Obama wants lower corporate tax rates

[Inthemiddle]

I don't see a tax code that heavily increase the tax burden on manufacturers is a centrist position, especially if your goal is to increase the manufacturing base in the US.

So, lowering taxes is increasing the tax burden? If you're not going to say something even slightly connected to reality, then just don't say anything at all.

 

[Baruch Menachem]

If I had the belief that he was being even the most tiny bit sincere in this, I would be joyfully enthusiastically supporting this. However, I see this is mostly wind. He knows he can count on the Senate to table it, or worse yet amend the hell out it so it is insupportable. He doesn't want the actual cut, as that would be against all he has stood for during his entire adult life. He just wants to get up and tell audiences that he proposed a tax cut but the Republicans wouldn't go along with it.

 

[Oddball]

Conservatives are centrist.

There's just no end to the stupidity that's been posted on this board lately, is there?

Well, you do seem to insist on continuing to post here.

 

[Inthemiddle]

How many republicans that you know that have been calling for an insurance mandate???

The individual mandate was a Republican alternative to Clinton's health care reform bill in the early 90s, and was supported by, among others, Newt Gingrich. On Meet The Press, October 3, 1993, Tim Russert questioned Gingrich on his position regarding Clinton's health care initiative, where Gingrich said, "people--individuals, exactly like automobile insurance--individuals having health insurance and being required to have health insurance, and I am prepared to vote for a voucher which will give individuals, on a sliding scale, a government subsidy so as to ensure that everyone as individuals has health insurance."

John Chafee, the Republican Senator from Rhode Island sponsored a bill that would have created an individual mandate for health insurance. Chuck Grassely supported the individual mandate when the Health Care law was before Congress in 2009 saying that the best way to establish universal coverage was "through an individual mandate and that's individual responsibility and even Republicans believe in individual responsibility."

Just a few off the top of my head.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I don't see a tax code that heavily increase the tax burden on manufacturers is a centrist position, especially if your goal is to increase the manufacturing base in the US.

So, lowering taxes is increasing the tax burden? If you're not going to say something even slightly connected to reality, then just don't say anything at all.

No, eliminating deductions and write offs for devaluation of equipment investments so is. If you have no idea what Obama is actually proposing you shouldn't try to argue in defense of what he is proposing.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

How many republicans that you know that have been calling for an insurance mandate???

The individual mandate was a Republican alternative to Clinton's health care reform bill in the early 90s, and was supported by, among others, Newt Gingrich. On Meet The Press, October 3, 1993, Tim Russert questioned Gingrich on his position regarding Clinton's health care initiative, where Gingrich said, "people--individuals, exactly like automobile insurance--individuals having health insurance and being required to have health insurance, and I am prepared to vote for a voucher which will give individuals, on a sliding scale, a government subsidy so as to ensure that everyone as individuals has health insurance."

John Chafee, the Republican Senator from Rhode Island sponsored a bill that would have created an individual mandate for health insurance. Chuck Grassely supported the individual mandate when the Health Care law was before Congress in 2009 saying that the best way to establish universal coverage was "through an individual mandate and that's individual responsibility and even Republicans believe in individual responsibility."

Just a few off the top of my head.

Actually, it wasn't, but we do appreciate you trying to lay off the worst part of Obamacare on people that had nothing to do with it.

Yes, I know there was a mandate proposed when Clinton was a president, but that mandate was that people carry insurance catastrophic coverage, not health insurance that covered routine medical care. They are not even close to the same thing.

 

[Rocko]

How many republicans that you know that have been calling for an insurance mandate???

The individual mandate was a Republican alternative to Clinton's health care reform bill in the early 90s, and was supported by, among others, Newt Gingrich. On Meet The Press, October 3, 1993, Tim Russert questioned Gingrich on his position regarding Clinton's health care initiative, where Gingrich said, "people--individuals, exactly like automobile insurance--individuals having health insurance and being required to have health insurance, and I am prepared to vote for a voucher which will give individuals, on a sliding scale, a government subsidy so as to ensure that everyone as individuals has health insurance."

John Chafee, the Republican Senator from Rhode Island sponsored a bill that would have created an individual mandate for health insurance. Chuck Grassely supported the individual mandate when the Health Care law was before Congress in 2009 saying that the best way to establish universal coverage was "through an individual mandate and that's individual responsibility and even Republicans believe in individual responsibility."

Just a few off the top of my head.

You came up with a few...I give you that, but don't act like an insurance mandate is something that has been widely supported by Republicans , and now because it's Obama republicans loath the idea.

Any true conservative would be against a federal or state mandate of insurance...it goes against the grain of conservative ideology.

 

[Inthemiddle]

And here is Gingrich explaining how he supports Romneycare and its potential to change the American health care system.

 

[Inthemiddle]

Actually, it wasn't

So you're looking the horse in the face and calling it a dog? Can you please try to be just 1% honest today?

Yes, I know there was a mandate proposed when Clinton was a president, but that mandate was that people carry insurance catastrophic coverage, not health insurance that covered routine medical care. They are not even close to the same thing.

False.

 

[Rocko]

And here is Gingrich explaining how he supports Romneycare and its potential to change the American health care system.

Thats fine....doesn't change the FACT that a mandate never had support amongst conservatives. Not everything is about how conservates hate Obama....We do have beliefs on policy, and a mandate was never something we wannted!

 

[Inthemiddle]

but don't act like an insurance mandate is something that has been widely supported by Republicans

When did I act like it was "widely supported" by Republicans? All I did was point to a few Republicans who supported the idea, and have shown that the whole idea was a Republican concept to begin with, meant to create individual accountability via the free market.

and now because it's Obama republicans loath the idea.

That's exactly what's happening, though. Even Gingrich, who was championing the concept for nearly a decade, suddenly turned the moment Obama agreed to the idea. Obama did not initially support the individual mandate. He came to embrace it as a compromise with Republicans who objected to his initial proposals.

It's simply dishonest to paint the Health Care law as some kind of raging leftist proposal. In fact, the individual mandate faces a great deal of criticism from the left wing. Infamous leftist Michael Moore condemns it as a "bailout for the insurance companies." The truly leftist policy for health care reform is a single payer system, and proponents of such a system generally do not approve of the individual mandate. The California Nurses Association calls the mandate a "scam" in advocating for a single payer system. And the Physicians for a National Health Program says that mandates won't work to effect reform.

Any true conservative would be against a federal or state mandate of insurance...it goes against the grain of conservative ideology.

So are conservatives now going to lobby to eliminate requirements for auto insurance?

 

[Wiseacre]

If I had the belief that he was being even the most tiny bit sincere in this, I would be joyfully enthusiastically supporting this. However, I see this is mostly wind. He knows he can count on the Senate to table it, or worse yet amend the hell out it so it is insupportable. He doesn't want the actual cut, as that would be against all he has stood for during his entire adult life. He just wants to get up and tell audiences that he proposed a tax cut but the Republicans wouldn't go along with it.

But it's not really a tax cut, he's actually going to raise corp taxes to the tune of $250 billion over 10 years. Which I could live with except he wants to pick winners and losers, his pet projects like wind and solar still get the breaks and subsidies but other businesses don't.

And I'm concerned about the notion of raising taxes on overseas profits by US multis. I don't think it'll work, they'll sell out to foreign corps and leave the US altogether. Lose - Lose. We ain't incentivizing businesses to come home IMHO, unless they get a waiver or have a buddy in the WH.

 

[Rocko]

but don't act like an insurance mandate is something that has been widely supported by Republicans

When did I act like it was "widely supported" by Republicans? All I did was point to a few Republicans who supported the idea, and have shown that the whole idea was a Republican concept to begin with, meant to create individual accountability via the free market.

and now because it's Obama republicans loath the idea.

That's exactly what's happening, though. Even Gingrich, who was championing the concept for nearly a decade, suddenly turned the moment Obama agreed to the idea. Obama did not initially support the individual mandate. He came to embrace it as a compromise with Republicans who objected to his initial proposals.

It's simply dishonest to paint the Health Care law as some kind of raging leftist proposal. In fact, the individual mandate faces a great deal of criticism from the left wing. Infamous leftist Michael Moore condemns it as a "bailout for the insurance companies." The truly leftist policy for health care reform is a single payer system, and proponents of such a system generally do not approve of the individual mandate. The California Nurses Association calls the mandate a "scam" in advocating for a single payer system. And the Physicians for a National Health Program says that mandates won't work to effect reform.

Any true conservative would be against a federal or state mandate of insurance...it goes against the grain of conservative ideology.

So are conservatives now going to lobby to eliminate requirements for auto insurance?

Ha, just because it was born in the Heritage foundation doesn't mean it's a "republican concept", and how the hell does a mandate create individual accountablity in the concept of free markets? you're obviously reaching.

Newt has been in politics for a million years. He didn't start his flip-flopping because of Obama.

If you you are truly "in the middle", you'll admit that reason republicans don't like the mandate is because of the mandate, and nothing to do with Obama hating as suggested by many liberals.

 

[jillian]

So now you agree we were right all along.



Damn, all it took to become a good idea was for a (D) to put his stamp on it.


I love the taste of hypocracy in the morning.

mmm

taste like well done toast.

you mean like the idea of individual mandates for health insurance originally being a republican plan, straight out of the heritage foundation, that magically became "socialist" and "unconstitutional" as soon as it no longer had an (R) on it?

that kind of hypocritical?

How many republicans that you know that have been calling for an insurance mandate???

Provide me quotes of any, you dumb cow.

piss off, loser. maybe you should know what your own party wanted while bill clinton was president. this was an R idea... THAT is why romney did romneycare, you braindead troll.

do you not even know what the heritage foundation is. they said individual mandates was taking on PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY.

Dismissed.

 

[jillian]

And here is Gingrich explaining how he supports Romneycare and its potential to change the American health care system.

Thats fine....doesn't change the FACT that a mandate never had support amongst conservatives. Not everything is about how conservates hate Obama....We do have beliefs on policy, and a mandate was never something we wannted!

loser doesn't even know what real conservatives wanted:

Founded in 1973, The Heritage Foundation is a research and educational institution—a think tank—whose mission is to formulate and promote conservative public policies based on the principles of free enterprise, limited government, individual freedom, traditional American values, and a strong national defense.

We believe the principles and ideas of the American Founding are worth conserving and renewing. As policy entrepreneurs, we believe the most effective solutions are consistent with those ideas and principles. Our vision is to build an America where freedom, opportunity, prosperity, and civil society flourish.

About

it was THEIR freaking plan, braindead twit.

 

[Rocko]

you mean like the idea of individual mandates for health insurance originally being a republican plan, straight out of the heritage foundation, that magically became "socialist" and "unconstitutional" as soon as it no longer had an (R) on it?

that kind of hypocritical?

How many republicans that you know that have been calling for an insurance mandate???

Provide me quotes of any, you dumb cow.

piss off, loser. maybe you should know what your own party wanted while bill clinton was president. this was an R idea... THAT is why romney did romneycare, you braindead troll.

do you not even know what the heritage foundation is. they said individual mandates was taking on PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY.

Dismissed.

you're a piece of trash. Don't tell me Republicans generally supported your facist mandate, bitch.

Everyone knows that conseravtives support tort reform, opening up competition amongst insurance companies..The mandate was never something a true conservative would ever support, you stupid dumb fuck.

Romneycare has been critizied by ever conservate and their mother, you asshole.

 

[Rocko]

And here is Gingrich explaining how he supports Romneycare and its potential to change the American health care system.

Thats fine....doesn't change the FACT that a mandate never had support amongst conservatives. Not everything is about how conservates hate Obama....We do have beliefs on policy, and a mandate was never something we wannted!

loser doesn't even know what real conservatives wanted:

Founded in 1973, The Heritage Foundation is a research and educational institution—a think tank—whose mission is to formulate and promote conservative public policies based on the principles of free enterprise, limited government, individual freedom, traditional American values, and a strong national defense.

We believe the principles and ideas of the American Founding are worth conserving and renewing. As policy entrepreneurs, we believe the most effective solutions are consistent with those ideas and principles. Our vision is to build an America where freedom, opportunity, prosperity, and civil society flourish.

About

it was THEIR freaking plan, braindead twit.

you're dumber than I thought. You think the heritage foundation is father of conservative thought, you moron. I didn't say it didn't come from the heritage foundation. I said it's not a conservative idea, retard. You fucking child.

 

[Rocko]

Read the thread by the way moron. I said the idea was born in the heritage foundation, idiot.

 

[Inthemiddle]

Ha, just because it was born in the Heritage foundation doesn't mean it's a "republican concept"

No, what makes it a "Republican concept" is the fact that it was first proposed and advocated by Republicans.

and how the hell does a mandate create individual accountablity in the concept of free markets? you're obviously reaching.

I never said anything about the concept of free markets. An individual mandate, as explained by Gingrich, creates individual responsibility because individuals are held accountable to pay for their own coverage. They have the options open to them that are in the free market, regarding which company they will do business with, and the details of their particular plans, which allows them to choose plans that work best for them based on their particular needs and financial limitations. That, at least, is the theory that has been presented behind the mandate. I, personally, do not support the mandate. I'm just presenting it for what it is and the thinking that has gone behind it.

Newt has been in politics for a million years. He didn't start his flip-flopping because of Obama.

Then what was it?

If you you are truly "in the middle", you'll admit that reason republicans don't like the mandate is because of the mandate, and nothing to do with Obama hating as suggested by many liberals.

First of all, being a centrist does not require that I refrain from criticising people for playing partisan games. Second, if what you were saying were true, then why the sudden flip flopping the moment Obama came to embrace the individual mandate? Why was that the first moment that formerly supportive Republicans suddenly objected to it? Why is it that Boehner suggested the individual mandate as a compromise over what Obama was initially proposing, just to reject it the moment Obama said yes?

 

[Oddball]