Obama opponents NEVER satisfied

Well, the first civilian trial of an Al Qaeda affiliate suspect in the 1998 bombings of US embassies in Nairobi, Tanzania and Kenya is over. And out of 280 charges, Mr. Ahmed Khalfan Ghailani, 36, was found guilty of one. Conspiracy to destroy government property and buildings.

Outrageous, you say? Well, he's in for 20 years to life.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/18/nyregion/18ghailani.html

Now I know that emotions run high regarding all things related to Al Qaeda, but keep this in mind: This guy is going to do 20 YEARS before being considered for parole....how much you want to bet he's NOT going to get it?

A witness for the prosecution who says Ghailani received explosives and was more involved in the plot to attack the embassies was never heard by the jury because his testimomy was coerced (i.e., tortured), which is inadmissable in American court.

Now to prevent such things in the future...don't torture prisoners, and you have a better shot of faster trials with better sentencing because people wanted an execution sentence. So now the anti-Obama politicians and pundits are all screaming "Obama's civilian trials are a failure! He shames America's 9/11 victims, diminishes us in th eworld's eyes!"....which is interesesting being that the same detractors claimed that such trials could not happen on US soil due to the security risk. Welll, local residents and commuters were mostly unawares that such a trial was taking place in New York City!

So, we have a SAFE trial with a conviction....a hell of a lot more than Bush did for 8 years with all his Constitution/Bill of Rights bending actions. More to come, I'm sure.

It's utter lunacy.

Most of the big guys were never read their rights.

Most of them were questioned without an attorney present and under duress. Logically most of the evidence has to be thrown out.

You bring them to the states and you have to give them the same rights a citizen gets and the prosecution has little or no case? You're fucked.

None of them was captured in an occupied country so they didn't fall under Geneva Convention rules......but we're giving them a lawyer and rights they shouldn't have. They're supposed to spend their lives behind bars for the duration of the war...but since it's not a declared war the war never ends.
 
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The author of the stupid original post subscribes to the absurd notion that we "should" treat terrorism in the same way we treat mere criminality.

It was precisely that kind of mindless liberal "thinking" that led to the kinds of problems that made 9/11/2001 possible.


You need to divorce yourself of the delusion that you're intellectually capable of discerning what others think when it's painfully obvious that you cannot comprehend what you read.

The opening post tells it plain.....Ghailani tried in a US court...found guilty and sentenced. Something neocon toadys like YOU swore couldn't happen and would be detrimental to the US war on terror.

YOU WERE WRONG....THIS IS A WIN FOR THE USA, and it happened on OBAMA'S watch.....and you're too blinded by your partisan hatred to see the good of this.

Your god the Shrub and his minions opened the door on this problem with Gitmo, you neocon liability. Check out Hamdan vs. Rumsfeld. Obama is dealing with the mess YOUR boy left.

9/11 happened because the Shrub threw out all the policies that kept our security agencies on their toes and the country safe from such an attack for 7 years. Criminal negligence is the least you can charge the Shrub & company with.
 
To the title of the thread...I think they will be satisfied in January 2012.

So like a good little neocon parrot, you just AVOID THE FACT that Obama was right on this one issue, and the USA has proven to the world that it's justice system works.

I wonder what joker you have in mind for 2012 to defeat Obama? Or are you just blowing smoke?
 
When you say opponents...does that include George Soros and Andy Stern? Lololol...Barry better watch out for his own "friends". They are wayyyy more dangerous than any conservative?
 
The author of the stupid original post subscribes to the absurd notion that we "should" treat terrorism in the same way we treat mere criminality.

It was precisely that kind of mindless liberal "thinking" that led to the kinds of problems that made 9/11/2001 possible.


You need to divorce yourself of the delusion that you're intellectually capable of discerning what others think when it's painfully obvious that you cannot comprehend what you read.

The opening post tells it plain.....Ghailani tried in a US court...found guilty and sentenced. Something neocon toadys like YOU swore couldn't happen and would be detrimental to the US war on terror.

YOU WERE WRONG....THIS IS A WIN FOR THE USA, and it happened on OBAMA'S watch.....and you're too blinded by your partisan hatred to see the good of this.

Your god the Shrub and his minions opened the door on this problem with Gitmo, you neocon liability. Check out Hamdan vs. Rumsfeld. Obama is dealing with the mess YOUR boy left.

9/11 happened because the Shrub threw out all the policies that kept our security agencies on their toes and the country safe from such an attack for 7 years. Criminal negligence is the least you can charge the Shrub & company with.

You're full of it dude.
 
The author of the stupid original post subscribes to the absurd notion that we "should" treat terrorism in the same way we treat mere criminality.

It was precisely that kind of mindless liberal "thinking" that led to the kinds of problems that made 9/11/2001 possible.

The funny thing is that the people who think that way voted for Obama based on his campaign rhetoric to the same. Sorta different now that he has to actually do the job now huh?
I thought it was funny how he had to walk back so much of his campaign rhetoric when he took office and started seeing real intel and not just the crap in the media. :lol:
 
Do some here really think that torture should be OK? Would it be OK for other countries to Torture our soldiers to get the information they want if were capture because its their service instead of their courts and that makes it OK.

Were America, not the talaban or Alkaida or Iran or Saddam, we actually want people to look up to us because we are better than they are.

What part of all this is GOD's plan anyway.

This is not God's plan, this is God's judgement!

Really? I had no idea America was a theocracy! You'd better hop right over to the nearest Fox News affiliate and spread the word.
 
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So, we have a SAFE trial with a conviction....a hell of a lot more than Bush did for 8 years with all his Constitution/Bill of Rights bending actions. More to come, I'm sure
.


Since when do we bring the enemy captured on the battlefield to the U.S. and give them Constitutional rights? Khalid Sheikh Mohammed would have been executed by now if not for you stupid libs. The Constitution does not apply to the enemy, you libs are such backwards idiots...Unreal!! :cuckoo:

Justice for KSM!!


220px-Khalid_Shaikh_Mohammed_after_capture.jpg

It wasn't "liberals" who only convicted three out of hundreds. No, it was Republicans and conservatives, and then, get this, the stupid fucks let two of the three go.

This is why Conservatives and Republicans should be kept away from government and left out of important decisions. Their delusions render them incapable of rational behavior.

Torture saves the nation. But they only convict three out of hundreds and let two of the three go to invent more plots.

They give trillion dollar tax breaks and the economy falls apart.

They invade Iraq and let in hundreds of al Qaeda and end up turning Iraq into Iran's friend.

This is why they hate government. Because everything they do when in charge, fails. I'd be frustrated too. I can't blame them. I'm actually sympathetic.
 
The author of the stupid original post subscribes to the absurd notion that we "should" treat terrorism in the same way we treat mere criminality.

It was precisely that kind of mindless liberal "thinking" that led to the kinds of problems that made 9/11/2001 possible.

The funny thing is that the people who think that way voted for Obama based on his campaign rhetoric to the same. Sorta different now that he has to actually do the job now huh?

What would be funny if it weren't so tragic, is how jokers like YOU and Liability are so against the simple idea of Obama in the Oval office that you are against the FACT that a terrorist was successfully tried and convicted in a US court of law and duly sentenced. This is a win for the USA on the international stage, but you don't/won't see it.

You're insipid stubborness regarding Obama's achievment on any level borders the irrational. Hell, he compromises to the GOP to the point that pisses of his supporters, and YOU are still railing against him. You're pathetic.
 
Now I know that emotions run high regarding all things related to Al Qaeda, but keep this in mind: This guy is going to do 20 YEARS before being considered for parole....how much you want to bet he's NOT going to get it?
That is actually the point. I should not have to BET on the security of this nation. Terrorists that are NOT us citizens or even IN this country are NOT afforded those rights that are in the constitution. They are WAR criminals and should be treated as such. This is particularly true with terrorists that seem to not care one iota about their own life other than ending it with grater American casualties. 20 years in prison will do nothing to temper the need for them to kill as many of us as possible. I find it rather disturbing that you are perfectly fine with placing these individuals back out there at all. If the sentence had been life I can understand but it is not. 20 to life is an entirely different sentence.

You should read the Hamdan vs. Rumsfeld case, because it was the Shrub & company that created this mess with Gitmo. Terrorist organizations are not nations that we can declare war on...which is why the idiotic invasion of Iraq has caused more problems for decades to come. You fight them with intelligence and police actions or strategic military action....like in Afghanistan at the beginning before the Shrub & Rumsfeld pulled out vital forces to invade Iraq based on lies.

During WWII, captured German soldiers were kept on US soil, and afforded all the rights under the Geneva Convention. The Shrub & company's convoluted logic wants to declare people war criminals while at the same time "detain" them in Gitmo limbo....with all the bad implications that has come to mean. Remember, 500 people released after years of interrogation without a reason given or an apology or reparation. Think all those people have nothing but good will and cheer for us? But I didn't hear a PEEP of protest about that from the neocon peanut gallery.

20 years to life means that in 20 years this joker gets a REVIEW.....NO GUARANTEE he gets out. During that time, he may turn over information....and STILL remain inside afterwards. Hell, there are BANK ROBBERS and DRUG DEALERS who NEVER get out on the sentencing deal.

Essentially, this shows the world that we are not just rounding up muslims or Arabs and holding them/torturing them willy-nilly. The system works, and another operative is out of the loop.
 
Well, the first civilian trial of an Al Qaeda affiliate suspect in the 1998 bombings of US embassies in Nairobi, Tanzania and Kenya is over. And out of 280 charges, Mr. Ahmed Khalfan Ghailani, 36, was found guilty of one. Conspiracy to destroy government property and buildings.

Outrageous, you say? Well, he's in for 20 years to life.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/18/nyregion/18ghailani.html

Now I know that emotions run high regarding all things related to Al Qaeda, but keep this in mind: This guy is going to do 20 YEARS before being considered for parole....how much you want to bet he's NOT going to get it?

A witness for the prosecution who says Ghailani received explosives and was more involved in the plot to attack the embassies was never heard by the jury because his testimomy was coerced (i.e., tortured), which is inadmissable in American court.

Now to prevent such things in the future...don't torture prisoners, and you have a better shot of faster trials with better sentencing because people wanted an execution sentence. So now the anti-Obama politicians and pundits are all screaming "Obama's civilian trials are a failure! He shames America's 9/11 victims, diminishes us in th eworld's eyes!"....which is interesesting being that the same detractors claimed that such trials could not happen on US soil due to the security risk. Welll, local residents and commuters were mostly unawares that such a trial was taking place in New York City!

So, we have a SAFE trial with a conviction....a hell of a lot more than Bush did for 8 years with all his Constitution/Bill of Rights bending actions. More to come, I'm sure.

It's utter lunacy.

Most of the big guys were never read their rights.

Most of them were questioned without an attorney present and under duress. Logically most of the evidence has to be thrown out.

You bring them to the states and you have to give them the same rights a citizen gets and the prosecution has little or no case? You're fucked.

None of them was captured in an occupied country so they didn't fall under Geneva Convention rules......but we're giving them a lawyer and rights they shouldn't have. They're supposed to spend their lives behind bars for the duration of the war...but since it's not a declared war the war never ends.

And yet Ghailani is going away for 20 to life.....so a major hole is blown in your assertion. Gitmo detainees gave the Al Qaeda propaganda machine everything it needed.....and now this trial has shown the world that we no longer just practice the same black bag operations that is so common elsewhere.

The lunacy is thinking that "well, we've got Gitmo and the damage is done...so let's continue in that vein". Your assertion that the torture makes the detainees bullet proof in court does not hold......remember, there are constant cases where convictions are made on more than one venue of evidence.
 
When you say opponents...does that include George Soros and Andy Stern? Lololol...Barry better watch out for his own "friends". They are wayyyy more dangerous than any conservative?

So you can't handle Obama being proven right on this item.....but regurgitating 2008 election neocon clap trap won't change that fact, will it chuckles?

This is a win for the USA, and folks like you are too blind with partisan hatred to see that.
 
The author of the stupid original post subscribes to the absurd notion that we "should" treat terrorism in the same way we treat mere criminality.

It was precisely that kind of mindless liberal "thinking" that led to the kinds of problems that made 9/11/2001 possible.

The funny thing is that the people who think that way voted for Obama based on his campaign rhetoric to the same. Sorta different now that he has to actually do the job now huh?
I thought it was funny how he had to walk back so much of his campaign rhetoric when he took office and started seeing real intel and not just the crap in the media. :lol:

A broad brush generalization on your part, Dave. I notice how you and the others like you can't even acknowledge the FACT that this conviction is a win for America on the international stage, as it shows were not about the black hole of Gitmo for Arabs and muslims....that the US justice system works to a large degree.
 
The author of the stupid original post subscribes to the absurd notion that we "should" treat terrorism in the same way we treat mere criminality.

It was precisely that kind of mindless liberal "thinking" that led to the kinds of problems that made 9/11/2001 possible.


You need to divorce yourself of the delusion that you're intellectually capable of discerning what others think when it's painfully obvious that you cannot comprehend what you read.

The opening post tells it plain.....Ghailani tried in a US court...found guilty and sentenced. Something neocon toadys like YOU swore couldn't happen and would be detrimental to the US war on terror.

YOU WERE WRONG....THIS IS A WIN FOR THE USA, and it happened on OBAMA'S watch.....and you're too blinded by your partisan hatred to see the good of this.

Your god the Shrub and his minions opened the door on this problem with Gitmo, you neocon liability. Check out Hamdan vs. Rumsfeld. Obama is dealing with the mess YOUR boy left.

9/11 happened because the Shrub threw out all the policies that kept our security agencies on their toes and the country safe from such an attack for 7 years. Criminal negligence is the least you can charge the Shrub & company with.

You're full of it dude.

Translation: the neocon Libability (in every sense of the word) was faced with a few FACTS that he couldn't BS away with his rhetoric....hence his pathetic response.

Guys like Liability just can't handle the FACT that this case is a win for the USA on the international stage...our justice system works, so we don't have to sandbag arabs & muslims like some gulag toting 3rd world nation or old style Soviet bloc nation.

Nope, Libability isn't about the country, isn't about Americas future....Liability's all about getting OBAMA, getting the LIBBIES, getting those muslims, getting those arabs.....truth, justice and the American way be damned.
 
The funny thing is that the people who think that way voted for Obama based on his campaign rhetoric to the same. Sorta different now that he has to actually do the job now huh?

The funny thing is that Israel, which has had far more experience with terrorism than we do, treats arrested terrorist suspects as a criminal matter.

And the really really funny thing is that no one had a problem with trying Richard Reid in a civilian court because george bush was president at the time.

Israel most certainly does not treat terrorism as a law enforcement problem, the law enforcement option is just that - an option. Richard Reid was not high value enough to use for military operations so he was referred to the DOJ. KSH? Different story. Israel didn't go send their lawyers and police officers after the terrorists who carried out the Munich Massacre.

add to that Richard Reid was caught, in the act. the whole situation is completely different..the idea is you prosecute to win, just as you defend to win.....we didn't. He did, in 20 years he will be on the street again.
 
So, we have a SAFE trial with a conviction....a hell of a lot more than Bush did for 8 years with all his Constitution/Bill of Rights bending actions. More to come, I'm sure
.


Since when do we bring the enemy captured on the battlefield to the U.S. and give them Constitutional rights? Khalid Sheikh Mohammed would have been executed by now if not for you stupid libs. The Constitution does not apply to the enemy, you libs are such backwards idiots...Unreal!! :cuckoo:

Justice for KSM!!


220px-Khalid_Shaikh_Mohammed_after_capture.jpg

It wasn't "liberals" who only convicted three out of hundreds. No, it was Republicans and conservatives, and then, get this, the stupid fucks let two of the three go.

This is why Conservatives and Republicans should be kept away from government and left out of important decisions. Their delusions render them incapable of rational behavior.

Torture saves the nation. But they only convict three out of hundreds and let two of the three go to invent more plots.

They give trillion dollar tax breaks and the economy falls apart.

They invade Iraq and let in hundreds of al Qaeda and end up turning Iraq into Iran's friend.

This is why they hate government. Because everything they do when in charge, fails. I'd be frustrated too. I can't blame them. I'm actually sympathetic.


you're babbling dude, you know that right? :eusa_eh:
 
so, lets cut to the chase.

when and where does KSM go on trial?

Since Mr. Holder is not here to answer, I'll accept an answer from his acolytes......
 
so, lets cut to the chase.

when and where does KSM go on trial?

Since Mr. Holder is not here....

Mr. Holder told me to tell you to let the adults handle this. You'll be alright. /Now take your thumb out of your mouth and put it up your ass.

The terrorists will never win, no matter how much you aid and abet them. :evil:
 

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