Not tyranny, but something else....

[Votto]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

 

[Ringel05]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Shit!! I was hoping y'all wouldn't catch on this soon. Hail Hydra!!

 

[whitehall]

Why is it selected Tocqueville paragraphs are only quoted during republican administrations?

 

[MACAULAY]

de Toqueville predicted that the Great American Experiment would lat until Congress figured out it could bribe the people with their own money.

The Lyndon Johnson Democrats did that in the 1960's.

The game is still on because the rapacious self-dealing cowards in Congress have now learned to bribe the people with their children's money...and even their grandchildren's money.

They all know it will collapse, but they just hope it won't collapse before their next election. That's all they care about.

 

[DigitalDrifter]

Not tranny ?
Why the hell not, damn, I was hoping to see a picture of some chick with a penis, I mean think about that, long hair, boobs, curvy ass, and then wham ! Right between the eyes shock of shock, there's a damn penis !! Imagine the look on your fa.......................wait......................wha...........the hell............ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, "tyranny!!!!"
Nevermind.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Mark Krikorian www.nationalreview.com/author/mark-krikorian is the author of the article from which the OP disingenuously quotes

Krikorian is a violent anti-immigrant home, and needs to be read as such.

He is all for deep state admin as long as it does what he wants.

 

[Tehon]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Soft despotism. I don't think it is really a commentary on collectivism.

 

[Tehon]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Soft despotism. I don't think it is really a commentary on collectivism.

If we add context to the quote that the OP deceitfully framed, we can see that what the author of the quote intended to say was that it was individualism that precipitated the form of soft despotism found in democratic societies.

I want to imagine under what new features despotism could present itself to the world; I see an innumerable crowd of similar and equal men who spin around restlessly, in order to gain small and vulgar pleasures with which they fill their souls. Each one of them, withdrawn apart, is like a stranger to the destiny of all the others; his children and his particular friends form for him the entire human species;g as for the remainder of his fellow citizens, he is next to them, but he does not see them; he touches them without feeling them; he exists only in himself and for himself alone, and if he still has a family, you can say that at least he no longer has a country.

And the full context;

Democratic governments will be able to become violent and even cruel in certain moments of great agitation and great dangers; but these crises will be rare and passing.

When I think about the petty passions of the men of our times, about the softness of their mores, about the extent of their enlightenment, about the purity of their religion, about the mildness of their morality, about their painstaking and steady habits, about the restraint that they nearly all maintain in vice as in virtue, I am not afraid that they will find in their leaders tyrants, but rather tutors.

So I think that the type of oppression by which democratic peoples are threatened will resemble nothing of what preceded it in the world; our contemporaries cannot find the image of it in their memories. I seek in vain myself for an expression that exactly reproduces the idea that I am forming of it and includes it; the old words of despotism and of tyranny do not work. The thing is new, so I must try to define it, since I cannot name it.

I want to imagine under what new features despotism could present itself to the world; I see an innumerable crowd of similar and equal men who spin around restlessly, in order to gain small and vulgar pleasures with which they fill their souls. Each one of them, withdrawn apart, is like a stranger to the destiny of all the others; his children and his particular friends form for him the entire human species;g as for the remainder of his fellow citizens, he is next to them, but he does not see them; he touches them without feeling them; he exists only in himself and for himself alone, and if he still has a family, you can say that at least he no longer has a country.

Above those men arises an immense and tutelary power that alone takes charge of assuring their enjoyment and of looking after their fate. It is absolute, detailed, regular, far-sighted and mild. It would resemble paternal power if, like it, it had as a goal to prepare men for manhood; but on the contrary it seeks only to fix them irrevocably in childhood; it likes the citizens to enjoy themselves, provided that they think only about enjoying themselves. It works willingly for their happiness; but it wants to be the unique agent for it and the sole arbiter; it attends to their security, provides for their needs, facilitates their pleasures, conducts their principal affairs, directs their industry, settles their estates, divides their inheritances;k how can it not remove entirely from them the trouble to think and the difficulty of living?

This is how it makes the use of free will less useful and rarer every day; how it encloses the action of the will within a smaller space and little by little steals from each citizen even the use of himself. Equality has prepared men for all these things; it has disposed men to bear them and often even to regard them as a benefit.

After having thus taken each individual one by one into its powerful hands, and having molded him as it pleases, the sovereign power extends its arms over the entire society; it covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated, minute, and uniform rules, which the most original minds and the most vigorous souls cannot break through to go beyond the crowd; it does not break wills, but it softens them, bends them and directs them; it rarely forces action, but it constantly opposes your acting; it does not destroy, it prevents birth; it does not tyrannize, it hinders, it represses, it enervates, it extinguishes, it stupifies, and finally it reduces each nation to being nothing more than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

I have always believed that this sort of servitude, regulated, mild and peaceful, of which I have just done the portrait, could be combined better than we imagine with some of the external forms of liberty, and that it would not be impossible for it to be established in the very shadow of the sovereignty of the people.

 

[Votto]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Soft despotism. I don't think it is really a commentary on collectivism.

Really, so what individual is going to snuff out individualism within society by him or herself?

As Hillary Clinton would say, it takes a village.

Naturally, collectivism seeks to centralize itself, as it always does, into one person or group of people running the show. I reckon you would then blame this on individualism then?

That's just crazy.

 

[Votto]

Mark Krikorian www.nationalreview.com/author/mark-krikorian is the author of the article from which the OP disingenuously quotes

Krikorian is a violent anti-immigrant home, and needs to be read as such.

He is all for deep state admin as long as it does what he wants.

What are you babbling about? I never even heard of this Mark K.

Why is it when the left always concentrates on ad homonym attacks instead of engaging in substantive dialogue?

Then again, that might make them lose every debate they engage in.

My bad.

 

[Tehon]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Soft despotism. I don't think it is really a commentary on collectivism.

Really, so what individual is going to snuff out individualism within society by him or herself?

As Hillary Clinton would say, it takes a village.

Naturally, collectivism seeks to centralize itself, as it always does, into one person or group of people running the show. I reckon you would then blame this on individualism then?

That's just crazy.

Given our form of government it is not crazy to think that individualism has allowed this to happen. I think that is effectively what Tocqueville is saying. By withdrawing into ourselves we have given room for a soft form of tyranny to take root.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Mark Krikorian www.nationalreview.com/author/mark-krikorian is the author of the article from which the OP disingenuously quotes

Krikorian is a violent anti-immigrant home, and needs to be read as such.

He is all for deep state admin as long as it does what he wants.

What are you babbling about? I never even heard of this Mark K.

Why is it when the left always concentrates on ad homonym attacks instead of engaging in substantive dialogue?

Then again, that might make them lose every debate they engage in.

My bad.

I bet you don't know who is catching for the LA Dodgers, so what you know is no one else's issue.

No one has ad hommed anyone. An accurate description of Krikorian is anti-immigration, and he is all for deep state that benefits his wheel house.

Why is it, Votto, when you are disagreed with, you take it personally?

 

[gipper]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Soft despotism. I don't think it is really a commentary on collectivism.

Really, so what individual is going to snuff out individualism within society by him or herself?

As Hillary Clinton would say, it takes a village.

Naturally, collectivism seeks to centralize itself, as it always does, into one person or group of people running the show. I reckon you would then blame this on individualism then?

That's just crazy.

Given our form of government it is not crazy to think that individualism has allowed this to happen. I think that is effectively what Tocqueville is saying. By withdrawing into ourselves we have given room for a soft form of tyranny to take root.

So are you claiming we need a big centralized government imposing collectivism, so that the people don’t withdraw into themselves?

 

[gipper]

Mark Krikorian www.nationalreview.com/author/mark-krikorian is the author of the article from which the OP disingenuously quotes

Krikorian is a violent anti-immigrant home, and needs to be read as such.

He is all for deep state admin as long as it does what he wants.

What are you babbling about? I never even heard of this Mark K.

Why is it when the left always concentrates on ad homonym attacks instead of engaging in substantive dialogue?

Then again, that might make them lose every debate they engage in.

My bad.

I bet you don't know who is catching for the LA Dodgers, so what you know is no one else's issue.

No one has ad hommed anyone. An accurate description of Krikorian is anti-immigration, and he is all for deep state that benefits his wheel house.

Why is it, Votto, when you are disagreed with, you take it personally?

Jake wake up. Everything is not a conspiracy of the alt right. It’s okay. Don’t be afraid.

The OP posted a quote. It has nothing to do with your delusions.

 

[JakeStarkey]

gipper, the at right thinks everyone is conspiring against it.

Guess what? You are hiding your eyes from the truth.

 

[Tehon]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Soft despotism. I don't think it is really a commentary on collectivism.

Really, so what individual is going to snuff out individualism within society by him or herself?

As Hillary Clinton would say, it takes a village.

Naturally, collectivism seeks to centralize itself, as it always does, into one person or group of people running the show. I reckon you would then blame this on individualism then?

That's just crazy.

Given our form of government it is not crazy to think that individualism has allowed this to happen. I think that is effectively what Tocqueville is saying. By withdrawing into ourselves we have given room for a soft form of tyranny to take root.

So are you claiming we need a big centralized government imposing collectivism, so that the people don’t withdraw into themselves?

I am saying that we are a collective and that by denying that fact you leave space for government to step into the void and set up shop.

 

[Votto]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Soft despotism. I don't think it is really a commentary on collectivism.

Really, so what individual is going to snuff out individualism within society by him or herself?

As Hillary Clinton would say, it takes a village.

Naturally, collectivism seeks to centralize itself, as it always does, into one person or group of people running the show. I reckon you would then blame this on individualism then?

That's just crazy.

Given our form of government it is not crazy to think that individualism has allowed this to happen. I think that is effectively what Tocqueville is saying. By withdrawing into ourselves we have given room for a soft form of tyranny to take root.

No, he visited the US in the 1800's and marveled how the state was not intertwined with personal freedoms like it was in Europe and celebrated this fact.


You really don't know this or are you just playing dumb?

Feel free to disagree with him, but don't lie about him.

 

[Votto]

Mark Krikorian www.nationalreview.com/author/mark-krikorian is the author of the article from which the OP disingenuously quotes

Krikorian is a violent anti-immigrant home, and needs to be read as such.

He is all for deep state admin as long as it does what he wants.

What are you babbling about? I never even heard of this Mark K.

Why is it when the left always concentrates on ad homonym attacks instead of engaging in substantive dialogue?

Then again, that might make them lose every debate they engage in.

My bad.

I bet you don't know who is catching for the LA Dodgers, so what you know is no one else's issue.

No one has ad hommed anyone. An accurate description of Krikorian is anti-immigration, and he is all for deep state that benefits his wheel house.

Why is it, Votto, when you are disagreed with, you take it personally?

You attacked a complete stranger and then attacked me for citing him when I have no idea who he is.

That is called being a troll.

If you wish to participate in the thread, by all means do.

 

[Votto]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Soft despotism. I don't think it is really a commentary on collectivism.

Really, so what individual is going to snuff out individualism within society by him or herself?

As Hillary Clinton would say, it takes a village.

Naturally, collectivism seeks to centralize itself, as it always does, into one person or group of people running the show. I reckon you would then blame this on individualism then?

That's just crazy.

Given our form of government it is not crazy to think that individualism has allowed this to happen. I think that is effectively what Tocqueville is saying. By withdrawing into ourselves we have given room for a soft form of tyranny to take root.

So are you claiming we need a big centralized government imposing collectivism, so that the people don’t withdraw into themselves?

I am saying that we are a collective and that by denying that fact you leave space for government to step into the void and set up shop.

What does that mean exactly? Leave space for government?

So the solution is to allow government to have all the space so that there is no space for them to take?

 

[gipper]

Alexis de Tocqueville quote on collectivism

After having thus successively taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but it prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.

Soft despotism. I don't think it is really a commentary on collectivism.

Really, so what individual is going to snuff out individualism within society by him or herself?

As Hillary Clinton would say, it takes a village.

Naturally, collectivism seeks to centralize itself, as it always does, into one person or group of people running the show. I reckon you would then blame this on individualism then?

That's just crazy.

Given our form of government it is not crazy to think that individualism has allowed this to happen. I think that is effectively what Tocqueville is saying. By withdrawing into ourselves we have given room for a soft form of tyranny to take root.

So are you claiming we need a big centralized government imposing collectivism, so that the people don’t withdraw into themselves?

I am saying that we are a collective and that by denying that fact you leave space for government to step into the void and set up shop.

So then, we need collectivism because we are a collective. Right? If so, how do you institute collectivism without government?