No tax cut extension will crash the stock market Obama thinks he revived

[The Rabbi]

Poor, poor rich man. Hell, give the bastards another tax break so they can ship some more factories overseas. Yep, that's the Republican ticket.

Letting people keep more of their own money is not "giving" them anything, twit.

Letting people not pay for what they owe IS.

We owe 12 trillion in debt. Who do you want to pay that off?

Really? Where did I sign any agreement to borrow that money? Where did anyone?
Is this honestly the best argument you can come up with? Because it's pretty piss-poor, even by your low standards.

 

[Vast LWC]

Nobody is going to wait until 2011 to realize capital gains.

How big are your balls, President Pro Growth?

Delaying Tax Vote Could Crash Stock Market - Washington Whispers (usnews.com)

Failure by Congress to extend the Bush tax cuts, especially locking in the 15 percent capital gains tax rate, will spark a stock market sell off starting December 15 as investors move to lock in gains at a lower rate than the 20 percent it would jump to next year, warn analysts. [See who gets the most money from the financial industry.]

While it is unclear how bad the sell off could be, it could wipe out the year's gains, they warn.

"Capital gains tax rate will increase from 15 to 20 percent if the tax cuts are not extended. The last time the capital gains tax rate increased--on Jan. 1, 1987 from 20 to 28 percent--investors realized their gains at the lower tax rate," said Daniel Clifton at a Washington partner at Strategas Research Partners. "We would expect a similar effect this time around as investors see the tax rate going up and choose to realize their gains and incur the 15 percent tax." [See a gallery of political caricatures.]

In a memo to clients, Clifton says that the date most clients are focused on is December 15th for a deal in Congress before beginning to sell. One reason: Many stock options expire that day and investors have to act.

OK:

1. Corporations just finished their most profitable quarter ever. The stock market is not going to suddenly crash if they raise taxes a few percentage points.

and

2. Having a 15% capital gains tax encourages reliance on investments made with borrowed money (in other words, gambling), rather than making money the old-fashioned way, through work. Since a large portion of this investment goes to companies with most, or all of their workforce overseas, it does not stimulate American jobs.
Also it causes a massive bubble and burst effect in the stock market. The 12% capital gains tax in the 1920's, for instance, was one of the primary causes of the great crash, and, by extension, the Great Depression.

 

[JWBooth]

While the underlying value may remain the same, the stock prices will fall as sellers begin to outnumber buyers. Those looking to buy will hold off until prices become a bargain. If this scenario plays out, and if the market falls far enough, fast enough, it could be a very good day to pick up some bargains.

As for the absurd claim that the dimocraps passed any kind of tax cut, it takes a leap in logic to call an extension of current rates a cut, as opposed to simply choosing not to let them go up.

Anything short of reducing the current rate(s) is not a cut, despite any claims otherwise.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Letting people keep more of their own money is not "giving" them anything, twit.

Letting people not pay for what they owe IS.

We owe 12 trillion in debt. Who do you want to pay that off?

Really? Where did I sign any agreement to borrow that money? Where did anyone?
Is this honestly the best argument you can come up with? Because it's pretty piss-poor, even by your low standards.

So you don't pay your income taxes at all, because you're not legally obligated? Income taxes are voluntary according to YOU???

Geez, haven't seen one of these characters in a long time.

 

[The Rabbi]

Letting people not pay for what they owe IS.

We owe 12 trillion in debt. Who do you want to pay that off?

Really? Where did I sign any agreement to borrow that money? Where did anyone?
Is this honestly the best argument you can come up with? Because it's pretty piss-poor, even by your low standards.

So you don't pay your income taxes at all, because you're not legally obligated? Income taxes are voluntary according to YOU???

Geez, haven't seen one of these characters in a long time.

Does that mean you support gay marriage?

 

[The Rabbi]

2. Having a 15% capital gains tax encourages reliance on investments made with borrowed money (in other words, gambling), rather than making money the old-fashioned way, through work.

Could you please explain this comment. If I build a factory and employ hundreds of people but go to the bank for a loan, how is that any different from anything else??

 

[boedicca]

Many of us, including myself, pointed out long ago that the prospect of the Bush tax cuts being allowed to expire was driving artificial growth in the stock market this year.

 

[NYcarbineer]

The House Democrats, over almost unanimous opposition of the GOP, passed a massive tax cut yesterday.

Your a revisionist FOOL and a LIAR! If you want to say fuck the millionaires (meaning the people who make over $1 mil a year) fine, but they passed one of the largest in history tax increases on the SUCCESSFULL SMALL BUSINESS OWNER who employee the majority of Americans! The $250k-$750K that the Democrats Demonize are the exact people who create the jobs that most of us have!

Do you really thinking hitting them NOW is a good decision? I guarantee if this somehow passes in the Senate, then we see unemployment increase pass 10%, heck I think pass 11%! Some assholes might want that, because a change in government might happen, but I personally fear it!

Lastly, unlike the uneducated fool above, there is not unlining asset value of a stock. A stocks price is what people pay. Increasing the capital gains tax by a wooping 5% will decrease the value of ALL STOCKS! The stock market could be headed for another crash (not a Great Depression Crash), but a huge 1000s of points drop!

Then why aren't those business owners creating jobs now? They GET that tax rate NOW, and have for many years. They were getting that tax rate in 2006/2007 when we fell into one of the worst recessions in history. Why didn't these tax rates prevent THAT?

Be specific in your answer.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Many of us, including myself, pointed out long ago that the prospect of the Bush tax cuts being allowed to expire was driving artificial growth in the stock market this year.

Which is of course nonsense.

 

[Vel]

The House Democrats, over almost unanimous opposition of the GOP, passed a massive tax cut yesterday.

No, they agreed to not raise taxes on some Americans in the midst of economic downturn.

No, they passed a tax cut for EVERYONE to replace the expiring Bush tax cuts.

Whose tax rate is going to be REDUCED from the rate they are paying today? A little clarity please.

 

[dilloduck]

What a classic piece of misunderstanding. If people are selling an asset now because they believe the sale will be taxed more heavily in the future, the underlying price of the asset doesn't change. The stock market may or may not decline in the short term as a result, but the fundamental value of the market doesn't change.

This is the kind of ill-conceived logic one gets when such a large sector of your economy is based on the speculative trading of savings.

An economy based on gambling---people really need to think about that or a bit.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Really? Where did I sign any agreement to borrow that money? Where did anyone?
Is this honestly the best argument you can come up with? Because it's pretty piss-poor, even by your low standards.

So you don't pay your income taxes at all, because you're not legally obligated? Income taxes are voluntary according to YOU???

Geez, haven't seen one of these characters in a long time.

Does that mean you support gay marriage?

You say you didn't vote for government spending so you don't have to pay for it. Why don't you just not pay your income taxes then?

 

[NYcarbineer]

No, they agreed to not raise taxes on some Americans in the midst of economic downturn.

No, they passed a tax cut for EVERYONE to replace the expiring Bush tax cuts.

Whose tax rate is going to be REDUCED from the rate they are paying today? A little clarity please.

They are going to be reduced from the rates they rise to at the end of the year.

 

[Vel]

Poor, poor rich man. Hell, give the bastards another tax break so they can ship some more factories overseas. Yep, that's the Republican ticket.

Letting people keep more of their own money is not "giving" them anything, twit.

Yet, when the Federal Government gave out tax credits as part of the stimulus, you counted it as "Spending".

Go figure.

That was spending because they didn't limit the credit to those that were actually PAYING taxes. They made that tax credit available as a cash rebate to those that owed no tax. Had they set it up where the credit couldn't be counted as an overpayment, it would have been simply allowing people to keep their own money.

 

[Vel]

No, they passed a tax cut for EVERYONE to replace the expiring Bush tax cuts.

Whose tax rate is going to be REDUCED from the rate they are paying today? A little clarity please.

They are going to be reduced from the rates they rise to at the end of the year.

Then they are not a tax CUT. Doublespeak and obfuscation, the hallmarks of modern politics.

 

[boedicca]

Many of us, including myself, pointed out long ago that the prospect of the Bush tax cuts being allowed to expire was driving artificial growth in the stock market this year.

Which is of course nonsense.

Which explains your complete and utter lack of knowledge of economics, business, and human psychology.

 

[boedicca]

As a reminder: we are not undertaxed, the government spends TOO MUCH MONEY.

Here's the trend in Federal outlays (real cash spending) as a % of GDP

And here it is for all government spending (Fed, State, County, Local) as a % of GDP

The bigger the share of government in the economy, the worse the real economic performance and creation of real jobs.

Obamanomics = Epic Fail.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Many of us, including myself, pointed out long ago that the prospect of the Bush tax cuts being allowed to expire was driving artificial growth in the stock market this year.

Which is of course nonsense.

Which explains your complete and utter lack of knowledge of economics, business, and human psychology.

Good f'n grief.

Up is down now? Aggghhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[RDD_1210]

Whose tax rate is going to be REDUCED from the rate they are paying today? A little clarity please.

They are going to be reduced from the rates they rise to at the end of the year.

Then they are not a tax CUT. Doublespeak and obfuscation, the hallmarks of modern politics.

I know this is difficult for you to grasp. But Dems just voted for REDUCING the taxes for people under 250k, REDUCE compared to what they are suppose to be next year. It doesn't matter what they are now, they are not voting on that. If they do nothing, the tax rate will be higher next year as previously planned, so they are trying to vote to reduce that. Keep spinning though.

 

[Cuyo]

The House Democrats, over almost unanimous opposition of the GOP, passed a massive tax cut yesterday.

Your a revisionist FOOL and a LIAR! If you want to say fuck the millionaires (meaning the people who make over $1 mil a year) fine, but they passed one of the largest in history tax increases on the SUCCESSFULL SMALL BUSINESS OWNER who employee the majority of Americans! The $250k-$750K that the Democrats Demonize are the exact people who create the jobs that most of us have!

Owners' personal tax rates do not affect their ability to "Create jobs." Only profit is taxed. Profit comes after payroll. This is a setup, and you're playing right into their hands.