Obamacare Can Kill You

[jillian]

yes, he's saying a bunch of bullshit and you're repeating it.

I don't know why you would say that.
Why would he WANT to have to pay for this with his insurance?
Of course he wouldn't lie about that and want to take on this headache?
What motivation would he have?

If you think he is trying to make some political statement,
he's MORE CONCERNED WITH GETTING HIS DOCTOR'S APPTS
AND MEDICAL ISSUES COVERED.

WHY WOULD HE MAKE SOME HASSLE OUT OF NOTHING
TO MAKE A POLITICAL STATEMENT THAT ISN'T GOING TO PAY HIS BILLS.

the most likely answer is he doesn't exist. second, his entire story might be bullshit.

you're saying that as a result of a car accident he needs a CAT scan but his hospital won't do it because although they accept his insurance policy they think thry might not be paid for some time so they just won't schedule him.

and you want us to believe that even with a police report naming the other driver at fault his insurance company is not pursuing the other driver's insurance, that they'd rather pay for the costs.

and you want us to believe that even though the other driver ran a light the police almost let her leave and was then so intimidated that he didn't file his report for days.

do you see why this doesnt make sense?

No, NOBODY is paying for those catscan costs. If he wants it done HE has to pay for it and then sue for it after the fact.
That's why there's no motivation to go through the expense, and he has to deal with that on his own.

Now, for the CAR, YES the insurance company is suing the other one.
His limit is 2500 and the damage is much greater and they can go after the driver and the other insurance company for that.

so he's electing to have them done, they haven't been ordered by a doctor?

He couldn't even go see a doctor for 12 days because he didn't have a claim number.
By then, he was reporting 3 incidents where he collapsed.
So at that point, yes, of course I WOULD ASSUME any professional he consulted would recommend catscans.

But as for the catscan providers, they only agreed to schedule it if he put it on his insurance.

Now ogibillm maybe you are saying the catscan people are Bullshitting him
and just saying that to get the better insurance to pay. Maybe they are hardballing him
because they dont really want to take the other insurance so they are just saying they won't.

That's like telling people no we only take cash up front because that's how they prefer to get paid.
Could be.

From what I understand, a lot of private doctors close to retiring opted to retire early to get out
from under whatever paperwork was coming with this insurance reform.

Maybe this is another field where the service providers are picky about what they will accept.

My friend is not very creative, has zero imagination, and is only straightforward business.
He would not be able to make this up. He has no reason to as he has no time or desire to mess with such a huge headache.

no offense. that sounds absurd.

 

[Arianrhod]

2. the only thing he said about the insurance exchanges is that the same way the
catscan providers won't accept private insurance that takes a year to pay, they
won't accept insurance under the federal exchanges for the same reason -- they can't
afford to foot the costs while waiting to get paid. That's what he said.

Then either he's not being honest with you, or he's with one lousy insurer. Hospital bills are submitted to the insurer as soon as they're incurred. No hospital would tolerate an insurer taking a year to pay.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

It is interesting how real life can bring truth front and center exposing flaws in policy. One such flaw in Obamacare and the effort to bring better healthcare to millions of Americans can cause your demise. Today many people have coverage with a deductible so high that they are afraid to use it. In some ways this is akin to having no coverage at all and this poses a massive problem.

Ironically someone paying very little because of Obamacare will rush to the emergency room when they get the flu while many people responsible for their own bills hang back in fear they will take a financial beating. If you are at a loss as to how Obamacare can take a life you find a a real life story below titled. "Obamacare Can Kill You." I know because I drove the person to the hospital. It is also a warning of the danger many of us face.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2016/01/obamacare-can-kill-you.html

using someone's baseless opinion piece on some rightwingnut blog isn't proof of anything.

but thanks for the nonsense.

You can always use more.

It's what you are made of of.

Left-wing attention whore.

 

[jillian]

It is interesting how real life can bring truth front and center exposing flaws in policy. One such flaw in Obamacare and the effort to bring better healthcare to millions of Americans can cause your demise. Today many people have coverage with a deductible so high that they are afraid to use it. In some ways this is akin to having no coverage at all and this poses a massive problem.

Ironically someone paying very little because of Obamacare will rush to the emergency room when they get the flu while many people responsible for their own bills hang back in fear they will take a financial beating. If you are at a loss as to how Obamacare can take a life you find a a real life story below titled. "Obamacare Can Kill You." I know because I drove the person to the hospital. It is also a warning of the danger many of us face.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2016/01/obamacare-can-kill-you.html

using someone's baseless opinion piece on some rightwingnut blog isn't proof of anything.

but thanks for the nonsense.

You can always use more.

It's what you are made of of.

Left-wing attention whore.

I'm not the one posting lies loon

And look in the mirror before you call anyone else an attention white, loser

 

[Sun Devil 92]

It is interesting how real life can bring truth front and center exposing flaws in policy. One such flaw in Obamacare and the effort to bring better healthcare to millions of Americans can cause your demise. Today many people have coverage with a deductible so high that they are afraid to use it. In some ways this is akin to having no coverage at all and this poses a massive problem.

Ironically someone paying very little because of Obamacare will rush to the emergency room when they get the flu while many people responsible for their own bills hang back in fear they will take a financial beating. If you are at a loss as to how Obamacare can take a life you find a a real life story below titled. "Obamacare Can Kill You." I know because I drove the person to the hospital. It is also a warning of the danger many of us face.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2016/01/obamacare-can-kill-you.html

using someone's baseless opinion piece on some rightwingnut blog isn't proof of anything.

but thanks for the nonsense.

You can always use more.

It's what you are made of of.

Left-wing attention whore.

I'm not the one posting lies loon

And look in the mirror before you call anyone else an attention white, loser

Oh, we pretty much know that if you posted it, it is a lie.

Even your spell check is stupid......

 

[jillian]

It is interesting how real life can bring truth front and center exposing flaws in policy. One such flaw in Obamacare and the effort to bring better healthcare to millions of Americans can cause your demise. Today many people have coverage with a deductible so high that they are afraid to use it. In some ways this is akin to having no coverage at all and this poses a massive problem.

Ironically someone paying very little because of Obamacare will rush to the emergency room when they get the flu while many people responsible for their own bills hang back in fear they will take a financial beating. If you are at a loss as to how Obamacare can take a life you find a a real life story below titled. "Obamacare Can Kill You." I know because I drove the person to the hospital. It is also a warning of the danger many of us face.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2016/01/obamacare-can-kill-you.html

using someone's baseless opinion piece on some rightwingnut blog isn't proof of anything.

but thanks for the nonsense.

You can always use more.

It's what you are made of of.

Left-wing attention whore.

I'm not the one posting lies loon

And look in the mirror before you call anyone else an attention white, loser

Oh, we pretty much know that if you posted it, it is a lie.

Even your spell check is stupid......

Oh no! My phone auto corrected!!!! Shut up moron and stop posting discredited garbage.

Wacko!

 

[ogibillm]

1. the majority of the burden is on HIM to pay.

why? that makes no sense.

2. the only thing he said about the insurance exchanges is that the same way the
catscan providers won't accept private insurance that takes a year to pay, they
won't accept insurance under the federal exchanges for the same reason -- they can't
afford to foot the costs while waiting to get paid. That's what he said.

again, this makes no sense. either they accept the insurance or they don't.

I've seen signs from other places that post publicly they won't accept federal insurance under the exchanges.

bullshit

 

[Arianrhod]

I've seen signs from other places that post publicly they won't accept federal insurance under the exchanges.

What "federal insurance"? You mean the private insurance consumers can access through the marketplaces? Or are you spreading that idiotic rumor that "Obamacare is insurance" again?

 

[ogibillm]

I've seen signs from other places that post publicly they won't accept federal insurance under the exchanges.

What "federal insurance"? You mean the private insurance consumers can access through the marketplaces? Or are you spreading that idiotic rumor that "Obamacare is insurance" again?

and that's exactly how you know it's bullshit

 

[emilynghiem]

2. the only thing he said about the insurance exchanges is that the same way the
catscan providers won't accept private insurance that takes a year to pay, they
won't accept insurance under the federal exchanges for the same reason -- they can't
afford to foot the costs while waiting to get paid. That's what he said.

Then either he's not being honest with you, or he's with one lousy insurer. Hospital bills are submitted to the insurer as soon as they're incurred. No hospital would tolerate an insurer taking a year to pay.

Arianrhod that's why they would not even schedule the catscans because they will not tolerate not getting paid by insurance companies.

 

[ogibillm]

2. the only thing he said about the insurance exchanges is that the same way the
catscan providers won't accept private insurance that takes a year to pay, they
won't accept insurance under the federal exchanges for the same reason -- they can't
afford to foot the costs while waiting to get paid. That's what he said.

Then either he's not being honest with you, or he's with one lousy insurer. Hospital bills are submitted to the insurer as soon as they're incurred. No hospital would tolerate an insurer taking a year to pay.

Arianrhod that's why they would not even schedule the catscans because they will not tolerate not getting paid by insurance companies.

but they accept that insurance?

 

[emilynghiem]

It is interesting how real life can bring truth front and center exposing flaws in policy. One such flaw in Obamacare and the effort to bring better healthcare to millions of Americans can cause your demise. Today many people have coverage with a deductible so high that they are afraid to use it. In some ways this is akin to having no coverage at all and this poses a massive problem.

Ironically someone paying very little because of Obamacare will rush to the emergency room when they get the flu while many people responsible for their own bills hang back in fear they will take a financial beating. If you are at a loss as to how Obamacare can take a life you find a a real life story below titled. "Obamacare Can Kill You." I know because I drove the person to the hospital. It is also a warning of the danger many of us face.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2016/01/obamacare-can-kill-you.html

using someone's baseless opinion piece on some rightwingnut blog isn't proof of anything.

but thanks for the nonsense.

Dear jillian
with people's personal beliefs, they are not required to prove them.
People have the right to believe in God without proof, just not to impose that faith-based belief on others.

here, with health care, beliefs in right to life, right to health care, and free choice/free market,
For SOME reason people have gotten into this fight where they are trying to force each other to PROVE their beliefs.

This is because policy is being IMPOSED.

If it were kept as voluntary FREE CHOICE to participate in whatever system people BELIEVE in funding, then
NOBODY WOULD HAVE TO JUSTIFY ANYTHING.
IF YOU BELIEVE IN IT, YOU FUND IT,
JUST LIKE FUNDING YOUR CHRISTIAN PROGRAMS, YOUR PROLIFE PROGRAMS, YOUR SUNDAY SCHOOL OR CAMP PROGRAMS. YOU DON'T HAVE TO JUSTIFY FUNDING PRIVATE RELIGIOUS ACTIVITIES AS LONG AS YOU DON'T IMPOSE THAT ON SOMEONE ELSE OR OTHERWISE VIOLATE LAWS OR RIGHTS. WHY CAN'T WE RESPECT THAT HEALTH CARE INVOLVES BELIEFS, AND QUIT TRYING TO FORCE PEOPLE TO CHANGE THEIR BELIEFS USING THE OTHER'S SIDE'S PROOF.

Sorry to yell in ALL CAPS jillian
but this is so obvious to me, it is ridiculous.

Prochoice and prolife are not going to agree,
so why not separate funding and programs already!

So obvious, and yet like a couple getting divorced
they can't seem to understand why they need two separate
households and bank accounts instead of trying to dominate
and control each other. Get real.

 

[Arianrhod]

It is interesting how real life can bring truth front and center exposing flaws in policy. One such flaw in Obamacare and the effort to bring better healthcare to millions of Americans can cause your demise. Today many people have coverage with a deductible so high that they are afraid to use it. In some ways this is akin to having no coverage at all and this poses a massive problem.

Ironically someone paying very little because of Obamacare will rush to the emergency room when they get the flu while many people responsible for their own bills hang back in fear they will take a financial beating. If you are at a loss as to how Obamacare can take a life you find a a real life story below titled. "Obamacare Can Kill You." I know because I drove the person to the hospital. It is also a warning of the danger many of us face.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2016/01/obamacare-can-kill-you.html

using someone's baseless opinion piece on some rightwingnut blog isn't proof of anything.

but thanks for the nonsense.

Dear jillian
with people's personal beliefs, they are not required to prove them.
People have the right to believe in God without proof, just not to impose that faith-based belief on others.

here, with health care, beliefs in right to life, right to health care, and free choice/free market,
For SOME reason people have gotten into this fight where they are trying to force each other to PROVE their beliefs.

This is because policy is being IMPOSED.

If it were kept as voluntary FREE CHOICE to participate in whatever system people BELIEVE in funding, then
NOBODY WOULD HAVE TO JUSTIFY ANYTHING.
IF YOU BELIEVE IN IT, YOU FUND IT,
JUST LIKE FUNDING YOUR CHRISTIAN PROGRAMS, YOUR PROLIFE PROGRAMS, YOUR SUNDAY SCHOOL OR CAMP PROGRAMS. YOU DON'T HAVE TO JUSTIFY FUNDING PRIVATE RELIGIOUS ACTIVITIES AS LONG AS YOU DON'T IMPOSE THAT ON SOMEONE ELSE OR OTHERWISE VIOLATE LAWS OR RIGHTS. WHY CAN'T WE RESPECT THAT HEALTH CARE INVOLVES BELIEFS, AND QUIT TRYING TO FORCE PEOPLE TO CHANGE THEIR BELIEFS USING THE OTHER'S SIDE'S PROOF.

Sorry to yell in ALL CAPS jillian
but this is so obvious to me, it is ridiculous.

Prochoice and prolife are not going to agree,
so why not separate funding and programs already!

So obvious, and yet like a couple getting divorced
they can't seem to understand why they need two separate
households and bank accounts instead of trying to dominate
and control each other. Get real.

Emily, unfortunately health and freedom from auto accidents have nothing to do with your faith. I'd recommend you go back to the beginning and either abandon this bizarre story or explain it in a way that makes sense, because right now it doesn't, and prayers won't help.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

It is interesting how real life can bring truth front and center exposing flaws in policy. One such flaw in Obamacare and the effort to bring better healthcare to millions of Americans can cause your demise. Today many people have coverage with a deductible so high that they are afraid to use it. In some ways this is akin to having no coverage at all and this poses a massive problem.

Ironically someone paying very little because of Obamacare will rush to the emergency room when they get the flu while many people responsible for their own bills hang back in fear they will take a financial beating. If you are at a loss as to how Obamacare can take a life you find a a real life story below titled. "Obamacare Can Kill You." I know because I drove the person to the hospital. It is also a warning of the danger many of us face.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2016/01/obamacare-can-kill-you.html

using someone's baseless opinion piece on some rightwingnut blog isn't proof of anything.

but thanks for the nonsense.

You can always use more.

It's what you are made of of.

Left-wing attention whore.

I'm not the one posting lies loon

And look in the mirror before you call anyone else an attention white, loser

Oh, we pretty much know that if you posted it, it is a lie.

Even your spell check is stupid......

Oh no! My phone auto corrected!!!! Shut up moron and stop posting discredited garbage.

Wacko!

I am afraid there is all kind of credible evidence to the effect you are a moron.

Can't help that.........

Like you would know what was credible.

Someone said you claim to be a lawyer.....

I told them you meant liar.

 

[ObligationLaunch]

Well isn't medical 'care" not the third reason for the deads of people?

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Well isn't medical 'care" not the third reason for the deads of people?

What ?

 

[emilynghiem]

2. the only thing he said about the insurance exchanges is that the same way the
catscan providers won't accept private insurance that takes a year to pay, they
won't accept insurance under the federal exchanges for the same reason -- they can't
afford to foot the costs while waiting to get paid. That's what he said.

Then either he's not being honest with you, or he's with one lousy insurer. Hospital bills are submitted to the insurer as soon as they're incurred. No hospital would tolerate an insurer taking a year to pay.

Dear Arianrhod
When the medical coverage is from an accident and there is litigation involved, don't you get that the insurance companies and lawyers will work to delay any kind of payment until they absolutely get ordered by the court and have to pay.

Have you ever heard of public school lawyers blocking kids getting access to accommodations, because all they have to do is APPEAL the ruling, it gets TIED UP IN COURT, and takes so long to resolve the kid will already have graduated by then so the school never has to pay!

Well with lawyers and insurance that doesn't want to have to pay until it is absolutely proven, don't you think they would hold out as well.

My friend's car insurance is focused on the car, so YES they are suing to get the other company/Liberty to pay for that.

For the medical costs, they are capped at 2500. That's all my friend's insurance pays for under the policy he chose.

Don't you see it would be cheaper for the company to pay the first 2500 in costs and FU the legal hassles and protracted litigation. The "soft tissue" type injuries are HARD to prove one way or another, and my friend is looking at getting totally screwed over.

The insurance will find it easier to assume nothing is damaged if he is still walking around like normal, and not bother with longterm testing to make sure there aren't internal injuries that will surface and worsen over time.

It's in HIS best interest to document any conditions and prove that this is from the accident, so he can collect, but it takes a very good personal injury lawyer. The obvious injuries like broken bones or head injuries that are more clearly visible are hard enough to go through a lawyer to chase after and make the insurance pay.

With "soft tissue" type injuries, these are usually too difficult and expensive to do the work in advance and expect to get paid later.

Cases have to be VERY straight forward with concrete and easy to establish proof or it's very hard to find a lawyer who can afford the resources it takes to fight this and beat the insurance company lawyers.

My friend is lucky that one of his buddies got his father to take this on as a favor. Most people can't find a lawyer to do that.

I've had friends who had property literally stolen from them, and it costs too much to pursue it and they had to take the hit.

If it's not clear cut where the other side knows they are going to have to pay, they are going to hold off, let it get tied up in litigation, and try to outlast the resources of the victim. Some people have lost their estates and their sanity trying to win for the sake of principle when the opposing sides' legal resources could keep pushing and dragging it out, playing games with motions and other stalling tactics until the average person can't afford to keep fighting.

Sorry but I've seen enough of this, and had two friends who made judicial and legal reform their causes, ending up dying before they ever saw justice in their cases. I advocate for conflict resolution, mediation and consensus as the standard for redressing grievances, because I've seen too much nonsense and abuses go on with the legal system to trust that anyone would get justice out of it in a reasonable timeframe and ever collect on their judgment even if they do win. Just craziness.

I prefer to stay sane even if it means losing in the material sense.
I try to work with people who respect consent/consensus as the standard of laws, contracts and civil society because this other "adversarial" system can cause more damage and problems than it resolves. Again I've had friends walk away from issues, and my godmother will even counsel people to drop cases if the cost is going to exceed any chance they will collect; it's just not worth it, so we need to work on prevention instead, where people are trained to mediate conflicts and help each other raise money for restitution instead of running from the law. Relationships and civil society are more important, and we need to teach that as valuable, to preserve our relations, community and nation, instead of teaching bullying tactics and rewarding people for delaying and obstructing justice.

 

[emilynghiem]

1. the majority of the burden is on HIM to pay.

why? that makes no sense.

2. the only thing he said about the insurance exchanges is that the same way the
catscan providers won't accept private insurance that takes a year to pay, they
won't accept insurance under the federal exchanges for the same reason -- they can't
afford to foot the costs while waiting to get paid. That's what he said.

again, this makes no sense. either they accept the insurance or they don't.

I've seen signs from other places that post publicly they won't accept federal insurance under the exchanges.

bullshit

ogibillm His insurance is for the car. they are only required to pay 2500 so that's all they are going to do and leave the rest to him.

He can use his employee insurance to pay, but most of it is going to be his cost, so he has to sue the other party and insurance if he wants his personal injuries paid for.

He has to prove he was injured.
The burden of proof is on him even though someone else caused the accident.

After he wins, THEN he can ask for all legal expenses and medical costs to be paid for. But good luck collecting that either.

All the people he talked with said he has to get a
PERSONAL INJURY lawyer to do that.

This is very expensive and difficult to prove a 'soft tissue'
internal injury type case. It's a pain in the rear.

So nobody is going to agree to foot the bill for as LONG
as this is going to take, knowing how insurance companies will drag things out.

My friend normally cannot afford to hire a PI lawyer for the length of time he's looking at. Luckily he has a friend who is going to help, as a favor,
but normally no person, no lawyers, and no company/institution
can afford the cost of pursuing a case like this.

It is too easy to get around it, and drag it out until it is too expensive to keep fighting. Just too easy, so of course the lawyers will play that game.

 

[emilynghiem]

I've seen signs from other places that post publicly they won't accept federal insurance under the exchanges.

What "federal insurance"? You mean the private insurance consumers can access through the marketplaces? Or are you spreading that idiotic rumor that "Obamacare is insurance" again?

OK Arianrhod sorry for the bad wording.
My friend jumped on me also for calling it federal insurance.
he says the same thing that obamacare is not insurance.

So that's NOT what I mean.

What my friend is saying is that the catscan providers accepted his insurance that is through his employment which still leaves him to cover most of the cost.

He was saying these same providers would not accept other insurance.

Arianrhod and ogibillm
You act like this is some new thing about providers not accepting insurance. This was going on even BEFORE ACA, and many providers also clarified AFTER ACA they wouldn't accept some patients under certain plans.

Why are you acting like this is not already going on???

Doctors, Hospitals Say 'No' to Obamacare Plans

"But one thing is out of the government's control: whether doctors and hospitals will agree to accept patients who buy these plans.
Surveys and data are limited, so it's difficult to gauge the extent of the issue, but anecdotal evidence from patients and providers show it is a struggle. Some newly insured patients wonder whether it's worth paying for coverage they can't actually use. Even when they do find a provider, reports show they face crippling out-of-pocket costs they didn't expect.
Doctors or hospitals may be left out of insurance networks for many reasons; the decision is usually up to the insurance company, not the provider, but it usually comes down to reimbursement, which can be lower through plans obtained via the Obamacare marketplace."

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Doctors, Hospitals Say 'No' to Obamacare Plans

"But one thing is out of the government's control: whether doctors and hospitals will agree to accept patients who buy these plans.
Surveys and data are limited, so it's difficult to gauge the extent of the issue, but anecdotal evidence from patients and providers show it is a struggle. Some newly insured patients wonder whether it's worth paying for coverage they can't actually use. Even when they do find a provider, reports show they face crippling out-of-pocket costs they didn't expect.
Doctors or hospitals may be left out of insurance networks for many reasons; the decision is usually up to the insurance company, not the provider, but it usually comes down to reimbursement, which can be lower through plans obtained via the Obamacare marketplace."

Seems that this is the one major issue that the left just sticks it's head in the sand over.