Not our finest hour.....CIA torture exposed

[rightwinger]

America used to be the good guys

And now Trump wants America to be no better than terrorists.

That is the justification I can’t understand

They look at terrorists, call them viscous animals and then use them as the standard for our moral behavior

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Torture is always used by an authoritarian state to further its agenda. The brits used torture as a matter of course in Belfast and I understand that nobody has been brought to trial over it. Everybody looks the other way and unless the higher ranks are held accountable then it will never change.

 

[rightwinger]

Torture is always used by an authoritarian state to further its agenda. The brits used torture as a matter of course in Belfast and I understand that nobody has been brought to trial over it. Everybody looks the other way and unless the higher ranks are held accountable then it will never change.

In our case, we have a President authorizing torture and getting his justice department to approve it

 

[georgephillip]

CIA used this prisoner as a means to try out its torture methods. Problem is, he was not actually in AlQaeda



'I felt like I was going to die': A harrowing look into CIA torture from the eyes of a detainee

Seton Hall report depicts CIA detainee in graphic drawings of torture

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

"The text portion of the Seton Hall report begins, 'Americans may find it difficult to acknowledge that top officials in the West Wing of the White House and the Office of Legal Counsel of the Department of Justice orchestrated and poorly oversaw a horrific torture program that was responsible for the detention and interrogation of countless detainees.'

"'Sixteen years ago, the White House and the Department of Justice created a torture program and, through a series of legal memoranda, attempted to immunize Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) agents from criminal liability.'"

Abu Zubaydah was captured in Pakistan in 2002 and accused of being a high-ranking member of al-Qaida; he wasn't, but his torture was so "heroic" the CIA arranged for cremation if he died.

Too much MAGA maybe?

Yet, we keep the man in prison without a trial

Only reason is we are afraid to have him testify what America did to him

Yet, we keep the man in prison without a trial

Only reason is we are afraid to have him testify what America did to him

White supremacy married to American Exceptionalism continues to blind many of us to some of our government's most heinous acts

Opinion | Don’t Look Away

"There is nothing in the crude drawings by Abu Zubaydah, a prisoner captured in 2002 and still held by the United States in the Guantánamo Bay detention camp, that hasn’t been described before in the various official and unofficial investigations into the moral travesty that was the C.I.A.’s program of 'enhanced interrogation,' one of the more devious euphemisms ever devised.

"We’ve read of the waterboarding and sleep deprivation and humiliation and all the other horrors, and of the lasting effect they had, often on innocent men."

I can't help wonder how much worse this will get if another 911 comes our way?

 

[rightwinger]

CIA used this prisoner as a means to try out its torture methods. Problem is, he was not actually in AlQaeda



'I felt like I was going to die': A harrowing look into CIA torture from the eyes of a detainee

Seton Hall report depicts CIA detainee in graphic drawings of torture

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

"The text portion of the Seton Hall report begins, 'Americans may find it difficult to acknowledge that top officials in the West Wing of the White House and the Office of Legal Counsel of the Department of Justice orchestrated and poorly oversaw a horrific torture program that was responsible for the detention and interrogation of countless detainees.'

"'Sixteen years ago, the White House and the Department of Justice created a torture program and, through a series of legal memoranda, attempted to immunize Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) agents from criminal liability.'"

Abu Zubaydah was captured in Pakistan in 2002 and accused of being a high-ranking member of al-Qaida; he wasn't, but his torture was so "heroic" the CIA arranged for cremation if he died.

Too much MAGA maybe?

Yet, we keep the man in prison without a trial

Only reason is we are afraid to have him testify what America did to him

Yet, we keep the man in prison without a trial

Only reason is we are afraid to have him testify what America did to him

White supremacy married to American Exceptionalism continues to blind many of us to some of our government's most heinous acts

Opinion | Don’t Look Away

"There is nothing in the crude drawings by Abu Zubaydah, a prisoner captured in 2002 and still held by the United States in the Guantánamo Bay detention camp, that hasn’t been described before in the various official and unofficial investigations into the moral travesty that was the C.I.A.’s program of 'enhanced interrogation,' one of the more devious euphemisms ever devised.

"We’ve read of the waterboarding and sleep deprivation and humiliation and all the other horrors, and of the lasting effect they had, often on innocent men."

I can't help wonder how much worse this will get if another 911 comes our way?

It’s not just if another 9-11 comes our way.....

But what happens when we get involved in a war and our adversary uses these same techniques on our soldiers?

How do we show moral outrage?

 

[georgephillip]

CIA used this prisoner as a means to try out its torture methods. Problem is, he was not actually in AlQaeda



'I felt like I was going to die': A harrowing look into CIA torture from the eyes of a detainee

Seton Hall report depicts CIA detainee in graphic drawings of torture

So he wasn’t a “high ranking” member of AQ....just a low or medium one?

Is there anything to back up this story besides what a terrorist and his lawyer are claiming?

So he wasn’t a “high ranking” member of AQ....just a low or medium one?

Is there anything to back up this story besides what a terrorist and his lawyer are claiming?

Is there anything that would justify his torture?

Abu Zubaydah - Wikipedia

"During his time in CIA custody, Zubaydah was extensively interrogated; he was water-boarded 83 times[3] and subjected to numerous other torture techniques including forced nudity, sleep deprivation, confinement in small dark boxes, deprivation of solid food, stress positions, and physical assaults.[4]

"Videotapes of some of Zubaydah's interrogations are amongst those destroyed by the CIA in 2005.[5][6][7][8]

"Zubaydah and ten other 'high-value detainees' were transferred to Guantanamo in September 2006.

"He and other former CIA detainees are held in Camp 7, where conditions are the most isolating.

"At his Combatant Status Review Tribunal in 2007, Zubaydah said he was told that the CIA realized he was not significant."

 

[georgephillip]

CIA used this prisoner as a means to try out its torture methods. Problem is, he was not actually in AlQaeda



'I felt like I was going to die': A harrowing look into CIA torture from the eyes of a detainee

Seton Hall report depicts CIA detainee in graphic drawings of torture

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

"The text portion of the Seton Hall report begins, 'Americans may find it difficult to acknowledge that top officials in the West Wing of the White House and the Office of Legal Counsel of the Department of Justice orchestrated and poorly oversaw a horrific torture program that was responsible for the detention and interrogation of countless detainees.'

"'Sixteen years ago, the White House and the Department of Justice created a torture program and, through a series of legal memoranda, attempted to immunize Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) agents from criminal liability.'"

Abu Zubaydah was captured in Pakistan in 2002 and accused of being a high-ranking member of al-Qaida; he wasn't, but his torture was so "heroic" the CIA arranged for cremation if he died.

Too much MAGA maybe?

Thats pretty incredible......
So how did these school kids get this info from our intelligence community?

Thats pretty incredible......
So how did these school kids get this info from our intelligence community?

Did you bother to read the link?

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

"The report was prepared by Professor Mark P. Denbeaux, the director of the Seton Hall University School of Law in Newark, NJ—who is also a lawyer for Zubaydah and several other detainees at Guantanamo Bay—and a group of his students.

Abu Zubaydah, a Palestinian whose real name is Zayn al-Abidin Muhammad Husayn, is a Saudi Arabian citizen who was arrested in Faisalabad, Pakistan on March 28, 2002 during a raid on a safe house involving the FBI and Pakistani intelligence..."

"Although the capture of Zubaydah was publicized widely in the US press as a major victory in the 'war on terror'—a significant factor in the decision by the White House to torture him—it was determined subsequent to his torture by US intelligence that Zubaydah had no advanced knowledge of the terror attacks of 9/11 and he was not a member of Al Qaeda."

 

[rightwinger]

CIA used this prisoner as a means to try out its torture methods. Problem is, he was not actually in AlQaeda



'I felt like I was going to die': A harrowing look into CIA torture from the eyes of a detainee

Seton Hall report depicts CIA detainee in graphic drawings of torture

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

"The text portion of the Seton Hall report begins, 'Americans may find it difficult to acknowledge that top officials in the West Wing of the White House and the Office of Legal Counsel of the Department of Justice orchestrated and poorly oversaw a horrific torture program that was responsible for the detention and interrogation of countless detainees.'

"'Sixteen years ago, the White House and the Department of Justice created a torture program and, through a series of legal memoranda, attempted to immunize Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) agents from criminal liability.'"

Abu Zubaydah was captured in Pakistan in 2002 and accused of being a high-ranking member of al-Qaida; he wasn't, but his torture was so "heroic" the CIA arranged for cremation if he died.

Too much MAGA maybe?

Thats pretty incredible......
So how did these school kids get this info from our intelligence community?

Thats pretty incredible......
So how did these school kids get this info from our intelligence community?

Did you bother to read the link?

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

"The report was prepared by Professor Mark P. Denbeaux, the director of the Seton Hall University School of Law in Newark, NJ—who is also a lawyer for Zubaydah and several other detainees at Guantanamo Bay—and a group of his students.

Abu Zubaydah, a Palestinian whose real name is Zayn al-Abidin Muhammad Husayn, is a Saudi Arabian citizen who was arrested in Faisalabad, Pakistan on March 28, 2002 during a raid on a safe house involving the FBI and Pakistani intelligence..."

"Although the capture of Zubaydah was publicized widely in the US press as a major victory in the 'war on terror'—a significant factor in the decision by the White House to torture him—it was determined subsequent to his torture by US intelligence that Zubaydah had no advanced knowledge of the terror attacks of 9/11 and he was not a member of Al Qaeda."

So the guy was not involved in the 9-11 attacks and was not a member of Al Qaeda

So why is he still in prison?

Because we are afraid to try him and have the information about our human rights violations becoming public record

 

[Gdjjr]

Because we are afraid to try him and have the information about our human rights violations becoming public record

EXACTLY!

 

[CrusaderFrank]

America used to be the good guys

And now Trump wants America to be no better than terrorists.

Stalinist dem chimes in

 

[Gdjjr]

Don't mean to hi-jack your thread, but it gave me an opportunity to add to mine-

This country has become a laughing stock for one reason. Double Standards.
Read through the thread linked- in that thread, it seems it's perfectly okay to torture people who are *considered* (but not proven) to have terrorist ties. But, there is whining when they torture our military personnel. That coincides with those who refuse to read and consider opposing views and prefer to rely on partisan 30 second sound bites for their opinions. Those being detained came from their own lands- our soldiers invaded their lands, so, who are the terrorists? Our pledge of allegiance is a joke- Liberty and Justice for all means absolutely nothing. The Rule of Laws is a sham.

There are multiple points here. Double standards is but one, but is indicative of the hypocrisy that is pervasive and rampant in this country. We call ourselves civilized yet praise uncivilized behavior, as long as it's our own or actually, anyone we disagree with. We collectively, through our representative gov't, approve of evil perpetrated in our name. It's amazing that an allegedly educated society doesn't have the knowledge to realize something as simple as begets, begets. Some things cannot be denied.

This Country was founded on the principle, the philosophy, that "all men are created equal and have certain unalienable rights"- there are no caveats in that principle. Denying or restricting rights while claiming Liberty and Justice for all is an ultimate Double Standard- then we whine and cry when we're considered a laughing stock while boasting how great we are. There's a saying; that dog will bite. Those type sayings come about for a reason.

Common sense has taken a vacation from the US political scene- logic has taken a vacation from our society- Double Standards has become a religion fueled with ignorance and practiced with zealotry. The godvernment acolytes who worship at the alter of the partisan Double Standard church are determined to have their way (depending on how the wind is blowing on a given day) and agree that Forcing their beliefs, wants and desires on others is the American value system they love.

America: We Have a Problem

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

How do we know any of that?
You don’t seem to be able to answer the question if there is any evidence outside of a terrorist’s word.

I got an idea!
Why don’t we have a trial and have CIA agents testify under oath how they tortured him?

How does that change the fact you're for the terrorist?

I am for American values

They do not include torture

Personally I dont give a shit if they hook jumper cables to their nuts.
It's not like they aren't doing that to our troops already.

Show where they do that to our troops

So Pooflinger thinks terrorist dont torture Americans....

 

[rightwinger]

I got an idea!
Why don’t we have a trial and have CIA agents testify under oath how they tortured him?

How does that change the fact you're for the terrorist?

I am for American values

They do not include torture

Personally I dont give a shit if they hook jumper cables to their nuts.
It's not like they aren't doing that to our troops already.

Show where they do that to our troops

So Pooflinger thinks terrorist dont torture Americans....

Show where they do that to our troops.....that was your claim
You just making shit up?

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

How does that change the fact you're for the terrorist?

I am for American values

They do not include torture

Personally I dont give a shit if they hook jumper cables to their nuts.
It's not like they aren't doing that to our troops already.

Show where they do that to our troops

So Pooflinger thinks terrorist dont torture Americans....

Show where they do that to our troops.....that was your claim
You just making shit up?

Dont be any dumber than you have to be Pooflinger......

 

[pknopp]

CIA used this prisoner as a means to try out its torture methods. Problem is, he was not actually in AlQaeda



'I felt like I was going to die': A harrowing look into CIA torture from the eyes of a detainee

Seton Hall report depicts CIA detainee in graphic drawings of torture

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

Seton Hall Law School report exposes new details of CIA torture program

"The text portion of the Seton Hall report begins, 'Americans may find it difficult to acknowledge that top officials in the West Wing of the White House and the Office of Legal Counsel of the Department of Justice orchestrated and poorly oversaw a horrific torture program that was responsible for the detention and interrogation of countless detainees.'

"'Sixteen years ago, the White House and the Department of Justice created a torture program and, through a series of legal memoranda, attempted to immunize Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) agents from criminal liability.'"

Abu Zubaydah was captured in Pakistan in 2002 and accused of being a high-ranking member of al-Qaida; he wasn't, but his torture was so "heroic" the CIA arranged for cremation if he died.

Too much MAGA maybe?

Yet, we keep the man in prison without a trial

Only reason is we are afraid to have him testify what America did to him

Yet, we keep the man in prison without a trial

Only reason is we are afraid to have him testify what America did to him

White supremacy married to American Exceptionalism continues to blind many of us to some of our government's most heinous acts

Opinion | Don’t Look Away

"There is nothing in the crude drawings by Abu Zubaydah, a prisoner captured in 2002 and still held by the United States in the Guantánamo Bay detention camp, that hasn’t been described before in the various official and unofficial investigations into the moral travesty that was the C.I.A.’s program of 'enhanced interrogation,' one of the more devious euphemisms ever devised.

"We’ve read of the waterboarding and sleep deprivation and humiliation and all the other horrors, and of the lasting effect they had, often on innocent men."

I can't help wonder how much worse this will get if another 911 comes our way?

It's going to happen. You do not do the things to other people without them at some point retaliating. It's human nature. It's what we would demand.

 

[rightwinger]

I am for American values

They do not include torture

Personally I dont give a shit if they hook jumper cables to their nuts.
It's not like they aren't doing that to our troops already.

Show where they do that to our troops

So Pooflinger thinks terrorist dont torture Americans....

Show where they do that to our troops.....that was your claim
You just making shit up?

Dont be any dumber than you have to be Pooflinger......

You FAIL once again
Show where our troops are being tortured......it is your claim

 

[theHawk]

CIA used this prisoner as a means to try out its torture methods. Problem is, he was not actually in AlQaeda



'I felt like I was going to die': A harrowing look into CIA torture from the eyes of a detainee

Seton Hall report depicts CIA detainee in graphic drawings of torture

So he wasn’t a “high ranking” member of AQ....just a low or medium one?

Is there anything to back up this story besides what a terrorist and his lawyer are claiming?

So he wasn’t a “high ranking” member of AQ....just a low or medium one?

Is there anything to back up this story besides what a terrorist and his lawyer are claiming?

Is there anything that would justify his torture?

Abu Zubaydah - Wikipedia

"During his time in CIA custody, Zubaydah was extensively interrogated; he was water-boarded 83 times[3] and subjected to numerous other torture techniques including forced nudity, sleep deprivation, confinement in small dark boxes, deprivation of solid food, stress positions, and physical assaults.[4]

"Videotapes of some of Zubaydah's interrogations are amongst those destroyed by the CIA in 2005.[5][6][7][8]

"Zubaydah and ten other 'high-value detainees' were transferred to Guantanamo in September 2006.

"He and other former CIA detainees are held in Camp 7, where conditions are the most isolating.

"At his Combatant Status Review Tribunal in 2007, Zubaydah said he was told that the CIA realized he was not significant."

All of your sources are the terrorist himself.

You may love terrorists because you hate America just as much as they do, the rest of us will pass on believing anything this Muslim has to say.

 

[rightwinger]

CIA used this prisoner as a means to try out its torture methods. Problem is, he was not actually in AlQaeda



'I felt like I was going to die': A harrowing look into CIA torture from the eyes of a detainee

Seton Hall report depicts CIA detainee in graphic drawings of torture

So he wasn’t a “high ranking” member of AQ....just a low or medium one?

Is there anything to back up this story besides what a terrorist and his lawyer are claiming?

So he wasn’t a “high ranking” member of AQ....just a low or medium one?

Is there anything to back up this story besides what a terrorist and his lawyer are claiming?

Is there anything that would justify his torture?

Abu Zubaydah - Wikipedia

"During his time in CIA custody, Zubaydah was extensively interrogated; he was water-boarded 83 times[3] and subjected to numerous other torture techniques including forced nudity, sleep deprivation, confinement in small dark boxes, deprivation of solid food, stress positions, and physical assaults.[4]

"Videotapes of some of Zubaydah's interrogations are amongst those destroyed by the CIA in 2005.[5][6][7][8]

"Zubaydah and ten other 'high-value detainees' were transferred to Guantanamo in September 2006.

"He and other former CIA detainees are held in Camp 7, where conditions are the most isolating.

"At his Combatant Status Review Tribunal in 2007, Zubaydah said he was told that the CIA realized he was not significant."

All of your sources are the terrorist himself.

You may love terrorists because you hate America just as much as they do, the rest of us will pass on believing anything this Muslim has to say.

What terrorist?

What has he ever been convicted of?
He has never even been charged

The burden of proof is on the accuser. You need actual evidence

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Personally I dont give a shit if they hook jumper cables to their nuts.
It's not like they aren't doing that to our troops already.

Show where they do that to our troops

So Pooflinger thinks terrorist dont torture Americans....

Show where they do that to our troops.....that was your claim
You just making shit up?

Dont be any dumber than you have to be Pooflinger......

You FAIL once again
Show where our troops are being tortured......it is your claim

You're a complete dumbass.
You dont remember soldiers being dragged through the streets?

 

[rightwinger]

Show where they do that to our troops

So Pooflinger thinks terrorist dont torture Americans....

Show where they do that to our troops.....that was your claim
You just making shit up?

Dont be any dumber than you have to be Pooflinger......

You FAIL once again
Show where our troops are being tortured......it is your claim

You're a complete dumbass.
You dont remember soldiers being dragged through the streets?

Are you talking 25 years ago?
I thought we were talking about what is happening today