one of the first things I noticed was that the person "tallying" the votes (which are conducted by a vague "show of hands" rather than the verifiable paper ballot system) made no effort what-so-ever to actually count the hands in the air, but rather he glanced up for barely a second (not nearly long enough to count), then marked down whatever it is he marked down. When the voting was finished I noted his "tally" of votes didn't even come close to matching my count. The fact is the person who was counting didn't count at all, he simply prioritized the agenda items as he saw fit. And this was hardly an isolated incident; this has been a consistent pattern of behavior. That vote counter was a member of the small "clique" which somehow seems to always end up in charge of the work groups, and always seems to get its way in general assembly votes. Having spent the last two weeks watching and working to figure out what's going on (and what's going wrong) I have come to the conclusion with no doubt in my mind that said clique is comprised of representatives of the local democratic party.

Why would the protests organizers choose Armory Park as the location over Veinte De Agosto Park? Early on it was claimed that this was to avoid interfering with the Tucson meet yourself event, however in reality that event did NOT include De Agosto Park and staging a protest there not only would not have interfered with it, the event would have worked to the protests advantage had De Agosto park been used. Furthermore De Agosto is right in front of the Unisource energy tower and literally in the median of a main traffic artery, there can be NO BETTER LOCATION for this protest. The fact is Armory Park is out of sight, and out of sight is out of mind, that's just where local democrats would prefer it, out of the minds of the citizens of Tucson.

I may vote for almost every democrat in every election, but that doesn't mean I follow them blindly, and because my eyes are open I can plainly see that we are being misled.

Lest we forget, liberal officials are every bit as guilty of taking corporate bribes (in the form of campaign contributions, perks, cushy jobs, and so forth) as conservatives are. They have every bit the vested interest in the corporate corruption of Washington that the republicans and tea partiers do. So while democrats may be giving lip service to supporting the protest in the interest of using it to energize their base, the reality is they would far prefer it if the protests just "went away".

That's why the painfully poor decision was made to place the protest in Armory Park followed by one bad decision after another which the democratic "clique" may have pretended to allow you to vote on, but for which the votes were in fact not counted. Those bad decisions are the real reason the protest is stagnant and languishing into nonexistence and those bad decisions are a direct consequence of the involvement of the local Democratic Party.

Ladies and gentlemen, I say it again, we are betrayed!

That why I'm asking, correction, begging each and every REAL occupy protester to leave behind that "clique" of five or six local democratic party reps behind, pack up your tents and move to the REAL occupy protest in De Agosto park. And My message to that clique of democrats is much simpler, you (just like the republicans) need to clean up your act and start putting the needs of the country above your own personal greed.

 

[deepthunk]

Ya know, when I first visited the protest I first noted that one of the problems with the direct democratic system they employ is that everybody had a bunch of different ideas about how to do things and no one was really thinking practically about important basic matters, or noting various issues such as the poor appearance, drug habits, and criminal histories of the homeless who had joined them, issues with food safety (after all one contaminated batch of food could have ended the protest in a single day), and so forth. One could not bring this up with the protesters (especially the issue with removing the homeless, because they have such hearts), because they are indeed a lot like cats, and you can&#8217;t herd a cat, you need a piece of fish or a squirt bottle to get a cat to do anything.

Fortunately, the issue with the homeless came to light before any of them committed any crimes the conservatives could exploit in the press, and thanks to the health department the food is now being served from a clean sanitary facility.

I was just over at the protest today, and the place has really clean up nicely. The tents are all new, the people are all clean cut up-standing citizens and I can&#8217;t imagine any Joe Average being in dissuaded in any way by the appearance of it from walking through that park or talking to anyone there.

It would appear that even though they are leaderless and no good decisions were made, that things coincidentally worked out for their benefit. I couldn&#8217;t be happier.