ObamaCare- Mandate is Constitutional as a Tax, etc.

[Procrustes Stretched]

Oregon anticipated this and has been reducing OHP coverage substantially over the last couple of years.

Soon nobody will be able to get adequate medical care via insurance! Yay, progressive heaven! More people die that way!

Unlike the conservative nitwits, Oregon did not stick it's head in the sand

 

[Foxfyre]

Riiiight. The leeches who pay zip in federal taxes now have to pay the Obamacare tax?

I don't think so.

The "leeches" as you refer to poor people, already get free health coverage, only they're using emergency rooms as their primary care physicians.

80% of our population already is covered by insurance .... Notwithstanding the handwringing over the heritage foundation's plan

Wake up, we already pay for their emergency room visits in our insurance premiums...

We cannot continue down this path, it only spells ruin...

You have been smoked, the majority of Non Tax paying citizens are committing fraud on their tax returns and sucking billions out of the system, do you believe a $60K household income has valid deductions to get a $7K to $11K refund?

All that is required to correct the emergency room problem is to return the responsibility to the states and to give the hospitals and clinics ability to bill people utilizing the system. If they can't provide identification and a mailing address, that would be reason enough to inquire as to their immigration status. Once hospitals and clinics have ability to garnish wages or place liens on property or otherwise collect what is owed them for services rendered, you see those who can afford to buy insurance buying it. Then go back to the old system of one charity hospital designated to take the truly indigent and everybody pay the routine stuff out of pocket and the system again becomes affordable.

 

[Avatar4321]

We were able to repeal it beforehand. Why exactly is this a good decision for Republicans other than it gives us the issue for the election which is a silly reason to make it.

This is a loss for Americans. Period. Any type of spin is just that. Bullcrap

 

[Wiseacre]

I would say the SCOTUS dumped the problem back in Congress' lap, where it belongs. And ours too, as voters and taxpayers. It really should frame the debate for the upcoming election: big gov't, more taxes, more spending, and more debt, or not. I just hope the information is clear about who gets what and how it is paid for.

 

[Liability]

The SCOTUS decision was an abomination.

I like (but do not actually buy) the spin that this is good news for the GOP.

It certainly means that the right has a shit load of work to do and fast.

 

[jillian]

That is why he wrote a narrow opinion. This was a smart move by Roberts. This gives Obama and progressives a short celebration until reality sets in. By ruling the mandate is a tax, he gave the republicans legal grounds to repeal it because as everyone knows, any tax can be repealed. Lol. This is a victory for republicans. Roberts didn't want to go down in history as the guy who took away the opportunity for tens of millions of Americans to not be able to get Health Insurance. He just passed the mandate back to Congress in the form of a tax so they can repeal it under that option.

Are you really this delusional?

 

[auditor0007]

LOL. The other side of the coin is that it can, and should be, used to establish a single payer universal health care system based on an income tax on all income. A system that emphasizes preventive care rather than trips to the emergency room. A system, like those in Japan and Germany, that would require Health Insurance Companies, to be non-profits.

This will lower costs for all, with much better results, as we have seen in the other industrial nations.

Germany does not have single payer universal health care. They have a public/private partnership where people can have their own insurance if they choose, or just publicly provided insurance that covers nothing but basic care. You'll get an aspirn for your headache but not cancer treatment.

Japan's health care system is failing.

Health care in Japan: Not all smiles | The Economist

On the positive side, patients can nearly always see a doctor within a day. But they must often wait hours for a three-minute consultation. Complicated cases get too little attention. The Japanese are only a quarter as likely as the Americans or French to suffer a heart attack, but twice as likely to die if they do.

Some doctors see as many as 100 patients a day. Because their salaries are low, they tend to overprescribe tests and drugs. (Clinics often own their own pharmacies.) They also earn money, hotel-like, by keeping patients in bed. Simple surgery that in the West would involve no overnight stay, such as a hernia operation, entails a five-day hospital stay in Japan.

Emergency care is often poor. In lesser cities it is not uncommon for ambulances to cruise the streets calling a succession of emergency rooms to find one that can cram in a patient. In a few cases people have died because of this. One reason for a shortage of emergency care is an abundance of small clinics instead of big hospitals. Doctors prefer them because they can work less and earn more.

Their system is not perfect either. Our system turns many people away from needed care, and the cost for those who can afford it is astronomical. Here is something to chew on though; if Japan doubled their spending on healthcare, they would still spend almost 30% less than us per capita. Just think how much better care they would get for double the money, and they would still pay much less than we do. Our system is a disaster, and anyone who supports the status quo is out of their mind.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

We were able to repeal it beforehand. Why exactly is this a good decision for Republicans other than it gives us the issue for the election which is a silly reason to make it.

This is a loss for Americans. Period. Any type of spin is just that. Bullcrap

The Obamacare ruling is a great thing for America. National health care is going to be like health care in Massachusetts under Romneycare.

The numbers of people without health insurance in Massachusetts has been plummeting -- and that is a good thing!!!

 

[Katzndogz]

In the first hour after the decision, Romney's on line campaign donations went up by $300,000 and is still rising.

 

[Liability]

In the first hour after the decision, Romney's on line campaign donations went up by $300,000 and is still rising.

I had tossed out some of his campaign literature (i.e., solicitations for $ help).

No more. I will send him some bucks, now.

I just hope that he does grasp the stupidity of this Act and works with the GOP majority to gut it ASAP after he is inaugurated.

 

[Katzndogz]

LOL. The other side of the coin is that it can, and should be, used to establish a single payer universal health care system based on an income tax on all income. A system that emphasizes preventive care rather than trips to the emergency room. A system, like those in Japan and Germany, that would require Health Insurance Companies, to be non-profits.

This will lower costs for all, with much better results, as we have seen in the other industrial nations.

Germany does not have single payer universal health care. They have a public/private partnership where people can have their own insurance if they choose, or just publicly provided insurance that covers nothing but basic care. You'll get an aspirn for your headache but not cancer treatment.

Japan's health care system is failing.

Health care in Japan: Not all smiles | The Economist

On the positive side, patients can nearly always see a doctor within a day. But they must often wait hours for a three-minute consultation. Complicated cases get too little attention. The Japanese are only a quarter as likely as the Americans or French to suffer a heart attack, but twice as likely to die if they do.

Some doctors see as many as 100 patients a day. Because their salaries are low, they tend to overprescribe tests and drugs. (Clinics often own their own pharmacies.) They also earn money, hotel-like, by keeping patients in bed. Simple surgery that in the West would involve no overnight stay, such as a hernia operation, entails a five-day hospital stay in Japan.

Emergency care is often poor. In lesser cities it is not uncommon for ambulances to cruise the streets calling a succession of emergency rooms to find one that can cram in a patient. In a few cases people have died because of this. One reason for a shortage of emergency care is an abundance of small clinics instead of big hospitals. Doctors prefer them because they can work less and earn more.

Their system is not perfect either. Our system turns many people away from needed care, and the cost for those who can afford it is astronomical. Here is something to chew on though; if Japan doubled their spending on healthcare, they would still spend almost 30% less than us per capita. Just think how much better care they would get for double the money, and they would still pay much less than we do. Our system is a disaster, and anyone who supports the status quo is out of their mind.

Japan's health care system is disintegrating. It's not a good example.

 

[GWV5903]

We need to read and understand ALL of the decision:

Supreme Court upholds health care law - NBC Politics

In other words, the STATES MAY OPT OUT OF THE PROGRAM?

If 24 states have sued and will opt out, where does that leave the entire program?

I think you better hold off celebrating until you understand the ENTIRE decision.

Yes they can and I hope they do, in the coming days this will be clearer, there is more to come from this ruling, the tax definition puts a whole new twist in this...

 

[The T]

The SCOTUS decision was an abomination.

I like (but do not actually buy) the spin that this is good news for the GOP.

It certainly means that the right has a shit load of work to do and fast.

That they do.

 

[nodoginnafight]

That is why he wrote a narrow opinion. This was a smart move by Roberts. This gives Obama and progressives a short celebration until reality sets in. By ruling the mandate is a tax, he gave the republicans legal grounds to repeal it because as everyone knows, any tax can be repealed. Lol. This is a victory for republicans. Roberts didn't want to go down in history as the guy who took away the opportunity for tens of millions of Americans to not be able to get Health Insurance. He just passed the mandate back to Congress in the form of a tax so they can repeal it under that option.

ANY LAW can be repealed
sort of shoots your theory all to hell, huh?

 

[The T]

It also keeps the economy down so the Dems get blown out again like they did in 2010.

Agreed. Watch unemployment rise...

 

[JakeStarkey]

We were able to repeal it beforehand. Why exactly is this a good decision for Republicans other than it gives us the issue for the election which is a silly reason to make it.

This is a loss for Americans. Period. Any type of spin is just that. Bullcrap

Please go read Mosiah 4 with a humble and contrite heart.

 

[Inthemiddle]

You know, this is all a funny thing for me. When I first read the headline, I did a mini-celebration on account of the various debates I've had here and elsewhere in the past several months regarding the constitutionality of the health care law. So, I've won the argument this time. Whoopie.

But on the other hand, I'm celebrating the continuance of a law that I whole heartedly disagree with. Can this be a lesson, please? All this time that so many people have been babbling about the alleged unconstitutionality of the law, is time and energy wasted. We're not back at the beginning. If we the people, and our elected officials, had instead turned these past several months toward repealing the law, offering alternatives, etc, then something might have actually been accomplished by now. The Republicans have really shot themselves in the feet. The AZ lawsuit was a de facto win for Obama, this is a resounding victory for Obama, and the Supreme Court has just told the country that the primary plank in the GOP platform is factually wrong.

 

[Inthemiddle]

What will the Federal Government command us to purchase next? Ipods? Guns? Obama's book?

It's happened before. But it won't happen again in the modern age. The government would be too afraid of a populace that is universally armed by mandate.

 

[GWV5903]

The "leeches" as you refer to poor people, already get free health coverage, only they're using emergency rooms as their primary care physicians.

80% of our population already is covered by insurance .... Notwithstanding the handwringing over the heritage foundation's plan

Wake up, we already pay for their emergency room visits in our insurance premiums...

We cannot continue down this path, it only spells ruin...

You have been smoked, the majority of Non Tax paying citizens are committing fraud on their tax returns and sucking billions out of the system, do you believe a $60K household income has valid deductions to get a $7K to $11K refund?

All that is required to correct the emergency room problem is to return the responsibility to the states and to give the hospitals and clinics ability to bill people utilizing the system. If they can't provide identification and a mailing address, that would be reason enough to inquire as to their immigration status. Once hospitals and clinics have ability to garnish wages or place liens on property or otherwise collect what is owed them for services rendered, you see those who can afford to buy insurance buying it. Then go back to the old system of one charity hospital designated to take the truly indigent and everybody pay the routine stuff out of pocket and the system again becomes affordable.

I agree, now will congress do that? Highly unlikely...

We are coming closer and closer to another revolution imho...

 

[Wiseacre]

You know, this is all a funny thing for me. When I first read the headline, I did a mini-celebration on account of the various debates I've had here and elsewhere in the past several months regarding the constitutionality of the health care law. So, I've won the argument this time. Whoopie.

But on the other hand, I'm celebrating the continuance of a law that I whole heartedly disagree with. Can this be a lesson, please? All this time that so many people have been babbling about the alleged unconstitutionality of the law, is time and energy wasted. We're not back at the beginning. If we the people, and our elected officials, had instead turned these past several months toward repealing the law, offering alternatives, etc, then something might have actually been accomplished by now. The Republicans have really shot themselves in the feet. The AZ lawsuit was a de facto win for Obama, this is a resounding victory for Obama, and the Supreme Court has just told the country that the primary plank in the GOP platform is factually wrong.

But he flat out lied to us man, he looked square intot he camera talking to Stephanoupolis and said unequivically that the mandate was not a tax. And he said he waould not raise taxes on those families making under $250k. And we now know that both of these are not true. Congrats on your victory, you must be so proud.