No Prayer in Public Schools !

[peach174]

In 1963 the Supreme Court ruled no prayer in public schools.

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies, to no prayers at sport events.
The idea is that Public Schools can not sponsor a religion.

But a public high school in Michigan which is 90% Muslim can.
Fordson High School - not a peep about this any where in the news.
No one is taking this on as a public school sponsoring a religion.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkHO-D_fo6M]CBS: Muslims Students at Public School Pray Before Game - YouTube[/ame]

Why is it that no one is taking this school to court?

Then people wonder why christians are saying this is war against christianty.

 

[Dragon]

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies

Do you have a link or citation for this?

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

In 1963 the Supreme Court ruled no prayer in public schools.

No they didn't. Kids can still pray in school if they want. What the SCOTUS said was as follows:

"We repeat and again reaffirm that neither a State nor the Federal Government can constitutionally force a person 'to profess a belief or disbelief in any religion.'" Neither can constitutionally pass laws or impose requirements which aid all religions as against non-believers, and neither can aid those religions based on a belief in the existence of God as against those religions founded on different beliefs."

FindLaw | Cases and Codes

Edward Schempp sued because the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania was requiring students to listen to and/or read portions of the Bible as part of their public education.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies

Do you have a link or citation for this?

There have been plenty of lawsuits filed about prayers at graduations and sporting events all across this country, but you already knew that.

 

[rdean]

In 1963 the Supreme Court ruled no prayer in public schools.

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies, to no prayers at sport events.
The idea is that Public Schools can not sponsor a religion.

But a public high school in Michigan which is 90% Muslim can.
Fordson High School - not a peep about this any where in the news.
No one is taking this on as a public school sponsoring a religion.
CBS: Muslims Students at Public School Pray Before Game - YouTube

Why is it that no one is taking this school to court?

Then people wonder why christians are saying this is war against christianty.

If the coach was leading the prayer, then it's "organized" and that's a "no no".

If the students spontaneously pray, then "so what"?

Did you notice, it was in the boy's locker room? No one was graduating. The right wing wants to turn this into a Christian police state. We can't let any religion do that. We have to fight the "occult".

 

[pinqy]

In 1963 the Supreme Court ruled no prayer in public schools.

It was 1962, Engel v Vitale and the ruling was against school required prayers. It was brought about by Christians: Unitarians.
Students are perfectly free to pray if they want to.

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies,

Based on the 1991 Supreme Court decision Lee v Weisman which was about a rabbi giving the graduation prayer. Rabbis are Jewish, not Christian.

to no prayers at sport events.

That was Santa Fe v Doe in 2000. Brought about by Catholic and Mormon Students.

The idea is that Public Schools can not sponsor a religion.

1st Ammendment establishment clause applied to the states via the 14th ammendment.

But a public high school in Michigan which is 90% Muslim can.

You showed a prayer by the players before the game. Not a school required prayer, not a prayer at graduation or for the attendees at the game. Go to any high school in Texas, Nebraska, or anywhere that's majority Christian and you'll see locker room prayers by Christians.

Why is it that no one is taking this school to court?

Because no one has complained. And if the prayers are solely by the players...not required or lead by the coaches...there's no legitimate complaint.

 

[peach174]

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies

Do you have a link or citation for this?

Valedictorian fights judge's ban on graduation prayer | Reuters

 

[peach174]

In 1963 the Supreme Court ruled no prayer in public schools.

It was 1962, Engel v Vitale and the ruling was against school required prayers. It was brought about by Christians: Unitarians.
Students are perfectly free to pray if they want to.

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies,

Based on the 1991 Supreme Court decision Lee v Weisman which was about a rabbi giving the graduation prayer. Rabbis are Jewish, not Christian.

That was Santa Fe v Doe in 2000. Brought about by Catholic and Mormon Students.

1st Ammendment establishment clause applied to the states via the 14th ammendment.

But a public high school in Michigan which is 90% Muslim can.

You showed a prayer by the players before the game. Not a school required prayer, not a prayer at graduation or for the attendees at the game. Go to any high school in Texas, Nebraska, or anywhere that's majority Christian and you'll see locker room prayers by Christians.

Why is it that no one is taking this school to court?

Because no one has complained. And if the prayers are solely by the players...not required or lead by the coaches...there's no legitimate complaint.

Your are right the first one was in 1962.
I was referring to the 1963 Madelyn Murray O'Hare vs Curlett which was the 2nd ruling and she was an Atheist.

 

[pinqy]

In 1963 the Supreme Court ruled no prayer in public schools.

It was 1962, Engel v Vitale and the ruling was against school required prayers. It was brought about by Christians: Unitarians.
Students are perfectly free to pray if they want to.

Based on the 1991 Supreme Court decision Lee v Weisman which was about a rabbi giving the graduation prayer. Rabbis are Jewish, not Christian.

That was Santa Fe v Doe in 2000. Brought about by Catholic and Mormon Students.

1st Ammendment establishment clause applied to the states via the 14th ammendment.


You showed a prayer by the players before the game. Not a school required prayer, not a prayer at graduation or for the attendees at the game. Go to any high school in Texas, Nebraska, or anywhere that's majority Christian and you'll see locker room prayers by Christians.

Why is it that no one is taking this school to court?

Because no one has complained. And if the prayers are solely by the players...not required or lead by the coaches...there's no legitimate complaint.

Your are right the first one was in 1962.
I was referring to the 1963 Madelyn Murray O'Hare vs Curlett which was the 2nd ruling and she was an Atheist.

Murray v Curlett was decided as part of Abington v Schempp, and the Schempps were Unitarians.

 

[peach174]

This school is accommodating a religious rule of their football players during Ramadan.

All-American Muslim: Football Practice During Ramadan : Video : TLC

But Christian students can't wear crosses in some schools or prey openly in the lunchrooms and are being bombarded by law suits and individual school rules.

On January 15, 2002, in Wilton, New York, kindergartener Kayla Broadus was stopped by her teacher from saying the "God is great, God is good" table prayer out loud with her friends before snack time.[9] The Saratoga Springs City school district sided with the teacher, claiming the prayer was a violation of the supposedly constitutional "separation of church and state."

The point is that this High School is 90 to 95% Muslim and is a public school and they accommodate their religion.
This is fine and they should be able to to so.
But so should Christians be allowed to have their religious freedom as well, but they are not.
From 2004 to 2006, a public school banned Bible study by children ... during recess. A teacher complained about the use of the Bible and the principal then censored the study activity, according to a sworn statement by a teacher told to stop it. Principal "Summa, having learned of a complaint by a teacher and of the students' Bible study, told fourth-grade teacher Virginia Larue to nix the group's recess meeting. Larue did, according to her deposition. In that sworn statement, Larue said she briefly informed Summa of a parental complaint about the Bible study, and Summa then instructed her to end the practice, citing fear over 'separation of church and state.' Larue later told one of Luke's Bible study colleagues the group could no longer meet at recess, according to the deposition."[10]

In 2005, a New Jersey award-winning high school football coach, Marcus Borden, was ordered by his intolerant school district not to bow his head or "take a knee" during any player-initiated prayers. Borden resigned from coaching in October over the issue.

It was perfectly fine for public schools to have open worship from the beginning of our nation until 1962.
It is the point of the 1st amendment to Freedom of religion not shuting up religion.

 

[NoNukes]

In 1963 the Supreme Court ruled no prayer in public schools.

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies, to no prayers at sport events.
The idea is that Public Schools can not sponsor a religion.

But a public high school in Michigan which is 90% Muslim can.
Fordson High School - not a peep about this any where in the news.
No one is taking this on as a public school sponsoring a religion.
CBS: Muslims Students at Public School Pray Before Game - YouTube

Why is it that no one is taking this school to court?

Then people wonder why christians are saying this is war against christianty.

What are you doing about it?

 

[Dragon]

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies

Do you have a link or citation for this?

Valedictorian fights judge's ban on graduation prayer | Reuters

That ruling does not ban prayers at graduation. It bans only school-led, formal prayers. There is nothing to stop any student from praying at any time. If you think there is, please provide a link or citation to that -- not it's third cousin once removed.

Also, please provide a link or citation to students not being allowed to wear crosses in school.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Do you have a link or citation for this?

Valedictorian fights judge's ban on graduation prayer | Reuters

That ruling does not ban prayers at graduation. It bans only school-led, formal prayers. There is nothing to stop any student from praying at any time. If you think there is, please provide a link or citation to that -- not it's third cousin once removed.

Also, please provide a link or citation to students not being allowed to wear crosses in school.

So you are claiming a Valedictorian CAN say a prayer or recite Bible passages in their speech?

 

[Dragon]

So you are claiming a Valedictorian CAN say a prayer or recite Bible passages in their speech?

What I am claiming is that there is no ban on "prayers at graduation." A ban on official prayers led by anyone endorsed by the school is not that.

And I will also claim one other thing: that public prayer of this sort is not only unconstitutional, but also un-Christian:

5 When you pray, don't be like the hypocrites. They love to stand in the synagogues and on the street corners and pray so people will see them. I tell you the truth, they already have their full reward. 6 When you pray, you should go into your room and close the door and pray to your Father who cannot be seen. Your Father can see what is done in secret, and he will reward you.

Gospel according to Matthew, Chapter 6.

 

[pinqy]

So you are claiming a Valedictorian CAN say a prayer or recite Bible passages in their speech?

What I am claiming is that there is no ban on "prayers at graduation." A ban on official prayers led by anyone endorsed by the school is not that.

Caveat: IF the school reviews and approves the speech, then there are restrictions on religious context.

 

[peach174]

In 1963 the Supreme Court ruled no prayer in public schools.

This has lead to many public schools not allowing Christians to pray at graduation ceremonies, to no prayers at sport events.
The idea is that Public Schools can not sponsor a religion.

But a public high school in Michigan which is 90% Muslim can.
Fordson High School - not a peep about this any where in the news.
No one is taking this on as a public school sponsoring a religion.
CBS: Muslims Students at Public School Pray Before Game - YouTube

Why is it that no one is taking this school to court?

Then people wonder why christians are saying this is war against christianty.

What are you doing about it?

Why would I? They should be able worship freely
did you read what I posted?
The point is that this High School is 90 to 95% Muslim and is a public school and they accommodate their religion.
This is fine and they should be able to to so.
But so should Christians be allowed to have their religious freedom as well

 

[Dragon]

The point is that this High School is 90 to 95% Muslim and is a public school and they accommodate their religion.
This is fine and they should be able to to so.
But so should Christians be allowed to have their religious freedom as well

They do. That prayer was not led by the coach (who was nowhere in sight). It was not an official school prayer. The football players took it on themselves to pray. Christian players can do exactly the same thing.

 

[peach174]

No, they are being taken to court all the time when they do it.

This same group does not do it to any other religious groups only Christians

Atheist Group Objects To Student-Led Prayers During Football Game

This was all over the news in Oct.

 

[Smartt33]

My solution is that true believers, those willing to follow Christ and actually carry the cross, do just that.

Many people who are responding to your post are stepping over the real issue. However, I believe most Christians are doing the same. They want to holler and screem about the "injustice" but they are not willing to be out there on the battlefield.

If a person doesn't pray in school, they cannot complain tbecause it appears they are not allowed to. If a person doesn't take his faith with him wherever he goes, they cannot complain when they are told they cannot.

Paul was told by the government not to preach, but God told him to preach. He preached, and ended up in prison, but his story has impacted this world in awesome ways.

I for one follow my Lord. When I am called upon by Him to pray, share my faith, or just tell a student that God loves them, I do it. I work in the schools almost every day, and God goes with me. I listen for his prompting, and follow it.

Agasinst the law? many here say yes. However, here is what God's Word says:

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; <b>against such things there is no law</b>. 24 Now those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

 

[Caroljo]

Everyone can pray whenever they want...
I pray several times a day, wherever i am it doesn't matter because i pray in "silence". You don't have to bow your head or get on your knees to do this.

There are many kids in school that pray...many have been able to do the "Meet at the Flagpole" prayers and as far as i know nobody has ever stopped them.

I have heard alot about kids getting in trouble at school for praying though, and are told they can't bring Bibles to school. One young girl at a school near us was praying with another girl in the hallway because the other girl had some family problems. They were both taken to the principal and told if it happened again they would be kicked out. If it's between 2 or more people that WANT to pray and not interrupting or bothering anyone else, they should be allowed, it's their "right".

A few years ago at graduation in our town, the Valedictorian was told she could not say a prayer. So....at the end of her speech, almost ALL of the graduating class started reciting the Lords Prayer. Then almost ALL of the people in the bleachers said it right along with them! That was AWESOME! The looks on the administrations faces were priceless! Lol!