Obama set's back Iran's nuclear program by years

[Jarhead]

But Obama did actually mistakenly say 57 states. Gore did not say he invented the internet. A pundant turned the word create and turned it into invent. It's an often repeated lie that many people believe. Some I suspect chose to believe it even though they know it's a lie.

Because "I took the initiative in creating the Internet" can easily be spun into "I invented the internet"...

And the truth is, you dont even need to spin "I took the initiative in creating the Internet"....the words alone IN THAT ORDER can easily mean that he is taking claim to inventing the interent.

"Inventing" means something entirely different from "initiating the creation." Gore obviously didn't have the scientific nor technical academic background to "invent" the Internet. But he was the first legislator to promote the concept in a manner others could understand, based on the science and technology (just as he did with "An Inconvenient Truth").

Internet pioneers Vint Cerf and Bob Kahn noted that, "as far back as the 1970s, Congressman Gore promoted the idea of high speed telecommunications as an engine for both economic growth and the improvement of our educational system. He was the first elected official to grasp the potential of computer communications to have a broader impact than just improving the conduct of science and scholarship [...]

24 Jun 1986: Albert Gore introduce S 2594 Supercomputer Network Study Act of 1986.[51] As another example, he sponsored hearings on how advanced technologies might be put to use in areas like coordinating the response of government agencies to natural disasters and other crises."[52]

Al Gore - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I know Maggie.
It became a line for political humor.
Just like Sara Palins "I can see Russia from my house".

The difference is...I saw it as humor with Gore....but many saw it as "fact" with Palin.

 

[Baruch Menachem]

Anyway..... The Iranians now know we can compromise any system at any time. Unless they can invent an operating system from scratch, and write their own code to run the centrifuges, we can do this over and over.

This may mean they have to buy whole new computer systems, whole new software for the machinery.... It is expensive just for that.

And when it comes right down to it..... We can do this to any electronic system they have. With something similar, if Obama wanted to, he could turn all of Tehan's lights off from the oval office. He could do more damage to Iran without causing a singe shot to be fired than we could do with any number of bombs, missiles or tanks.
It is a nice little warning to the Chinese and the Russians as well.

 

[jillian]

torture doesnt work.

You get unreliable intell from torture

Tell that to someone whos life was saved because of waterboarding.

name one person....

 

[Two Thumbs]

Then being a realist surely you understand blowback for illegal activity.

Surely then you'd have no problems with US industries being attacked by the same or similar software .. you'd have no problems with foreign spying on our government .. you'd have no problems with a foreign government attacking the vunerable US elections systems and "electing" whoever they want.

The door to realism does not swing one way.

China does much of that now.

Spying is to be expected. Those Russian spies got sent home. I'd bet we got something for them, and won't know what for 75 years.

But we either accept to do it b/c they do it, or be prepared to be unarmed if it's ever done on a large scale.

I don't disagree with that .. however, what say you if we are ever hit with what we do to other countries?China does it because all nations do it. Israel spies on us probably more than any nation.

But spying is a long way from nuclear annihilation. It's a long way from software viruses that cripple industries .. as you correctly stated.

Any idea how devastating such an attack would be to an already fragile and economically weak America?

Better to allow the Iranians to do what they're going to do anyway then open the door to American devastation.

We are hit like that, or in simular fashion. China has done it and will do it again. And I think N Korrea did to (not certain).

Part of what we do, to win out, is create things we think our opponent can't stop, but before we let it loose, we figure out how to stop it ourselves.

So if we and Israel did send this worm, our governments have the anti-worm program.

The rest of the world is screwed, but the fed it safe.

 

[MaggieMae]

Al Gore did take the initiative in creating the internet.

He worked in the congress to pave the way for its success.

he was right.

Gore can not help that people want to misunderstand what he said on purpose to score political points.

If you think the internet would not have happened w/o Gore, you're deluded


wait

Never mind..

Nobody has ever claimed that, nor will they. But hey, carry on. Maybe you'll start a whole new series of Gore-bashing threads. I'd actually like to see some of those because I'll bet not a single one of you even knows why you hate him so much, other than he wrote another book based on scientific analysis. And that he has a stodgy personality.

 

[Two Thumbs]

torture doesnt work.

You get unreliable intell from torture

Tell that to someone whos life was saved because of waterboarding.

name one person....

Can't. It's classified information.

 

[MaggieMae]

Lets assume this story is true, and we have destroyed some of Irans property.

We have not declared war on Iran, therefore we can not legally destroy thier property.

It's a war crime.

Obama is a war mongering war criminal.

Whatcha say lefties?

This is a spook knife fight.

Been done for decades to avoid total war.

Putting aside the rhetoric...

It is no doubt a smart move to avoid a military action.
But...
It is no doubt reason for Iran to declare a war against us.

Will be interesting to see how "sane" that guy is..

And yes, I know his name, but cant spell it...so I went with "that guy"....

Achmedinejad is just a noisy figurehead. The Mullahs run the country, along with the Revolutionary Guard. The Mullahs do the politics, the Guard does the citizen maintenance.

 

[Jarhead]

Al Gore did take the initiative in creating the internet.

He worked in the congress to pave the way for its success.

he was right.

Gore can not help that people want to misunderstand what he said on purpose to score political points.

If you think the internet would not have happened w/o Gore, you're deluded


wait

Never mind..

Nobody has ever claimed that, nor will they. But hey, carry on. Maybe you'll start a whole new series of Gore-bashing threads. I'd actually like to see some of those because I'll bet not a single one of you even knows why you hate him so much, other than he wrote another book based on scientific analysis. And that he has a stodgy personality.

huh?
How many Gore threads do you see on this site?
Now lets compare to how many Palin threads there are?

One WAS VP...the other ran for VP
Both are in the limelight by choice.

Yet you criiticize the few that bash Gore?

DO you do the same to those that bash Palin?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

torture doesnt work.

You get unreliable intell from torture

Tell that to someone whos life was saved because of waterboarding.

name one person....

Terry Jeffrey
CIA Waterboarding Produced Intel That Stopped Attack on Los Angeles
CIA Waterboarding Produced Intel That Stopped Attack on Los Angeles - Terry Jeffrey - Townhall Conservative

 

[Jarhead]

This is a spook knife fight.

Been done for decades to avoid total war.

Putting aside the rhetoric...

It is no doubt a smart move to avoid a military action.
But...
It is no doubt reason for Iran to declare a war against us.

Will be interesting to see how "sane" that guy is..

And yes, I know his name, but cant spell it...so I went with "that guy"....

Achmedinejad is just a noisy figurehead. The Mullahs run the country, along with the Revolutionary Guard. The Mullahs do the politics, the Guard does the citizen maintenance.

And Bin Laden was not capable of attacking our shores.

 

[MaggieMae]

It is a lie, a falsehood, a myth to say Al Gore said he invented the internet, period. Like Ike "created" the interstate highway system he did not "invent" the technology needed to build super highways.

You quoted him stating that he created the internet. It's not my fault Al Gore is a narcissistic liar.

If that's the way you want to continue to condense it, then go ahead and continue looking foolish.

 

[MaggieMae]

Putting aside the rhetoric...

It is no doubt a smart move to avoid a military action.
But...
It is no doubt reason for Iran to declare a war against us.

Will be interesting to see how "sane" that guy is..

And yes, I know his name, but cant spell it...so I went with "that guy"....

Iran has not started a war in decades..arguably centuries..

And the parameters I am using is initiating a conventional war.

No, they have not started a war....but as we are seeing, they sure know how to egg people on.

And you don't think Iran has been egging us on for years with their continued threats and enhancement of their nuclear capability? It's time we became PROactive on many things, Iran included, without the necessity of blowing things up first.

 

[MaggieMae]

Lets assume this story is true, and we have destroyed some of Irans property.

We have not declared war on Iran, therefore we can not legally destroy thier property.

It's a war crime.

Obama is a war mongering war criminal.

Whatcha say lefties?

I'm certain its illegal (I'm ok with it, though) but I don't believe it's a war crime as defined by the War Crimes Act.

Torture is though.

As is cruel or inhuman treatment.

United States Code: Title 18,2441. War crimes | LII / Legal Information Institute

who's the war mongering war criminal again?

whatcha say rightie?

You talking about Bush?

A crimes a crime. If he had something to do with it, he needs to be charged.

As gruesome as this will sound

I'm not against torture, not at all.

A gang of people have one of my kids and I have ahold of a person that knows where my kid is but won't talk no matter how kind I am.

I wonder how far I would go to get the info needed out of him, given the chance.

So when they are waterboarding murderers that know when other peoples kids will be killed, I'm ok with that.

And you can send me to jail after I save lives.

Or you've gone on a wild goose chase after the perp tells a bunch of lies just to stop the torture.

 

[Truthmatters]

Tell that to someone whos life was saved because of waterboarding.

name one person....

Terry Jeffrey
CIA Waterboarding Produced Intel That Stopped Attack on Los Angeles
CIA Waterboarding Produced Intel That Stopped Attack on Los Angeles - Terry Jeffrey - Townhall Conservative

Monica Crowley revives dubious claim that waterboarding KSM resulted in "actionable intelligence" | Media Matters for America



KSM reportedly said he "gave a lot of false information ... in order to make the ill-treatment stop"; and the Bush administration said the L.A. attack was thwarted in February 2002 -- more than a year before KSM was captured.

 

[Jarhead]

Iran has not started a war in decades..arguably centuries..

And the parameters I am using is initiating a conventional war.

No, they have not started a war....but as we are seeing, they sure know how to egg people on.

And you don't think Iran has been egging us on for years with their continued threats and enhancement of their nuclear capability? It's time we became PROactive on many things, Iran included, without the necessity of blowing things up first.

Uh....Maggie....sort of what we did?
Thus the thread that cirticizes THAT action as well.

 

[MaggieMae]

torture doesnt work.

You get unreliable intell from torture

then how come we saved lives and got more bad guys?

You will find no "official" information anywhere on how many lives were saved because Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was waterboarded 18 times. None. But you will find information that physical torture for a Muslim doesn't work anywhere near as well as showing him a blood-soaked Tampax or filling his head full of lies about his whore of a wife, or by threatening the well-being of his family.

 

[BlackAsCoal]

If we didnt create it, someone else would have.
And whereas I admire your passion for your dream of a "conflict free" world, I see things from a "what is, is" perspective.

We did not create Hitler.
We did not create the dictators of yore, present and those to come.
Total power and acquiision of territory is part of human nature. Most try to acquire it without compromising their morals and others try to acquire it regardless of what is right.
The existance of the latter is why our world will always have conflict.
Unfortunately, as technology increases, so does ones INability to forsee and plan for an attack...and thereforte pro-active measures must be taken.
Believe me....I hate war; But war has been a part of humans since the beginning.

I hate NEEDLESS war brother. Most wars are NEEDLESS.

Someone else may have created the nuclear world, but no one else did. In fact, no other country has ever used them .. we did twice .. and threaten to use them again.

The Chinese don't go around the world threatening small and tiny nations. They don't rely on military power to spread their agenda .. and guess who's winning? The Chinese.

America is infected with the disease of violence. Controlled by our fetish for things that go boom.

Our "pro-active" measure of releasing a virus that attacks industry is much like the testing we did on Japanese people.

What say you if/when that virus comes back to hit American industries?

What say me?
Exactly what I said about Assange.

Dont blame him....blame ourselves for not preparing for it...or avoiding it.

Correct .. and that was the conclusion after the release of the Pentagon Papers.

Yes, we open the door to things when we apply our technology to be pro active....but you saw on 9-11 what happens when we are not pro-active.

9/11 had nothing to do with anything but the US failed to act on a plethora of credible intelligence they had been given from all around the world. Why we failed to act is open to question lol but there is simply no doubt that we ignored what was right in our face.

Additionally, we had/have an ulterior motive for wanting to be in Afghanistan and Iraq. 9/11, like Pearl Harbor, served that purpose .. which is why PNAC called it "A New Pearl Harbor." Technology shares no blame for 9/11.

The US is very technologically advanced and thus why we are pioneers with certain things such as nuclear arms etc.....It has a lot to do with two things...the size of our population and the "free market" we have here.

It has everything to do with colonialism and war for profit.

There is no such thing as a "free market." It only exists in the libertarian mind.

China has more people, but much less that are free to apply their ingenuity...and thus they lag behind in technology....so maybe your concern is that we are always one step ahead in technology.

Don't fool yourself about "freedom" and how advanced we are over China ..

China's Exporst of Advanced Technology Products to the United States
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But we must not forget...whereas our military is continually advancing itself in training and arms use to minimize and ultimately eliminate civilian casualties, we see other nations doing what they can to simply be able to use their military to win a war regardoless of civilian casualites.

I give credit to the US for lessons learned after WW2.

Brother PLEASE.

We do WHAT to minimize civilian casualties?

We massacred hundreds of thousands of innocent Iraqis .. dropped monstrous tonnage of big ass bombs on a civilian population that was absolutely no threat to us .. used depleted uranium weapons .. used WP which melted the skin right off living humans .. and babies. Melted right down to the bone.

I cannot view our own terrorism and horror through rose-colored glasses.

 

[MaggieMae]

Why on earth are you detracting from who is really responsible. We all know none of this was possible without Al Gore. He invented the Internet. He deserves all the credit.

Do you get all your facts from paraphrasing pundits?

snopes.com: Al Gore Invented the Internet

Here's Al

"I've traveled to every part of this country during the last six years. During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative in creating the Internet. I took the initiative in moving forward a whole range of initiatives that have proven to be important to our country's economic growth and environmental protection, improvements in our educational system."

So who was it that took "I took the initiative in creating the Internet." to mean "I invented the internet"? Why does the myth persist?

Why? Maybe this will help.
create - Synonyms from Roget's A-Z Thesaurus and Roget's II

And as for snopes you may want to check on them.
Snopes exposed

Any fact-checking organization willing to post BOTH SIDES AND EVIDENCE of an issue can be trusted far more than the off-the-wall bullshit put out by "mom & pop" bloggers and biased Internet "news" outlets, in my humble opinion. If you don't trust Snopes, go elsewhere. If you don't trust Wikipedia entries, click on their plethora of links at the bottom of each of their pages. But to not trust a fact-checker just because you don't like what they discover means you need to take your blinders off and remove the cotton from your ears.

 

[Jarhead]

When you say:

9/11 had nothing to do with anything but the US failed to act on a plethora of credible intelligence they had been given from all around the world. Why we failed to act is open to question () but there is simply no doubt that we ignored what was right in our face.

It appears you are agreeing that we needed to be pro-active in regard to those that swished to attack us.

And what would that have been?

As for "what have we done to minimize civilian casualites"

I can answer that question with personal experience (not me being in the sand pit, but many of my friends.)

We have lost countless American Soldiers....that is what we have done.

It is a lot safer to simply hit a building from long range where we know an insurgent is hiding in than to painfully knock on every door looking for him in an effort to avoid civilian casualites.

And that is just the tip of the iceberg.

 

[Two Thumbs]

Al Gore did take the initiative in creating the internet.

He worked in the congress to pave the way for its success.

he was right.

Gore can not help that people want to misunderstand what he said on purpose to score political points.

If you think the internet would not have happened w/o Gore, you're deluded


wait

Never mind..

Nobody has ever claimed that, nor will they. But hey, carry on. Maybe you'll start a whole new series of Gore-bashing threads. I'd actually like to see some of those because I'll bet not a single one of you even knows why you hate him so much, other than he wrote another book based on scientific analysis. And that he has a stodgy personality.

Gore is out of politics, so he would normally have little affect on our lives.
Gore wants in our pocket books. Since his book and movie have been debunked as half baked science, I don't think he should be held in high reguard by anyone.

but keep the faith

your making blind faith, cross huggers seem normal.