Obama’s Economists: ‘Stimulus’ Has Cost $278,000 per Job

[The Rabbi]

The payroll tax credit was so bad that 2 GOP senators want it repealed. It simply is a failure. Like the rest of his program.

 

[DontBeStupid]

The payroll tax credit was so bad that 2 GOP senators want it repealed. It simply is a failure. Like the rest of his program.

Wait. You and the GOP are now saying a tax credit is not the answer for increased job growth?

Hell has frozen over.

 

[DontBeStupid]

All that being said, anyone who claims the Recovery Act was a waste or was a failure is just lying. Two and a half million jobs is not a failure.

So you don't just disagree with us, you're accusing us of bad faith? Two and a half million jobs at $666 billion is a massive failure when the Republic faces a $14 trillion debt.

Correct. I am.

For decades now we have had to listen to the GOP scream and cry and lie about how tax cuts will not only pay for themselves, but will magically create jobs, increase revenue and cure erectile dysfunction. However, now that Obama has gone and implemented GOP ideas, in an effort to get GOP support, which they withheld, now the GOP and the good little "conservatives" are screaming and crying about how bad the tax cuts were at job creation.

The hypocrisy is really pretty amazing.

 

[xsited1]

How can it be possible not to understand why we are in such dire straights. So whats the next trick of this administration?

Obama

They were warned:

With all due respect Mr.President, that is not true.

 

[The Rabbi]

The payroll tax credit was so bad that 2 GOP senators want it repealed. It simply is a failure. Like the rest of his program.

Wait. You and the GOP are now saying a tax credit is not the answer for increased job growth?

Hell has frozen over.

Don't be stupid.
Not every "tax credit" is going to be effective at encouraging growth. Temporary, "targeted" breaks will do nothing but increase the deficit.
Permanent changes that increase the incentive to work harder and invest more will increase the economy, and thus job growth.

 

[Trajan]

1. Nice to see the wingnuts conceding that the stimulus did in fact create or save almost 3 million jobs.

2. Keep in mind, the stimulus' cost included almost 300 billion in tax cuts.

oh, so NOW you're down with "tax cuts" ( I only use the term because you did and you are incapable of simple addition and subtraction)

 

[Trajan]

Tax cuts, tax credits, tax incentives. There's certainly a difference, but there's a key similarity: they all add to the debt equally.

Here's wiki's rundown.

Tax incentives for individuals
Total: $237 billion

$116 billion: New payroll tax credit of $400 per worker and $800 per couple in 2009 and 2010. Phaseout begins at $75,000 for individuals and $150,000 for joint filers.[28]
$70 billion: Alternative minimum tax: a one year increase in AMT floor to $70,950 for joint filers for 2009.[28]
$15 billion: Expansion of child tax credit: A $1,000 credit to more families (even those that do not make enough money to pay income taxes).
$14 billion: Expanded college credit to provide a $2,500 expanded tax credit for college tuition and related expenses for 2009 and 2010. The credit is phased out for couples making more than $160,000.
$6.6 billion: Homebuyer credit: $8,000 refundable credit for all homes bought between 1/1/2009 and 12/1/2009 and repayment provision repealed for homes purchased in 2009 and held more than three years. This only applies to first-time homebuyers.[40]
$4.7 billion: Excluding from taxation the first $2,400 a person receives in unemployment compensation benefits in 2009.
$4.7 billion: Expanded earned income tax credit to increase the earned income tax credit — which provides money to low income workers — for families with at least three children.
$4.3 billion: Home energy credit to provide an expanded credit to homeowners who make their homes more energy-efficient in 2009 and 2010. Homeowners could recoup 30 percent of the cost up to $1,500 of numerous projects, such as installing energy-efficient windows, doors, furnaces and air conditioners.
$1.7 billion: for deduction of sales tax from car purchases, not interest payments phased out for incomes above $250,000.

Tax incentives for companies
Total: $51 billion

$15 billion: Allowing companies to use current losses to offset profits made in the previous five years, instead of two, making them eligible for tax refunds.
$13 billion: to extend tax credits for renewable energy production (until 2014).
$11 billion: Government contractors: Repeal a law that takes effect in 2012, requiring government agencies to withhold three percent of payments to contractors to help ensure they pay their tax bills. Repealing the law would cost $11 billion over 10 years, in part because the government could not earn interest by holding the money throughout the year.
$7 billion: Repeal bank credit: Repeal a Treasury provision that allowed firms that buy money-losing banks to use more of the losses as tax credits to offset the profits of the merged banks for tax purposes. The change would increase taxes on the merged banks by $7 billion over 10 years.
$5 billion: Bonus depreciation which extends a provision allowing businesses buying equipment such as computers to speed up its depreciation through 2009.

The $51 billion in tax incentives for companies were all terrible, as Rabbi suggests, but this was less than 20% of the full figure.

The wasteful homebuyer/home energy/car purchase incentives only total to $12.6 billion (CARS aka Cash for Clunkers wasn't part of the ARRA). Less than 5%.

So 40% of the $288 billion in tax incentive provisions was the $116 billion payroll tax credit. This is certainly wasteful. The credit is placed on the taxpayer side, so there's no encouragement for businesses to retain/hire employees. It would have been better to apply that $116 billion to food stamps or unemployment programs.

All that being said, anyone who claims the Recovery Act was a waste or was a failure is just lying. Two and a half million jobs is not a failure.

So you don't just disagree with us, you're accusing us of bad faith? Two and a half million jobs at $666 billion is a massive failure when the Republic faces a $14 trillion debt.

what happened to paygo?

 

[DontBeStupid]

How can it be possible not to understand why we are in such dire straights. So whats the next trick of this administration?

Obama

They were warned:

With all due respect Mr.President, that is not true.

Interesting choice of links, since they were wrong.

 

[The Rabbi]

How can it be possible not to understand why we are in such dire straights. So whats the next trick of this administration?

Obama

They were warned:

With all due respect Mr.President, that is not true.

Interesting choice of links, since they were wrong.

No, they weren't.
In fact everything predicted was true.

 

[DontBeStupid]

They were warned:

With all due respect Mr.President, that is not true.

Interesting choice of links, since they were wrong.

No, they weren't.
In fact everything predicted was true.

Maybe I missed the predictions from the one page of names that was linked. What exactly did Cato predict? Because the whole topic of this thread is based around the fact that millions of jobs were created.

 

[Avorysuds]

The payroll tax credit was so bad that 2 GOP senators want it repealed. It simply is a failure. Like the rest of his program.

Wait. You and the GOP are now saying a tax credit is not the answer for increased job growth?

Hell has frozen over.

A tax credit is not a tax cut, it’s a deficit building program that usually is aimed at poor people who don’t create jobs anyways.

Low and consistent taxes are key, or help with a stable economy. You’re a hack, you know it and I know it. No one on these boards that I have ever seen claim that neither “tax credits ”nor“ tax cuts” will fix the economy, just help it along. You’re just pissed because Obama’s stimulus was an epic sized failure that is permanently recorded in our history.

You’re dishonest, lie and have cheated your way through debates sense you came to these boards.

 

[Trajan]

How can it be possible not to understand why we are in such dire straights. So whats the next trick of this administration?

Obama

They were warned:

With all due respect Mr.President, that is not true.

Interesting choice of links, since they were wrong.

he and harry are attempting to craft a Romulan cloak for stimulus called- Investments...krugmans calcs ante- stimulus said 630 billion or so would do, the Admins plan ala Romer? do we need to post that again? 8% unemployment...etc.

they cannot even QUANTIFY the jobs they say they created, the cbo has been saying anywhere between 1.4 and 3.3 million- so now they have settle don 2.4 , how friggin convenient, right smack dab in the middle of their 250% error estimate window....

 

[Avorysuds]

DontBeStupid, what is it? Did the Stimulus that was huge "tax credits" save the country from a Depression or not... You can't claim it worked and argue that it was mostly "tax credits" that did it while also claiming "tax credits" are evil and don't create jobs... Pick a side and stick to it, you catch yourself in so much partisan bullshit it seems pointless to "debate" you... Most people only make you look like a fool so people who read the boards and don't post can LOL at you.

 

[American Cowboy]

Here we go again. Fun with numbers again. You guys seem to think the entire Recovery Act was money sent directly to people in the form of salaries. It wasn't, so dividing the jobs number by the total just gets you some generic jobs/$ spent number, which means pretty much nothing. Not to mention, this is over 2 years, and no one here is even talking about the annual amounts, which would at least be more useful.

Plus, as has already been stated, and was stated in the report, $292B of the Recover Act stimulus was in the form of tax cuts. As has been talked about for years now, tax cuts are a terrible way to stimulate the economy. This is just more proof of that. Had the entire Recovery Act been a jobs programs, the job numbers would have been much better.

All that being said, anyone who claims the Recovery Act was a waste or was a failure is just lying. Two and a half million jobs is not a failure. Getting the economy growing again is not a failure. The only problems with the Recovery Act was the tax cuts and its size. Too many tax cuts and not enough spending.

You are ignoring the facts.

Have another cuo

 

[Avorysuds]

They were warned:

With all due respect Mr.President, that is not true.

Interesting choice of links, since they were wrong.

he and harry are attempting to craft a Romulan cloak for stimulus called- Investments...krugmans calcs ante- stimulus said 630 billion or so would do, the Admins plan ala Romer? do we need to post that again? 8% unemployment...etc.

they cannot even QUANTIFY the jobs they say they created, the cbo has been saying anywhere between 1.4 and 3.3 million- so now they have settle don 2.4 , how friggin convenient, right smack dab in the middle of their 250% error estimate window....

I do love how they just get to pick a random (huge) number of all jobs created during a set time and claim it was their doing.

Anything good = Because of Obama and the Dems

Anything bad = Republicans minority in somehow fucked the Dems because they hate America.

LOL, awesome logic these days.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

I think it is hilarious that anyone even argues that it worked... it hasn't. We're worse off for sure.. and getting worserer and worserer.

 

[DontBeStupid]

The payroll tax credit was so bad that 2 GOP senators want it repealed. It simply is a failure. Like the rest of his program.

Wait. You and the GOP are now saying a tax credit is not the answer for increased job growth?

Hell has frozen over.

A tax credit is not a tax cut, it’s a deficit building program that usually is aimed at poor people who don’t create jobs anyways.

Low and consistent taxes are key, or help with a stable economy. You’re a hack, you know it and I know it. No one on these boards that I have ever seen claim that neither “tax credits ”nor“ tax cuts” will fix the economy, just help it along. You’re just pissed because Obama’s stimulus was an epic sized failure that is permanently recorded in our history.

You’re dishonest, lie and have cheated your way through debates sense you came to these boards.

SINCE I came to these boards. Just fyi.

By the way, still waiting for you guys to prove how low taxes is the key here. And how Obama "failed" while creating 2.5 million jobs.

 

[P@triot]

I find it funny how some posts are avoided at all cost by most liberals.

Posts??? I find it funny how most FACTS are avoided at all costs by most liberals!

 

[Avorysuds]

Wait. You and the GOP are now saying a tax credit is not the answer for increased job growth?

Hell has frozen over.

A tax credit is not a tax cut, it’s a deficit building program that usually is aimed at poor people who don’t create jobs anyways.

Low and consistent taxes are key, or help with a stable economy. You’re a hack, you know it and I know it. No one on these boards that I have ever seen claim that neither “tax credits ”nor“ tax cuts” will fix the economy, just help it along. You’re just pissed because Obama’s stimulus was an epic sized failure that is permanently recorded in our history.

You’re dishonest, lie and have cheated your way through debates sense you came to these boards.

SINCE I came to these boards. Just fyi.

By the way, still waiting for you guys to prove how low taxes is the key here. And how Obama "failed" while creating 2.5 million jobs.

Still waiting for you to prove that Obama created 2.5 million jobs... Wonder if the UE rate will go up this month or sit around 9%.

 

[P@triot]

Here we go again. Fun with numbers again. You guys seem to think the entire Recovery Act was money sent directly to people in the form of salaries. It wasn't, so dividing the jobs number by the total just gets you some generic jobs/$ spent number, which means pretty much nothing. Not to mention, this is over 2 years, and no one here is even talking about the annual amounts, which would at least be more useful.

Plus, as has already been stated, and was stated in the report, $292B of the Recover Act stimulus was in the form of tax cuts. As has been talked about for years now, tax cuts are a terrible way to stimulate the economy. This is just more proof of that. Had the entire Recovery Act been a jobs programs, the job numbers would have been much better.

All that being said, anyone who claims the Recovery Act was a waste or was a failure is just lying. Two and a half million jobs is not a failure. Getting the economy growing again is not a failure. The only problems with the Recovery Act was the tax cuts and its size. Too many tax cuts and not enough spending.

How can you claim that he created “2.5 million jobs” when unemployment has RISEN since his 3 economic stimulus packages??? Unemployment never went above 8% under Bush. It has never gone below 9% under Obama.

Sorry my friend, the sad truth is every decision of the Obama administration has been a job killing step. They have suffocated the economy with stifling regulation, reckless childish spending, and anti-free market rhetoric and posturing.

Case in point: the National Labor Relations Board (NLRB) versus Boeing! To catch you up on the story, Boeing Corporation decided to build a new assembly plant in Charleston, South Carolina, in order to produce the 787 Dreamliner. The NLRB (which is responsible investigating unfair labor practices) got wind of the decision and last month filed a complaint against Boeing, alleging that the company decided to build the plant in South Carolina out of retaliation for union strikes at its Washington state facilities. Never mind that Boeing actually added 2,000 jobs in Washington on this particular project.

And even if they hadn’t added 2,000 jobs in Washington, who in the hell is the federal government to tell Boeing where they can build a plant???? Boeing could be creating jobs with the construction of their new plant, but instead it has been held up by the anti-capitalism, pro-Marxist Obama Administration. The Obama Administration broke the record for the longest period of unemployment over 9% (sans the Great Depression). The Obama Administration added over $5 trillion in debt in just 2.5 years (it took us 230+ years as a nation to climb to $9 trillion in debt). The Obama Administration signed the Financial “Reform” bill which has created unnecessary regulations and costs on businesses. And the Obama Administration gave us the nightmare which is Obamacare – another bill creating unnecessary costs on businesses. You can rave about Obama all you want, but the facts don’t lie.