Not the view you were looking for: A conservative woman's view on abortion

[Coyote]

Liberals don't say that a fetus isn't human, we say it's not a human life yet.

The decision to have a baby is the most life altering decision a woman can make, and one which changes the lives of everyone in her family. As such, it is not a choice that anyone else can make for her.

The idea that women should be forced to give birth to a child she cannot afford to carry or bear, is barbaric in the extreme. It is just as barbaric as forcing her to abort a child she wants.

When you're prepared to give women health care, child care and paid maternity leave, the number of abortions will come down. But not until.

Actual pro-lifers do support quality universal healthcare, free child care, and paid leave for both parents. Since when do anti-lifers give a damn about forced abortion? Unless it's based on the gender of the child I mean.

Do they really?

I'm asking this because pro-lifers are typically conservative, and along with the conservative line is less government, less subsidies - they don't support family - friendly policies like paid leave for both parents or universal health care (or they seem to think that what we had before Obamacare was "universal". This might be my own bias - but do you have evidence for your claim?

If you going to call us "anti-lifers" then please be accurate with the other label - it should be pro-some-lifers or anti-choicers.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Liberals don't say that a fetus isn't human, we say it's not a human life yet.

"We don't spout THAT ignorant unfounded bullshit. We spout THIS ignorant unfounded bullshit instead."

The decision to have a baby is the most life altering decision a woman can make, and one which changes the lives of everyone in her family. As such, it is not a choice that anyone else can make for her.

The idea that women should be forced to give birth to a child she cannot afford to carry or bear, is barbaric in the extreme. It is just as barbaric as forcing her to abort a child she wants.

"It's barbaric that you can't remake the world and the consequences of your actions just by wishing. Also, it's barbaric that puffs of pastel glitter don't issue from my ass when I fart!"

When you're prepared to give women health care, child care and paid maternity leave, the number of abortions will come down. But not until.

"We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

I rest my case.

If I had a "case" that made me sound as hysterical and ignorant as yours does, I'd rest it at the first opportunity, too.

 

[Cecilie1200]

[We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

So pretty much it's: fuck you - you were slutty enough to get pregnant - we are going to force you to have that baby, regardless of your ability to care for it.

Yet one more bit of evidence that you don't give a crap about them once they are born.

Ooh, look, squawking points! Honestly, have you ever in your life had a post that wasn't just a cut-and-paste of this week's slogans from whatever e-mail the DNC sends out?

 

[Coyote]

[We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

So pretty much it's: fuck you - you were slutty enough to get pregnant - we are going to force you to have that baby, regardless of your ability to care for it.

Yet one more bit of evidence that you don't give a crap about them once they are born.

Ooh, look, squawking points! Honestly, have you ever in your life had a post that wasn't just a cut-and-paste of this week's slogans from whatever e-mail the DNC sends out?

I don't get emails from the DNC. I do, however, notice what is posted here and form my opinions based on it. IE - women who get unwanted pregnancies are sluts who need to suck it up and find a way to raise that baby. Thank you for the confirmation

 

[Coyote]

Liberals don't say that a fetus isn't human, we say it's not a human life yet.

"We don't spout THAT ignorant unfounded bullshit. We spout THIS ignorant unfounded bullshit instead."

The decision to have a baby is the most life altering decision a woman can make, and one which changes the lives of everyone in her family. As such, it is not a choice that anyone else can make for her.

The idea that women should be forced to give birth to a child she cannot afford to carry or bear, is barbaric in the extreme. It is just as barbaric as forcing her to abort a child she wants.

"It's barbaric that you can't remake the world and the consequences of your actions just by wishing. Also, it's barbaric that puffs of pastel glitter don't issue from my ass when I fart!"

When you're prepared to give women health care, child care and paid maternity leave, the number of abortions will come down. But not until.

"We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

I rest my case.

If I had a "case" that made me sound as hysterical and ignorant as yours does, I'd rest it at the first opportunity, too.

What's "ignorant" about it? Here's your chance to dazzle us with ....whatever

 

[Pedro de San Patricio]

Do they really?

I'm asking this because pro-lifers are typically conservative, and along with the conservative line is less government, less subsidies - they don't support family - friendly policies like paid leave for both parents or universal health care (or they seem to think that what we had before Obamacare was "universal". This might be my own bias - but do you have evidence for your claim?

If you going to call us "anti-lifers" then please be accurate with the other label - it should be pro-some-lifers or anti-choicers.

You're right. There are a lot of people who use the label while actively opposing the kinds of things that are required to make their stated policy possible. A lot of that does have to do with their unspoken belief that society's protection should end at the birth canal. I hope we have common ground against them. The one who would leave a child to starve to death after being born is no better than the one who would have the baby ripped apart and tossed in the dumpster out back before birth. In either instance a human being's life is judged not to be worth society's time.

About your protest that I should call myself anti-choice if I'm going to use the accurate term for the other camp, I'm actually completely fine with that label. Filicide isn't even the only choice I'm against. There are a lot of other rights libs have come up with over the years that I oppose as well, such as the right to free internet access, the right to practice pederasty, the right never to be fired, and the extension of full Constitutional civil rights for non-citizens who commit acts of war against the US or US persons. I also oppose a few Constitutional ones, such as the right of the press to disseminate sensitive information regarding things like national security or military TTP. (I'm *still* pissed with Fox for advertising every movement of every US unit they could in the early stages of Iraq. It's like nobody at the fucking company ever heard of OPSEC...) I'm willing to accept the term for what I am. Are you willing to accept your own position?

 

[Cecilie1200]

[We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

So pretty much it's: fuck you - you were slutty enough to get pregnant - we are going to force you to have that baby, regardless of your ability to care for it.

Yet one more bit of evidence that you don't give a crap about them once they are born.

Ooh, look, squawking points! Honestly, have you ever in your life had a post that wasn't just a cut-and-paste of this week's slogans from whatever e-mail the DNC sends out?

I don't get emails from the DNC. I do, however, notice what is posted here and form my opinions based on it. IE - women who get unwanted pregnancies are sluts who need to suck it up and find a way to raise that baby. Thank you for the confirmation

So you're not even getting marching orders from the top? You're just mindlessly repeating what you hear HERE?

Now I'm depressed by the true extent of your pathos.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Liberals don't say that a fetus isn't human, we say it's not a human life yet.

"We don't spout THAT ignorant unfounded bullshit. We spout THIS ignorant unfounded bullshit instead."

The decision to have a baby is the most life altering decision a woman can make, and one which changes the lives of everyone in her family. As such, it is not a choice that anyone else can make for her.

The idea that women should be forced to give birth to a child she cannot afford to carry or bear, is barbaric in the extreme. It is just as barbaric as forcing her to abort a child she wants.

"It's barbaric that you can't remake the world and the consequences of your actions just by wishing. Also, it's barbaric that puffs of pastel glitter don't issue from my ass when I fart!"

When you're prepared to give women health care, child care and paid maternity leave, the number of abortions will come down. But not until.

"We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

I rest my case.

If I had a "case" that made me sound as hysterical and ignorant as yours does, I'd rest it at the first opportunity, too.

What's "ignorant" about it? Here's your chance to dazzle us with ....whatever

If you have to ask what's ignorant about "it's human, but not a human life yet", then you should sue whoever taught your high school biology classes. If you have to ask what's ignorant about the idea that a woman chooses to have sex, knowing that Nature and biology dictate that that is the method by which human beings reproduce, get's pregnant, and then is being "barbarically forced" to have a baby by other people simply because they refuse to condone her killing of the human being HER actions produced, then you should sue your parents for neglecting to teach you the basic morals needed to be a civilized person. If you have to ask what's ignorant about "I'm not going to change my behaviors or make wise life decisions, and you're a big meanie head for not giving me money", then you're utterly hopeless, and should be isolated from society for the safety of others.

Dazzle you? More like work to give a rat's ass that you exist.

 

[Dragonlady]

Liberals don't say that a fetus isn't human, we say it's not a human life yet.

"We don't spout THAT ignorant unfounded bullshit. We spout THIS ignorant unfounded bullshit instead."

The decision to have a baby is the most life altering decision a woman can make, and one which changes the lives of everyone in her family. As such, it is not a choice that anyone else can make for her.

The idea that women should be forced to give birth to a child she cannot afford to carry or bear, is barbaric in the extreme. It is just as barbaric as forcing her to abort a child she wants.

"It's barbaric that you can't remake the world and the consequences of your actions just by wishing. Also, it's barbaric that puffs of pastel glitter don't issue from my ass when I fart!"

When you're prepared to give women health care, child care and paid maternity leave, the number of abortions will come down. But not until.

"We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

I rest my case.

If I had a "case" that made me sound as hysterical and ignorant as yours does, I'd rest it at the first opportunity, too.

What's "ignorant" about it? Here's your chance to dazzle us with ....whatever

If you have to ask what's ignorant about "it's human, but not a human life yet", then you should sue whoever taught your high school biology classes. If you have to ask what's ignorant about the idea that a woman chooses to have sex, knowing that Nature and biology dictate that that is the method by which human beings reproduce, get's pregnant, and then is being "barbarically forced" to have a baby by other people simply because they refuse to condone her killing of the human being HER actions produced, then you should sue your parents for neglecting to teach you the basic morals needed to be a civilized person. If you have to ask what's ignorant about "I'm not going to change my behaviors or make wise life decisions, and you're a big meanie head for not giving me money", then you're utterly hopeless, and should be isolated from society for the safety of others.

Dazzle you? More like work to give a rat's ass that you exist.

Once again you have proven you don't care about living people at all. You want to save the lives of the unborn but would condemn poor married couples to a life with no sex because they can't afford to have more children.

You are a total hypocrite. You don't want to help these children once they're born.

You are utterly lacking in common sense or common decency. Poor women get 80% of the abortions in the U.S. Women whose families cannot support more children. And you think these women shouldn't be having sex with their husbands.

You are too stupid to be one person.

 

[Coyote]

Do they really?

I'm asking this because pro-lifers are typically conservative, and along with the conservative line is less government, less subsidies - they don't support family - friendly policies like paid leave for both parents or universal health care (or they seem to think that what we had before Obamacare was "universal". This might be my own bias - but do you have evidence for your claim?

If you going to call us "anti-lifers" then please be accurate with the other label - it should be pro-some-lifers or anti-choicers.

You're right. There are a lot of people who use the label while actively opposing the kinds of things that are required to make their stated policy possible. A lot of that does have to do with their unspoken belief that society's protection should end at the birth canal. I hope we have common ground against them. The one who would leave a child to starve to death after being born is no better than the one who would have the baby ripped apart and tossed in the dumpster out back before birth. In either instance a human being's life is judged not to be worth society's time.

Yes, I think we have common ground there.

About your protest that I should call myself anti-choice if I'm going to use the accurate term for the other camp, I'm actually completely fine with that label. Filicide isn't even the only choice I'm against. There are a lot of other rights libs have come up with over the years that I oppose as well, such as the right to free internet access, the right to practice pederasty, the right never to be fired, and the extension of full Constitutional civil rights for non-citizens who commit acts of war against the US or US persons. I also oppose a few Constitutional ones, such as the right of the press to disseminate sensitive information regarding things like national security or military TTP. (I'm *still* pissed with Fox for advertising every movement of every US unit they could in the early stages of Iraq. It's like nobody at the fucking company ever heard of OPSEC...) I'm willing to accept the term for what I am. Are you willing to accept your own position?

No, because my position is not pro-abortion. I would never ever counsel a woman to have an abortion if she did not want it. I would let her come to what choice SHE needed, and SHE could live with - because it is her responsibility, her body, the consequences and very real risks for what ever decision fall upon her and she has to live with it. That is the difference between pro-choice and pro-abortion. What I personally believe or would choose for myself is not what she might and I have no right to impose my choices upon her.

A lot of what you are describing aren't exactly "rights". What you call disseminating senstive information regarding NS etc - is not a "right". The right involved is the right of a free press which is vital to a democracy and an open society. The issue is that fine line between the right of the public to be informed (and maintain an open society) and the need to maintain our country's security (and protect an open society). I happen to agree with you on that one.

On these....what do you mean?
the right to practice pederasty
the right never to be fired


...and the extension of full Constitutional civil rights for non-citizens who commit acts of war against the US or US persons

Imo - I don't know about this as a "right" however we have put them (I'm thinking of Guantanamo), including many who were eventually released with no charges - into a deliberately grey and lawless category of "enemy combatents" where they are protected by neither the constitution nor the Geneva convention. That, in my opinion, was wrong.

 

[Coyote]

[We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

So pretty much it's: fuck you - you were slutty enough to get pregnant - we are going to force you to have that baby, regardless of your ability to care for it.

Yet one more bit of evidence that you don't give a crap about them once they are born.

Ooh, look, squawking points! Honestly, have you ever in your life had a post that wasn't just a cut-and-paste of this week's slogans from whatever e-mail the DNC sends out?

I don't get emails from the DNC. I do, however, notice what is posted here and form my opinions based on it. IE - women who get unwanted pregnancies are sluts who need to suck it up and find a way to raise that baby. Thank you for the confirmation

So you're not even getting marching orders from the top? You're just mindlessly repeating what you hear HERE?

Now I'm depressed by the true extent of your pathos.

Let me see if I understand you correctly:
Women who get pregnant need to own their responsibility. Yes or no?
That means - in your reality...partial ownership
There shalt be NO choice
There shalt be NO assistance (even if the mothers are just kids themselves)

Effectively - you're saying "fuck you" (even if they've already been fucked) - it's your bed, now lie on it.

That's an admirable position I suppose...fits with all that compassionate conservative crap that folks espouse. In fact it sounds very much like "women who get unwanted pregnancies are sluts who need to suck it up and find a way to raise that baby"

On the other hand - a little assistance can go a long way in encouraging a mother to keep a baby rather than abort it, to not become yet one more single mother high-school drop out statistic and perhaps break a cycle of dependence.

By all means - derail this with your DNC talking points etc etc rather than add something meaningful to the conversation

 

[Coyote]

Liberals don't say that a fetus isn't human, we say it's not a human life yet.

"We don't spout THAT ignorant unfounded bullshit. We spout THIS ignorant unfounded bullshit instead."

The decision to have a baby is the most life altering decision a woman can make, and one which changes the lives of everyone in her family. As such, it is not a choice that anyone else can make for her.

The idea that women should be forced to give birth to a child she cannot afford to carry or bear, is barbaric in the extreme. It is just as barbaric as forcing her to abort a child she wants.

"It's barbaric that you can't remake the world and the consequences of your actions just by wishing. Also, it's barbaric that puffs of pastel glitter don't issue from my ass when I fart!"

When you're prepared to give women health care, child care and paid maternity leave, the number of abortions will come down. But not until.

"We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

I rest my case.

If I had a "case" that made me sound as hysterical and ignorant as yours does, I'd rest it at the first opportunity, too.

What's "ignorant" about it? Here's your chance to dazzle us with ....whatever

If you have to ask what's ignorant about "it's human, but not a human life yet", then you should sue whoever taught your high school biology classes. If you have to ask what's ignorant about the idea that a woman chooses to have sex, knowing that Nature and biology dictate that that is the method by which human beings reproduce, get's pregnant, and then is being "barbarically forced" to have a baby by other people simply because they refuse to condone her killing of the human being HER actions produced, then you should sue your parents for neglecting to teach you the basic morals needed to be a civilized person. If you have to ask what's ignorant about "I'm not going to change my behaviors or make wise life decisions, and you're a big meanie head for not giving me money", then you're utterly hopeless, and should be isolated from society for the safety of others.

Dazzle you? More like work to give a rat's ass that you exist.

"When you're prepared to give women health care, child care and paid maternity leave, the number of abortions will come down. But not until." - that doesn't sound ignorant.

Your spew, on the other hand sounds like a very angry vindictive person.

 

[Pedro de San Patricio]

No, because my position is not pro-abortion. I would never ever counsel a woman to have an abortion if she did not want it. I would let her come to what choice SHE needed, and SHE could live with - because it is her responsibility, her body, the consequences and very real risks for what ever decision fall upon her and she has to live with it. That is the difference between pro-choice and pro-abortion. What I personally believe or would choose for myself is not what she might and I have no right to impose my choices upon her.

You may not. Society is well within its rights to impose on the individual. These impositions are called laws. You're not allowed to walk up to someone and shoot them in the face no matter how much of a personal annoyance they may be. You're not allowed to kill your child after they're born because you decide they'd get in the way of your aspirations or some of the creature comforts you enjoy. We want society to impose an obligation not to kill your child before birth as well. That's pretty much what it comes down to. One side defends the choice to take your offspring's life* as a basic human right and firmly distinguishes between a-okay feticide and the horrific infanticide that it would be just moments after birth. The other opposes the validity of this choice because it simply doesn't see a difference between doing this to your child before or after they're born.

*Despite occasionally also arguing that there is no life to take anyway...

 

[Coyote]

No, because my position is not pro-abortion. I would never ever counsel a woman to have an abortion if she did not want it. I would let her come to what choice SHE needed, and SHE could live with - because it is her responsibility, her body, the consequences and very real risks for what ever decision fall upon her and she has to live with it. That is the difference between pro-choice and pro-abortion. What I personally believe or would choose for myself is not what she might and I have no right to impose my choices upon her.

You may not. Society is well within its rights to impose on the individual. These impositions are called laws. You're not allowed to walk up to someone and shoot them in the face no matter how much of a personal annoyance they may be. You're not allowed to kill your child after they're born because you decide they'd get in the way of your aspirations or some of the creature comforts you enjoy. We want society to impose an obligation not to kill your child before birth as well. That's pretty much what it comes down to. One side defends the choice to take your offspring's life* as a basic human right and firmly distinguishes between feticide and infanticide. The other opposes the validity of this choice because it simply doesn't see a difference between doing this to your child before or after they're born.

*Despite occasionally also arguing that there is no life to take anyway...

You are not allowed to kill your child after it's born because those same laws don't consider it a child until birth.

What you call a "personal annoyance" or "getting in the way of creature comforts" completely trivializes what it means to become pregnant and raise a child - and the profound effects it has on a person's life. Raising a child is not a "personal annoyance".

If you want "society" to intervene in what is a woman's most intimate and life changing decisions at what point does that society intervene? What is a consistent expectation? Killing the sperm? Preventing implantation? Does the woman's use of a IUD make he a murderer? And does this not reduce her to the status of an incubator? Many forms of birth control are potential abortificants - including the most reliable.

Personally, I can agree with some restrictions on abortion particularly when there ample support for the woman in order to persuade her that having the baby is a good choice including comprehensive health care (even socialized medicine), paid parental leave (and a guarantee they won't be fired for pregnancy), assistance in completing an education and improving job skills if she is a single mother. Also, ample support in helping prevent pregnancy including realistic sex education, free birth control.

 

[Pedro de San Patricio]

You are not allowed to kill your child after it's born because those same laws don't consider it a child until birth.

The law does not consider them persons until the personhood fairy waves her magic wand over them at the end of the birth canal. This does not mean that they are not alive, humans, or the woman's children by definition.

What you call a "personal annoyance" or "getting in the way of creature comforts" completely trivializes what it means to become pregnant and raise a child - and the profound effects it has on a person's life. Raising a child is not a "personal annoyance".

What is the single most common reason given for aborting your child?

If you want "society" to intervene in what is a woman's most intimate and life changing decisions at what point does that society intervene? What is a consistent expectation? Killing the sperm? Preventing implantation? Does the woman's use of a IUD make he a murderer? And does this not reduce her to the status of an incubator? Many forms of birth control are potential abortificants - including the most reliable.

Personally, I can agree with some restrictions on abortion particularly when there ample support for the woman in order to persuade her that having the baby is a good choice including comprehensive health care (even socialized medicine), paid parental leave (and a guarantee they won't be fired for pregnancy), assistance in completing an education and improving job skills if she is a single mother. Also, ample support in helping prevent pregnancy including realistic sex education, free birth control.

Before, preferably. I agree with pretty much everything you say here. (The only thing I can think to add is that elective sterilization should be accessible alongside less permanent contraception and come with no questions asked.) Establishing a functional conception-to-grave healthcare system that doesn't encourage parents to kill their children for their own interest is going to take a LOT of funds and effort, and will inevitably be met with serious opposition from both your side and the majority of mine, but I'm willing to do what I can if you are.

 

[Dragonlady]

Over 70% of women who have abortions cite financial concerns as the primary reason for the abortion. 42% of women having abortions live below the poverty line. Another 27% have family incomes between 100 and 200% of the federal poverty level. 89% of abortion occur within the first trimester.

Induced Abortion in the United States

It should be noted that amniocentesis, the go-to test for genetic abnormalities, is not performed until the second trimester, and results are usually not available until the 20th week of gestation and these would make up the bulk of the 1.2% of pregnancies terminated after 20 weeks. As an over 40 mother, I was told that should the results of my amnio be adverse, they expected my decision immediately.

I was fortunate in that I never had to make that decision. Everyone I know with a severely handicapped child has to face difficult choices once they become too old to care for the child. Mid-life parents face these difficult choices sooner rather than later. The period between the amnio and the results was very stressful, because logic told me what my decision must be, but it was not something I would ever want to do, just speaking for myself.

Pedro, I don't know of anyone who is "pro-abortion". In a perfect world every child would be welcomed with love. Nor are people who oppose abortion necessarily "pro-life". Many believe in the death penalty, or in the righteousness of war. I oppose both. I believe that "pro-choice" and "anti-abortion" are the best descriptions for both sides.

The so-called "pro-life" faction choose this name for themselves because they didn't want to be perceived as against something. That implied that they didn't believe in freedom. They also applied the label "pro-abortion" to the pro-choice side because it made us seem inhuman. Many people on the choice side personally oppose abortion, as I do, but that is our "choice". Pro-choice is the correct appellation. We are not and have never been "pro-abortion".

 

[Cecilie1200]

"We don't spout THAT ignorant unfounded bullshit. We spout THIS ignorant unfounded bullshit instead."

"It's barbaric that you can't remake the world and the consequences of your actions just by wishing. Also, it's barbaric that puffs of pastel glitter don't issue from my ass when I fart!"

"We'll stop killing babies when you sufficiently nanny us like the helpless, ignorant vaginas on legs that we are. Fuck that whole 'intelligent, independent equality' bullshit!"

I rest my case.

If I had a "case" that made me sound as hysterical and ignorant as yours does, I'd rest it at the first opportunity, too.

What's "ignorant" about it? Here's your chance to dazzle us with ....whatever

If you have to ask what's ignorant about "it's human, but not a human life yet", then you should sue whoever taught your high school biology classes. If you have to ask what's ignorant about the idea that a woman chooses to have sex, knowing that Nature and biology dictate that that is the method by which human beings reproduce, get's pregnant, and then is being "barbarically forced" to have a baby by other people simply because they refuse to condone her killing of the human being HER actions produced, then you should sue your parents for neglecting to teach you the basic morals needed to be a civilized person. If you have to ask what's ignorant about "I'm not going to change my behaviors or make wise life decisions, and you're a big meanie head for not giving me money", then you're utterly hopeless, and should be isolated from society for the safety of others.

Dazzle you? More like work to give a rat's ass that you exist.

Once again you have proven you don't care about living people at all. You want to save the lives of the unborn but would condemn poor married couples to a life with no sex because they can't afford to have more children.

You are a total hypocrite. You don't want to help these children once they're born.

You are utterly lacking in common sense or common decency. Poor women get 80% of the abortions in the U.S. Women whose families cannot support more children. And you think these women shouldn't be having sex with their husbands.

You are too stupid to be one person.

"You didn't say it, but I'm SURE this is what you think, so I'm going to argue against it as though you said it, and ignore everything you ACTUALLY said."

There's a name for that: strawman.

And a name for people who use it: fucktard.

 

[NYcarbineer]

If you anti-abortionists want to start sending women to prison for life for having an abortion,

you're going to have to amend the Constitution, and that will never happen.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Pro-choice is not a liberal position. It is a mainstream centrist position. 80% of Americans believe abortion should be legal in all or some circumstances.

 

[Pedro de San Patricio]

If you anti-abortionists want to start sending women to prison for life for having an abortion,

you're going to have to amend the Constitution, and that will never happen.

It's funny how you ask a question, then ignore the answer and pretend you were given a different one. I'm still waiting on an actual amendment from your side. So far all we have is a half-assed and totally willful misapplication by an activist court of a barely related right to doctor patient confidentiality (which was put in place explicitly because going through the legitimate channels would never work).