Obama to Announce Car Mileage Plan

[Zoom-boing]

I thought I had read somewhere awhile back that ethanol reduces the efficiency of mpg on cars. Anyone know anything about this?

That is correct....There are fewer BTUs in a given volume of ETOH than in the same amount of gasoline.

Also, ETOH eats the crap out of the gaskets and seals in engines designed for gasoline, and really plays havoc with marine engines.

Am I understanding this right? Ethanol was put into the gasoline supply so we would use less gas (thus, reducing our need for foreign oil) but the ethanol reduces mpg, so we need to fill up more frequently?

 

[Oddball]

Pretty much....And the increased maintenance and repairs are hardly what you would call environmentally friendly.

But leftist politicians and the lemming moonbats who act as though they're demi-gods only care about their reputed intents, not the results.

 

[Care4all]

I thought I had read somewhere awhile back that ethanol reduces the efficiency of mpg on cars. Anyone know anything about this?

That is correct....There are fewer BTUs in a given volume of ETOH than in the same amount of gasoline.

Also, ETOH eats the crap out of the gaskets and seals in engines designed for gasoline, and really plays havoc with marine engines.

Am I understanding this right? Ethanol was put into the gasoline supply so we would use less gas (thus, reducing our need for foreign oil) but the ethanol reduces mpg, so we need to fill up more frequently?

no, i don't think you are understanding it correctly?

ethanol in gasoline replaces refined oil in gasoline, thus reducing oil use, even with the miles per gallon reduction...

also, it burns purer, not adding pollution to our air.

that being said, congress's mandate was short sighted, screwed up food prices around the world because they used CORN to make the ethanol yahdeedah....they messed up badly in my opinion...switch grass or even sugar would have been better, (if we lifted the sugar embargo with Cuba)

 

[Oddball]

no, i don't think you are understanding it correctly?

ethanol in gasoline replaces refined oil in gasoline, thus reducing oil use, even with the miles per gallon reduction...

also, it burns purer, not adding pollution to our air.

that being said, congress's mandate was short sighted, screwed up food prices around the world because they used CORN to make the ethanol yahdeedah....they messed up badly in my opinion...switch grass or even sugar would have been better, (if we lifted the sugar embargo with Cuba)

Problem being that it also has been wrecking seals and gaskets, as ETOH is a solvent.

The pollution supposedly not being added to the air (which I find to be a questionable premise in the first place) is popping up in increased maintenance/repair costs and the associated increased solid and liquid waste mitigation.

But, like I said, know-nothing politicians and their hangers-on can't be measured and judged by their results....It's their purported intents that you're supposed to pay attention to.

 

[Care4all]

no, i don't think you are understanding it correctly?

ethanol in gasoline replaces refined oil in gasoline, thus reducing oil use, even with the miles per gallon reduction...

also, it burns purer, not adding pollution to our air.

that being said, congress's mandate was short sighted, screwed up food prices around the world because they used CORN to make the ethanol yahdeedah....they messed up badly in my opinion...switch grass or even sugar would have been better, (if we lifted the sugar embargo with Cuba)

Problem being that it also has been wrecking seals and gaskets, as ETOH is a solvent.

The pollution supposedly not being added to the air (which I find to be a questionable premise in the first place) is popping up in increased maintenance/repair costs and the associated increased solid and liquid waste mitigation.

But, like I said, know-nothing politicians and their hangers-on can't be measured and judged by their results....It's their purported intents that you're supposed to pay attention to.

does brazil with their ethanol made out of sugar waste i think, do this to their cars or are their cars retrofitted somehow to prevent this damage that you speak about...?

 

[Oddball]

Probably...Or they're manufactured to operate with ETOH, like flex fuel vehicles.

Still, the solid and liquid waste mitigation involved with retro fitting, lest we forget the borderline prohibitive costs, make the proposition an environmental push....at best.

The economic concept of externalities still applies, no mater anyone's claimed good intentions.

 

[k2skier]

Oh, goody...

Yet another authoritarian Kool-Aider who can't wrap their head around the fact tha mpg is not the only logically legitimate way to measure fuel efficiency.

Probably a snowboarder, too.

Book me passage on the last plane out.

If MPG isn't a good measure of fuel efficiency, then what do you consider a better one?

Snowboarder? With a nick, k2skier, really! Actually I started to ride some last year because my 15 year old wanted to, after 12-14 times we can go almost anywhere, but still prefer skis on good days, snowboardings boring.

35.5 AVERAGE for the lineup won't be hard.

We lost our moral compass when we started growing food for our cars, what a joke

E10 only really damages carburetor engines, most injection engines will be fine. I hate the stuff, all I do anymore is rebuild carbs from water being drawn into the fuel, or E10 swells up the rubber parts and throws the settings off.

 

[driveby]

I'm patiently waiting for Obama's "i'm gonna stfu now" plan ........

 

[k2skier]

I'm patiently waiting for Obama's "i'm gonna stfu now" plan ........

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, 7.5 more years, in your face! HAHAHAHAAHAHA

 

[KittenKoder]

I'm patiently waiting for Obama's "i'm gonna stfu now" plan ........

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, 7.5 more years, in your face! HAHAHAHAAHAHA

How, it's already all over yours.

 

[Oddball]

Oh, goody...

Yet another authoritarian Kool-Aider who can't wrap their head around the fact tha mpg is not the only logically legitimate way to measure fuel efficiency.

Probably a snowboarder, too.

Book me passage on the last plane out.

If MPG isn't a good measure of fuel efficiency, then what do you consider a better one?

Snowboarder? With a nick, k2skier, really! Actually I started to ride some last year because my 15 year old wanted to, after 12-14 times we can go almost anywhere, but still prefer skis on good days, snowboardings boring.

35.5 AVERAGE for the lineup won't be hard.

We lost our moral compass when we started growing food for our cars, what a joke

E10 only really damages carburetor engines, most injection engines will be fine. I hate the stuff, all I do anymore is rebuild carbs from water being drawn into the fuel, or E10 swells up the rubber parts and throws the settings off.

There being other measures of efficiency doesn't necessarily make them better or worse, it just makes them other measures. If you had read through the thread, you'd know that one other measure is horsepower per CID...Which, in some instances, has doubled in the last 25 years or so.

E10 has been playing absolute havoc with marine engines....Good thing aircraft still use high grade leaded gasoline.

 

[k2skier]

Oh, goody...

Yet another authoritarian Kool-Aider who can't wrap their head around the fact tha mpg is not the only logically legitimate way to measure fuel efficiency.

Probably a snowboarder, too.

Book me passage on the last plane out.

If MPG isn't a good measure of fuel efficiency, then what do you consider a better one?

Snowboarder? With a nick, k2skier, really! Actually I started to ride some last year because my 15 year old wanted to, after 12-14 times we can go almost anywhere, but still prefer skis on good days, snowboardings boring.

35.5 AVERAGE for the lineup won't be hard.

We lost our moral compass when we started growing food for our cars, what a joke

E10 only really damages carburetor engines, most injection engines will be fine. I hate the stuff, all I do anymore is rebuild carbs from water being drawn into the fuel, or E10 swells up the rubber parts and throws the settings off.

There being other measures of efficiency doesn't necessarily make them better or worse, it just makes them other measures. If you had read through the thread, you'd know that one other measure is horsepower per CID...Which, in some instances, has doubled in the last 25 years or so.

E10 has been playing absolute havoc with marine engines....Good thing aircraft still use high grade leaded gasoline.

I'm a marine mechanic...you can get "clean" gas at marinas in Oregon and Washington, it's also available to farmers.

add-More hp per ci isn't necessarily a measure of efficiency, it's also racing technology introduced to passenger cars to feed our thirst for performance. In the small engine field a 13 ci 5hp B&S was the norm, now 6.5hp is attained with 12 ci.

 

[Oddball]

I'm a marine mechanic...you can get "clean" gas at marinas in Oregon and Washington, it's also available to farmers.

Yes, you can....However, not everyone know this and in many instances the damage has already been done. A lot of people have just pulled their boats on trailers up to the auto gas pumps, where it's cheaper, and filled them up in blissful ignorance.

 

[neurosport]

all that means is that REAL cars will become extra expensive as manufacturers won't be able to build as many of them as they can sell

at the same times small cars will become basically free because manufacturers will need to sell them even if nobody wants them

although i am generally free market i do agree with this particular measure. this will keep fuel prices lower and the air cleaner and will overall be good for the nation.

hybrids and small cars are not the only ways to improve gas mileage

turbochargers, diesel, direct fuel injection, valvetronic, double clutch transmission, higher tire pressure, aluminum body, aerodynamic improvements to car underbody, and just plain different engine tuning can all be used to improve gas mileage

of course simply having a small car with a small engine will be the most effective way of getting that gas mileage - more effective than even hybrid technology

Americans lately started driving cars that are way too fast. this is bullshit. i should be driving a fast car and everybody else should be driving one of those smart for two pieces of shit.