Obama, Stephanopoulos Spar Over Definition of 'Tax'

[VaYank5150]

You shouldn't ask those questions. it irritates them ....which is a violation of the "patriot" Act.


.

But that is the part I don't understand? Conservatives are supposed to be about spending less government tax dollars. With Obama's proposal, we could actually FORCE responsibility back on those who CHOOSE not to purchase insurance and at the same time, provide it for only those who truly cannot afford it?

The federal government has no authority to force me to get healthcare. NONE.


.

Then why do they have the authority to force hospitals to cover your sorry ass when you need medical treatment and have no insurance?

 

[Oddball]

So, just WHO do you suppose pays for all of the people who CHOOSE not to have heath insurance? The HMO Fairy???

Although this may of a bit of a challenge to consider, maybe they pay their own way?

Too broad of a brush, perhaps? Yes, I am certain SOME pay their own way. However, if that was the rule and not the exception, this conversation possibly wouldn't be taking place, now would it?

Bunk.

The only reason the conversation is taking place is because this has become a strawman talking point of the medical Marxists, which presumes all who show up at clinics and ERs sans insurance are deadbeats.

 

[VaYank5150]

Although this may of a bit of a challenge to consider, maybe they pay their own way?

Too broad of a brush, perhaps? Yes, I am certain SOME pay their own way. However, if that was the rule and not the exception, this conversation possibly wouldn't be taking place, now would it?

Bunk.

The only reason the conversation is taking place is because this has become a strawman talking point of the medical Marxists, which presumes all who show up at clinics and ERs sans insurance are deadbeats.

Huh?

 

[Oddball]

In the political arena, what's the presupposition when people who have no insurance get treatment at ERs and clinics?....They're deadbeats, who are a defacto burden on the system.

Classic strawman.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

ANYTIME The government takes your property (income is property) it is a tax regardless of what they try to call it.

If it comes out of your wealth and goes into the governments it is a tax. Taxes are called many things such as:

Taxes (excise, property, sales, utilities, income, interest income, ect)
Fees
Tolls
Fines (AKA in Massachussettes if you dont "choose" to buy health insurance you are charged a fine by the state, you didn't break the law like a speeding fine...that is different)

 

[Contumacious]

But that is the part I don't understand? Conservatives are supposed to be about spending less government tax dollars. With Obama's proposal, we could actually FORCE responsibility back on those who CHOOSE not to purchase insurance and at the same time, provide it for only those who truly cannot afford it?

The federal government has no authority to force me to get healthcare. NONE.


.

Then why do they have the authority to force hospitals to cover your sorry ass when you need medical treatment and have no insurance?

They have NO authority to force hospitals to cover my great ass.

Hospitals want monopoly powers and they want to receive medicare funds so they agree to provide medical care to everyone.

Individuals can not open a new hospital they have to get permission from the bureaucracy.


Learn and quit posting bullshit.

 

[Ravi]

ANYTIME The government takes your property (income is property) it is a tax regardless of what they try to call it.

If it comes out of your wealth and goes into the governments it is a tax. Taxes are called many things such as:

Taxes (excise, property, sales, utilities, income, interest income, ect)
Fees
Tolls
Fines (AKA in Massachussettes if you dont "choose" to buy health insurance you are charged a fine by the state, you didn't break the law like a speeding fine...that is different)

Yep...it's been quite amusing down here watching the polls raising all the fees and fines and pretending they haven't raised taxes.

 

[manifold]

No kidding Ravi!

Romney still claims he never raised any taxes in Mass while he was governor. He just tripled every "fee" he got his greedy little mitts on! (pun intended )

 

[Oddball]

ANYTIME The government takes your property (income is property) it is a tax regardless of what they try to call it.

If it comes out of your wealth and goes into the governments it is a tax. Taxes are called many things such as:

Taxes (excise, property, sales, utilities, income, interest income, ect)
Fees
Tolls
Fines (AKA in Massachussettes if you dont "choose" to buy health insurance you are charged a fine by the state, you didn't break the law like a speeding fine...that is different)

Yep...it's been quite amusing down here watching the polls raising all the fees and fines and pretending they haven't raised taxes.

Old semantic trick that both teams play.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

President Obama and ABC News' George Stephanopoulos got in a testy sparring match Sunday over whether the president's health care plan includes a tax increase, leading the host to look up the Merriam-Webster dictionary definition of taxes.

In the interview airing Sunday, Stephanopoulos pressed the president on his plan to require people to purchase health insurance.

"Under this mandate, the government is forcing people to spend money, fining you if you don't. How is that not a tax?" the host asked.

Obama responded: " No, but -- but, George, you -- you can't just make up that language and decide that that's called a tax increase."

Stephanopoulos then offered the dictionary definition.

"I don't think I'm making it up. Merriam-Webster's dictionary: 'Tax, a charge, usually of money, imposed by authority on persons or property for public purposes,'" he said.

Visibly taken aback, Obama rejected the notion it was a tax increase and said pulling the dictionary out was a sign the host was "stretching" a little.

"No. That -- that's not true, George. The -- for us to say that you've got to take a responsibility to get health insurance is absolutely not a tax increase," Obama said.

Obama, Stephanopoulos Spar Over Definition of 'Tax' - Political News - FOXNews.com

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rL7ak__MGyw]YouTube - Obama Goes Toe-To-Toe With Stephanopoulos On "Tax Increases"[/ame]


You have to sit through Barry's rambling on to get to the tax thing, it's the last minute of the vid.

Obama denies it's a tax and when GS says to Obama "your critics say it is a tax increase" Obama replies "my critics say everything is a tax increase. My critics say I'm taking over every sector of the economy". Note, Obama doesn't even attempt to deny this. Nothing, nada, zilch.

ROFLMNAO...

Yeah...

There was the The BOY King, clambering on about how the inquisiter was making up words... So Stephenopolous breaks out the DICTIONARY and proves that he was using the word AS IT IS DEFINED; and in typical Marxist form... The Leftist runs to demand that THE VERY USE OF A DICTIONARY proves the argument is weak.

Pure ad populum drivel...

But it does prove what I've said for 15 years... IF the LEADERSHIP of the ideological Left were to try and debate their positions on message boards such as this, they would fair NO BETTER than the idiots which are already here.

Good news kids... It turns out that the BOY King is an IMBECILE; she's no brighter than Jullian, Chris, Ravi or any of the usual suspects that have their asses handed to them here, on a minute to minute basis.

 

[oreo]

Strictly speaking I don't think it is a tax. But it is a distinction without a difference: you are making people pay for something they may not want.
But here's Obama once again muffing it when called to think on his feet.

It's NOT a tax. These morons are spinning again. In fact Obama is trying to help the rest of us out by forcing people WE CURRENTLY PAY FOR to get health insurance. What about this is a BAD thing?

How about this: One time where you as a liberal & me as a conservative AGREE: I agee that health insurance must be mandatory. I have brought this up several times. We are required to carry automobile liability--& the first thing I get blasted back with. Auto insurance is to protect the property of the individual who was not at fault--therefore--mandating health insurance is not in the same realm.

B.S.--people who can afford medical insurance & choose not to get it--& then end up in our hosptials do financial damage to all of us.

So--I say--make it mandatory--fine the crap out of those who do not have health insurance--& if they still do not get it & end up in our hosptials--add the cost of that to their life-time tax liability & charge them interest on the amount. I really don't care if it takes them the rest of their lives to pay that bill back. I don't want to get stuck with the bill on people who think their new car stereo is more important than obtaining health insurance.--

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

ANYTIME The government takes your property (income is property) it is a tax regardless of what they try to call it.

If it comes out of your wealth and goes into the governments it is a tax. Taxes are called many things such as:

Taxes (excise, property, sales, utilities, income, interest income, ect)
Fees
Tolls
Fines (AKA in Massachussettes if you dont "choose" to buy health insurance you are charged a fine by the state, you didn't break the law like a speeding fine...that is different)

Yep...it's been quite amusing down here watching the polls raising all the fees and fines and pretending they haven't raised taxes.

Oh our dump sticker went from 70 to 150/year. We have to PAY extra to recycle now. RMV processing fees went up 15%, property tax in plymouth went up (and since its paid through the mortgage payment that went up too) They added a new regulatory fee to the phone bill.

There are more....

No kidding Ravi!

Romney still claims he never raised any taxes in Mass while he was governor. He just tripled every "fee" he got his greedy little mitts on! (pun intended )

Yeah he didn't raise taxes and he had a surplus......so he got the money from.....FEES .

Now we are 2 billion in debt 2 years into our govt assisted health care (not govt run, they are just assisting paying for private insurance) and we have raised the sales tax and more fees. I'm waiting for the income tax hike.

 

[The T]

ANYTIME The government takes your property (income is property) it is a tax regardless of what they try to call it.

If it comes out of your wealth and goes into the governments it is a tax. Taxes are called many things such as:

Taxes (excise, property, sales, utilities, income, interest income, ect)
Fees
Tolls
Fines (AKA in Massachussettes if you dont "choose" to buy health insurance you are charged a fine by the state, you didn't break the law like a speeding fine...that is different)

Yep...it's been quite amusing down here watching the polls raising all the fees and fines and pretending they haven't raised taxes.

Oh our dump sticker went from 70 to 150/year. We have to PAY extra to recycle now. RMV processing fees went up 15%, property tax in plymouth went up (and since its paid through the mortgage payment that went up too) They added a new regulatory fee to the phone bill.

There are more....

No kidding Ravi!

Romney still claims he never raised any taxes in Mass while he was governor. He just tripled every "fee" he got his greedy little mitts on! (pun intended )

Yeah he didn't raise taxes and he had a surplus......so he got the money from.....FEES .

Now we are 2 billion in debt 2 years into our govt assisted health care (not govt run, they are just assisting paying for private insurance) and we have raised the sales tax and more fees. I'm waiting for the income tax hike.

What is a FEE but a TAX?

 

[The T]

Note at 1:08 Obama says "what I've been trying to say throughout this campaign, uh, throughout this effort to get health care done . . ." He's in perpetual campaign mode.

Yes he is, and the majority are tired of this. He is NO Leader.

 

[The T]

Strictly speaking I don't think it is a tax. But it is a distinction without a difference: you are making people pay for something they may not want.
But here's Obama once again muffing it when called to think on his feet.

Anytime Any money/property is exacted from an individual by the Government by MANDATE is a TAX. George was correct. Obama was WRONG.

 

[Huh?]

You will be receiving a brochure in the mail soon, it will tell you what to eat, fuck, inhale.....

I Loves the smell of tyranny in the morning


.

Lol, like that's something new...

 

[Huh?]

I don't know about every state but most and certainly here in Arizona, if you don't maintain insurance on your vehicle the government suspends the tags on your car...guess what happens if you get caught driving it?

Arizona is a red state so we can thank the republicons for that one, I suppose.

If it were the republicons who came up with a health plan I'd be willing to bet that there wouldn't be near as much nitpicking from those on the right...granted they aren't likely to do such a thing for whatever reason they'd prefer that many things that could be simple should require a trip to the emergency room where a little Ketchup pack size packet of Vaseline costs about 10 bucks...perhaps that's why they think that everything the damnocraps try to do requires Vaseline and figures the country can't afford it...they'd rather spend the money to "help" 20 million Iraqi's than to help more than twice as many Americans...go figure.

Call it whatever the fuck you want but we get screwed regardless of who is in power when it comes to spending money...

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

I don't know about every state but most and certainly here in Arizona, if you don't maintain insurance on your vehicle the government suspends the tags on your car...guess what happens if you get caught driving it?

Arizona is a red state so we can thank the republicons for that one, I suppose.

If it were the republicons who came up with a health plan I'd be willing to bet that there wouldn't be near as much nitpicking from those on the right...granted they aren't likely to do such a thing for whatever reason they'd prefer that many things that could be simple should require a trip to the emergency room where a little Ketchup pack size packet of Vaseline costs about 10 bucks...perhaps that's why they think that everything the damnocraps try to do requires Vaseline and figures the country can't afford it...they'd rather spend the money to "help" 20 million Iraqi's than to help more than twice as many Americans...go figure.

Call it whatever the fuck you want but we get screwed regardless of who is in power when it comes to spending money...

Golly... Lets see... If you follow your graph; it tracks the aquisition of power by Leftist legislatures... Yet... it labels the respective periods by the Presidents.

Now what sort of FOOL would label a graph of LEGISLATIVE SPENDING, by using the Cheif Executive, who can't spend a freakin CENT before the LEGISLATURE WRITES A CHECK.

Are you people really this stupid or do you think that we're stupid enough to buy this idiocy?

 

[Huh?]

I don't know about every state but most and certainly here in Arizona, if you don't maintain insurance on your vehicle the government suspends the tags on your car...guess what happens if you get caught driving it?

Arizona is a red state so we can thank the republicons for that one, I suppose.

If it were the republicons who came up with a health plan I'd be willing to bet that there wouldn't be near as much nitpicking from those on the right...granted they aren't likely to do such a thing for whatever reason they'd prefer that many things that could be simple should require a trip to the emergency room where a little Ketchup pack size packet of Vaseline costs about 10 bucks...perhaps that's why they think that everything the damnocraps try to do requires Vaseline and figures the country can't afford it...they'd rather spend the money to "help" 20 million Iraqi's than to help more than twice as many Americans...go figure.

Call it whatever the fuck you want but we get screwed regardless of who is in power when it comes to spending money...

Golly... Lets see... If you follow your graph; it tracks the aquisition of power by Leftist legislatures... Yet... it labels the respective periods by the Presidents.

Now what sort of FOOL would label a graph of LEGISLATIVE SPENDING, by using the Cheif Executive, who can't spend a freakin CENT before the LEGISLATURE WRITES A CHECK.

Are you people really this stupid or do you think that we're stupid enough to buy this idiocy?

Quite the common response, ignoring my other points and trying to put the normal conservative spin on the graph which, of course, ignores the veto power of the President...funny that Reagan, late in his term took credit for getting things under control and Bush did not have a leftist legislature during the reversal of the trend following the Clinton years but you do highlight the point that trying to blame everything on the President is a failure in logic regardless of who occupies the seat...thank you.

 

[Oddball]

What is a FEE but a TAX?

A good question for the up-and-comer republican enabler dipshit, Tim Pawlenty, from Minnesnowta.

He raised the per-pack tax on smokes by a buck, after taking the "no new taxes" pledge, and cynically called it a "fee".