North vs South

[alan1]

North vs South?
First let me say I am not trying to pick a fight or rehash the Civil war,I'm trying to understand something that I thought was long dead. I'm a Northerner born and raised and very proud of family and heritage.

Recently I have been encountering some remarks about people up North from folks living down South that weren't nice to say the least. My sister, whose Ex- in- laws are from the Carolina's, tells me it's common, or at least it was with her inlaws, to make "Damn Yankee" comments.

I'll be the first to admit the North East is very rude and obnoxious or can seem so to people who don't live here.The further North you go the worse it gets. I've been in the South several times but never encountered this prejudice face to face, but on line it seems to be prevalent.

It's 2012 the Civil War was in the 1860's and I gotta say that most people in the USA did the major immigration thing in the early 1900's and their family's weren't even here during the Civil War. So here's the Question. Why the long standing animosity with Southerner's toward the North? Seems as silly to me as blacks going on about Slavery when they never were slaves or American's getting testy about the Brit's over the Revolution. Why can't this country move on?

You ask,
"Why the long standing animosity with Southerner's toward the North?"
My answer is for you to look at the posts on this board (and others) where insults against southerners are commonplace, many in the north or west make assumptions that people from the south are hicks, racist, ignorant or just plain stupid.
Animosity goes both ways.

 

[BluePhantom]

North vs South?
First let me say I am not trying to pick a fight or rehash the Civil war,I'm trying to understand something that I thought was long dead. I'm a Northerner born and raised and very proud of family and heritage.

Recently I have been encountering some remarks about people up North from folks living down South that weren't nice to say the least. My sister, whose Ex- in- laws are from the Carolina's, tells me it's common, or at least it was with her inlaws, to make "Damn Yankee" comments.

I'll be the first to admit the North East is very rude and obnoxious or can seem so to people who don't live here.The further North you go the worse it gets. I've been in the South several times but never encountered this prejudice face to face, but on line it seems to be prevalent.

It's 2012 the Civil War was in the 1860's and I gotta say that most people in the USA did the major immigration thing in the early 1900's and their family's weren't even here during the Civil War. So here's the Question. Why the long standing animosity with Southerner's toward the North? Seems as silly to me as blacks going on about Slavery when they never were slaves or American's getting testy about the Brit's over the Revolution. Why can't this country move on?

You ask,
"Why the long standing animosity with Southerner's toward the North?"
My answer is for you to look at the posts on this board (and others) where insults against southerners are commonplace, many in the north or west make assumptions that people from the south are hicks, racist, ignorant or just plain stupid.
Animosity goes both ways.

As I pointed out in another thread....in the south animosity against the north is just as widespread. I think the point Violet is making (I will let her speak for herself, but just what I interpret) is "north or south we are all Americans and it's about time that a Yankee embraces a Reb as brother to brother". Personally I agree with her.

 

[The Gadfly]

There are other examples of minor institutionalized bigotry towards the South and it's interesting to point them out. Except for maybe Texas and Florida (which has more New Yorkers than "crackers") the geographical location of the Southern States is usually identified but the term "northern states" is never used. A person is introduced as being from the South but never the north. A weather incident might occur in the "south" but never "in the north". Back in the first half of the 20th century a celebrity or an important person would usually be identified as a southerner but never a "northerner".

Just curious but why do you put the term "crackers" in quotes? According to Ravi and other liberals it's a perfectly acceptable term with no racist implications whatsoever...at least so liberals are arguing on another thread.

Here we go again. I thought I explained this to Y'all in the "Cracker Counties" thread.As commonly used by non-Southerners the terms "cracker" and "redneck"have come to have a nastier connotation than they originally had. Used in that pejorative sense, the meaning has taken on a connotation more similar to "White Trash". That is, the connotation is broadened from simply ""working class (or poor) White Southerner" to include "uneducated, uncouth, immoral, lazy, possibly inbred and racist". With that connotation, both words, while NOT racial slurs, ARE insulting, disparaging and contemptuous, and usually intended as such. When used in that fashion, both words are offensive to most educated Southerners.

Now, do we use them ourselves? Yes, and partly for the same reason Blacks use the N-word and its variants; to take the sting out of a reference that is intended to degrade and wound and disparage. The way we use both terms (outside parts of FL and GA the preferred one is "redneck"), it means roughly "Southern good ole boy (or girl)".

Believe me, when you use either word with a tone of voice or in a context that indicates the reference is snide, contemptuous, and with insult intended, we know EXACTLY what you mean, and we don't like it! That leaves a gray area, where the word is used as a regional reference, rather thoughtlessly and in a somewhat exploitative fashion, usually by outsiders who find our culture and/or accent somehow amusing or quaint. Is that terribly insulting? Well, not especially, and often no real harm is intended; but if one holds to the same standard of "sensitivity" that some PC liberals want people to observe when dealing with any OTHER culture/people, it probably should not be used that way, either.

 

[BluePhantom]

There are other examples of minor institutionalized bigotry towards the South and it's interesting to point them out. Except for maybe Texas and Florida (which has more New Yorkers than "crackers") the geographical location of the Southern States is usually identified but the term "northern states" is never used. A person is introduced as being from the South but never the north. A weather incident might occur in the "south" but never "in the north". Back in the first half of the 20th century a celebrity or an important person would usually be identified as a southerner but never a "northerner".

Just curious but why do you put the term "crackers" in quotes? According to Ravi and other liberals it's a perfectly acceptable term with no racist implications whatsoever...at least so liberals are arguing on another thread.

Here we go again. I thought I explained this to Y'all in the "Cracker Counties" thread.As commonly used by non-Southerners the terms "cracker" and "redneck"have come to have a nastier connotation than they originally had. Used in that pejorative sense, the meaning has taken on a connotation more similar to "White Trash". That is, the connotation is broadened from simply ""working class (or poor) White Southerner" to include "uneducated, uncouth, immoral, lazy, possibly inbred and racist". With that connotation, both words, while NOT racial slurs, ARE insulting, disparaging and contemptuous, and usually intended as such. When used in that fashion, both words are offensive to most educated Southerners.

Now, do we use them ourselves? Yes, and partly for the same reason Blacks use the N-word and it's variants; to take the sting out of a reference that is intended to degrade and wound and disparage. The way we use both terms (outside parts of FL and GA the preferred one is "redneck") it means roughly "Southern good ole boy (or girl)".

Believe me, when you use either word with a tone of voice or in a context that indicates the reference is snide, contemptuous, and with insult intended, we know EXACTLY what you mean, and we don't like it! That leaves a gray area, where the word is used as a regional reference, rather thoughtlessly and in a somewhat exploitative fashion, usually by outsiders who find our culture and/or accent somehow amusing or quaint. Is that terribly insulting? Well, not especially, and often no real harm is intended; but if one holds to the same standard of "sensitivity" that some PC liberals want people to observe when dealing with any OTHER culture/people, it probably should not be used that way, either.

Yes I know.....my point is that the same argument is being rejected on this thread to support the liberal position and accepted on the other thread to support the liberal position. So...which the fuck is it?

 

[alan1]

North vs South?
First let me say I am not trying to pick a fight or rehash the Civil war,I'm trying to understand something that I thought was long dead. I'm a Northerner born and raised and very proud of family and heritage.

Recently I have been encountering some remarks about people up North from folks living down South that weren't nice to say the least. My sister, whose Ex- in- laws are from the Carolina's, tells me it's common, or at least it was with her inlaws, to make "Damn Yankee" comments.

I'll be the first to admit the North East is very rude and obnoxious or can seem so to people who don't live here.The further North you go the worse it gets. I've been in the South several times but never encountered this prejudice face to face, but on line it seems to be prevalent.

It's 2012 the Civil War was in the 1860's and I gotta say that most people in the USA did the major immigration thing in the early 1900's and their family's weren't even here during the Civil War. So here's the Question. Why the long standing animosity with Southerner's toward the North? Seems as silly to me as blacks going on about Slavery when they never were slaves or American's getting testy about the Brit's over the Revolution. Why can't this country move on?

You ask,
"Why the long standing animosity with Southerner's toward the North?"
My answer is for you to look at the posts on this board (and others) where insults against southerners are commonplace, many in the north or west make assumptions that people from the south are hicks, racist, ignorant or just plain stupid.
Animosity goes both ways.

As I pointed out in another thread....in the south animosity against the north is just as widespread. I think the point Violet is making (I will let her speak for herself, but just what I interpret) is "north or south we are all Americans and it's about time that a Yankee embraces a Reb as brother to brother". Personally I agree with her.

I was merely pointing out that it is a two way street.
If a New Yorker steps into South Carolina, the moment they hear his accent, they will ask him where he is from. The same thing will happen if a person from South Carolina steps into CA, they will ask him where he is from. I've seen this behavior in every state I've lived in.

 

[The Gadfly]

North vs South?
First let me say I am not trying to pick a fight or rehash the Civil war,I'm trying to understand something that I thought was long dead. I'm a Northerner born and raised and very proud of family and heritage.

Recently I have been encountering some remarks about people up North from folks living down South that weren't nice to say the least. My sister, whose Ex- in- laws are from the Carolina's, tells me it's common, or at least it was with her inlaws, to make "Damn Yankee" comments.

I'll be the first to admit the North East is very rude and obnoxious or can seem so to people who don't live here.The further North you go the worse it gets. I've been in the South several times but never encountered this prejudice face to face, but on line it seems to be prevalent.

It's 2012 the Civil War was in the 1860's and I gotta say that most people in the USA did the major immigration thing in the early 1900's and their family's weren't even here during the Civil War. So here's the Question. Why the long standing animosity with Southerner's toward the North? Seems as silly to me as blacks going on about Slavery when they never were slaves or American's getting testy about the Brit's over the Revolution. Why can't this country move on?

You ask,
"Why the long standing animosity with Southerner's toward the North?"
My answer is for you to look at the posts on this board (and others) where insults against southerners are commonplace, many in the north or west make assumptions that people from the south are hicks, racist, ignorant or just plain stupid.
Animosity goes both ways.

As I pointed out in another thread....in the south animosity against the north is just as widespread. I think the point Violet is making (I will let her speak for herself, but just what I interpret) is "north or south we are all Americans and it's about time that a Yankee embraces a Reb as brother to brother". Personally I agree with her.

There have been times when we had that. Back toward the end of the nineteenth century, in the so-called "Era of Good Feeling". The nation as a whole took some steps toward reconciliation. In the North, there were calls to return the captured surrendered regimental colors of Confederate units, and many in fact were returned. Twenty years after Gettysburg, veterans of the battle from both sides reunited there and embraced one another. As recently as the 1950's, the South's Confederate heritage was accepted, its heroes honored, and there were movies and TV shows that painted BOTH sides in a heroic light, without demonizing either. In 1958, an act of the U.S. Congress officially declared Confederate Veterans to be American Veterans. Even the Centennial observances for the conflict were respectful to both sides; the valor, honor and fighting spirit of the Confederate soldier was honored, as part of the American military tradition....and then, well AFTER the civil rights movement had succeeded, the assault on all things Southern and especially Confederate was renewed; it has continued unabated ever since. First it was the Battle Flag, then the song "Dixie"; it's been going downhill ever since, and there's no end in sight. Now people say both Dixie, and the flag, and anything else Confederate, offends them, so the tradition and the symbols that for years had been accepted as emblematic of the South had to go. Offense, or simply politically motivated spite and revenge? Hell, I don't know; all I know is that when I asked Black friends back in the sixties if either the flag or the song bothered them, all those I talked to said they felt neither had anything to do with them. All I know is that when you are a part of the only people in America who have been asked to hide their history and heritage, and give up their regional symbols, because someone was offended, when your kids go to school and have to listen to and affirm the vilification of their ancestors, that hurts too. So yes, I feel persecuted, yes, I blame liberals for doing it, and yes, that's one more reason for me to dislike everything any liberal says or does, and it explains why I'd vote for a mangy dog, before I'd ever vote for a liberal.

 

[BluePhantom]

I was merely pointing out that it is a two way street.
If a New Yorker steps into South Carolina, the moment they hear his accent, they will ask him where he is from. The same thing will happen if a person from South Carolina steps into CA, they will ask him where he is from. I've seen this behavior in every state I've lived in.

True.....but a little southern belle that winks her eye and says "you are new in town? well shit sugar let me take you for a sweet tea" is a lot more attractive than a New jersey chick saying "EY!! Ya gonna buy me a soda er wat?!?!?"

 

[The Gadfly]

Just curious but why do you put the term "crackers" in quotes? According to Ravi and other liberals it's a perfectly acceptable term with no racist implications whatsoever...at least so liberals are arguing on another thread.

Here we go again. I thought I explained this to Y'all in the "Cracker Counties" thread.As commonly used by non-Southerners the terms "cracker" and "redneck"have come to have a nastier connotation than they originally had. Used in that pejorative sense, the meaning has taken on a connotation more similar to "White Trash". That is, the connotation is broadened from simply ""working class (or poor) White Southerner" to include "uneducated, uncouth, immoral, lazy, possibly inbred and racist". With that connotation, both words, while NOT racial slurs, ARE insulting, disparaging and contemptuous, and usually intended as such. When used in that fashion, both words are offensive to most educated Southerners.

Now, do we use them ourselves? Yes, and partly for the same reason Blacks use the N-word and it's variants; to take the sting out of a reference that is intended to degrade and wound and disparage. The way we use both terms (outside parts of FL and GA the preferred one is "redneck") it means roughly "Southern good ole boy (or girl)".

Believe me, when you use either word with a tone of voice or in a context that indicates the reference is snide, contemptuous, and with insult intended, we know EXACTLY what you mean, and we don't like it! That leaves a gray area, where the word is used as a regional reference, rather thoughtlessly and in a somewhat exploitative fashion, usually by outsiders who find our culture and/or accent somehow amusing or quaint. Is that terribly insulting? Well, not especially, and often no real harm is intended; but if one holds to the same standard of "sensitivity" that some PC liberals want people to observe when dealing with any OTHER culture/people, it probably should not be used that way, either.

Yes I know.....my point is that the same argument is being rejected on this thread to support the liberal position and accepted on the other thread to support the liberal position. So...which the fuck is it?

Ask the liberals, because they change positions faster than a worm on hot asphalt; makes my head hurt trying to keep up with them (which I suspect, is their objective). They can be about as clear as Mississippi mud, when it suits them, and transparent as air, when it suits them. I swear I believe if you gave a typical liberal a gray fence post, and asked him whether it was black or white, he'd just paint one side white, and the other side black, and then insist it was BOTH, to begin with.

 

[The Gadfly]

I was merely pointing out that it is a two way street.
If a New Yorker steps into South Carolina, the moment they hear his accent, they will ask him where he is from. The same thing will happen if a person from South Carolina steps into CA, they will ask him where he is from. I've seen this behavior in every state I've lived in.

True.....but a little southern belle that winks her eye and says "you are new in town? well shit sugar let me take you for a sweet tea" is a lot more attractive than a New jersey chick saying "EY!! Ya gonna buy me a soda er wat?!?!?"

Now, THAT, is the pure truth! Testify!

 

[alan1]

I was merely pointing out that it is a two way street.
If a New Yorker steps into South Carolina, the moment they hear his accent, they will ask him where he is from. The same thing will happen if a person from South Carolina steps into CA, they will ask him where he is from. I've seen this behavior in every state I've lived in.

True.....but a little southern belle that winks her eye and says "you are new in town? well shit sugar let me take you for a sweet tea" is a lot more attractive than a New jersey chick saying "EY!! Ya gonna buy me a soda er wat?!?!?"

The last time I was in New Jersey, they took me to Carmignes (sp) in New York for dinner.
The last time I was in South Carolina, they took me home for dinner.
I couldn't tell ya which was better.

 

[JamesInFlorida]

I was merely pointing out that it is a two way street.
If a New Yorker steps into South Carolina, the moment they hear his accent, they will ask him where he is from. The same thing will happen if a person from South Carolina steps into CA, they will ask him where he is from. I've seen this behavior in every state I've lived in.

True.....but a little southern belle that winks her eye and says "you are new in town? well shit sugar let me take you for a sweet tea" is a lot more attractive than a New jersey chick saying "EY!! Ya gonna buy me a soda er wat?!?!?"

I don't think I've laughed out loud from USMB before. Job well done.

 

[editec]

Dang....Sherry is from the mid-west.

Born and raised in the burbs north of Chicago...currently residing in the Sunshine state.

The pop vs. soda thing was always a curiosity. It was always the east coasters that called it soda.

Except in the Boston region where it is often called TONIC.\

And apparently that use of the word tonic ranges about one day's wagon ride from Boston.

The linguistic theory I've heard to explain that is that the first large distributor of TONIC so dominated the Boston Region market (in the late 18th and early 19th century) that the wordthey used: "tonic" became the word people came to associate with soda.

 

[jwreck]

It's pop...not soda.

Pop is the guy that boinks mom.

 

[Cuyo]

North vs South?
First let me say I am not trying to pick a fight or rehash the Civil war,I'm trying to understand something that I thought was long dead. I'm a Northerner born and raised and very proud of family and heritage.

Recently I have been encountering some remarks about people up North from folks living down South that weren't nice to say the least. My sister, whose Ex- in- laws are from the Carolina's, tells me it's common, or at least it was with her inlaws, to make "Damn Yankee" comments.

I'll be the first to admit the North East is very rude and obnoxious or can seem so to people who don't live here.The further North you go the worse it gets. I've been in the South several times but never encountered this prejudice face to face, but on line it seems to be prevalent.

It's 2012 the Civil War was in the 1860's and I gotta say that most people in the USA did the major immigration thing in the early 1900's and their family's weren't even here during the Civil War. So here's the Question. Why the long standing animosity with Southerner's toward the North? Seems as silly to me as blacks going on about Slavery when they never were slaves or American's getting testy about the Brit's over the Revolution. Why can't this country move on?

I'm guessing today a lot of it has to do with political differences. I have occasionally heard people here in the south complain about all the northerners moving down here and bringing their "liberal" politics with them that ruined their home state to begin with, but it's not really all that common. I'm from Boston so the letter "R" is not my friend. It's painfully obvious where I'm from and I haven't really had any problems with anybody down here other than my southern friends who like to occasionally rip on me about it, but that's what your buddies do.

Fixed your avatar for you.

Now that's funny right there.

C'mon Taz, be a good sport. Use Ernie's version!