Obama has increased government spending less than any president in at least a generation.

[Redfish]

Blaming all this on Rs, most of whom are progressives, is absurd.

No doubt income inequality is a problem, but it is a problem because both parties are owned by the elites and as such, do the elite's bidding. To blame conservatives SOLELY for income inequality and deficit spending, fails on so many levels.

You mean the GOP ISN'T conservative? Hasn't gone sooooo fukking right wing the past 20+ years, Goldwater called them nuts???


Yeah, it's the Dems/Liberals who fight tax increases right? lol

Hint that's the number 1 reason for income inequality. In days where they LITERALLY took 70%+ of someones wages in taxes IF they made about $4 million today, kept corps from GIVING the exec's such outrageous salaries, if Gov't would take most of it.

How the GOP Became the Party of the Rich

The inside story of how the Republicans abandoned the poor and the middle class to pursue their relentless agenda of tax cuts for the wealthiest one percent


"The Republican Party has totally abdicated its job in our democracy, which is to act as the guardian of fiscal discipline and responsibility," says David Stockman, who served as budget director under Reagan. "They're on an anti-tax jihad – one that benefits the prosperous classes."

The staggering economic inequality that has led Americans across the country to take to the streets in protest is no accident. It has been fueled to a large extent by the GOP's all-out war on behalf of the rich. Since Republicans rededicated themselves to slashing taxes for the wealthy in 1997, the average annual income of the 400 richest Americans has more than tripled, to $345 million – while their share of the tax burden has plunged by 40 percent. Today, a billionaire in the top 400 pays less than 17 percent of his income in taxes – five percentage points less than a bus driver earning $26,000 a year. "Most Americans got none of the growth of the preceding dozen years," says Joseph Stiglitz, the Nobel Prize-winning economist. "All the gains went to the top percentage points."


How the GOP Became the Party of the Rich Rolling Stone


DON'T WORRY ABOUT ADDRESSING ANY OF THE POINTS I POSIT, AS YOU NEVER DO, JUST CREATING A FALSE PREMISE AND ARGUE FROM THAT POINT INSTEAD, lol

total horseshit. No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes. In those days there were hundreds of exemptions and deductions. The rich paid a lower % of their income than they do today.

No, your statement is horseshit.

It's not hard to get to 70% when you add up cumulative taxes at the federal, state, and local levels, fines, fees, winnings, then double taxes like corporate taxes.

the chart is federal income taxes, not total of all taxes. read before posting, then you don't look stupid.

Let's recap. You said, "No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes." I said that's not true, and provided an explanation. Then in response you say I look stupid and point to a chart that shows some people paying 70% of their income in federal income taxes as proof of my stupidity. Uhmm... maybe if you learned how to read a chart you would not be making yourself look so stupid.

the chart is on federal income tax rates over time. It does not address the changes to the tax code that eliminated many deductions and exemptions. My original point is valid.

 

[Dad2three]

Blaming all this on Rs, most of whom are progressives, is absurd.

No doubt income inequality is a problem, but it is a problem because both parties are owned by the elites and as such, do the elite's bidding. To blame conservatives SOLELY for income inequality and deficit spending, fails on so many levels.

You mean the GOP ISN'T conservative? Hasn't gone sooooo fukking right wing the past 20+ years, Goldwater called them nuts???


Yeah, it's the Dems/Liberals who fight tax increases right? lol

Hint that's the number 1 reason for income inequality. In days where they LITERALLY took 70%+ of someones wages in taxes IF they made about $4 million today, kept corps from GIVING the exec's such outrageous salaries, if Gov't would take most of it.

How the GOP Became the Party of the Rich

The inside story of how the Republicans abandoned the poor and the middle class to pursue their relentless agenda of tax cuts for the wealthiest one percent


"The Republican Party has totally abdicated its job in our democracy, which is to act as the guardian of fiscal discipline and responsibility," says David Stockman, who served as budget director under Reagan. "They're on an anti-tax jihad – one that benefits the prosperous classes."

The staggering economic inequality that has led Americans across the country to take to the streets in protest is no accident. It has been fueled to a large extent by the GOP's all-out war on behalf of the rich. Since Republicans rededicated themselves to slashing taxes for the wealthy in 1997, the average annual income of the 400 richest Americans has more than tripled, to $345 million – while their share of the tax burden has plunged by 40 percent. Today, a billionaire in the top 400 pays less than 17 percent of his income in taxes – five percentage points less than a bus driver earning $26,000 a year. "Most Americans got none of the growth of the preceding dozen years," says Joseph Stiglitz, the Nobel Prize-winning economist. "All the gains went to the top percentage points."


How the GOP Became the Party of the Rich Rolling Stone


DON'T WORRY ABOUT ADDRESSING ANY OF THE POINTS I POSIT, AS YOU NEVER DO, JUST CREATING A FALSE PREMISE AND ARGUE FROM THAT POINT INSTEAD, lol

total horseshit. No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes. In those days there were hundreds of exemptions and deductions. The rich paid a lower % of their income than they do today.

No, your statement is horseshit.

It's not hard to get to 70% when you add up cumulative taxes at the federal, state, and local levels, fines, fees, winnings, then double taxes like corporate taxes.

the chart is federal income taxes, not total of all taxes. read before posting, then you don't look stupid.

IF only you weren't an ignorant tool... lol

First you argue the chart was this:

"It's not hard to get to 70% when you add up cumulative taxes at the federal, state, and local levels, fines, fees, winnings, then double taxes like corporate taxes"

NOW you are saying it's ONLY income taxes? When it's CBO numbers on FEDERAL EFFECTIVE TAX RATES (they include income, payroll, gas estimates, cap gains, etc into EFFECTIVE)

lol

 

[Dad2three]

BOOOOOOOOOOOSH lmao!

Nah we ALL know Dubya policies stopped Nov 2008, once Obama was elected right? According to Rushblo at least..

did clinton policies end on the day Bush took office?

did you ever hear Bush blame Clinton the way Obozo has blamed Bush? NO, thats the difference between a decent human being and a piece of shit.

Blame Clinton? Oh right a 4% unemployment rate and projected surpluses of $5+ trillion that Dubya inherited.. Boy Dubya sure changed that. But YES, for YEARS Conservatives blamed Clinton for the recession of 2001, Dubya ignoring 9/11 warnings, for gutting the military, etc.. lol

 

[Dad2three]

More proof that the far left is a more dangerous religion than the one ISIS pushes..

Hey my new Mexican slave has showed up for "work". Where you been? On A ROOF? I got a job for ya. If you want to work that is.

Come on, you know the vast majority of these right wingers ONLY want to suck of the teet of Gov't 'entitlements'...

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Obama added more debt than all previous Presidents combined, but he's apparently a fiscal Conservative

Progressives are fucking morons

 

[Dad2three]

its nothing but left wing lies and propaganda. the facts refute it.

Well go ahead and post up your "facts" there redfish. You got em? Right?
If you have no credible sources to refute the information above, well guess what that makes you red?

why should I bother to post facts that are there for anyone to find? you and your moronic friends ignore facts. Your left wing religion trumps facts. Everyone knows that.

But if you are really interested go to the CBO website and look up the lies that dad23 posted. But you won't because your brainwashing is complete.

"But if you are really interested go to the CBO website and look up the lies that dad23 posted. But you won't because your brainwashing is complete."


No I can't refute anything but why don't you go waste your time even though you too can't refute ACTUAL REALITY. THAT'S YOUR POSIT? lol

 

[Treeshepherd]

Well maybe the far left drones should set the example and give the government all their money and show us the path..

If it weren't for false premises, distortions and LIES, what else would right wingers EVER have???

Obama extended the Bush tax cuts when he had a Dem majority in the House and Senate.

Now that has reversed, and he says in the SOTU that we should raise taxes on the rich. That's what State of the Union addresses are for; empty political gestures to appease your base. Unfortunately, political theater is highly effective.

"Obama extended the Bush tax cuts when he had a Dem majority in the House and Senate."

THE ACTUAL FACTS:




Barack Obama gives way to Republicans over Bush tax cuts
Allies say president 'blackmailed' into extending tax cut for wealthier Americans which may cost $4tn in lost revenue



In a bruising political battle that appears to set the tone for Obama's dealings with the Republicans in Congress following their victories in last month's midterm elections, the president had sought to extend a tax cut for middle-class Americans introduced by the Bush administration seven years ago which expires at the end of this month. But he wanted to see a return to pre-cut rates for households with an income above $250,000 a year, on the grounds that wealthier Americans could afford to pay more. The move would generate trillions of dollars for the financially-strapped treasury over the next decade.\

But Republicans blocked the legislation in the Senate at the weekend and said they would rather see everyone's taxes rise than agree to scrapping the cuts for the wealthy. Some Democrats called on Obama to stand firm and let the Republicans carry the blame for the inevitable middle-class backlash.


Barack Obama gives way to Republicans over Bush tax cuts US news The Guardian

Different parties spew different rhetoric. In my opinion, the outcomes are scripted. Politicians are just bad B grade actors cavorting on a stage. It's like pro wrestling where someone Hulk Hogan wins and Andre the Giant loses, but the outcome is scripted and they both get paid by McMahon at the end of the day.

You can quote a politician saying he wanted this or he wanted that. Reagan said in his speeches he wanted Congress to reduce spending, giving partisan Reps ammo to blame Dems.

The system is set up for deficits to continue, to build One Nation Under Surveillance, and for endless war. The differences in the parties are purely rhetorical and cosmetic.

I agree with a lot of the points you've been making, but I don't think it's at all accurate to say that the two parties are equivalent, or that their public scuffles are mere kabuki theater. I hear this a lot from people who dislike politics in general - engineers, often enough, for instance. And yeah, a lot of it is pretty cynical. But if Republicans had had more control over Congress in the last half-decade, we certainly would not have the Affordable Care Act, which is a pretty substantial policy difference.

Sure, those trends you've noted are real, but it's the deficit will continue, because as you noted there is swell of Baby Boomers retiring. That's not exactly something the system could engineer on its own. I'm not saying that there ISN'T a lot of shadow-puppetry going on in politics (it's something opponents of a political party can point out endlessly), but that doesn't mean those parties aren't working toward opposite goals.

@Paperman ,

You mention the ACA, that it wouldn't exist without a Democratic majority.

Let me attempt to respond.

First of all, our system is set up in a way, sort of like the ebb and flow of the tides, that Dems come into power cyclically. They come in and go out with the political tides.

So, Dems come into power and none of them (except Kucinich, briefly) champion single payer or the public option. Obama never gives one of his rousing speeches about single-payer or a public insurance option. The patent excuse is given... "We'd never get the votes for that." Whatever you think about single-payer or a public option, hate that or love it, at least they logistically have a chance to lower the cost of healthcare.

Instead, we get the ACA. The Republican minority sees Gruber's writing on the wall, and they can save face by not voting for it, knowing that it will pass anyway. No harm done to their insurance-lobby backers.

Now, Republicans are beginning to get on board with the ACA (ie Gov Kasich of Ohio), if not in words then in actions. And, we're stuck with a program that does nothing to reduce the cost of healthcare. What it does is work to get everyone on insurance (having insurance is not necessarily having good healthcare). Subsidies are paid from the government, with money created by debt. Where does that money go? Straight to the insurance industry which supports the campaigns of both parties. You see the racket? This is a tennis game between government and an industry that finances elections.

When the FED 'buys' bonds from the Treasury, it receives securities from one of its member banks. In turn, it electronically creates an inflated balance in that member bank, and that new money goes to the Treasury. Now that money can be used to pay for subsidies, errr, be given to the insurance industry. So, the created money really doesn't enter a wide circulation , which would cause massive inflation. It stays in a tight circle of elites.

 

[billyerock1991]

LOL, What else are you going to pull out of your ass? Ronnie's tax cuts for the rich, brought in more revenues? Or SS taxes Ronnie increased by over $2+ trillion that hid the REAL costs of his tax cuts, which is owed to the "BK" SS system?

PLEASE show ANY correlation to lowering Corp taxes and ANY growth in the US, EVER!!!


STUDY: These Charts Show There's Almost No Correlation Between Tax Rates and GDP

These Charts Show There s Probably No Correlation Between Tax Rates and GDP - Business Insider


Capital Gains Tax Rates and Economic Growth (or not)

If you read the editorial page of the Wall Street Journal (or surf around the nether regions of Forbes.com), you may come to the conclusion that no aspect of tax policy is more important for economic growth than the way we tax capital gains. You’d be wrong

Capital Gains Tax Rates and Economic Growth or not - Forbes

Well holy shit-------------I guess we should raise everyone's taxes to 98%, then we would see real prosperity, right ya dumb shit?

lets tax the living shit out our every american and every american business---------punish those greedy bastards for daring to work hard and make money--------WTF. Put 100% of US money and wealth in the hands of the govt in DC-----------------yeah, then we would see some real progress.

you libs are such fuckin idiots. you make me vomit.

Well maybe the far left drones should set the example and give the government all their money and show us the path..

If it weren't for false premises, distortions and LIES, what else would right wingers EVER have???

Obama extended the Bush tax cuts when he had a Dem majority in the House and Senate.

Now that has reversed, and he says in the SOTU that we should raise taxes on the rich. That's what State of the Union addresses are for; empty political gestures to appease your base. Unfortunately, political theater is highly effective.

You mean when the GOP in Dec 2010 said they'd block ANYTHING if the Dems took the top 2% rates back up to where they were for Clinton??? You know that BLACKMAIL thing since the Dems didn't have 60 votes in the Senate? Need a link Bubba?

No they ONLY got the top tax rate back to those making $450,000+ a year as a family to increase, AND Obama's ALWAYS said we need more revenues!

Yes, GOP's political theater IS effective to their right wing base, gutting taxes on the rich like Ronnie did while increasing SS taxes on the workers, lol

its nice to see some people pay attention like you do

 

[Dad2three]

9/11 for one thing
the housing crisis for another (was no housing crisis at the time)
dodd/frank (Republican had been pushing for that for many years. Look it up)
not taking OBL when he could have ( fucking weak right there)
lying under oath ( OMG that caused a financial collapse LMAO)
the false dot com bubble ( Clinton did THAT? Are you sure?)
disgracing the oval office

(OMG that must of been the reason for the Bush economic collapse)

You are pitiful.

Your fucked up opinions are not proof of anything other than you are Obama Deranged. I WANT THE REAL DEAL. Like the stuff D23 posts.

You know, articles from reputable sources that indicate that Bush should have blamed Clinton for something.
Can you do that? Or is all you have an opinion?

August 7, 2002
Bush says he inherited recession

Bush, Cheney take advantage of revised GDP data to say economy a mess when they took office.

"When I took office, our economy was beginning a recession," Bush said in a speech at a Mississippi high school. "Then our economy was hit by terrorists. Then our economy was hit by corporate scandals. But I'm certain of this: We won't let fear undermine our economy and we're not going to let fraud undermine it either."

Bush says he inherited recession - Aug. 7 2002



lol

Why Prosecutors Don't Go After Wall Street

BUSH GAVE A GET OUT OF JAIL FREE CARD SUMMER 2008

Why Prosecutors Don t Go After Wall Street NPR

“When regulators don’t believe in regulation and don’t get what is going on at the companies they oversee, there can be no major white-collar crime prosecutions,”...“If they don’t understand what we call collective embezzlement, where people are literally looting their own firms, then it’s impossible to bring cases.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/14/business/14prosecute.html?pagewanted=all

The FBI correctly identified the epidemic of mortgage control fraud at such an early point that the financial crisis could have been averted had the Bush administration acted with even minimal competence.
'
The Two Documents Everyone Should Read to Better Understand the Crisis William K. Black

Dubya was warned by the FBI of an "epidemic" of mortgage fraud in 2004. He gave them less resources.

FBI saw threat of loan crisis - Los Angeles Times

Shockingly, the FBI clearly makes the case for the need to combat mortgage fraud in 2005, the height of the housing crisis:

Financial Crimes Report to the Public 2005

FBI mdash Financial Crimes Report 2005

The Bush Rubber Stamp Congress ignored the obvious and extremely detailed and well reported crime spree by the FBI.

THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION and CONGRESS stripped the White Collar Crime divisions of money and manpower.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/19/washington/19fbi.html?pagewanted=all

DUBYA FOUGHT ALL 50 STATE AG'S IN 2003, INVOKING A CIVIL WAR ERA RULE SAYING FEDS RULE ON "PREDATORY" LENDERS!

 

[Kosh]

Well holy shit-------------I guess we should raise everyone's taxes to 98%, then we would see real prosperity, right ya dumb shit?

lets tax the living shit out our every american and every american business---------punish those greedy bastards for daring to work hard and make money--------WTF. Put 100% of US money and wealth in the hands of the govt in DC-----------------yeah, then we would see some real progress.

you libs are such fuckin idiots. you make me vomit.

Well maybe the far left drones should set the example and give the government all their money and show us the path..

If it weren't for false premises, distortions and LIES, what else would right wingers EVER have???

Obama extended the Bush tax cuts when he had a Dem majority in the House and Senate.

Now that has reversed, and he says in the SOTU that we should raise taxes on the rich. That's what State of the Union addresses are for; empty political gestures to appease your base. Unfortunately, political theater is highly effective.

You mean when the GOP in Dec 2010 said they'd block ANYTHING if the Dems took the top 2% rates back up to where they were for Clinton??? You know that BLACKMAIL thing since the Dems didn't have 60 votes in the Senate? Need a link Bubba?

No they ONLY got the top tax rate back to those making $450,000+ a year as a family to increase, AND Obama's ALWAYS said we need more revenues!

Yes, GOP's political theater IS effective to their right wing base, gutting taxes on the rich like Ronnie did while increasing SS taxes on the workers, lol

its nice to see some people pay attention like you do

Oh look a far left drone agreeing with another far left drone..

 

[Kosh]

9/11 for one thing
the housing crisis for another (was no housing crisis at the time)
dodd/frank (Republican had been pushing for that for many years. Look it up)
not taking OBL when he could have ( fucking weak right there)
lying under oath ( OMG that caused a financial collapse LMAO)
the false dot com bubble ( Clinton did THAT? Are you sure?)
disgracing the oval office

(OMG that must of been the reason for the Bush economic collapse)

You are pitiful.

Your fucked up opinions are not proof of anything other than you are Obama Deranged. I WANT THE REAL DEAL. Like the stuff D23 posts.

You know, articles from reputable sources that indicate that Bush should have blamed Clinton for something.
Can you do that? Or is all you have an opinion?

August 7, 2002
Bush says he inherited recession

Bush, Cheney take advantage of revised GDP data to say economy a mess when they took office.

"When I took office, our economy was beginning a recession," Bush said in a speech at a Mississippi high school. "Then our economy was hit by terrorists. Then our economy was hit by corporate scandals. But I'm certain of this: We won't let fear undermine our economy and we're not going to let fraud undermine it either."

Bush says he inherited recession - Aug. 7 2002



lol

Why Prosecutors Don't Go After Wall Street

BUSH GAVE A GET OUT OF JAIL FREE CARD SUMMER 2008

Why Prosecutors Don t Go After Wall Street NPR

“When regulators don’t believe in regulation and don’t get what is going on at the companies they oversee, there can be no major white-collar crime prosecutions,”...“If they don’t understand what we call collective embezzlement, where people are literally looting their own firms, then it’s impossible to bring cases.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/14/business/14prosecute.html?pagewanted=all

The FBI correctly identified the epidemic of mortgage control fraud at such an early point that the financial crisis could have been averted had the Bush administration acted with even minimal competence.
'
The Two Documents Everyone Should Read to Better Understand the Crisis William K. Black

Dubya was warned by the FBI of an "epidemic" of mortgage fraud in 2004. He gave them less resources.

FBI saw threat of loan crisis - Los Angeles Times

Shockingly, the FBI clearly makes the case for the need to combat mortgage fraud in 2005, the height of the housing crisis:

Financial Crimes Report to the Public 2005

FBI mdash Financial Crimes Report 2005

The Bush Rubber Stamp Congress ignored the obvious and extremely detailed and well reported crime spree by the FBI.

THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION and CONGRESS stripped the White Collar Crime divisions of money and manpower.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/19/washington/19fbi.html?pagewanted=all

DUBYA FOUGHT ALL 50 STATE AG'S IN 2003, INVOKING A CIVIL WAR ERA RULE SAYING FEDS RULE ON "PREDATORY" LENDERS!

More far left propaganda posted using the far left scriptures and trying to connect dots that do not exist in reality..

 

[Dad2three]

You mean IF we don't get revenues back to where Carter/Clinton had them? Why do you keep going back to 2008, when the deficit was directly related to Dubya's subprime meltdown AND Dubya/GOP gutting revenues from 20% to less than 15% of GDP, and the GOP's stated goal is to reduce it further? lol

AP? Oh you meant right wing big story who DISTORTED the CBO?

The baseline budget outlook has worsened slightly since May 2013, when CBO last published its 10-year projections.

At that time, deficits projected under current law totaled $6.3 trillion for the 2014–2023 period, or about 3 percent of GDP. Deficits are now projected to
be about $1 trillion larger. The bulk of that change occurred in CBO’s estimates of revenues: The agency has reduced its projection of total revenues by $1.6 trillion,
largely because of changes in the economic outlook

http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/45010-Outlook2014_Feb_0.pdf

lol

Now the AP is a right wing think tank?

"But if current laws do not change, the period of shrinking deficits will soon come to an end. Between 2015 and 2024, annual budget shortfalls are projected to rise substantially—from a low of $469 billion in 2015 to about $1 trillion from 2022 through 2024"
Updated Budget Projections 2014 to 2024 Congressional Budget Office

Of course current laws are not going to change, partly due to how easy it is for one party to take cover by what the other party says. Republicans/Democrats said this, so it's all the Republicans/Democrats fault [insert opposite party affiliation].

How easy it is to divide and conquer public opinion, when what a politician says in front of a camera is taken as genuine. How easy it is for people to fall for the Warren Buffet line that billionaires should be taxed more, when behind the scenes his lawyers and lobbyists are working to prevent a tax increase on billionaires.

LOL right back at ya.

Good little rightie YOUR link wasn't AP Bubba, lol



ALL you have is the usual right wing nonsense. Don't try to refute the Dems got US revenues back to Carter's levels under Clinton OR the GOP blocking EVERY attempt by Obama to get more revenues, no it's 'both parties' BS

More talking points with Buffett, nothing more, next you'll trot out the meme on his Corp tax fight with the IRS, lol


Your link

"from a low of $469 billion in 2015 to about $1 trillion from 2022 through 2024—mainly because of the aging population, rising health care costs, an expansion of federal subsidies for health insurance, and growing interest payments on federal debt."


Weird, I thought Ronnie saving SS took care of that and his tax cuts for the rich brought in more money? lol

The posit of the thread, one you haven't even attempted to refute, is Obama is having the slowest growth of any Prez in generations!



I KNOW, LET'S GO BACK TO THE TIME WHEN GREENSPAN TESTIFIED TO THE GOP CONGRESS THAT BILL CLINTON'S POLICIES WERE IN DANGER OF PAYING OFF THE DEBT TO FAST? YOU KNOW WHEN THEY HAD THEIR FIRST TAX CUT, BEFORE THEY WENT TO WAR AND GUTTED REVENUES EVEN MORE???

lol

My link provided in post #249 was AP. Click it, if you don't believe me. My next link in post #255 was CBO.

Your gigantic all cap paragraphs are annoying and mostly hyperbole.

Right wing, left wing, chicken wing, ring a ding... just flying around in circles. I'm not from any wing or clown club. I'm a slayer of sacred cows. I'm not a fan of Reagan, and I've written to dispel Reagan myths on USMB. I'm not a fan of Obama, and the idea that Obama has reduced spending is a fabrication. Clinton, Bush, Obama, Reagan, etc., all merely different new and improved packaging on the same old product.

The only thing I said about Clinton was that he signed the legislation to lift the Glass-Steagall Act.
"The big bank boosters and analysts [like Forbes] who should know better are repeating the falsehood that repeal of Glass-Steagall had nothing to do with the Panic of 2008."
Repeal of Glass-Steagall Caused the Financial Crisis - US News

I think that Clinton did some positive things to reduce the deficit (Omnibus Debt Reduction Act 1993). He also had a stingy Congress. But what raised revenues more than anything was the dot com and real estate boom. To argue otherwise is to be a daft clown.

"My link provided in post #249 was AP. Click it, if you don't believe me"

I did, it said 'big story' (which I thought was big Gov't R/W site, sorry)

It doesn't open to the entire story and was only talking about the H/C



"Your gigantic all cap paragraphs are annoying and mostly hyperbole."

Got it, YOU hate FACTUAL data supported by links that showed Dubya cheering on the Banksters Subprime bubble AS he gutted regulators



"I'm not a fan of Obama, and the idea that Obama has reduced spending is a fabrication"


Without false premises what would YOU right wingers EVER have?

The ACTUAL premise of this thread
"Obama has increased government spending less than any president in at least a generation."





"The only thing I said about Clinton was that he signed the legislation to lift the Glass-Steagall Act."


No ACTUALLY what you said RIGHT WINGER:


"And Clinton lifted the Glass Steigall Act, one of the root causes which led to the financial crisis of 2007-2009. Oh wait, don't tell me, the Reps held a gun to his head."

Nope, as shown by me, and the Ayn Randian guys, NOT true. This was a REGULATOR failure, not a regulation failure!

THEN you give me an OPINION NOT REFUTING WHAT I POSTED ABOUT G/S? I'm shocked. No really, I am, lol

Weird, did your hedge funder refute THIS:

If you tally the institutions that ran into severe problems in 2008-09, the list includes Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers, Merrill Lynch, AIG, and Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, none of which would have come under Glass-Steagall’s restrictions.

...As for the FDIC-insured commercial banks that ran into trouble, the record is also clear: what got them into trouble were not activities restricted by Glass-Steagall. Their problems arose from investments in residential mortgages and residential mortgage-backed securities—investments they had always been free to engage in.


Why The Glass-Steagall Myth Persists - Forbes


Oh right, I didn't think so...


"He also had a stingy Congress"

Sure, sure, THAT'S why we saw what happened when Dubya got in office in 2001 right? lol. Clinton had surpluses, 3 after vetoing the GOP's $700+ billion tax cut



"But what raised revenues more than anything was the dot com and real estate boom. To argue otherwise is to be a daft clown."


Weird so Carter getting near 20% of GDP was dotcom/housing too?


"Clinton's 1993 budget cuts, which reduced projected red ink by more than $400 billion over five years, sparked a major drop in interest rates that helped boost investment in all the equipment and systems that brought forth the New Age economy of technological innovation and rising productivity." — Business Week, May 19, 1997

I guess daft is a good word for BW




"The deficit has come down, and I give the Clinton Administration and President Clinton himself a lot of credit for that. [He] did something about it, fast. And I think we are seeing some benefits." — Paul Volcker, Federal Reserve Board Chairman (1979-1987), in Audacity, Fall 1994 (PRE GOP CONGRESS)




One of the reasons Goldman Sachs cites for the "best economy ever" is that "on the policy side, trade, fiscal, and monetary policies have been excellent, working in ways that have facilitated growth without inflation. The Clinton Administration has worked to liberalize trade and has used any revenue windfalls to reduce the federal budget deficit." — Goldman Sachs, March 1998


IF ONLY DUBYA HADN'T HAPPENED TO US RIGHT?

Let's see now...Progressives have taken total control of education, media, fine arts, literature, and pop culture. This of course, naturally leads to them taking control of politics and government. Yet, some think conservatives, who have little power, have caused the problems mentioned. How can one be so blind?

The cause of the problem is progressivism and yet, you want more of the very thing that caused the problem in the first place.

Got it, as usual with you when your first talking points are DEMOLISHED with credible and logical links, you go in another direction.

Thanks for playing Bubba

Republicans/conservatives : Don't believe that government can work.
.................... Gets elected and then sets out to prove themselves right.

 

[Dad2three]

You mean the GOP ISN'T conservative? Hasn't gone sooooo fukking right wing the past 20+ years, Goldwater called them nuts???


Yeah, it's the Dems/Liberals who fight tax increases right? lol

Hint that's the number 1 reason for income inequality. In days where they LITERALLY took 70%+ of someones wages in taxes IF they made about $4 million today, kept corps from GIVING the exec's such outrageous salaries, if Gov't would take most of it.

How the GOP Became the Party of the Rich

The inside story of how the Republicans abandoned the poor and the middle class to pursue their relentless agenda of tax cuts for the wealthiest one percent


"The Republican Party has totally abdicated its job in our democracy, which is to act as the guardian of fiscal discipline and responsibility," says David Stockman, who served as budget director under Reagan. "They're on an anti-tax jihad – one that benefits the prosperous classes."

The staggering economic inequality that has led Americans across the country to take to the streets in protest is no accident. It has been fueled to a large extent by the GOP's all-out war on behalf of the rich. Since Republicans rededicated themselves to slashing taxes for the wealthy in 1997, the average annual income of the 400 richest Americans has more than tripled, to $345 million – while their share of the tax burden has plunged by 40 percent. Today, a billionaire in the top 400 pays less than 17 percent of his income in taxes – five percentage points less than a bus driver earning $26,000 a year. "Most Americans got none of the growth of the preceding dozen years," says Joseph Stiglitz, the Nobel Prize-winning economist. "All the gains went to the top percentage points."


How the GOP Became the Party of the Rich Rolling Stone


DON'T WORRY ABOUT ADDRESSING ANY OF THE POINTS I POSIT, AS YOU NEVER DO, JUST CREATING A FALSE PREMISE AND ARGUE FROM THAT POINT INSTEAD, lol

total horseshit. No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes. In those days there were hundreds of exemptions and deductions. The rich paid a lower % of their income than they do today.

No, your statement is horseshit.

It's not hard to get to 70% when you add up cumulative taxes at the federal, state, and local levels, fines, fees, winnings, then double taxes like corporate taxes.

the chart is federal income taxes, not total of all taxes. read before posting, then you don't look stupid.

Let's recap. You said, "No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes." I said that's not true, and provided an explanation. Then in response you say I look stupid and point to a chart that shows some people paying 70% of their income in federal income taxes as proof of my stupidity. Uhmm... maybe if you learned how to read a chart you would not be making yourself look so stupid.

the chart is on federal income tax rates over time. It does not address the changes to the tax code that eliminated many deductions and exemptions. My original point is valid.

NO it isn't dummy, it's CBO'S numbers on the EFFECTIVE FEDERAL TAX BURDEN THROUGH THE YEARS! And it CLEARLY shows the top 1/10th of 1% paying ABOVE 60%-70% EFFECTIVE tax rate for MOST OF THE TIME IN THE 1950'-1970'S....

 

[Kosh]

total horseshit. No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes. In those days there were hundreds of exemptions and deductions. The rich paid a lower % of their income than they do today.

No, your statement is horseshit.

It's not hard to get to 70% when you add up cumulative taxes at the federal, state, and local levels, fines, fees, winnings, then double taxes like corporate taxes.

the chart is federal income taxes, not total of all taxes. read before posting, then you don't look stupid.

Let's recap. You said, "No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes." I said that's not true, and provided an explanation. Then in response you say I look stupid and point to a chart that shows some people paying 70% of their income in federal income taxes as proof of my stupidity. Uhmm... maybe if you learned how to read a chart you would not be making yourself look so stupid.

the chart is on federal income tax rates over time. It does not address the changes to the tax code that eliminated many deductions and exemptions. My original point is valid.

NO it isn't dummy, it's CBO'S numbers on the EFFECTIVE FEDERAL TAX BURDEN THROUGH THE YEARS! And it CLEARLY shows the top 1/10th of 1% paying ABOVE 60%-70% EFFECTIVE tax rate for MOST OF THE TIME IN THE 1950'-1970'S....

Far left propaganda!

Then again the CBO also posted that 30 million people would still be without health insurance after the full implementation of Obamcare..

Goes to show that the far left invokes such things unless they believe it favors their religious cause..

 

[Dad2three]

Obama added more debt than all previous Presidents combined, but he's apparently a fiscal Conservative

Progressives are fucking morons

Weird, yet Ronnie's tripled ALL previous US Prez debt? And Dubya doubled them???? lol

Clinton's last F/Y budget ends

09/30/2001 $5,807,463,412,200.06 US debt

Dubya's final F/Y budget ends

09/30/2009 $11,909,829,003,511.75 US debt

Start with $5.8 (with projected surpluses of $5+ trillion) and end up MORE THAN DOUBLING IT ($6.1+ TRILLION) TO $11.9 TRILLION??? lol

Government - Historical Debt Outstanding - Annual 2000 - 2014

 

[Dad2three]

No, your statement is horseshit.

It's not hard to get to 70% when you add up cumulative taxes at the federal, state, and local levels, fines, fees, winnings, then double taxes like corporate taxes.

the chart is federal income taxes, not total of all taxes. read before posting, then you don't look stupid.

Let's recap. You said, "No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes." I said that's not true, and provided an explanation. Then in response you say I look stupid and point to a chart that shows some people paying 70% of their income in federal income taxes as proof of my stupidity. Uhmm... maybe if you learned how to read a chart you would not be making yourself look so stupid.

the chart is on federal income tax rates over time. It does not address the changes to the tax code that eliminated many deductions and exemptions. My original point is valid.

NO it isn't dummy, it's CBO'S numbers on the EFFECTIVE FEDERAL TAX BURDEN THROUGH THE YEARS! And it CLEARLY shows the top 1/10th of 1% paying ABOVE 60%-70% EFFECTIVE tax rate for MOST OF THE TIME IN THE 1950'-1970'S....

Far left propaganda!

Then again the CBO also posted that 30 million people would still be without health insurance after the full implementation of Obamcare..

Goes to show that the far left invokes such things unless they believe it favors their religious cause..

Oh you mean PROJECTED versus actually using treasury data of past tax burdens? See why we say conservatism is a religion of morons (Thanks Eddie B)...

 

[Dad2three]

9/11 for one thing
the housing crisis for another (was no housing crisis at the time)
dodd/frank (Republican had been pushing for that for many years. Look it up)
not taking OBL when he could have ( fucking weak right there)
lying under oath ( OMG that caused a financial collapse LMAO)
the false dot com bubble ( Clinton did THAT? Are you sure?)
disgracing the oval office

(OMG that must of been the reason for the Bush economic collapse)

You are pitiful.

Your fucked up opinions are not proof of anything other than you are Obama Deranged. I WANT THE REAL DEAL. Like the stuff D23 posts.

You know, articles from reputable sources that indicate that Bush should have blamed Clinton for something.
Can you do that? Or is all you have an opinion?

August 7, 2002
Bush says he inherited recession

Bush, Cheney take advantage of revised GDP data to say economy a mess when they took office.

"When I took office, our economy was beginning a recession," Bush said in a speech at a Mississippi high school. "Then our economy was hit by terrorists. Then our economy was hit by corporate scandals. But I'm certain of this: We won't let fear undermine our economy and we're not going to let fraud undermine it either."

Bush says he inherited recession - Aug. 7 2002



lol

Why Prosecutors Don't Go After Wall Street

BUSH GAVE A GET OUT OF JAIL FREE CARD SUMMER 2008

Why Prosecutors Don t Go After Wall Street NPR

“When regulators don’t believe in regulation and don’t get what is going on at the companies they oversee, there can be no major white-collar crime prosecutions,”...“If they don’t understand what we call collective embezzlement, where people are literally looting their own firms, then it’s impossible to bring cases.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/14/business/14prosecute.html?pagewanted=all

The FBI correctly identified the epidemic of mortgage control fraud at such an early point that the financial crisis could have been averted had the Bush administration acted with even minimal competence.
'
The Two Documents Everyone Should Read to Better Understand the Crisis William K. Black

Dubya was warned by the FBI of an "epidemic" of mortgage fraud in 2004. He gave them less resources.

FBI saw threat of loan crisis - Los Angeles Times

Shockingly, the FBI clearly makes the case for the need to combat mortgage fraud in 2005, the height of the housing crisis:

Financial Crimes Report to the Public 2005

FBI mdash Financial Crimes Report 2005

The Bush Rubber Stamp Congress ignored the obvious and extremely detailed and well reported crime spree by the FBI.

THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION and CONGRESS stripped the White Collar Crime divisions of money and manpower.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/19/washington/19fbi.html?pagewanted=all

DUBYA FOUGHT ALL 50 STATE AG'S IN 2003, INVOKING A CIVIL WAR ERA RULE SAYING FEDS RULE ON "PREDATORY" LENDERS!

More far left propaganda posted using the far left scriptures and trying to connect dots that do not exist in reality..

I get it Bubba, MUCH better to blame the Gay, MINORITY member (Barney Frank) of the GOP MAJORITY House where simply GOP majority ruled from 1995-Jan 2007 right?

We know how much super powers those gays have right? lol

 

[Treeshepherd]

Got it, as usual with you when your first talking points are DEMOLISHED with credible and logical links, you go in another direction.

Demolished... right.

I think I've got the gist of your clown posts. You agree with Forbes and the banking cabal that eliminating the Glass-Steagall act was inconsequential. You're on the record saying that deficits are not due to spike again after FY 2015. You lay the entire blame for the financial crisis at the feet of Republicans. You think that Obama is one of the most frugal presidents in history. And, you think that spamming threads with bold all caps in 16 font makes your arguments more effective. Wow, you DEMOLISHED everyone.

Moving along...

 

[Dad2three]

You mean the GOP ISN'T conservative? Hasn't gone sooooo fukking right wing the past 20+ years, Goldwater called them nuts???


Yeah, it's the Dems/Liberals who fight tax increases right? lol

Hint that's the number 1 reason for income inequality. In days where they LITERALLY took 70%+ of someones wages in taxes IF they made about $4 million today, kept corps from GIVING the exec's such outrageous salaries, if Gov't would take most of it.

How the GOP Became the Party of the Rich

The inside story of how the Republicans abandoned the poor and the middle class to pursue their relentless agenda of tax cuts for the wealthiest one percent


"The Republican Party has totally abdicated its job in our democracy, which is to act as the guardian of fiscal discipline and responsibility," says David Stockman, who served as budget director under Reagan. "They're on an anti-tax jihad – one that benefits the prosperous classes."

The staggering economic inequality that has led Americans across the country to take to the streets in protest is no accident. It has been fueled to a large extent by the GOP's all-out war on behalf of the rich. Since Republicans rededicated themselves to slashing taxes for the wealthy in 1997, the average annual income of the 400 richest Americans has more than tripled, to $345 million – while their share of the tax burden has plunged by 40 percent. Today, a billionaire in the top 400 pays less than 17 percent of his income in taxes – five percentage points less than a bus driver earning $26,000 a year. "Most Americans got none of the growth of the preceding dozen years," says Joseph Stiglitz, the Nobel Prize-winning economist. "All the gains went to the top percentage points."


How the GOP Became the Party of the Rich Rolling Stone


DON'T WORRY ABOUT ADDRESSING ANY OF THE POINTS I POSIT, AS YOU NEVER DO, JUST CREATING A FALSE PREMISE AND ARGUE FROM THAT POINT INSTEAD, lol

total horseshit. No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes. In those days there were hundreds of exemptions and deductions. The rich paid a lower % of their income than they do today.

No, your statement is horseshit.

It's not hard to get to 70% when you add up cumulative taxes at the federal, state, and local levels, fines, fees, winnings, then double taxes like corporate taxes.

the chart is federal income taxes, not total of all taxes. read before posting, then you don't look stupid.

Let's recap. You said, "No one ever paid 70% of his income in taxes." I said that's not true, and provided an explanation. Then in response you say I look stupid and point to a chart that shows some people paying 70% of their income in federal income taxes as proof of my stupidity. Uhmm... maybe if you learned how to read a chart you would not be making yourself look so stupid.

the chart is on federal income tax rates over time. It does not address the changes to the tax code that eliminated many deductions and exemptions. My original point is valid.

"the chart is on federal income tax rates over time"


lol


NO IT'S NOT. IT'S THE ACTUAL FEDERAL EFFECTIVE RATES DUMMY

THIS IS THE HISTORY OF THE TOP TAX RATE DUMMY

 

[Kosh]

9/11 for one thing
the housing crisis for another (was no housing crisis at the time)
dodd/frank (Republican had been pushing for that for many years. Look it up)
not taking OBL when he could have ( fucking weak right there)
lying under oath ( OMG that caused a financial collapse LMAO)
the false dot com bubble ( Clinton did THAT? Are you sure?)
disgracing the oval office

(OMG that must of been the reason for the Bush economic collapse)

You are pitiful.

Your fucked up opinions are not proof of anything other than you are Obama Deranged. I WANT THE REAL DEAL. Like the stuff D23 posts.

You know, articles from reputable sources that indicate that Bush should have blamed Clinton for something.
Can you do that? Or is all you have an opinion?

August 7, 2002
Bush says he inherited recession

Bush, Cheney take advantage of revised GDP data to say economy a mess when they took office.

"When I took office, our economy was beginning a recession," Bush said in a speech at a Mississippi high school. "Then our economy was hit by terrorists. Then our economy was hit by corporate scandals. But I'm certain of this: We won't let fear undermine our economy and we're not going to let fraud undermine it either."

Bush says he inherited recession - Aug. 7 2002



lol

Why Prosecutors Don't Go After Wall Street

BUSH GAVE A GET OUT OF JAIL FREE CARD SUMMER 2008

Why Prosecutors Don t Go After Wall Street NPR

“When regulators don’t believe in regulation and don’t get what is going on at the companies they oversee, there can be no major white-collar crime prosecutions,”...“If they don’t understand what we call collective embezzlement, where people are literally looting their own firms, then it’s impossible to bring cases.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/14/business/14prosecute.html?pagewanted=all

The FBI correctly identified the epidemic of mortgage control fraud at such an early point that the financial crisis could have been averted had the Bush administration acted with even minimal competence.
'
The Two Documents Everyone Should Read to Better Understand the Crisis William K. Black

Dubya was warned by the FBI of an "epidemic" of mortgage fraud in 2004. He gave them less resources.

FBI saw threat of loan crisis - Los Angeles Times

Shockingly, the FBI clearly makes the case for the need to combat mortgage fraud in 2005, the height of the housing crisis:

Financial Crimes Report to the Public 2005

FBI mdash Financial Crimes Report 2005

The Bush Rubber Stamp Congress ignored the obvious and extremely detailed and well reported crime spree by the FBI.

THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION and CONGRESS stripped the White Collar Crime divisions of money and manpower.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/19/washington/19fbi.html?pagewanted=all

DUBYA FOUGHT ALL 50 STATE AG'S IN 2003, INVOKING A CIVIL WAR ERA RULE SAYING FEDS RULE ON "PREDATORY" LENDERS!

More far left propaganda posted using the far left scriptures and trying to connect dots that do not exist in reality..

I get it Bubba, MUCH better to blamer the Gay, MINORITY member (Barney Frank) of the GOP MAJORITY House where simply GOP majority ruled from 1995-Jan 2007 right?

We know how much super powers those gays have right? lol

And here comes the far left propaganda and the horrid use of their key words that they do not understand.